Estonian dude Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 IN OTHER NEWS:I chased 2 chicks at the same time and failed with both.If you have read the Today thread, thenThe only way life could [bleep] me even more in the ass would be by killing off my close relatives. Everything less serious has already been done this week. So I've noticed this thread's regulars all follow similar trends. RPG is constantly dealing with psycho exes.Muggi reminds us of the joys of polygamy.Saq is totally oblivious to how much chicks dig him.I strike out every other week.Kalphite wages a war against the friend zone.Randox pretty much stays rational.Etc, etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noxx Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 IN OTHER NEWS:I chased 2 chicks at the same time and failed with both.If you have read the Today thread, thenThe only way life could [bleep] me even more in the ass would be by killing off my close relatives. Everything less serious has already been done this week. Well, things aren't going to better with an attitude like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obfuscator Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 Radical feminism isn't limited to tumblr, Universities in Ontario and Quebec are infested with them. yeah there's some pretty ridiculous stuff that goes on there. i'm glad I'm out of university... "It's not a rest for me, it's a rest for the weights." - Dom Mazzetti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginger_Warrior Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 Sorry, been a bit busy... All political movements are judged by the radicals.They may receive disproportionately more attention, but that doesn't make them representative of the whole cause. That's a very obvious logical fallacy. And the only de facto discrimination that exists is in the pay gap right? Or do you have other examples?Yes, mostly relating to the media. Over four fifths of mainstream newspapers' front page stories are dedicated to male subjects. Only a fifth of frontpage stories are written by female journalists. Meanwhile, Page 3 shoots continue to depict (exclusively young and sexually attractive) women in an overtly sexualised manner.* Studies show barely any difference between the language describing women used in lads' magazines and language used by those convicted of sexual assault. In music videos, men are routinely depicted as suave and suited up, throwing scantly clad women around like confetti on a dancefloor. * (less of an issue in the US where Page 3 doesn't really exist, but definitely relevant to the UK)None of these examples have anything to do with wealth or a pay gap, but continue to reinforce the idea that a woman is only worth what men find sexually attractive about them. And even if you're lucky enough as a woman to be judged as sexually attractive, the discrimination doesn't stop there. What of your right to say No? Well, not according to Justin Timberlake ('I know you like it...') or Robin Thicke ('I know you want it...'). Very clearly, and in a very accessible, visual format, a link is drawn between sexual desire on the one hand, and aggression, control and ownership of women on the other, for all young men and boys to see. What of your desire to be judged for anything other than how you look? Well, not according to The Wanted ('But who cares? She walks like Rihanna'). Again, very clearly, and in a very accessible format, a message is given to young girls that they could do well in exams and perform well in a job (or not, as the case may be in the song), but it's all an irrelevance because the only thing that women are likely to be judged on is how they look in terms of attraction to men. @Giordano: There's definitely a link between socioeconomic status and inequality, but surely, gender and racial inequality exist against the background of socioeconomic inequality, rather than in spite of it. Does a black woman on a similar income to a white man receive different levels of sexist and racist discrimination? Almost certainly. | Favourite Game Music | Last.fm | HYT Friend Chat Rules | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Dash Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 What do you guys think about all of the yesallgirls garbage going around on Twitter at the moment? You know, since we are sort of already on the topic... “I had a feeling we weren’t coming back from this fight when it began.”“Do you have any regrets?”“I don’t. It seems surprising, I know, but I wouldn’t change a thing. This is how it was meant to be.”“Huh, you never really notice how lovely the day is until you realize you’ll never see it again.”“Mmmhmm.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginger_Warrior Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 If you want a discussion, you can't really go "it's garbage" and then walk off before saying why... >_> | Favourite Game Music | Last.fm | HYT Friend Chat Rules | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low Levelled Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 I've never understood the rah rah over women being sexualized in the media. If I could get paid to get pictures of me taken while wearing skimpy clothing, I'd do it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Dash Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 If you want a discussion, you can't really go "it's garbage" and then walk off before saying why... >_>It is garbage under the law of social media that states that all Twitter trends are garbage. You know me.... I never post, I just let you guys do the discussing. “I had a feeling we weren’t coming back from this fight when it began.”“Do you have any regrets?”“I don’t. It seems surprising, I know, but I wouldn’t change a thing. This is how it was meant to be.”“Huh, you never really notice how lovely the day is until you realize you’ll never see it again.”“Mmmhmm.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginger_Warrior Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 I've never understood the rah rah over women being sexualized in the media. If I could get paid to get pictures of me taken while wearing skimpy clothing, I'd do it.If I understand your point correctly, it implies as follows: you don't understand the problem whereby half of the population are given the message, in no uncertain terms, that their careers and aspirations are limited only to the roles that the other half allow them to perform for their own titillating satisfaction, and that in the absence of being able to provide that satisfaction, they aren't worth throwing the money at. If we were talking about race in that context, we'd be calling it apartheid, wouldn't we? | Favourite Game Music | Last.fm | HYT Friend Chat Rules | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpgGamer Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 I have no idea what this "Yesallgirls" thing is, and even after googling it I'm no less confused. But given context clues from Ginger's post I imagine its girls shouting glass ceiling at their careers and socioeconomic standing? And while the statistics of male journalism on front page verse female may be true, I don't find it a valid argument. That could be pure coincidence. Maybe there's just stronger established writers who happen to be male, there doesn't have to be anything malevolent about it (Just as seeing a skimpy outfitted dude on Page 3 may not be as overall appealing to the public) Quote Quote Anyone who likes tacos is incapable of logic. Anyone who likes logic is incapable of tacos. PSA: SaqPrets is an Estonian Dude Steam: NippleBeardTM Origin: Brand_New_iPwn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginger_Warrior Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 If you want a discussion, you can't really go "it's garbage" and then walk off before saying why... >_>It is garbage under the law of social media that states that all Twitter trends are garbage. You know me.... I never post, I just let you guys do the discussing.Understood. So your criticism is aimed at the use of hashtagging as a platform from which to launch short-term trends, rather than a more sustained message. Regrettably, I'd have to agree with you. That's not to say social media can't be used to campaign in this way, just that the use of trending means the message hits home but isn't followed through or reinforced, and therefore, quickly forgotten. 1 | Favourite Game Music | Last.fm | HYT Friend Chat Rules | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpgGamer Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 I wanted the one with the burning building and everyone is standing outside recording it instead of calling for help, but it has the same point. 4 Quote Quote Anyone who likes tacos is incapable of logic. Anyone who likes logic is incapable of tacos. PSA: SaqPrets is an Estonian Dude Steam: NippleBeardTM Origin: Brand_New_iPwn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giordano Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 @Giordano: There's definitely a link between socioeconomic status and inequality, but surely, gender and racial inequality exist against the background of socioeconomic inequality, rather than in spite of it. Does a black woman on a similar income to a white man receive different levels of sexist and racist discrimination? Almost certainly.What discrimination she would get would not ruin her chance at achieving her goals or financial independence. I'm not saying racism/sexism doesn't exist, it is just not a relevant factor anymore. 1 "The cry of the poor is not always just, but if you never hear it you'll never know what justice is." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obfuscator Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 Not sure if this has been posted already. But if you haven't seen it, it's well worth the twenty minutes: 1 "It's not a rest for me, it's a rest for the weights." - Dom Mazzetti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginger_Warrior Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 @Giordano: There's definitely a link between socioeconomic status and inequality, but surely, gender and racial inequality exist against the background of socioeconomic inequality, rather than in spite of it. Does a black woman on a similar income to a white man receive different levels of sexist and racist discrimination? Almost certainly.What discrimination she would get would not ruin her chance at achieving her goals or financial independence. I'm not saying racism/sexism doesn't exist, it is just not a relevant factor anymore.Really? Women make up just 19% of Congress. I'll agree that socioeconomic status plays a little role in that, but in this golden age where women couldn't want for more and every obstacle to gender equality has supposedly been toppled, you're not seriously suggesting that that's all down to class, are you? That's one hell of an extraordinary statement. | Favourite Game Music | Last.fm | HYT Friend Chat Rules | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omar Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 If we were talking about race in that context, we'd be calling it apartheid, wouldn't we?No. Apartheid was legally enforced. It was comparable to Jim Crow laws. Yes, mostly relating to the media. Over four fifths of mainstream newspapers' front page stories are dedicated to male subjects.Why do you think this is the case? Are more things happening to men? Are newspapers deliberately not covering things that happen to women? Are readers less interested in what happens to women? Not a rhetorical question, just not sure in what sense you think this is evidence of sexism. Only a fifth of frontpage stories are written by female journalists. Meanwhile, Page 3 shoots continue to depict (exclusively young and sexually attractive) women in an overtly sexualised manner.* Studies show barely any difference between the language describing women used in lads' magazines and language used by those convicted of sexual assault. In music videos, men are routinely depicted as suave and suited up, throwing scantly clad women around like confetti on a dancefloor.And 90% of workplace injuries happen to men. Is it any more fair that men are disproportionately expected to put the integrity of their body at stake in order to get a job? Or is doing things you wouldn't do if you weren't getting paid for it exactly what working is? None of these examples have anything to do with wealth or a pay gap, but continue to reinforce the idea that a woman is only worth what men find sexually attractive about them. And even if you're lucky enough as a woman to be judged as sexually attractive, the discrimination doesn't stop there.But the same thing is true for everyone. I don't care about my baker as an end in and of him or herself. I care about how good he is at baking bread. This is totally normal in a society with more people than you can know personally. What of your right to say No? Well, not according to Justin Timberlake ('I know you like it...') or Robin Thicke ('I know you want it...'). Very clearly, and in a very accessible, visual format, a link is drawn between sexual desire on the one hand, and aggression, control and ownership of women on the other, for all young men and boys to see.I won't comment on Timberlake because I don't remember the song, but you'll note that Thicke hates "blurred lines," not lines. The song is about mixed signals ("the way you grab me [what way, we're not sure, but apparently such that she...] / must want to get nasty"), which, in the interest of consent being taken seriously, should not be part of the lead-up to sex. That song also contrasts Thicke to another man who tried, and failed, to domesticate the woman in question, so I'm not sure where you're seeing that coverture-esque ownership thing. 1 Matt: You want that eh? You want everything good for you. You want everything that's--falls off garbage can Camera guy: Whoa, haha, are you okay dude? Matt: You want anything funny that happens, don't you? Camera guy: still laughing Matt: You want the funny shit that happens here and there, you think it comes out of your [bleep]ing [wagon] pushes garbage can down, don't you? You think it's funny? It comes out of here! running towards Camera guy Camera guy: runs away still laughing Matt: You think the funny comes out of your mother[bleep]ing creativity? Comes out of Satan, mother[bleep]er! nn--ngh! pushes Camera guy down Camera guy: Hoooholy [bleep]! Matt: FUNNY ISN'T REAL! FUNNY ISN'T REAL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggiwhplar Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 I have no idea what this "Yesallgirls" thing is, and even after googling it I'm no less confused. But given context clues from Ginger's post I imagine its girls shouting glass ceiling at their careers and socioeconomic standing? And while the statistics of male journalism on front page verse female may be true, I don't find it a valid argument. That could be pure coincidence. Maybe there's just stronger established writers who happen to be male, there doesn't have to be anything malevolent about it (Just as seeing a skimpy outfitted dude on Page 3 may not be as overall appealing to the public) It's "yesallwomen" not "yesallgirls." In a nutshell, a male virgin around our age went on a shooting spree as "revenge" against all the women who rejected him. And of course, instead of investigating the sexually-repressed nature of our society or the prescription drugs he was on, or why most men don't know how to get laid, the media is instead focused on reminding us that we are not entitled to women's affection. Yeah, no shit, that's why he killed all of them! I generally try to minimize my time spent reading about all of these "issues" though because at the end of the day, they'll only put me in a bad mood. People are generally just having kneejerk reactions and making mountains out of molehills when it comes to this stuff. As I read this thread, it seems like Ginger's trying to convince us that we've still got women chained to our refrigerators, when in reality, I think most women are doing just fine. Yes there is still sexism and inequality. But it's to a "healthy" level these days and it's something that will never be solved completely until humanity's extinction. EDIT: Got on Facebook, #YesAllWomen is the the #2 "trend" on my newsfeed. What's #1? "EMMA WATSON GRADUATES FROM BROWN UNIVERSITY: Emma Watson considers her education an act of rebellion. So, here she is, sticking it to the man." The irony here is that she got a degree in English instead of something like Engineering so she's keeping that "pay gap" wide for all the men she's trying to rebel against. Wish I knew how to turn off my Facebook "trending" thing. Like I said-- its blatant lack of facts and rationality makes my blood boil :P 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saradomin_Mage Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 How do you even get that trending thing on facebook? You mean top stories? :P In real life MMO you don't get 99 smithing by making endless bronze daggers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggiwhplar Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 Ya it shows up in the upper-right for me, just below Birthdays. Though it also looks like the top trends are shown in a random order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saradomin_Mage Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 Huh, no such thing on my facebook. Lucky me :P In real life MMO you don't get 99 smithing by making endless bronze daggers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obfuscator Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 Wish I knew how to turn off my Facebook "trending" thing. Like I said-- its blatant lack of facts and rationality makes my blood boil :P i had a similar problem a few years ago, but found this handy guide that solved the issue permanently: http://www.wikihow.com/Permanently-Delete-a-Facebook-Account "It's not a rest for me, it's a rest for the weights." - Dom Mazzetti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muggiwhplar Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 Wish I knew how to turn off my Facebook "trending" thing. Like I said-- its blatant lack of facts and rationality makes my blood boil :Pi had a similar problem a few years ago, but found this handy guide that solved the issue permanently: http://www.wikihow.com/Permanently-Delete-a-Facebook-Account Lol the trends are just one of the small prices I have to pay in order to have a simple and free way of keeping in touch with my old friends. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low Levelled Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 I've never understood the rah rah over women being sexualized in the media. If I could get paid to get pictures of me taken while wearing skimpy clothing, I'd do it.If I understand your point correctly, it implies as follows: you don't understand the problem whereby half of the population are given the message, in no uncertain terms, that their careers and aspirations are limited only to the roles that the other half allow them to perform for their own titillating satisfaction, and that in the absence of being able to provide that satisfaction, they aren't worth throwing the money at. If we were talking about race in that context, we'd be calling it apartheid, wouldn't we?Wow, that's a hell of a stretch. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omar Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 Well he had autism, so he lacks a brain capable of empathy and communication skills. Thats my beef with the whole "misagany lead to murder campaign", yes this guy had selfish beliefs but he literally lacks the brain structures needed to change that. That said this could have all been avoided if the mental health system took the warning signs more seriously. Careful with this. Yes, you need to have mental health issues in order to do this kind of thing. That's kind of like saying you need hands in order to strangle people. Matt: You want that eh? You want everything good for you. You want everything that's--falls off garbage can Camera guy: Whoa, haha, are you okay dude? Matt: You want anything funny that happens, don't you? Camera guy: still laughing Matt: You want the funny shit that happens here and there, you think it comes out of your [bleep]ing [wagon] pushes garbage can down, don't you? You think it's funny? It comes out of here! running towards Camera guy Camera guy: runs away still laughing Matt: You think the funny comes out of your mother[bleep]ing creativity? Comes out of Satan, mother[bleep]er! nn--ngh! pushes Camera guy down Camera guy: Hoooholy [bleep]! Matt: FUNNY ISN'T REAL! FUNNY ISN'T REAL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginger_Warrior Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 I'll only respond to those who offer counter-arguments and don't seek to trivialize the topic (since when have I suggested women are 'tied to the refrigerator'?).1. No. Apartheid was legally enforced. It was comparable to Jim Crow laws. 2. Why do you think this is the case? Are more things happening to men? Are newspapers deliberately not covering things that happen to women? Are readers less interested in what happens to women? Not a rhetorical question, just not sure in what sense you think this is evidence of sexism. 3. And 90% of workplace injuries happen to men. Is it any more fair that men are disproportionately expected to put the integrity of their body at stake in order to get a job? Or is doing things you wouldn't do if you weren't getting paid for it exactly what working is?4. But the same thing is true for everyone. I don't care about my baker as an end in and of him or herself. I care about how good he is at baking bread. This is totally normal in a society with more people than you can know personally. 5. I won't comment on Timberlake because I don't remember the song, but you'll note that Thicke hates "blurred lines," not lines. The song is about mixed signals ("the way you grab me [what way, we're not sure, but apparently such that she...] / must want to get nasty"), which, in the interest of consent being taken seriously, should not be part of the lead-up to sex. That song also contrasts Thicke to another man who tried, and failed, to domesticate the woman in question, so I'm not sure where you're seeing that coverture-esque ownership thing.Excellent points, well thought out post. 1) I think the comparison to Jim Crow is more appropriate, you're right, in that the arrangement is dependent on the relationship being an inherently unequal one. The main difference I'd note is that du jure discrimination has been virtually eliminated in the Western world. Another difference is that I don't think the discrimination is as strong today as it was with racism back then. Some men are misogynist and sexualize women at every turn. The majority, I'm convinced, are perfectly decent human beings and do not, but the problem is the former group aren't challenged nearly enough by the latter to change their attitudes or behaviour. 2) Good questions. There's certainly more men in political office, and since politics and economics dominates our newspapers, you might argue that accounts for the increased number of articles about male subjects. What's more concerning, though, is the manner in which women are presented on front pages of newspapers. In 2012, the top two woman most likely to be photographed (by far) were Kate and Pippa Middleton, perhaps not surprisingly following the wedding, but this was not followed by any description of what they've been up to or how this is even newsworthy, as they would have done for a politician, but followed by a blow-by-blow account of what they were wearing and how they appeared. I cannot recall the last time Michael Gove's or George Osbourne's attire was picked apart thread-by-thread to accompany a largely irrelevant and superficial account of their policies for education or the economy (of course, the irony there is they suit up quite well, being politicians in the public eye; perhaps some men wouldn't mind some free advice?). Again, though, the implication that women aren't there do anything useful, only to look pretty while men do the real work, is made, an association which was made ad nauseum with Diana. 3) This one is frequently brought up as a counter-argument to feminism. "Well, men have it bad too in some ways". I'm not going to argue against that, and I don't think most rational feminists would either, at least not the ones that follow the definition of 'wanting equality between both genders'. If we're going into more sociological territory and discussing power imbalances, though, I'd like to give a personal account. A female friend of mine who went to college to study car mechanics and engineering, but had to arrange her own work placement to pass the course, and was told by every garage in my hometown that, "You're a bird... you must be joking!". Women can't very well place themselves in hazardous occupations if discrimination stops them from even accessing those occupations in the first place, wouldn't you agree? 4) I doubt if your male baker was the Secretary of State, you'd ask him what designer shoes he wears, though. OK, you go to your baker for bread and you're not interested in his ideas about the world, I get that. But when it's your job to be foreign minister for the most powerful country on Earth... Is your choice of designer labels what the people are really interested in? 5) Alright then, fair play. How about this one? :P I see you walking home alone, your face is alive and brightBut you can't see how weak you are 'cause I could end it tonightIt's the feeling you get when you think that someone behind is watching youWell I can tell you now, that someone is me and I'm about to make it right [chorus] I creep up from behind, touch your neck, move down your spineYou take a look and breathe so sharpJust a matter of timeDon't scream I ask of you, but then you let one out and now it's time to goI come down on you like a ton of brickAll over so it's time to go Bit rapey? | Favourite Game Music | Last.fm | HYT Friend Chat Rules | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now