Holiday Musings and a permanent solution to rares

[das]

We don't need items to show how long we've been playing

 

 

 

I've played since july 2001.

 

I am fine with giving RS2 players rs2 holiday items, but keep my classic items untradeables for classic players, not for RS2 players.

 

 

 

As a proud classic player, I like the abilty to be distinguished and my age should give me the perks over RS2 players of having my pointing ears and scythe.

[Yoko Kurama]

 

 

 

As a proud classic player, I like the abilty to be distinguished and my age should give me the perks over RS2 players of having my pointing ears and scythe.

 

 

 

On that note, I have been playing since late 2001, and I was there on each of the days that the coveted non-tradeable rares were dropped, yet I was unable to get either of them. I didn't complain or partake in any of the 'riots' that occurred, but I do think that people that were present on the days that the untradable rares were dropped should be able to get them.

[Lordjake]

I read the whole thing, and I think it's a horrible set of ideas.

 

I played rs1, but missed the bunny/scythe events, and you don't see me begging Jagex to bring them back for a new event. I'm disappointed that I didn't get em, but I'm not asking Jagex to ruin the economy so I could get a clothing item.

 

 

 

Speaking from an economical standpoint, it would have severe consequences for everything that isn't removed. If you think rare items are bad, just wait when the price of raw materials doubles or triples due to the massive influx of gp into circulation.

 

Now that I think about it, I don't think there's even enough items out there to meet the total value of all the rares that would be removed from the game.

 

If you were to liquidate my bank, I'd be able to buy every single air rune put in the GE for almost 48 hours... imagine what kind of havoc that would create if no one would be able to buy air runes in the GE for a weekend. Now multiply that by like 10000, and that's what would happen if you had your way.

 

People will have access to the useless rares of the past (whoopie! now they can't complain anymore!), but they wouldn't be able to afford armor or food to train with... surely that's not what you wanted.

 

 

 

A new skill or skill add-on wouldn't hardly remove any of the GP brought in through the liquidation of the rares, especially if all the f2p-haters out there had their way. There's a huge amount of wealth out there in the banks of f2pers and ex-p2pers - an amount that's impossible to know.

 

Not only would the skill have to be both f2p and p2p, it would have to be awesome enough to justify blowing 100s of millions of GP on to level-up... something that Jagex hasn't done yet.

[das]

Good to see you around Lordjake, i remember you fondly from the old days

[Rien]

I believe Jard_Y_Dooku means well, but several of his ideas have not been thought through entirely.

 

 

 

Let me begin by stating that I do not believe that past holiday music, emote, and untradeable item rewards should have been--or should ever be--made available to those who may have missed them upon their initial release. As harsh as it may sound, not everyone is entitled to the same opportunities afforded long-term players.

 

The items. Why can't everyone get these? Why can't Joe Newb ever get a scythe? He just turned 13, and thus was of age to start playing RuneScape. It's not his fault that he didn't join 8 years ago. It's like blaming someone for being a particular race. He or she can't choose it, and should be given the same opportunity as a person from another race.

Why should everyone be able to receive these? I would agree with the above sentiment were the rewards to have been of any practical use, but this is clearly not the case. The players not fortunate enough to have been playing when the past holiday rewards were released are by no means disadvantaged by their misfortune. Long-term players do not benefit from having unlocked a few more music tracks and emotions than their younger-generation counterparts. And what of the item rewards? Let's accept it; the Scythe is no Abyssal Whip, and nor is any other reward extraordinary in any other way. It may not be Joe Newb's "fault" that he is younger than the typical 'Scaper and therefore has not been able to play as long, but this alone does not entitle him to the holiday rewards of years past. He is not being discriminated against and no one is laying any sort of blame on anyone else. These rewards have become prestigious as a result of their age and rarity--again, they are of no practical value to their owners. They have simply become a status symbol of the "Old-School." Really, the only reason why many players today wish to possess these rewards is because the rewards are associated with the long-term players and *mistakenly* their subsequent success. Ironically, if everyone were to receive these rewards today, they would essentially lose their inherent prestige and the items would be, for the most part, dumped on Diango to rot for eternity. As long as holiday rewards continue to offer no practical benefits, it cannot be asserted that younger players are being discriminated against or disadvantaged, as the rewards present no obstacle for them to overcome.

 

 

 

THAT WAS THE ORIGINAL IDEA. It was because of players' greed that partyhats were abused and raised to their ridiculous price. They are USELESS items that do absolutely nothing.

I agree with several other posters in that the tradeable rares are not "broken" and therefore do not require "fixing." Granted, Jagex probably did not intend for the rare items to become as grossly expensive as they have, but I see nothing wrong with this. Not everything follows or has followed Jagex's intentions and plans, but this does not mean that the unexpected results are necessarily detrimental. Emergent gameplay has long been an important aspect in MMORPGs, and how the rare items have been adapted to players' needs is only one more example. Affluent players, in recent years, have needed some other form of medium other than the gold piece to transfer and hold their wealth, what with the item cap of 2.1B (or whatever it happens to be) limiting the amount of gold they may possess at any one time. Naturally, they required some form of item or items that were of high-value and possessed relative market stability to ensure the reliability of their investment. Obviously, this lead to the conclusion that items of increasingly greater rarity would make for successively more reliable mediums, as their high-value could be better assured and preserved. The tradeable holiday item rewards--being finite and already a number of years old--made for the perfect canidate. Should these wealth mediums ever be removed from the game, it can be stated with a great deal of assurance that other, similarly "rare" items--such as high-end Treasure Trail items and Monster Drops--would only be made to figuratively "pick up the slack." Imagine the effect on Third-Age items--already ridiculously difficult to obtain as it stands--should the Rares be removed. They would become practically impossible to find, while all other high-end armours, weapons, and items would increase significantly in price. So, rather ironically, removing the Rares would only serve to release the floodgate that's currently keeping many useful items (e.g. Godswords, Dragon Armour, Barrows Armour, etc...) affordable to the RuneScape public. This would only hurt the people meant to benefit from such a misguided "solution"--sure, lower level players might be able to wear party hats and the like after such an action, but being able to afford gear of actual use to them would become significantly more difficult thereafter.

 

 

 

What Jard_Y_Dooku suggests should be done for the "greater good" of the game and its players could only prove to be catastrophic, ultimately. I don't mean this to be taken as offense, as I do respect him as a generally well-informed player and for his excellent guide work, but these suggestions are, as I believe, misguided.

[Mirror]

N&K here

 

 

 

But as some have stated here, the economic view from this would certainly cause inflation beyond my wildest imagination. Personally, I don't have a problem with tradeable rares. I know I will never be able to make it to the value of a party hat, but I am perfectly fine with that. It's a symbol of a game that I once missed (story not going into) and I will always regard it as that. But the problem with this, it's all my view, not what the community wants. It's all what Jagex wants to do. Sadly, I am going to say this, but it's their game. They get to choose what they want to do with the game. Whether that be to listen to their players (which it seems is what they are trying to do now) or follow their own plan, so be it. If the community wants what this topic proposed, then hats off to them if they follow through with such an idea.

 

 

 

So now the question is simple yet complicated at the same time, does the community want the current system or a new system? I have heard both views come from this thread, which is arguable that this was bound to be seen in any good discussion, but I think it needs to come down to the economical stand point. It's not a point of wants but rather a point of necessities. Sure some people want hats, but is it feasible? There is a cap, 2.1B to be exact. No gp can go past that, it's a numerical problem with the sequence, not something that is entirely able to be fixed. If the system was created to change all tradeable rares into an influx of gp, then that wealth could be lost by the cap or more likely, put into other products (and this is the inflation). This is following your first (which seems to be the most popular) idea. Following the second idea of just without warning, removing the trade status from the items, I think would cause an uproar from those that are rich enough to have purchased an item of worth. If knowledge was known of the change, some actions would have changed, and money be put into other products, which will still cause inflation, but not at the same rate as the first idea, because some users would still like to purchase the items before the were "discontinued" again, this time from everyone by use of the removal of trade status. I would prefer this method over the first one, due to the impact being lessened rather than being heightened.

 

 

 

*Note: Did not talk about the actual first idea. It would have the same economic problems as that of the ideas stated above.*

 

 

 

So in conclusion, it's all about the economics and the rares. Wealth needs to be put somewhere and tradeable rares are a great way to put money into things besides the gp. Jagex needs to pick the best economical choice, which I think is to keep it the same. No harm really is being done besides keeping an arguably ever growing want at certain items, but I think that adds to the flavor of this game. I will certainly never be able to hear the word Party Hat the same way again due to this game. And I will always enjoy that.

 

 

 

Thanks for the post!

[Makoto_the_Phoenix]

...Should these wealth mediums ever be removed from the game, it can be stated with a great deal of assurance that other, similarly "rare" items--such as high-end Treasure Trail items and Monster Drops--would only be made to figuratively "pick up the slack." Imagine the effect on Third-Age items--already ridiculously difficult to obtain as it stands--should the Rares be removed. They would become practically impossible to find, while all other high-end armours, weapons, and items would increase significantly in price. So, rather ironically, removing the Rares would only serve to release the floodgate that's currently keeping many useful items (e.g. Godswords, Dragon Armour, Barrows Armour, etc...) affordable to the RuneScape public. This would only hurt the people meant to benefit from such a misguided "solution"--sure, lower level players might be able to wear party hats and the like after such an action, but being able to afford gear of actual use to them would become significantly more difficult thereafter.

 

 

 

Oh no, I disagree here. 3rd Age, while difficult to obtain, would only skyrocket in desirability, and there would be more clue hunters out there seeking that oh-so rare armor. Dragon has had a black eye ever since the induction of Barrows, so its prices would rise marginally if at all. As for Godswords/Barrows: Neither are hard to obtain, as GWD and Barrows, respectively, are simple enough to do to profit.

 

 

 

Consider then, that after the demand explodes, the desire to get these items ultimately matches the demand of them, thus balancing the price out. For the first month, things will be insanely inflated, but after that, and after many, MANY people go hunting Kree'Arra, the prices will fall to where they belong.

 

 

 

You're thinking that the supply of these items can be bought out. Only problem is that you can't dry up an infinite supply. ;)

[Rien]

You're thinking that the supply of these items can be bought out. Only problem is that you can't dry up an infinite supply. ;)

I can see what you're saying, and you have a point--items such as the Third Age gear, while difficult to obtain and "rare" in their own sense, are not finite as are the tradeable holiday rewards. The problem then--a solution to which I cannot honestly think of--is that, without the Rares for use as a wealth medium, RuneScape's wealthy would not have any other adequate replacement to fall back on. What would happen once they try to liquidate their holdings, only to find that they can't so so effectively? As I've already outlined, I presumed that they would move on to the next few immediate items of high-value and rarity, but what you've pointed out essentially makes this a futile move, as it would only last for a few months before the desirability factor would produce enough hunters to drive up the supply. I could only think that the wealthy would then turn to market manipulation, and god knows that's rampant enough as it is. Either way, I think removing Rares would cause many more problems than it would solve. I only wish that the GX was more adaptive and that it hadn't been necessary to remove High-Stakes Dueling as a result of RWT. Inflation, stagnant Rares, and inflexible GX prices certainly are the severe problems, but I don't know that any "cure-all" exists or could be properly implemented if it did.

 

 

 

So in conclusion, it's all about the economics and the rares. Wealth needs to be put somewhere and tradeable rares are a great way to put money into things besides the gp. Jagex needs to pick the best economical choice, which I think is to keep it the same. No harm really is being done besides keeping an arguably ever growing want at certain items, but I think that adds to the flavor of this game. I will certainly never be able to hear the word Party Hat the same way again due to this game. And I will always enjoy that.

The concept of Rares definitely makes for a more dynamic--and, to my way of thinking, more interesting--game, but ever since Staking was removed and the GX was implemented, they've become more problematic than helpful, as I'm sure you know. I realize that I'm not being very helpful myself--as I haven't, and probably can't, propose a likely solution--but I believe Jagex needs to at least work or draw plans for some alternative system. As evidenced by the creation of "junk," affulent players are not willing to take the fall in order for the GX prices to correct themselves, so that really only leaves Jagex to come up with something that'll work. The thought of market manipulation in addition to the Rares/Third Age rotting away in a few, select bank accounts sickens me, to be honest. The current system is not working, and simply removing the heart of the problem--Rares--won't solve anything. It's almost more of a problem with how the game is played itself; raw materials can be gathered indefinitely, finished products are often useless (e.g. bows, smithable armours, and the like), and too many methods of gp creation exist (High Alchemy, shops, etc...). But if anything is to be done, I believe the answer lies in a complete renovation of the market system.

[Xx_Flare_xX]

I like the idea, much more fairer :thumbsup:

 

 

 

Mabey every year you get to choose only 1 item from previous years? that way recent players can still get an old item and no-one gets flooded with people running around with every item in the past 3 years of seasonal drops :

 

 

 

 

 

people will complain as hell and do the "we paid good money therefore we deserve" rubbish but your idea still gives them they're 800M back so that makes up for it :P

 

 

 

Seasonal items were made for FUN not for easy wealth.

[meili]

I think "wow, you're a noob, you're only level 50".

 

 

 

Nice attitude. I fail to see why anyone should respect the opinions of someone who thinks like this.

 

 

 

As for partyhats, they aren't doing any harm so there is no need to fix them. I mean, if you think Joe Newb can never get a rare holiday item, that is also true for many things Joe Newb will never be able to afford, such as 3rd age. Why should every player get a party hat but not 3rd age? :evil:

 

 

 

That's because this thread comes down to nothing more than "I don't think rares are fair so they should be removed and I should get all the nontradeables", then throwing in some irrelevant comparisons to pking, the wilderness, and other unrelated events or items.

 

 

 

Agreed.

 

 

 

Btw I hope the whole nachalo thing never becomes fashionable in Tip It. I think it's lame.

 

 

 

And please don't reply unless you have a GOOD argument against my idea.

 

 

 

I R GOOD. :roll: Generally, when you make a good post, people will reply with good posts. There isn't any need for you to say this or use the whole nachalo thing. It's all implied when you post. It's not like people will read it think "omg i can post any stupid ole thing that I can think of!" if you don't say "good posts only" :shame:

[Jard_Y_Dooku]

nachalo

 

 

 

I could nitpick and say that a handful of people are still mighty sore about the Wilderness Updates (case in point: just look at the MMG thread on the RSoF), but that's neither here nor there. It's true that the RS community (and economy) can survive many things, and the end of rares is one of those things.

 

 

 

I've long questioned the actual purpose of rares in our game, besides the fact that Jagex just came out and said that they were for fun. It doesn't make sense how any one player gets to decide that this [ultra hyper useless] item is all of a sudden worth so many millions of GP. It does nothing; it doesn't even tell you how long you've played.

 

 

 

I asked around a few years back, when I knew some people that had these hats. Their general reply was that it could hold wealth for them, while earning wealth at the same time. While this is true, skills hold significantly more intrinsic value, since over time, one can make that money back tenfold.

 

 

 

However, I fundamentally disagree that players should be entitled to Scythes or Bunny Ears, since those actually DO tell us how long a player's been playing. Sure, it's in the name of fun, but it'd feel silly to give everyone a Scythe when they weren't around to vote for it, or Bunny Ears when their account didn't exist before Easter '03.

 

 

 

[before you ask: yes, mine did; no I could not log in fast enough to get the drop. I blame 56K. I do have a Scythe, though. :)]

 

 

 

I don't think that the merchants will like the move very much, but consider that rares fall outside of the demand bell-curve; in stark contrast to the number of people that trade items on a daily basis, the number affected will be minimal. Not to mention, they'll be compensated for their rares.

 

 

 

Of course, you run into a problem with the amount of GP that a player can hold, or can be stored on the servers. There's a good chance that the GP cap can't be changed due to technical reasons (don't think you can coerce an int into a long int; not due to Java, but probably due to the way they store data in Oracle), so somehow, you'll have to compensate that once a player hits the 2.1B cap; perhaps adding paper cash, where 1 note counts for between 5K-100K might alleviate that.

 

 

 

For those that don't think that there's another high end item to earn: there's always 3rd Age to strive for, and not to mention, it actually has uses...

 

 

 

konets

 

 

 

How do you know Jagex uses Oracle? I use MySQL and I know for certain it supports 64-bit integers, and I think even 128. I haven't really looked into database comparisons, but I doubt Oracle lacks the capability to store 64-bit integers if that is in fact what Jagex uses.

 

 

 

Also, I doubt very many people care if you're "old school" or not. In my opinion at least, that's way overrated.

 

 

 

Anyways, see you guys in 12 hours (yes I sleep a lot). :) Thanks for all the great discussion so far, it's very interesting reading what everyone has to say.

[meili]

Btw although Jagex allows new players to unlock the old holiday emotes, they still cannot get the old holiday items. So why should older holiday items be the exception?

[Madmanpur3]

Nacho libre and Kutsvenic

 

 

 

Jagex made old holiday items. Jagex never intended for said holiday items to become super expensive, only fun things that people shared. Said holiday items became super expensive despite Jagex not desiring that. So it's something that Jagex put in the game, and is now different than how they intended it to be......IT'S A BUG!!! :ohnoes: We've all been witnessing the biggest bug in Runescape history and it's been going on for years, yet we never realized it?!

 

 

 

Here's my solution - make all holiday items free and tradable along with banning everyone who's ever sold a holiday item for money (them greedy bastards). :thumbup:

[Nytestryke24]

nachalo

 

 

 

I like this idea. Sure, it'd upset a couple people, but not too much, as they'd have their party hats, and they'd have their money. If they really had their party hats because they liked wearing them.. then it shouldn't bother them. If they didn't like wearing them? Then they just had it as an investment, and they've got their money. All is alright.. Okay, they won't make any more money out of it, but... it was never meant to make money, as previously stated.

 

 

 

I also like the idea of giving us newer players (October 2006 ftw ;)) Scythes, Bunny Ears, and I assume Yo-Yo's, Christmas Hats & Scarves, Marionettes and whatever else we missed. Sure, some people would get annoyed because they feel they should be 'honoured' in some way due to their having played longer- but there are those who were there, but didn't log on because they were on holiday etc. etc.

 

 

 

Good idea. Contact JaGeX nao pl0x!

 

 

 

Sincerely

 

Nytestryke24

 

 

 

konets

[Racheya]

I honestly don't care if someone else has an item I don't have :o

 

 

 

It's strange to imagine such a mythical concept but just because I don't own a Party hat it doesn't mean I should own one. Why should those who have been playing maybe a few months have something that people have been playing for YEARS with.

 

 

 

There is no point to them anyway, if you have the money to afford one then good on you. If you have been playing since the drop then good on you. *shrugs* You can't argue about everybody having equal opportunities because it's not an opportunity it's an item that you should have to obtain on your own.

[snowball]

Nachalo

 

 

 

[hide=Me and Jard y dooku's posts]

nachalo

 

 

 

I seem to replaced "tradeable rares" with "party hat" alot. But I digress

 

 

 

What is the purpose of a ring of stone? emote enhancers? Gnome firelighters? Gnome goggles or scarf? We don't need them either. They are about as useful as a phat, except they are not used like the phat: as a status symbol. That is the way I see the tradable discontinued items. If you have a phat, people around understand you have or have had a good deal of money or you could have a good deal of money. By replacing the party hats with money, you have destroyed a status symbol, symbolizing riches. Go to a king or queen, and replace their crown with some money, and that's effectively what this does. Then you would let diango give them out? That's horrible! Everyone would be wearing phats, then no one would be wearing phats unless they wanted to match with an outfit. You compare the party hats to toilet paper. Realize, then, that making them available to everyone makes them about as useful as used, wet toilet paper that sat in the back of your house for a few years.

 

 

 

I am talking about HOLIDAY ITEMS here. I understand many treasure trail items are useless, but they aren't "rare" items - more can always be brought into the game which is why they are fine. Anyone who has the will and determination to work hard, can get them.

 

 

 

Did you know: People can only have 1 ectophial Yes

 

Did you know: people can have more than 1 phat? Yes

 

Did you know: People can have more than 2.1 bil in phats if they have played for a long time or have a lot of cash? Yes

 

Did you know: 2.1 billion is the maximum amount of money that can be had? People have this much. Yes

 

 

 

Replacing the party hat with money then efficively destroys the cash people could have had with their money replaced phats. Congratulations! Following with this plan eliminates millions of gp from the economy and ticks off many people.

 

 

 

As I will mention again in my reply to another poster, Jagex certainly has the capability increase the cap or implement some way of overcoming that.

 

 

 

Let's lower the money bracket a little. There are people who really want a party hat, me included. Some of these people actually have the ability to buy a phat. Now imagine you just saved up 111.4m (GWD, DK, 200mil hunter exp, idc) and want a red phat. The game is updated soon before that, allowing everyone to get your coveted red phat. You can get that phat, but your dreams have been crushed.

 

 

 

How are your dreams crushed? I'd say "FINALLY! Now I can get a party hat for free!", and then proceed to spend my cash on training skills. In my case I'd just get the party hat for the sake of having it, pop it in my costume room, and probably never take it out. I quite enjoy my random event costumes, and my lumberjack suit. Full lumberjack is EXTREMELY difficult obtain, and I am proud to be one of the few players that has it. However, I am even more glad that any player who wishes, with hard work and determination, can achieve the same as I have.

 

 

 

Some people have played since RSC. They kept their favorite white phat, easter egg, and pumpkin. They promised never to trade it. Suddenly, these items are all mainstream. There is no point in keeping them anymore because more can be obtained.

 

 

 

People keep them because they like them. What's the difference?

 

 

 

Some people played when holiday items were dced (me included) I like my skeleton outfit, so around halloween, I wear it. Last halloween, some people wondered where I got it from, and Its because I played longer than they did. The same with the amazing ring of egg (i missed that one because I was out of the country at the time, but If I were there, it would be amazing to use at easter!) These people who have played for a while now no longer can show how long they have been playing.You may say, "Ya, but the emotes and songs are given out." The songs can only be heard by you and the emotes only last about 5 seconds, so they cannot be shown to everybody who you see, unless you want to ignore everything around you and stop what you are doing in order to show them an emote. The emotes are available to all during the event because they are not shown as well as costumes but for a few seconds.

 

 

 

THE WILDERNESS WAS REMOVED. THAT UPSET A LOT OF PEOPLE BUT THEY DID IT ANYWAYS FOR THE GREATER GOOD. AND WE GOT OVER IT.

 

 

 

Why did we get over it? Its either because there was a reason to remove it (Rwt) and people understood that, or because there were alternatives (current and future). And who is "we" anyway? I have still seen "bring Wildy back threads" I still like the old wild because of the lack of revs. I never went into the old wild but twice and the new wild thrice. I am not "over it", the people begging for the old wildy are not "over it", and the people who quit because of the lack of wild are not "over it."

 

 

 

Ok, I phrased that poorly. What I mean by "we got over it" is that hundreds of thousands of people still play RuneScape, and the game is continuing on very, very well. And the implementation of my ideas wouldn't stop it.

 

 

 

What would the "greater good" be in deleting rares anyway?

 

 

 

Giving all players equal opportunity and eliminating rares' effect on the economy.

 

 

 

Now everyone's happy, except for grumpy people who will whine that noobs can get partyhats. Well, you know what? THAT WAS THE ORIGINAL IDEA.

 

You work for Jagex? :o Otherwise, who are you to be telling me what the original idea was? For all we know, Jagex wanted to have 1337ly priced items. You know what I think, I think that the tradable rares were for whoever played then or wanted to give their buddies one, and the price is a side effect.

 

 

 

I don't need to work for them to know that's what they intended. It's even on the Tip.It website rares page... go look.

 

 

 

It was because of players' greed that partyhats were abused and raised to their ridiculous price.

 

Thus it was also the players greed that the price of a whip is abused and rose to a ridiculous price before falling. No my friend, it is the law of supply and demand. There is a limited supply of party hats, we want party hats, there is a high price of them. More people join the game, the demand increases the price of party hats rise. People with Party hats leave the game or rares or consumed, the supply goes down, the price increases.

 

 

 

If players were super intelligent, we could fix the problem ourselves by high-alching all rares. Then Jagex could delete them entirely or reintroduce them as untradeable. But that isn't how society works - I'll admit I wouldn't even alch a party hat (I'd sell it), and Jagex will need to solve the rares problem for us.

 

 

 

Imagine the amount of whips in the game must equal the amount of rares in the game. All others are destroyed, but you still have a whip. Well of course you are going to give a whip for a few mil even though they cost a many millions (in this scenario), I mean, If I sold it at what it is being asked for, then I would be greedy, wouldn't I?

 

 

 

I'm not an economist

That explains the supply and demand thing :roll:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

They are USELESS items that do absolutely nothing.

 

If Party hat is useless, then what does that make other "show off" items? should we make them available to everybody too? I do want a highwayman mask, a black cavalier, and a mime mask & beret.

 

 

 

Those items are hot holiday items. Useless items should have at least SOME idea of a reasonable price (TT items do), or should be untradeable.

 

 

 

A purple partyhat is 9m more than my Armadyl godsword.

 

I notice that you didn't say your purple party hat. Why is that? It seems you don't care for rares, so this may be biased for all I know.

 

 

 

You are correct. I think rares are stupid. Even if rares were 100k each, I wouldn't buy them because it's a waste of money for something that does nothing to improve my account. If they're free, on the other hand, I can detract from my normal activities for 5 minutes to get them all at once, and put them in my costume room to rot. My money is better spent on swords I can bash peoples' heads in with, and armor to prevent them from doing the same, than a hat that does nothing.

 

 

 

Also, MMORPGs are games where you can be anyone; no one player should have less "opportunity" than another because they joined the game at a later date.

 

Its a good thing I learned about logical fallacies in english recently: Non Sequitur. That first statement had nothing to do with the second. In response to the first statement. Its not that you can be anyone, its that you can not be yourself. In responce to the second statement: why not? I joined at a later date than some people, shouldn't I be able to play on RSC? Shouldn't I be able to re experience the falador massacre, the knife glitch, the old wild, the old graphics, the glitches, the guy that made legs into skirts and vice versa (D shirt -->d legs = cash)? I think you are tellling me I should

 

 

 

I'm talking about the ability to obtain in-game rewards (items & other things). None of those are achievements/rewards; they are events, experiences, etc.

 

 

 

You say the party hat is less useful than toilet paper. Certainly is. I can't use a partyhat to wipe - yeah Therefore, you should have no problem removing all the treaure trail items and replacing them with money, would you? I mean, they have about the same use as a party hat, except are more common. Lets make an NPC hand out free TT items. I mean, come on, all you had to do was earn a few million gp or play for some years to get a party hat. How about we allow everyone to get all the quest items from an NPC without doing the quest. I bet we would all love elite black armour and Dagon'hai robes. Those ancient magics could be available from the start. Lets cut out the need to even use runes! I mean, you only have to spend like 500k or something for 60 magic, so lets let ice rush become available at level 1 magic. That should make us all even right? I don't even have enough time in life to get Ancient magic, a dark bow,a godsword, or even a party hat. Why dont we just let another NPC give out free AGSs? I mean, its only a symbol of obtaining 75 attack and being able to get 1 from GWD or buy it, just as a party hat is a symbol of having enough money to get one. Don't agree with me? Then you don't agree with Jard y dooku.

 

 

 

Treasure trail items are not rare items. Runes are not rare items. Ancient magic isn't even an item. They can be freely obtained at any time, so there is no problem with them. And no, you're completely wrong about the AGS. It's not a status symbol at all. It's a useful weapon allowing you to train up to 4 skills.

 

 

 

Wow, Why can't I write this much in my english stuff? :shock:

 

konets

[/hide]

 

 

 

All in all, thank you for your thorough post. Again, I don't agree, but I am glad you took the time to read my post thoroughly and post your thoughts. I hope you appreciate that I have done the same for your post.

 

 

 

 

I understand that TT items, runes, ancients, and AGS are not rares, but there is the same idea. You work hard, you get a reward.

 

For the AGS, it is a useful weapon, true. However, It still is a symbol just like the party hat. The AGS symbolizes the determination to get 60mil and 75 attack or the determination to get one from armaldyl general. Likewise, the party hat symbolizes that you have played for a while or have the similar determination to get the money to pay for a phat.

 

 

 

If what you wanted to happen did occur, then we would need some way to store the spare money (certificates or something) and maybe the year cape thing that people are talking about

[Krazi]

And please don't reply unless you have a GOOD argument against my idea.

 

 

 

I R GOOD. :roll: Generally, when you make a good post, people will reply with good posts. There isn't any need for you to say this or use the whole nachalo thing. It's all implied when you post.

Nachalo

 

Judging by the number of people who didn't include "konets," I think there is a need for it. :wall: I personally like Jard's idea, the point of holiday items was FUN, not for a few people who happened to log on that day to be incredibly wealthy for the rest of their runescape career.

 

 

 

Konets

[Dragonlordjl]

Um, I would be FURIOUS if they allowed noobs to get Bunny Ears. They are the item I am most proud of, as it shows I have played since RSC. I am sure people with scythes would be livid, too.

 

 

 

Everything else is a good idea, though.

[Riemis]

Nachalo

 

 

 

Giving up my yoyo? It is the only thing that doesn't make me noobish! :(

 

But if jagex made something like a cape with the year in wich your account was created on it, i wouldn't mind :)

[Jard_Y_Dooku]

Um, I would be FURIOUS if they allowed noobs to get Bunny Ears. They are the item I am most proud of, as it shows I have played since RSC. I am sure people with scythes would be livid, too.

 

 

 

Everything else is a good idea, though.

 

 

 

With all due respect, I don't care how long you've played. Are you higher level than me? If so, kudos to you. If not... you have a bit more work to do. ;)

 

 

 

People really need to see that the length of time they've played really does mean little to nothing. Your actual achievements are what mean something. If I joined in 2008 and I am level 138, and I meet a level 50 who joined in 2001... why should I think highly of him in any way? I've gotten 135 levels in a year, but he's gotten 50 in 8 years. Not very good.

[Riemis]

Um, I would be FURIOUS if they allowed noobs to get Bunny Ears. They are the item I am most proud of, as it shows I have played since RSC. I am sure people with scythes would be livid, too.

 

 

 

Everything else is a good idea, though.

 

 

 

With all due respect, I don't care how long you've played. Are you higher level than me? If so, kudos to you. If not... you have a bit more work to do. ;)

 

 

 

People really need to see that the length of time they've played really does mean little to nothing. Your actual achievements are what mean something. If I joined in 2008 and I am level 138, and I meet a level 50 who joined in 2001... why should I think highly of him in any way? I've gotten 135 levels in a year, but he's gotten 50 in 8 years. Not very good.

 

Well i don't care about levels, only about fun, knowledge and people who like my holiday items :)

[das]

Um, I would be FURIOUS if they allowed noobs to get Bunny Ears. They are the item I am most proud of, as it shows I have played since RSC. I am sure people with scythes would be livid, too.

 

 

 

Everything else is a good idea, though.

 

 

 

With all due respect, I don't care how long you've played. Are you higher level than me? If so, kudos to you. If not... you have a bit more work to do. ;)

 

 

 

People really need to see that the length of time they've played really does mean little to nothing. Your actual achievements are what mean something. If I joined in 2008 and I am level 138, and I meet a level 50 who joined in 2001... why should I think highly of him in any way? I've gotten 135 levels in a year, but he's gotten 50 in 8 years. Not very good.

 

 

 

 

 

Speaking as someone who is higher level than you and older. RSC is a different game from RS2. whether you like it or not, the stats carried over, but it's a different animal but simply, I played classic, sounds like you didn't. RS2 has built in macros, RSC did not. I like to distinguish that fact. Money can't buy everything and every item should not be attainable to all so easily. Give away the rubber chicken and yo-yo. to rs2 players, they deserve it, but the ears, scythe and tradeable rares - Lets preserve them they way they were.

[Crimsoncow42]

Um, I would be FURIOUS if they allowed noobs to get Bunny Ears. They are the item I am most proud of, as it shows I have played since RSC. I am sure people with scythes would be livid, too.

 

 

 

Everything else is a good idea, though.

 

 

 

With all due respect, I don't care how long you've played. Are you higher level than me? If so, kudos to you. If not... you have a bit more work to do. ;)

 

 

 

People really need to see that the length of time they've played really does mean little to nothing. Your actual achievements are what mean something. If I joined in 2008 and I am level 138, and I meet a level 50 who joined in 2001... why should I think highly of him in any way? I've gotten 135 levels in a year, but he's gotten 50 in 8 years. Not very good.

 

Well i don't care about levels, only about fun, knowledge and people who like my holiday items :)

 

 

 

People do need to get rid of this mentality that showing off how long you've been playing means something. Having fun is what matters. Some people enjoy gaining levels and some people enjoying collecting and showing off items that some people don't have.

 

 

 

P.S. Team Buddies was one of the funnest games I've ever played. :thumbsup:

[Kilo]

It's like blaming someone for being a particular race.

 

 

 

That doesn't compare at all to this situation, and is a horrible analogy.

 

 

 

I don't think rares effect the economy as much as they used too. There is so much money floating around now, rares might as well be in their own little market. It's a part of Rs history, why give them out to everyone? Those people were around back then, they deserve the items, we don't.

[BiJay]

I don't have bunny ears, scythe or some other older holiday items. Yeah, I would like to have some of them but on the other hand I always think "wow" if I see someone who has bunny ears or scythe. And I'm envious, too. Giving the items to everyone would destroy the items by itself because they mean something. They mean you've been playing and enjoying this game for years. So I don't like this idea and I know it will never happen.

 

 

 

And the problems of high valued holiday rares is a thing of the past. You can't solve this problem because it's already too late.

 

 

 

Get over it, it's just a game!