Oil and the Future

[jessy87]

Americans are whiny. 'Gas' is $9 per gallon in the UK. Get over yourselves.

 

 

 

so many things i could say, but i am tired. I guess i will limit it to

 

why are you talking?

 

this a serious discussion that is not based on one nation especially since its a world wide product and "issue"

 

 

 

It's a fair point though that petrol prices in the UK are much higher than in the US, and since we have a lower disposable income on average than Americans rising oil prices hurt us more, and is more likely to push the UK into any kind of recession than the US at a simplistic level.

 

 

 

 

 

even so, I do believe these forums are for serious discussion, and thusly I view his opinion as spam, or i could. Its not what he said, more how he said it.

 

 

 

But, fact is, like i said previously. its a world wide issue. Bring up any idea of nation with this topic might be, off topic or simply spam. Especially one which is negative and clearly going to attract responses which will further go off topic and cause a huge "hurr hurr u got troll'd" bunch of crap.

 

 

 

 

 

There's also E-85 ethanol. already Venezuela has transitioned and is completely dependant on the grain product to run their cars.

 

 

 

 

 

E85 in Venezuela is much more practical then here in america in some ways.

 

 

 

down their I do believe they use sugar cane, (not sure, on the numbers so, check into if you like) Sugar cane is possibly 10 times more efficient then corn. Because all of the sugar cane is used, were in corn its only the stalk.

 

 

 

also I think wheat grass or "prarie/field" grass. I forget its name, but its the typical long grass you see in my state, that is actually capable of producing like some ungodly amount of E85 if we were to harvest and refine it.

[Lenticular_J]

There's also E-85 ethanol. already Venezuela has transitioned and is completely dependant on the grain product to run their cars.

 

The only problem with ethanol is the fact that, here in America at least, it sends food prices soaring.

 

 

 

By the way, how do you "fill up" a hydrogen-powered car? With water?

[hoffman44]

 

By the way, how do you "fill up" a hydrogen-powered car? With water?

 

 

 

With hydrogen, it emits water vapor.

[dusqi]

Americans are whiny. 'Gas' is $9 per gallon in the UK. Get over yourselves.

 

 

 

so many things i could say, but i am tired. I guess i will limit it to

 

why are you talking?

 

this a serious discussion that is not based on one nation especially since its a world wide product and "issue"

 

 

 

 

 

My point is that Europe has survived on higher 'gas' prices than America has now for the last 10 years. So your economy (or that of the world) isn't going to collapse overnight because of it. Although people in the UK do complain about high prices, from my experience it has been predominantly Americans that have been predicting an apocalypse because of it.

 

 

 

What will happen in the future? Travel will cost more for the next decade, and other items that need oil - but for the most part people will just suck it up. Eventually because of the high price someone will come up with an alternative. I think that since Europe has been slowly artificially raising the price of 'gas' in the last decade, that Europe will be better positioned to deal with this. I hope that the eventual solutions come from outside America, and that America ends up paying a high price for its myopia (Toyota is a good example of this).

 

 

 

(Yes, this was a "you should have seen it coming when you elected an oil tycoon for a President, twice" post)

 

 

 

 

 

Edit: Concerning what the solution is, I think that predicting future technology is a foolish endeavour, other than to say that it is probably something that none of us would ever have predicted.

 

 

 

 

 

Edit2: It amuses me when people blame speculators for the high price of oil, as if speculators are collectively carrying out some kind of clever scheme to screw everyone over. If a speculator comes along and pays $150 for a barrel of oil in 1 year, and then it goes down to $70, he loses a load of money, so they don't just do it for fun. Speculation is just what people predict the price will be. It is amoral.

[jessy87]

Americans are whiny. 'Gas' is $9 per gallon in the UK. Get over yourselves.

 

 

 

so many things i could say, but i am tired. I guess i will limit it to

 

why are you talking?

 

this a serious discussion that is not based on one nation especially since its a world wide product and "issue"

 

 

 

 

 

My point is that Europe has survived on higher 'gas' prices than America has now for the last 10 years. So your economy (or that of the world) isn't going to collapse overnight because of it. Although people in the UK do complain about high prices, from my experience it has been predominantly Americans that have been predicting an apocalypse because of it.

 

 

 

What will happen in the future? Travel will cost more for the next decade, and other items that need oil. Eventually because of the high price someone will come up with an alternative. I think that since Europe has been slowly artificially raising the price of 'gas' in the last decade, that Europe will be better positioned to deal with this. I hope that the eventual solutions come from outside America, and that America ends up paying a high price for its myopia.

 

 

 

(Yes, this was a "you should have seen it coming when you elected an oil tycoon for a President, twice" post)

 

 

 

 

 

Edit: Concerning what the solution is, I think that predicting future technology is a foolish endeavour, other than to say that it is probably something that none of us would ever have predicted.

 

 

 

 

 

Edit2: It amuses me when people blame speculators for the high price of oil, as if speculators are collectively carrying out some kind of clever scheme to screw everyone over. If a speculator comes along and pays $150 for a barrel of oil in 1 year, and then it goes down to $70, he loses a load of money, so they don't just do it for fun. Speculation is just what people predict the price will be.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

welcome to the gore foundation.

 

 

 

please, what does that have to do with anything

 

 

 

these spectators you refer to. do you mean, investors of oil futures? if so, they actually do cause and inflation in prices.

[Yomyth105]

Hey! No warring/flamming between Brits and Americans. (btw go America)

 

 

 

This is not how i wanted this topic to go. I wanted for ppl to suggest a solution for this problem. And for the ppl who tell us to stop whining. they r complete morons. If the oil prices increase drastically each day it is a huge problem. + ur saying that because u dont pay for ur own gas. but then again neither do i...

 

 

 

I read in an article that they will make cars that will run off electricity in 2years. or hybrids but more effective ones. They will do this once oil prices will become too large.

[RichieMcD]

We're all [bleep]ed completely in terms of Oil, that's my analysis on it anyways. Time to move away from Oil and start finding cheaper, cleaner fuel forms. Instead of combating the rising cost of Oil we should use it as an initiative to start looking at cleaner / cheaper energy forms.

[jackattack]

Would be funny if McCain gets voted in and makes that plan for a $300 million dollar prize for a good battery happen.

 

Then in a few months after some big oil company "miraculously" discovers a new source for energy. :lol: Would be a little fishy. :^o

 

 

 

Thats ridiculous. I bet if anyone did come up with that they would make a hell of a lot more than 300 million.

[meol]

It would just be an additional "gift" from the US government.

 

 

 

And how curious it turned out that ExxonMobil is already on the process of producing such a battery. :shock:

[dusqi]

What does Bush have to do with it? While the rest of the world's countries were looking at ways to reduce greenhouse gas emissions, which would have involved using less fossil fuels, he was busy thwarting it every chance he got and by doing so convincing Americans that anyone who promoted public transport, energy efficiency or energy alternatives was a hippie.

 

 

 

This isn't a new, surprising, or sudden problem (Where is gas headed? 3.50 a gallon? [september 2005]. Unfortunately the forums don't go further back). Americans will complain about the high prices, and then it will drop by 15% or so and they'll shut up about it for a while until it goes up by a lot again. Nothing will get done in the mean time because there is no political will for it and given that Europeans manage with $9 per gallon, the price still isn't high enough in America to actually change peoples' behaviour significantly. Maybe after the election.

[Lenticular_J]

 

By the way, how do you "fill up" a hydrogen-powered car? With water?

 

 

 

With hydrogen, it emits water vapor.

 

Where can you buy hydrogen? Interesting, we need trucks to be powered by this.

 

 

 

Or sailing ships.

[mario_sunny]

I'm not worried at all. We already have those fancy hydrogen cars, and in 5 years half of America will be driving them. Hell, then gas powered cars will be the 'old' thing, the out-of-style thing that nobody wants.

[jessy87]

What does Bush have to do with it? While the rest of the world's countries were looking at ways to reduce greenhouse gas emissions, which would have involved using less fossil fuels, he was busy thwarting it every chance he got and by doing so convincing Americans that anyone who promoted public transport, energy efficiency or energy alternatives was a hippie.

 

 

 

This isn't a new, surprising, or sudden problem (Where is gas headed? 3.50 a gallon? [september 2005]. Unfortunately the forums don't go further back). Americans will complain about the high prices, and then it will drop by 15% or so and they'll shut up about it for a while until it goes up by a lot again. Nothing will get done in the mean time because there is no political will for it and given that Europeans manage with $9 per gallon, the price still isn't high enough in America to actually change peoples' behaviour significantly. Maybe after the election.

 

 

 

 

 

oh please...

 

 

 

also, on the note of public transit. Its not a viable option for most. It is a joke honestly. The idea of public transport is more like a myth in my town, as the closest thing to it is simply a bus to school and back.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not worried at all. We already have those fancy hydrogen cars, and in 5 years half of America will be driving them. Hell, then gas powered cars will be the 'old' thing, the out-of-style thing that nobody wants.

 

 

 

 

 

theirs always going to be some people out their willing to drive those cars. Not just drive them, but enjoy them. Infact theirs alot of people who still buy lead additives for their gasoline so their cars run similarly to what they did when they were designed. to run via leaded gas.

[Giordano]

[Americans drive twice as much as the English, their entire economy survives on traveling long distances every day.

 

 

 

Is that just something you pulled out your [wagon]? (Not the economy bit)

 

No, that is pretty accurate. Especially true in the Western United States, which was mostly built after the 1950s during the change to surburban layout making us drive longer.

 

My parents used to own a video store near downtown Los Angeles. When me and my sister were born we couldn't live in a tiny apartment (which was twenty miles away) so the closest, cheap, good house was fifty miles away. In the suburbs. This was before the oil crisis when driving fifty miles to work was common and 'whatever' but now with the prices they are at now they couldn't spend going there everyday. You guys wanted my parents to buy a house closer to their work?

 

 

 

Plus our economy isn't the best at right now and we have many taxes. With these damn gas prices rising how are we supposed to pay them off if we need to drive to the place that will let us? (work)

[dusqi]

also, on the note of public transit. Its not a viable option for most. It is a joke honestly. The idea of public transport is more like a myth in my town, as the closest thing to it is simply a bus to school and back.

 

 

 

Because while European countries were slowly doing their best to wean themselves off of oil, America was burying its head in the sand and insisting that it was every American's right to buy a SUV.

[Quoi_Tu]

also, on the note of public transit. Its not a viable option for most. It is a joke honestly. The idea of public transport is more like a myth in my town, as the closest thing to it is simply a bus to school and back.

 

 

 

Because while European countries were slowly doing their best to wean themselves off of oil, America was burying its head in the sand and insisting that it was every American's right to buy a SUV.

 

 

 

That and the US is one gigantic suburbia. Some people drive half a mile to get off their neighborhood road and are only 4 miles from "downtown".

 

 

 

This oil crisis is just like the one in the 1970s. People will start driving less and automotive companies will develop more efficient cars to appeal to people's increasing conservative driving. Hopefully now we'll get to see new technology (like hydrogen) instead of just smaller cars.

[jessy87]

also, on the note of public transit. Its not a viable option for most. It is a joke honestly. The idea of public transport is more like a myth in my town, as the closest thing to it is simply a bus to school and back.

 

 

 

Because while European countries were slowly doing their best to wean themselves off of oil, America was burying its head in the sand and insisting that it was every American's right to buy a SUV.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

am i the only person who see's this post as being completely irrelevant?

 

 

 

most people dont want to buy the big SUV's with their SUPER GAS EATING V6'S yes, most are v6's. Even the v8's are a shell of their former self. your lucky if you can buy a 350 cubic inch motor for a chevy product outside of the new corvette with the 502.

 

 

 

And, other then the 302 for the mustang, I think trucks are the closest thing to having a big motor. Not to mention, you have to order the 302 most likely or buy the mustang GT to get the V8.

 

 

 

 

 

This oil crisis is just like the one in the 1970s. People will start driving less and automotive companies will develop more efficient cars to appeal to people's increasing conservative driving. Hopefully now we'll get to see new technology (like hydrogen) instead of just smaller cars.

 

 

 

Oh, yes even tho i was not born in the 70's or earlier, i know all about the "gas crunch" in the 70's.

 

 

 

Cars them selves did not get much smaller, they stayed relatively the same honestly. I would say take a look at your average Cadillac/lincoln but thats not fair at all, they were always big cars.

 

 

 

compare the first generation camaro(67-69) to the 2nd generation(70-81) they only got bigger and heavier with weaker motors. chevelle, el camino, buick. I dont think the phyiscally changed much.

 

 

 

Motors were toned down heavily. Your average motor from the factory(chevy) was either a 302small block, 350small block, 427 big block and 454big block.

 

 

 

then it adapted to, 327, 350, 400 small blocks. And slowly the 427's and 454's were just removed from the car's that were sent to dealer ships. Your average horse power went from the general 300-400+ area to 200-300ish. The 69 chevelle came out with nearly 500 horse power. And the Hemi motor of that era was closer to a horse power rating of 600.

 

 

 

 

 

point is, we are to the point reducing cylinders and removing cubic inches and lowering the horse power. JUST DOES NOT CUT IT anymore.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

if you want to know me personally, I dont complain about gas prices they concern me, but I do not voice my opinion about them being to high. The nearest I recall to complaining was "i remember when gas never went over 129 for 5 years" I drive a V8 Cadillac like a 4.3 litre motor which off the top of my head is about 250ish cubic inches. Heres another tid bit, I do not have a job. My parents dont hand me weekly money for gas(my dad gave me $40 a month ago fro gas, first time since i was like 18), no one does. Ill leave it at, i manage my money well.

 

 

 

 

 

also, my idea for cars that I can thought of long ago much before its creation was the segway, but incased in metal for safety at high speeds/crashes.

 

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[Quoi_Tu]

This oil crisis is just like the one in the 1970s. People will start driving less and automotive companies will develop more efficient cars to appeal to people's increasing conservative driving. Hopefully now we'll get to see new technology (like hydrogen) instead of just smaller cars.

 

 

 

Oh, yes even tho i was not born in the 70's or earlier, i know all about the "gas crunch" in the 70's.

 

 

 

Cars them selves did not get much smaller, they stayed relatively the same honestly. I would say take a look at your average Cadillac/lincoln but thats not fair at all, they were always big cars.

 

 

 

compare the first generation camaro(67-69) to the 2nd generation(70-81) they only got bigger and heavier with weaker motors. chevelle, el camino, buick. I dont think the phyiscally changed much.

 

 

 

Motors were toned down heavily. Your average motor from the factory(chevy) was either a 302small block, 350small block, 427 big block and 454big block.

 

 

 

then it adapted to, 327, 350, 400 small blocks. And slowly the 427's and 454's were just removed from the car's that were sent to dealer ships. Your average horse power went from the general 300-400+ area to 200-300ish. The 69 chevelle came out with nearly 500 horse power. And the Hemi motor of that era was closer to a horse power rating of 600.

 

 

 

 

 

point is, we are to the point reducing cylinders and removing cubic inches and lowering the horse power. JUST DOES NOT CUT IT anymore.

 

 

 

They didn't make pre-existing cars smaller, they made smaller cars. They just knocked down the horse power of pre-existing cars. Also, all those cars got heavier because of new safety regulations created in the 1970s (such as bumpers that could withstand 5 mph collision with no damage). In fact, those safety regulations were partly responsible for the downfall of some cars, such as the Opel GT (although it was the Datsun 240Z that was mostly responsible). Hey, at least you can still get good ol 454's off the internet to throw in just about any car, which seems to be a popular hobby these days :)

[jessy87]

 

They didn't make pre-existing cars smaller, they made smaller cars. They just knocked down the horse power of pre-existing cars. Also, all those cars got heavier because of new safety regulations created in the 1970s (such as bumpers that could withstand 5 mph collision with no damage). In fact, those safety regulations were partly responsible for the downfall of some cars, such as the Opel GT (although it was the Datsun 240Z that was mostly responsible). Hey, at least you can still get good ol 454's off the internet to throw in just about any car, which seems to be a popular hobby these days :)

 

 

 

 

 

omfg, opels. Sadly, the cars which were considered gas crunch cars are now much more "car" in my opinion.

 

 

 

I do recall some cars, of that same size sort of. the vega, chevette, OMFG PINTOS. And, the oldsmobile Omega, yeah tiny cars... of that era which were much more stylish then 80% of todays car's and had double the horse power and they were "economical" cars.

 

 

 

 

 

454s? wow, where do you live? lol, around here everyone is 350 crazy, omfg, hey thats a get mustang, lets put a 350 in it, oh sweet god, thats a nice buick/olds/pontiac. lets just put a 350 in it. My friend has a "racecar" thats a Vega, the yeaa eludes me, but it has a 350 in it. yes its a "panel wagon" vega... the grossest thing invented.

 

 

 

 

 

anyway, this thread has gone far off topic when you know we start discussing classic cars over the future of oil... But man, they just didnt make good cars. Look at the crystler(i think?) javelin.

[jackattack]

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[dusqi]

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I almost wish the Republicans had another term so that we could keep track of how they're doing with that :lol:

[jackattack]

Ya its funny how gas prices have gone up how much since the dems took office? If they hadn't blocked more drilling in what was it 2000 or 01' then we probably would be seeing some of that today.

[Quoi_Tu]

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I almost wish the Republicans had another term so that we could keep track of how they're doing with that :lol:

 

 

 

If they had a magic wand, they'd wave it.