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Price manipulation: right or wrong?


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#181
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Also, reading the rules and all the guidelines...well, lets be honest, sucks. Nobody readys them.

erm.....well who's fault is that then? If I'm concerned about something I certainly do read the rules, I have no sympathy for someone who moans about a problem they could have prevented if they had taken responsibility for their own actions. I've been scammed before, when there was no trade limit, yes I was seriously annoyed, but accepted that it was my own fault for getting involved and not checking things out first.




You got scammed? How dare they. Inform me of the cost and I shall ensure you're given the money back out of my own pocket*



*terms and conditions apply - All money's repayable to jrhairychest at standard apr% (569.5%), all moneys paid on demand, your home is at risk if you do not keep up repayment of a mortgage or loan secured on it. If your home is siezed we will tickle your face and go 'ooochy coochy cooooo' and run. ty!



I agree it is up to the player to be aware of the rules, because you cannot claim ignorance when it all goes pear shaped.

Price manipulation is not against the rules, anyone can take advantage of it, if they want to. Occasionally yes, you may lose some money....but really!



Jagex WILL do something about it. Its not a matter of if, its a matter of when.

yes they will, but it has not occured yet, so my point still stands from my previous post:

When they decided they would stop people smoking in a bar, it was still legal (withing the rules) until they actually changed the law. A bar could not be prosecuted until that law was passed. Therefore, if there is no rule against it, it is still 'legal' (within the rules) no matter how much it is frowned on, until that said 'rule' is stated.




And this is why I stand by that its right. In all honesty Jagex don't seem all that bothered about it. If most of the manipulators actually go out of pocket I'd say its a good thing and a lesson learned for most of them.

#182
Erewhon2
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Well...yes, but I do read the small print! Lmao! OMG that is soooo funny, I can't stop laughing....*hic* How can I ever take this debate seriously again????? :lol:
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#183
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Still, it's somewhat wrong, and if Jagex manages to fix this, the GE will return to normal again.

I have no doubt that Jagex will get round to preventing price manipulation from taking place, although I am sure something else will be invented by players trying to make a quick buck at the expense of others...human nature lol. But I must admit, it hasn't had much of an impact on me, I have never been part of it through a clan, nor would I, but I have taken advantage of price swings as I am sure many others have. ;)


I guess the ONLY way to fix this is to make a crapload of bots, make them mass-sell EVERY SINGLE ITEM THAT THERE IS IN RS TODAY, to counter price manipulation.



But then we have the bot problem again. #-o

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#184
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Also, reading the rules and all the guidelines...well, lets be honest, sucks. Nobody readys them.

erm.....well who's fault is that then? If I'm concerned about something I certainly do read the rules, I have no sympathy for someone who moans about a problem they could have prevented if they had taken responsibility for their own actions. I've been scammed before, when there was no trade limit, yes I was seriously annoyed, but accepted that it was my own fault for getting involved and not checking things out first.



Price manipulation is not against the rules, anyone can take advantage of it, if they want to. Occasionally yes, you may lose some money....but really!

Jagex WILL do something about it. Its not a matter of if, its a matter of when.

yes they will, but it has not occured yet, so my point still stands from my previous post:

When they decided they would stop people smoking in a bar, it was still legal (withing the rules) until they actually changed the law. A bar could not be prosecuted until that law was passed. Therefore, if there is no rule against it, it is still 'legal' (within the rules) no matter how much it is frowned on, until that said 'rule' is stated.


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#185
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Also, reading the rules and all the guidelines...well, lets be honest, sucks. Nobody readys them.

erm.....well who's fault is that then? If I'm concerned about something I certainly do read the rules, I have no sympathy for someone who moans about a problem they could have prevented if they had taken responsibility for their own actions. I've been scammed before, when there was no trade limit, yes I was seriously annoyed, but accepted that it was my own fault for getting involved and not checking things out first.




You got scammed? How dare they. Inform me of the cost and I shall ensure you're given the money back out of my own pocket*



*terms and conditions apply - All money's repayable to jrhairychest at standard apr% (569.5%), all moneys paid on demand, your home is at risk if you do not keep up repayment of a mortgage or loan secured on it. If your home is siezed we will tickle your face and go 'ooochy coochy cooooo' and run. ty!



I agree it is up to the player to be aware of the rules, because you cannot claim ignorance when it all goes pear shaped.

Price manipulation is not against the rules, anyone can take advantage of it, if they want to. Occasionally yes, you may lose some money....but really!



Jagex WILL do something about it. Its not a matter of if, its a matter of when.

yes they will, but it has not occured yet, so my point still stands from my previous post:

When they decided they would stop people smoking in a bar, it was still legal (withing the rules) until they actually changed the law. A bar could not be prosecuted until that law was passed. Therefore, if there is no rule against it, it is still 'legal' (within the rules) no matter how much it is frowned on, until that said 'rule' is stated.




And this is why I stand by that its right. In all honesty Jagex don't seem all that bothered about it. If most of the manipulators actually go out of pocket I'd say its a good thing and a lesson learned for most of them.

#186
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Well...yes, but I do read the small print! Lmao! OMG that is soooo funny, I can't stop laughing....*hic* How can I ever take this debate seriously again????? :lol:
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#187
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Still, it's somewhat wrong, and if Jagex manages to fix this, the GE will return to normal again.

I have no doubt that Jagex will get round to preventing price manipulation from taking place, although I am sure something else will be invented by players trying to make a quick buck at the expense of others...human nature lol. But I must admit, it hasn't had much of an impact on me, I have never been part of it through a clan, nor would I, but I have taken advantage of price swings as I am sure many others have. ;)


I guess the ONLY way to fix this is to make a crapload of bots, make them mass-sell EVERY SINGLE ITEM THAT THERE IS IN RS TODAY, to counter price manipulation.



But then we have the bot problem again. #-o

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#188
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I guess the ONLY way to fix this is to make a crapload of bots, make them mass-sell EVERY SINGLE ITEM THAT THERE IS IN RS TODAY, to counter price manipulation.

To be honest, the only way to ensure you are not part of price manipulation is to not use the GE in any size shape or form. It is possible, although it would change the nature of the game for the individual and this has been suggested before. That's why the GE is not like a real economy, we can actually manage without it. It is a choice to use the GE and profit or lose by that use.
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#189
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I guess the ONLY way to fix this is to make a crapload of bots, make them mass-sell EVERY SINGLE ITEM THAT THERE IS IN RS TODAY, to counter price manipulation.



But then we have the bot problem again. #-o




They have stated they will just make it so the price doesn't sharply rise. If they detect a price being manipulated, it just won't go up.

#190
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Also, reading the rules and all the guidelines...well, lets be honest, sucks. Nobody readys them.

erm.....well who's fault is that then? If I'm concerned about something I certainly do read the rules, I have no sympathy for someone who moans about a problem they could have prevented if they had taken responsibility for their own actions. I've been scammed before, when there was no trade limit, yes I was seriously annoyed, but accepted that it was my own fault for getting involved and not checking things out first.



Price manipulation is not against the rules, anyone can take advantage of it, if they want to. Occasionally yes, you may lose some money....but really!

Jagex WILL do something about it. Its not a matter of if, its a matter of when.

yes they will, but it has not occured yet, so my point still stands from my previous post:

When they decided they would stop people smoking in a bar, it was still legal (withing the rules) until they actually changed the law. A bar could not be prosecuted until that law was passed. Therefore, if there is no rule against it, it is still 'legal' (within the rules) no matter how much it is frowned on, until that said 'rule' is stated.






Yes, its their fault for not reading everything. But claiming everyone who does that is ignorant or automatically responsable is simply hyppocritical. Whens the last time you read the T@A to use software or a game? Whens the last time you read the 30 pages of fine print in your contract? If there is an absurd obligation on page 27 Paragraph 6, are you really in the wrong for not reading it?



Also, like I've said before, we must look past the TINY details and look at the big picture. Price Minipulation is wrong. Reguardless if the rules state it is or not. Am I not guilty of murder because the gun killed the person? Did the knife stab someone by itself? Is murder allowed if its not stated in the laws? Is threatening someone with a bomb different from a grenade?



Back to your example...Its true the bar could not be prosecuted. But "right" has two meanings(in this context). Right as in allowed, accepted, and Right as in technically allowed.



Now, is Jagex worried about price minipulation? Yes. Infact I can imagine they've discussed this alot. Just as luring was discussed. Alot of people were pissed they (At the time) didn't do anything about luring. The pressure is mounting. Ignoring won't do any good.

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#191
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Yes, its their fault for not reading everything. But claiming everyone who does that is ignorant or automatically responsable is simply hyppocritical. Whens the last time you read the T@A to use software or a game? Whens the last time you read the 30 pages of fine print in your contract? If there is an absurd obligation on page 27 Paragraph 6, are you really in the wrong for not reading it?

I have to disagree here, people are responsible for themselves. If they don't read the advice or rules, then they shouldn't complain when the inevitable happens. And I always read the small print in a contract, every damn word! Learnt that one the hard way.

Also, like I've said before, we must look past the TINY details and look at the big picture. Price Minipulation is wrong. Reguardless if the rules state it is or not. Am I not guilty of murder because the gun killed the person? Did the knife stab someone by itself? Is murder allowed if its not stated in the laws? Is threatening someone with a bomb different from a grenade?

I don't understand the metaphor here, I am not saying the GE is guilty of price manipulation, but the clans doing the manipulating, therefore it is the person using the tool, not the tool itself to blame. Having said that, some clans playing with price manipulation in an 'on-line' game hardly equates to murder and terrorism now does it????? Lets keep this real and in proportion! :o It's not against the rules, whatever 'moral highground' you may take, do you ever use the GE? Do you ever sell anything when the price is high? If you do, then you too are part of price manipulation however unintentionally. :shame:

I do take advantage and openly admit that.
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