Answered Melee weapons, new question: smithing ironman

[essiw]

Hi there :)

I haven't done much combat on my new (ironman) account and there was no eoc on my old account. I understand that (nearly) all weapons of the same metal do have the same dps? But they now only seem to differ in stab/slash and such. Now I am wondering, is it good to have weapons in all styles, and which weapon for which style is considered better? I am currently making my weapons myself (from steel) as I am an ironman (with a low combat right now).

Thanks for the answers :)

Edit: see below for my new question about smithing

[Sy_Accursed]

If its in the same tier it should equal so no real better or worse options until you get to the more diverse tiers in end-game.

 

Dual wield melee beats 2h still afaik.

 

In terms of style up until t80 weapons it is wise to conform to monster weaknesses, so yes having 3 sets for slash stab and crush is advisable.

[essiw]

Thanks sy :) I will make multiple sets of weapons, kind of strange that dual wield is better than 2h though.

 

 

but there is no difference now in for example scimitars and daggers? And is a mace better than others because it has the prayer bonus? Also should i prioritise on weapons with a quicker speed (of the same attack style)?

[Arceus]

The speed is (supposedly) balanced out with greater/smaller ability damage on the whole from invisible boosts.  I'm not sure the mace's prayer bonus is really large enough to provide a substantial effect, but it's been a while.

[essiw]

Ok :) so I can just use the weapons I like more (the looks) as long if I have one set of each attacking style :) I also whish shields were better than this, I kind of like shields...

[Arceus]

Sadly people in general seem to prefer bigger numbers over tactical strategy so shields don't play much of a role.  Maybe in the future though, who knows...

[Sy_Accursed]

Sadly people in general seem to prefer bigger numbers over tactical strategy so shields don't play much of a role.  Maybe in the future though, who knows...

 

Sadly it has nothing to do with bigger numbers and everything to do with strategy.

 

It is a product of DPS and the effects of defence.

The damage mitigated by using a shield is so little that the speed lost in the kill means you end up taking more damage overall.

 

Strategically speaking therefore it is foolish to use a shield as all you are doing is making your kills take longer whilst getting hurt more overall.

[Arceus]

I know, but the reason it is set up that way in the first place is because stronger shield effects would be unpopular as compared to hitting higher (or in my theories anyway).  If we started slashing max hits and gave a sufficient boosts to shields, people would probably complain and want their bigger hits back <.<.

[Saradomin_Mage]

If you're under attack from multiple fast hitting creatures, and you can be bothered, switching to a shield and using Revenge gets you to 200% weapon dps, which outperforms dual wield. Sadly, you'll miss out on the stronger abilities that come with 2h or dw melee.

 

For melee weapons, you can honestly just stick to one set per tier. If you're hitting decently enough with dual daggers, it's not worth it to shell out more for a mace/longsword set, or a 2h sword, especially once you're at level 60.

[Sy_Accursed]

If people complained because they slashed max hits they'd be perfectly justified - there is no reason to do it.

The answer to fixing shields does not lie in the nerfing of weapons - it lies in actually addressing the flaws of shields.

 

The fix for shields is simple: Defence needs to have a greater impact on damage taken, particularly for shields. Plus we need some monster at each level range designed to hit hard enough that a shield is worthwhile using.

 

Think of a model like dragonfire (before it got a bit tankable and super pots) it is an attack that specifically hits very hard unless a shield is used to mitigate it to the point that a shield is worth using.

[essiw]

I agree with sy. In my view purpose of shields is to take less damage while your kills will be slower, in order to safe food so you have to bank less. This would mean (if done well) that with higher level monsters shields would be better than dual weapons. I guess that right now the shields are only worth it if that means that you heal faster than that you take damage so you can camp the monsters without banking... but this might be slower than just fish for some food and killing faster.

 

If you're under attack from multiple fast hitting creatures, and you can be bothered, switching to a shield and using Revenge gets you to 200% weapon dps, which outperforms dual wield. Sadly, you'll miss out on the stronger abilities that come with 2h or dw melee.

 

For melee weapons, you can honestly just stick to one set per tier. If you're hitting decently enough with dual daggers, it's not worth it to shell out more for a mace/longsword set, or a 2h sword, especially once you're at level 60.

Thanks for your answer :) Though I am wondering why you think multiple sets are not worth it.

[Arceus]

That is a good point, but with banking being literally a two minute trip (most of the time?), and presets making it a five second affair to withdraw a fresh inventory of supplies...you see what I mean :P.

[essiw]

That is a good point, but with banking being literally a two minute trip (most of the time?), and presets making it a five second affair to withdraw a fresh inventory of supplies...you see what I mean :P.

Yes I agree :) But that is what I think they should change :P like sy said, make it so that defence really works as defence :P Also, couldn't they just add healing effects to defence (only when wearing a shield), that would at least make it more useful...

[Saradomin_Mage]

The additional 15% accuracy boost isn't worth the gp spent on other types of weapons.

[essiw]

The additional 15% accuracy boost isn't worth the gp spent on other types of weapons.

 

ah ok :) Well since I am an ironman I cannot really spent much (except for stores) ;)

[Saradomin_Mage]

Yeah, you don't really want to fork over 50k or 100k for a dragon mace/longsword just to cover the other two styles.

[essiw]

^ah yes I understand :)

 

Now for a new question (not really wanting to open a new topic for this). What would be a better strategy to train smithing? I am an ironman so I would like smithing xp but also something to high alch. I am not sure what is better for xp and money (and I need lots of coins for construction I guess)... I can see three ways:

Keep smithing steel platebodies, which are easy to make and have a nice high alch value.

Smelt gold ores and turn them into bracelets to high alch.

Smith the best metal bars I can do.

 

One thing needs to be said, I don't mind smelting/smithing :p I could also vary between methods of course...

[Arceus]

Is it at all possible for you to get good quantities of nature runes as ironman?  If so, superheating your ore and depositing it as you go could speed up the process significantly.  If not I'd probably go with the steel platebodies.  You can still use portable forges deployed by other players (I think?) so take advantage of that if you can, as it can grant you extra bars when smelting and save you bars when smithing too!

[essiw]

Is it at all possible for you to get good quantities of nature runes as ironman?  If so, superheating your ore and depositing it as you go could speed up the process significantly.  If not I'd probably go with the steel platebodies.  You can still use portable forges deployed by other players (I think?) so take advantage of that if you can, as it can grant you extra bars when smelting and save you bars when smithing too!

While I like smithing, I don't like runecrafting :p so I rather not superheat. Also I doubt I can use portable forges, as I cannot even use others peoples divination stuff :p

[Arceus]

I was thinking like as drops from monsters, but I guess they nerfed those.  And too bad about the forges but oh well, guess that makes sense.  Scroll of Efficiency is a small boost that could help, if you are allowed to purchase that?...but it's still a lot of work for an otherwise small benefit.

[essiw]

Yes I am pretty sure I can use that scroll (would be strange not to imo). That could help in the long run :) also varrock armour :p

[Saradomin_Mage]

I train smithing through iron ingot I in the Artisan's Workshop. Use the Dwarven mine, mine at the triple iron spot, and bank with the deposit box in the resource dungeon. For alching, I did carapace bodies/legs from killing cockroach soldiers.

[essiw]

I train smithing through iron ingot I in the Artisan's Workshop. Use the Dwarven mine, mine at the triple iron spot, and bank with the deposit box in the resource dungeon. For alching, I did carapace bodies/legs from killing cockroach soldiers.

Thanks :) that was one option I forgot about

[essiw]

Just came to the conclusion that it is not possible to buy off-handed weapons (except for dragon stuff)... guess I have a reason to use shields at adamant and rune levels... lol, or I should use a 2h, but I am not a fan of those.

[Arceus]

It's up to you man but I'd go for 2h and blast away lol.