Faux Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 With the UAW in their cradle and their current car line up, it would a waste of money to bail these guys out :: Guess the Movie Contest Champion: pfilc23 :: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoi_Tu Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Just to note since the media likes to warp things, bail out means loan. I think both GM and Ford can pull themselves out with a little help, but Chrysler I'm not so sure needs the help. Both GM and Ford are such widespread companies that own many other car companies and I think it would be wise to loan them the $25 billion. Beer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tryto Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 The government shouldn't bail out ANYONE. It's your tax dollars, which is just slushed into the government's coffers and then sent to these companies. If they created a product which people actually wanted, then they wouldn't need handouts. If they don't, then they don't serve a purpose and should collapse to free up the market. They're not going to be able to repay this loan; all car companies have been doing lately is losing more and more ground to other companies, which simply make better cars that are desired more than theirs. When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him. ~Jonathan SwiftWebsite Updates/Corrections here. WE APPRECIATE YOUR INPUT! Crewbie's Missions!Contributor of the Day!Thanks to artists: Destro3979, Guthix121, Shivers21, and Unoalexi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Range_This11 Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Terrible idea. Let them go bankrupt. If their cars aren't selling, there is a reason. People don't want unreliable American-made gas-guzzling cars anymore. "He could climb to it, if he climbed alone, and once there he could suck on the pap of life, gulp down the incomparable milk of wonder." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aeternitatis Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 We aren't all American, explain what's going on? "Only by going too far can one find out how far one can go." T.S. Eliot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackattack Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Terrible idea. Let them go bankrupt. If their cars aren't selling, there is a reason. People don't want unreliable American-made gas-guzzling cars anymore. What are you talking about? GM has a huge lineup of hybrids/electric cars coming up within the next year or so. Even the Sierra gets 20mpg. It's kind of silly that people are talking about bailing them out though. The unions have strangled them to death. The big 3 pay their employees 50% more than any other car companies. That is a good thing but why would you need government money when you can do that? Why doesn't the government stop making them retool their factories because of all these silly restrictions? That would surely save them some money. My carbon footprint is bigger than yours...and you know what they say about big feet. These are the times that try mens souls... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoi_Tu Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Terrible idea. Let them go bankrupt. If their cars aren't selling, there is a reason. People don't want unreliable American-made gas-guzzling cars anymore. Just to be clear, GM is also Buick, Cadillac, Chevrolet, GMC, Hummer, Saturn, Oldsmobile, Pontiac, Saab, Opel (GM's European division), Vauxhall (GM's British division), and Holden (Australian I think). Ford is also Lincoln, Mercury, Mazda, and Volvo. Chrysler may own Mercedes, but I can never remember where Mercedes goes. Also, a lot of foreign cars are American made now and even vice versa. The government shouldn't bail out ANYONE. It's your tax dollars, which is just slushed into the government's coffers and then sent to these companies. If they created a product which people actually wanted, then they wouldn't need handouts. If they don't, then they don't serve a purpose and should collapse to free up the market. People do want their cars (granted not the full size trucks and SUVs), but they don't want to spend money right now. Beer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azvareth Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 We aren't all American, explain what's going on? Yeah seriously, this is quite annoying. It's only proper to give a short backstory in your OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoi_Tu Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 We aren't all American, explain what's going on? Yeah seriously, this is quite annoying. It's only proper to give a short backstory in your OP. Here's an article with some numbers: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/04/business/04auto.html?ref=automobiles The grim results particularly for General Motors, whose sales dropped by 45 percent during the month raised new concerns about the chances of survival for Detroits troubled Big Three. Basically, three big American auto companies, GM, Ford, and Chrysler, are doing much worse than the rest of the industry in the US and the government is now debating whether to help them out or let them potentially go bankrupt. Some other articles: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/12/business/12auto.html?ref=automobiles http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/13/business/economy/13bankruptcy.html?_r=1&adxnnl=1&ref=automobiles&adxnnlx=1227042094-jrjX6759Tj/4aLAYpa2prQ Beer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deloriagod Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 I say we give them a little help. Maybe they won't make it but I don't mind as long as they're not giving their high end employees big end of the year bonuses with that money like some other company *hint hint* Internet Marketing For Newbies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biabf Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 They have to bail out the Big 3. As they own most big western car companies, if they go under, wont the western car industry be completely [bleep]ed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magekillr Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 I'd rather the government just take over completely, but if a "bailout" is the only other option (minus letting them die), I'd take the "bailout". For the record, the last time a car company was "bailed out", we profited. Furthermore, I'd rather not lose millions of jobs in a sinking economy (directly from the car companies, and the millions of others indirectly involved). Strict strict oversight, however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoi_Tu Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 I'd rather the government just take over completely, but if a "bailout" is the only other option (minus letting them die), I'd take the "bailout". For the record, the last time a car company was "bailed out", we profited. Furthermore, I'd rather not lose millions of jobs in a sinking economy (directly from the car companies, and the millions of others indirectly involved). Strict strict oversight, however. Just curious, what was the last one we bailed out? Beer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magekillr Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 I'd rather the government just take over completely, but if a "bailout" is the only other option (minus letting them die), I'd take the "bailout". For the record, the last time a car company was "bailed out", we profited. Furthermore, I'd rather not lose millions of jobs in a sinking economy (directly from the car companies, and the millions of others indirectly involved). Strict strict oversight, however. Just curious, what was the last one we bailed out? Chrysler under Jimmy Carter in 1980. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sbrideau Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 I say they should have the bail out. Good car companies (example: Toyota or Honda) need competitors to stay good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 It may be a good idea, because they'll bring other car companies down with them if these 'Big 3' collapse. Though it is a case of making cars which are ACTUALLY desirable, not just gas guzzlers which pollute our towns & cities. 2257AD.TUMBLR.COM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_am_Geed Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 the big 3 go under, the US economy collapses, imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deiophobus Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Don't those car industries supply jobs to a huge amount of the American workforce? So them going bankrupt would make unemployment skyrocket? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 ^Yes, probably :wall: 2257AD.TUMBLR.COM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenticular_J Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 If they created a product which people actually wanted, then they wouldn't need handouts. Inorite? What the [bleep]'s an "automobile"? These are companies that really need it. They've needed help ever since Japan basically took over the car market, it's just a bigger deal now because they have a chance to get help. Ford and Chevy, especially, are too nice. They have hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people working for them or who have worked for them. Paying millions of people wages and pension in the current economy when your vehicles aren't the bestsellers is tough. Wierd that I say that, since you can't walk down street in Texas without seeing a Ford or Chevy. catch it now so you can like it before it went so mainstream Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magekillr Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 What are you talking about? GM has a huge lineup of hybrids/electric cars coming up within the next year or so. Even the Sierra gets 20mpg. Well let's see: the cars are pieces of [cabbage] compared to foreign cars, in that they die in half of the time; they get crap mileage; they're huge [wagon] cars that people don't need. I like how you perceive "20 mpg" as good mileage. Although, in their defense, they're just feeding the demand of the public with their huge over sized, over polluting, crap mileage cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_am_Geed Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Don't those car industries supply jobs to a huge amount of the American workforce? So them going bankrupt would make unemployment skyrocket? yes, they do, without them we lose so many jobs its uthinkable. Try to have an economy running with many people out of the workforce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenticular_J Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Mage...What? Chevies and Fords are the longest-lasting cars I've ever driven. My grandpa has a thirty-year old Chevy that still runs fine. And a lot of people do need them. I have a job fairly set in stone with a landscaping company when I turn seventeen, and you have to haul materials (they do a lot of the richer estates). Am I gonna haul that in an Accord? catch it now so you can like it before it went so mainstream Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magekillr Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Yes, people do need them. Most, do not. You'll see 75-80% of our population driving these tanking things down the road, just count them (this is my anecdote). It's always 1 person driving them, too (more often it's a woman than a man, probably stay at home). Well, I'm not interested in your cool anecdote, because I trust statistics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faux Posted November 18, 2008 Author Share Posted November 18, 2008 Mage...What? Chevies and Fords are the longest-lasting cars I've ever driven. My grandpa has a thirty-year old Chevy that still runs fine. And a lot of people do need them. I have a job fairly set in stone with a landscaping company when I turn seventeen, and you have to haul materials (they do a lot of the richer estates). Am I gonna haul that in an Accord? Longest-lasting != reliability A car can exist forever, it's a question of how many times it ends up in the shop And don't be a fool. There's the Tundra/Tacoma offered by Toyota :: Guess the Movie Contest Champion: pfilc23 :: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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