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Range Haters United!


Danno385

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Just a little joke, mate. ::' Relax a bit. :)

 

Compfreak... he doesn't forgive, he doesn't forget, and he definetely doesn't joke.

 

 

 

Who said Range is underpowered...?

 

 

 

Edit: Sure, it could be considered boring... but why wouldn't Magic be as well, then? And taking two at once... Magic too pl0x.

[Summoning guide (AOW)] [Slayer guide] [Melee & Brawl player]

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Just a little joke, mate. ::' Relax a bit. :)

 

 

Got it, but if stricter moderation is *truely* being enforced, posts like this might be dealt with harshly, or more so in the future - making all of us suffer. Keep it in a PM or something :x

 

 

 

Just a little joke, mate. ::' Relax a bit. :)

 

Compfreak... he doesn't forgive, he doesn't forget, and he definetely doesn't joke.

 

Hey now... I'm all business in a debate, but I don't mind personal posts when there's a time and place for them :twss:

 

D03z j00 (ugh) !13k mudk1pz?

 

 

 

Who said Range is underpowered...?

 

No one did, this argument is about range being annoying to those not training it :P

DeviledEgg24.png

Drops: 1x Draconic Visage, 56x Abyssal Whip, 5x Demon Head, D Drops: 37, Barrows Drops: 43, DK Drops: 29

GWD drops: 14,000x Bars, 1x Armadyl Hilt, 2x Armadyl Skirt, 4x Sara Sword, 1x Saradomin Hilt, 8x Bandos Hilt, 8x Bandos Platebody, 9x Bandos Tassets, 4x Bandos Boots, 43x Godsword Shard, 82x Dragon Boots

Dry streak records: Saradomin 412 kills Bandos 988 kills Spirit Mages 633 kills - Slayer Sucks

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I hate training range. I ahte watching steel arrows from magic shortbows penatrate my dragon chainbody and legs like a hot wire through butter. I hate how we can magicly loose more than 2 arrows per minute from a longbow (5 is really pushing it for a short bow too). Then you get a cross bow. In runescape we one hand a weapon that to reload reqires you to use you feet to keep teh end on the ground while you use two hands to pull the string back. Granted I don't expect the rangers to have to deal with realistic ROF weapons, that'd be insane. But I do not like it when people with range levels bellow my defense level can penatrate full dragon using magic bows and less doing damage at such a pace an ancient mage would be hard pressed to keep up. When a melee person would rather take on an ancient mage in CW rather than a same leveled archer, its pretty sad.

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Ok. So let's take it from a melee stand point. Would it make sense if the bots were on the same square and the barrelchest anchor would beat a dagger?
Yes, it would. As soon as your animation starts, you have that monster.

 

 

 

You still haven't addressed my point. The clicks are being received at the exact same time in my scenario with the bots. Who would win? Random chance?

 

 

 

The kill is decided before anyone hits or any animations start. If the meleer wins, he beings to go through his whole 'anchor attack' animation. If the ranger wins, he begins his 'pull out the arrow and notch the bow' animation. If a meleer with an anchor gets the 'attack' signal into the server first, he will beat someone with a dd++ - even though it may take a second or longer for him to hit after the animation, and the person with the dagger may click attack in that time. There isn't more to the 'internet latency'; whoever clicks first gets that monster, as long as they can hit them from where they are standing. The 'illusion' of a ranger getting the monster after you hit is due to latency in your connection watching the ranger, the distance the ranger's arrow has to travel (although the timed hit is still the same), and the time it takes for the 'notch the bow and shoot' animation. Jagex has programed in animations as an afterthought; it's the same way with an AGS, you might miss the whole 'jump and dance' animation if you are hit just after you start it - but your hit will still register. Same goes for healing with a non-combat summon scroll while in combat - you might time it so that you jump up with the scroll animation so that only the hit on the opponent registers, and not your animation - but the hit will still register. The game is programed based on timings and hits; animations are simply layered on top of that.

 

 

 

You're still dancing around the whole animation taking longer point.

 

 

 

While not brought up before, I think the game works in very precise intervals, sort of like basic quantum mechanics, or at the very least, rounds. If we were to time a fight in milliseconds, a player could only actually make an attack at 100 milliseconds, 200 milliseconds, 300 milliseconds, etc. Calculations, actual splash, start of animation, whatever you want, they can only occur at these times. I'm pretty sure most people have noticed the precise and calculated intervals at which a player attacks with any given weapon. You might also notice a delay between you performing an action and your character actually going to perform it (Picking up bones is really obvious).

 

 

 

This minimizes your arguments of reaction time and Internet latency. I'm pretty sure that Jagex wouldn't have made it so that if player As click is received at 10 ms while player Bs click is received at 15ms (and a gap of 5 ms is ridiculously small) player A would win regardless of what weapon they use. A more realistic approach is to round down the two times down to the closest "interval", which would most likely be the same if the players are pretty much the same speed considering these intervals probably wouldn't be super tiny, then another factor would come into play as to which player would win. A probable factor is actual weapon speeds.

 

 

 

It's very often that a ranger "wins" a monster against a meleer. Very rarely has a ranger on rapid who's paying attention loses out to a battle axe. This has only happened to me once for reasons unknown. Why would it be so consistent across RS? It would be hard to believe that ALL meleers have slower reflexes than rangers.

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You still haven't addressed my point. The clicks are being received at the exact same time in my scenario with the bots. Who would win? Random chance?
Welcome to the electronic world, where measurments are taken in billionths of a second and there is no such thing as at the same time. One person's signal reaches Jagex before the other.

 

 

 

You're still dancing around the whole animation taking longer point.
What? That's exactly what I said - the numbers and mechanics operate independently of the animations, which are simply tacked on afterwords, sometimes messing up.

 

 

While not brought up before, I think the game works in very precise intervals, sort of like basic quantum mechanics, or at the very least, rounds. If we were to time a fight in milliseconds, a player could only actually make an attack at 100 milliseconds, 200 milliseconds, 300 milliseconds, etc. Calculations, actual splash, start of animation, whatever you want, they can only occur at these times. I'm pretty sure most people have noticed the precise and calculated intervals at which a player attacks with any given weapon. You might also notice a delay between you performing an action and your character actually going to perform it (Picking up bones is really obvious).

That's due to animations being added on. I'm not sure what your talking about with your rounds - I've never noticed it, with thousands of hours of play time logged. An example would serve your point - the only ones you offered were directly addressed with my comments on animations. And what was with the random quantim mechanics thrown in? Quantum mechanics has to do with randomness on the atomic level, not set intervals.

 

 

This minimizes your arguments of reaction time and Internet latency. I'm pretty sure that Jagex wouldn't have made it so that if player As click is received at 10 ms while player Bs click is received at 15ms (and a gap of 5 ms is ridiculously small) player A would win regardless of what weapon they use. A more realistic approach is to round down the two times down to the closest "interval", which would most likely be the same if the players are pretty much the same speed considering these intervals probably wouldn't be super tiny, then another factor would come into play as to which player would win. A probable factor is actual weapon speeds.

Why wouldn't they? If a player clicks on a monster first, they get it. Period. It doesn't have a thing to do with weapon speeds sin the KB. It's very easy for a server to determine which message came in first. The only limiting factor in electronic transmissions is the speed of light, which isn't too big of a concern given that we are mixing in human response times.

 

 

It's very often that a ranger "wins" a monster against a meleer. Very rarely has a ranger on rapid who's paying attention loses out to a battle axe. This has only happened to me once for reasons unknown. Why would it be so consistent across RS? It would be hard to believe that ALL meleers have slower reflexes than rangers.

How many people have you tested this with? As a melee player, I virtually always get the monster - I average at LEAST 9\10 'grabs' against a ranger. The main reason that meleers lose is because they don't position themselves exactly along the 'square' of the monster, and thus have to step backwards or forwards to attack, giving the ranger extra time.

 

 

 

 

I hate training range. I ahte watching steel arrows from magic shortbows penatrate my dragon chainbody and legs like a hot wire through butter. I hate how we can magicly loose more than 2 arrows per minute from a longbow (5 is really pushing it for a short bow too). Then you get a cross bow. In runescape we one hand a weapon that to reload reqires you to use you feet to keep teh end on the ground while you use two hands to pull the string back. Granted I don't expect the rangers to have to deal with realistic ROF weapons, that'd be insane. But I do not like it when people with range levels bellow my defense level can penatrate full dragon using magic bows and less doing damage at such a pace an ancient mage would be hard pressed to keep up. When a melee person would rather take on an ancient mage in CW rather than a same leveled archer, its pretty sad.

 

I hate training range. I ahte watching steel arrows from magic shortbows penatrate my dragon chainbody and legs like a hot wire through butter. I hate how we can magicly loose more than 2 arrows per minute from a longbow (5 is really pushing it for a short bow too). Then you get a cross bow. In runescape we one hand a weapon that to reload reqires you to use you feet to keep teh end on the ground while you use two hands to pull the string back. Granted I don't expect the rangers to have to deal with realistic ROF weapons, that'd be insane. But I do not like it when people with range levels bellow my defense level can penatrate full dragon using magic bows and less doing damage at such a pace an ancient mage would be hard pressed to keep up. When a melee person would rather take on an ancient mage in CW rather than a same leveled archer, its pretty sad.

 

Ehh? An ancient mage will devastate a person in a d chain vs. a ranger; the meleer can't even touch him. And your complaining that range is overpowered in the combat triangle, which has nothing to do with this rant :shock:

DeviledEgg24.png

Drops: 1x Draconic Visage, 56x Abyssal Whip, 5x Demon Head, D Drops: 37, Barrows Drops: 43, DK Drops: 29

GWD drops: 14,000x Bars, 1x Armadyl Hilt, 2x Armadyl Skirt, 4x Sara Sword, 1x Saradomin Hilt, 8x Bandos Hilt, 8x Bandos Platebody, 9x Bandos Tassets, 4x Bandos Boots, 43x Godsword Shard, 82x Dragon Boots

Dry streak records: Saradomin 412 kills Bandos 988 kills Spirit Mages 633 kills - Slayer Sucks

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Range skill itself is quite likeable, most of the time you don't have to pay attention at all.

 

 

 

But if people start to pick on multiple, but limited (let say only 3)spawns and not finish the kill, that's the problem. (putting aside the value of drops and put aside why anyone would train there in the first place.)

 

 

 

In f2p there aren't much ranging spots, the ones that came to my mind were Crandor lessers, mosses, crawlers, spiders, ankous, hill giants (non wildy), wildy lessers, greaters. Most of which are also melee dominated. You are bound to have limited spawns regardless if you're using any method of combat.

 

 

 

Ex. I find that the zombies graveyard west of clan war was a decent spot for ranging, then after a while meleers came, killing the ones that are attacking me, really....What the hell.

 

 

 

I find the ranging skill both love and hate, its slow but useful. The main reason for me would be train range because I already got max melee.

Total Level 2247- 11x 99s All Combat Skills, Slayer, Summoning, Woodcutting, Herblore

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I see what your trying to say, but its a part of Runescape and you can't change it. Range is actually one of my favorite skills, and not everyone who ranges is ill mannered. I realize that some can be jerks, but you cannot go out there and say all rangers are horrible. :ohnoes: It could start a fight.

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The last thing I don't like is training range. It is absolutly no fun at all. Standing behind bars or across a stream hitting 1-4 for 40 levels is not my idea of fun. At under level 20 magic you can already hit 8+ and with melee atleast you see your max hit go up slowly but surly!

 

 

 

While camping out at Rock Crabs (for lower levels) is a lot of fun I presume.

 

 

 

You are not worried about the melee max hit being the same as range as it will keep increasing slowly.. range doesn't remain constant :?

 

 

 

Guaranteed you won't find all the skills interesting, even I don't, but the reasons you give for "hating" range don't look stable.

 

 

 

Thanks..

 

Lord Shalaj

[99 Woodcutting] [99 Strength][99 Hitpoints]

 

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"What will come, will come..

..We will have to face it when it does!"

 

Farming With Profit and VineSweeper Guide

A better method to slay Dagannoths!

 

PvP drops:

[hide=]1 x Vesta's Chainbody, 3 x Brawling gloves (Melee [1], Range [1], Magic [1])[/hide]

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It does seem to me that Rangers do get the first hit if multiple people attempt to attack a monster.

 

 

 

The only thing that really bugs me is arrows stealers. When I range I don't expect people to take my arrows because I pay good money for them. :evil:

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It does seem to me that Rangers do get the first hit if multiple people attempt to attack a monster.

 

Myth. Due to meleers generally not being properly aligned and forced to take a step backwards or forwards to attack, putting them at a significant disadvantage. Whoever

 

 

 

The only thing that really bugs me is arrows stealers. When I range I don't expect people to take my arrows because I pay good money for them. :evil:

 

The 3k ground limit took care of this. Plus the accumulator.

DeviledEgg24.png

Drops: 1x Draconic Visage, 56x Abyssal Whip, 5x Demon Head, D Drops: 37, Barrows Drops: 43, DK Drops: 29

GWD drops: 14,000x Bars, 1x Armadyl Hilt, 2x Armadyl Skirt, 4x Sara Sword, 1x Saradomin Hilt, 8x Bandos Hilt, 8x Bandos Platebody, 9x Bandos Tassets, 4x Bandos Boots, 43x Godsword Shard, 82x Dragon Boots

Dry streak records: Saradomin 412 kills Bandos 988 kills Spirit Mages 633 kills - Slayer Sucks

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not everyone who ranges is ill mannered. I realize that some can be jerks, but you cannot go out there and say all rangers are horrible. :ohnoes:

 

 

 

Exactly, it's that percentage of rangers that people have learned to hate that give rangers the bad rep. Most rangers I meet here and there are actually quite nice. Instead of being like "For [insert swear]'s sake, stop taking 2 of them and share, you dumb ranger" or something along those lines, I just hop worlds. If not that, I wait for him to mess up/ lag and take one of his monsters \'

 

 

 

@ The thing about rangers getting the monster first because X reason and Internet Connection:

 

 

 

...... I don't know what to say... I'm clueless on that subject :lol:

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F2P for life :D

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Usually the people who hate range avidly and call it stupid are those idiots who dont know how to spell. No real offence..

 

 

 

Melee has a halberd. You can hit spacing from 2 spots away. Dont complain about ranged, you have pretty much the same bonus in melee.

 

 

 

Prince, you only win cause of your ranged defence. I dont see why a melee'er is complaining about a type they EASILY defeat.

 

 

 

Yomyth has probably said the most realistic thing.

 

 

 

Oh and, I have NEVER run into someone taking 2 monsters with range at one time. Even if they did I wouldnt make a thread.

 

 

 

Honestly, if you hate range just dont train it and dont diss it.

 

 

 

Ever thought that melee is lame?

 

It's not. But ranged can come in MUCH handier, and probably will.

I dont need a siggy no moar.

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Well, as much as there are points for you to hate about rangers, there are also some points that can be considered as a weak point for rangers, that make it a bit of a plight for them at times. Being that you are pure F2P, you may not understand the example that I am about to make, as it refers to a P2P area.

 

 

 

Rangers that I see in the Taverly Member's Dungeon training on/ killing blue dragons can often get their target stolen away if they start getting attacked by a baby. Safe spots for a ranger that provide protection from adults and babies are few and I have occasionally seen requests for food from rangers, whose armor does little to save them from the babies' melee attacks.

 

 

 

Another thing to consider is cost. With the exception of Barrows, any melee gear is a one-time cost for permanent use. For mages and rangers, they may have one permanent fixture (bow or staff) but still require ammo (arrows or runes) for it to work. I understand that you can argue that that's what runecrafting and fletching are for, but not everyone chooses to train those skills, and just like smithing, it can take a long time before you get to the more useful equipment.

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I would like to say that when I posted this it was origanly for people who do not like range to talk to each other about not liking it. If some of you want to post about how much you love range and how much you hate people who don't like it then start a new post called "Range Lovers United".

 

 

 

BTW Comp Freak you don't need to quote this.

In fact, I do have some pancake mix.

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I would like to say that when I posted this it was origanly for people who do not like range to talk to each other about not liking it. If some of you want to post about how much you love range and how much you hate people who don't like it then start a new post called "Range Lovers United".

 

 

 

BTW Comp Freak you don't need to quote this.

 

Why not?

 

 

 

Oh, and if you want to start some sort of range hating clan that refuses to talk to all those who support range, the rants forum isn't quite the place. :wall:

DeviledEgg24.png

Drops: 1x Draconic Visage, 56x Abyssal Whip, 5x Demon Head, D Drops: 37, Barrows Drops: 43, DK Drops: 29

GWD drops: 14,000x Bars, 1x Armadyl Hilt, 2x Armadyl Skirt, 4x Sara Sword, 1x Saradomin Hilt, 8x Bandos Hilt, 8x Bandos Platebody, 9x Bandos Tassets, 4x Bandos Boots, 43x Godsword Shard, 82x Dragon Boots

Dry streak records: Saradomin 412 kills Bandos 988 kills Spirit Mages 633 kills - Slayer Sucks

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Indeed, rants are a place to vent about things that make you mad in Runescape. In this case, rangers. In doing so, people with their assortment of opinions and views comment on the subject. If you are saying that if you had it your way, all pro-range comments would be erased, then you are more along the lines of a cult. I may not always like the rangers I encounter, but I at times find use in the skill.

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I would like to say that when I posted this it was origanly for people who do not like range to talk to each other about not liking it. If some of you want to post about how much you love range and how much you hate people who don't like it then start a new post called "Range Lovers United".

 

 

 

BTW Comp Freak you don't need to quote this.

 

Why not?

 

 

 

Oh, and if you want to start some sort of range hating clan that refuses to talk to all those who support range, the rants forum isn't quite the place. :wall:

 

 

 

I am ranting what I do not like about somthing and seeing what other people have to say about it. I am not starting a topic for people to critsize everything anyone not like them says. I am not critisizeing everyone not like me I am only critiszeing the person who is posting non stop here. Please, you have made you point 15 different times so you do not need to post here anymore. And don't take this as a chance to say that you can post wherever you want because I understand that. Its just that all of your posts after your first have been almost pointless.

In fact, I do have some pancake mix.

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I would like to say that when I posted this it was origanly for people who do not like range to talk to each other about not liking it. If some of you want to post about how much you love range and how much you hate people who don't like it then start a new post called "Range Lovers United".

 

 

 

BTW Comp Freak you don't need to quote this.

 

Why not?

 

 

 

Oh, and if you want to start some sort of range hating clan that refuses to talk to all those who support range, the rants forum isn't quite the place. :wall:

 

 

 

I am ranting what I do not like about somthing and seeing what other people have to say about it. I am not starting a topic for people to critsize everything anyone not like them says. I am not critisizeing everyone not like me I am only critiszeing the person who is posting non stop here. Please, you have made you point 15 different times so you do not need to post here anymore. And don't take this as a chance to say that you can post wherever you want because I understand that. Its just that all of your posts after your first have been almost pointless.

 

My posts have not been pointless; in fact, they have been the exact opposite, unlike your own. You posted some problems you had with range; I posted about why I believed they were not problems. Then you went off on an irrelevant tangent about how people shouldn't post if they don't agree with you. This is the real world, where not everyone agrees with you, and freedom of speech is an inalienable right. A forum is for discussion, not saying 'I'm right and everyone else is wrong, and I refuse to let them say they disagree with me". My posts have been valid, if somewhat impersonal - they are discussing, and in some cases refuting, important points brought up in discussion about your original posts. Your posts, on the other hand, have been nothing but spam, contributing nothing to the discussion and doing nothing but whining about how other people don't agree with you, even though you can't say anything against them. I have nothing wrong with you disagreeing with me; however, I do have a problem with you saying I cannot post anything that disagrees with you. If you can say something constructive, instead of hypocritically flaming me, feel free to post it - but until then, I will continue this discussion.

 

Thank you.

 

 

 

Cordially yours,

 

~DeviledEgg24

DeviledEgg24.png

Drops: 1x Draconic Visage, 56x Abyssal Whip, 5x Demon Head, D Drops: 37, Barrows Drops: 43, DK Drops: 29

GWD drops: 14,000x Bars, 1x Armadyl Hilt, 2x Armadyl Skirt, 4x Sara Sword, 1x Saradomin Hilt, 8x Bandos Hilt, 8x Bandos Platebody, 9x Bandos Tassets, 4x Bandos Boots, 43x Godsword Shard, 82x Dragon Boots

Dry streak records: Saradomin 412 kills Bandos 988 kills Spirit Mages 633 kills - Slayer Sucks

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Your (compfreak) posts have been pointles because they have had the same message everytime: range rules, everybody eles sucks. The only person on here I have atacked has been you.

In fact, I do have some pancake mix.

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Your (compfreak) posts have been pointles because they have had the same message everytime: range rules, everybody eles sucks. The only person on here I have atacked has been you.

 

 

 

You're digging yourself in deeper. Compfreak has provided very accurate and informative tidbits for range haters. You seem to be ranting that he's killing your rant. :-k

I love to meet people; send me a pm if you see me on RuneScape! :)

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Your (compfreak) posts have been pointles because they have had the same message everytime: range rules, everybody eles sucks. The only person on here I have atacked has been you.

 

All my posts (except for the last) have been reasonable and contained useful, accurate information facilitating clear, though provoking discussion. I have stated my opinions, and why I believe them; I have also altered and accepted them. You, on the other hand, have come here, posted one not-well-thought-out rant about range, then continually posted whining about how I didn't agree with you, while I and several others debated the finer points of your rant. If you could show me where I stated that 'everyone eles sucks", I could try and change4 that. However, until you do that, I will be forced to conclude that you really don't know what your talking about, and either refuse to or cannot back up your rant against the points I have come up with. Your posts, not mine, have been pure, simple spam, contributing nothing whatsoever to the discussion. Feel free to post if you wish to discuss how range sucks, but do not continue to rant at me. The very same fate you so wisely warned us of in the first post may befall you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

You're digging yourself in deeper. Compfreak has provided very accurate and informative tidbits for range haters. You seem to be ranting that he's killing your rant. :-k

 

:lol:

 

I have by no means killed the rant; I have simply brought up why I don't agree with what he is saying. If he wants to, he can explain why he believes I am incorrect, and so forth, making this an actual debate, not a 'wahh! you don't agree with me! stop posting on my threads!".

DeviledEgg24.png

Drops: 1x Draconic Visage, 56x Abyssal Whip, 5x Demon Head, D Drops: 37, Barrows Drops: 43, DK Drops: 29

GWD drops: 14,000x Bars, 1x Armadyl Hilt, 2x Armadyl Skirt, 4x Sara Sword, 1x Saradomin Hilt, 8x Bandos Hilt, 8x Bandos Platebody, 9x Bandos Tassets, 4x Bandos Boots, 43x Godsword Shard, 82x Dragon Boots

Dry streak records: Saradomin 412 kills Bandos 988 kills Spirit Mages 633 kills - Slayer Sucks

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