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200M in all Skills


Makilio

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What's more sickening is that Jagex would actually permit the kind of gamestyle where people are actually interested in -- quite literally -- throwing away their lives pursuing this sort of stuff. You'd think they would cap XP at 20, maybe 30M, to stop this nonsense. RS, being an MMORPG, by its very nature entails basically spending an inordinate amount of time on unproductive things, but this is simply preposterous. Also unsettling is how the community seems to have gotten behind these people, seem to be encouraging them, and are actually funding this insanity. But then the whole culture of video-game/television/hyper-consumption/atomisation has finally become the norm here in the West over the past 30 years, I suppose this isn't the abject manifestation of that.

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What's more sickening is that the community actually permits the kind of "holier than thou" attitude where people are actually interested in -- quite literally -- tearing down people's accomplishments to make them seem better. You'd think they'd realize that it's not their life, and that they don't know specific details around top players lives. RS, being an MMORPG, by its very nature entails a feeling of a "never beatable" environment, to keep players playing for years to come. Also unsettling is how a large portion of the community seems to back this arrogant, egotistical attitude and supports them with their own. But then the whole culture of "I'm better than you because I feel I'm more productive with my time even though I also play games, watch tv, etc" has finally become the norm here in the entire world over the past 15 years, I suppose this isn't the exact manifestation of that.

 

PS Suomi is from Finland, not the West.

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What's more sickening is that the community actually permits the kind of "holier than thou" attitude where people are actually interested in -- quite literally -- tearing down people's accomplishments to make them seem better.

 

I am not interested in Suomi or Jake or whoever as individuals, I am interested in the environment(adulating community, culture, company etc) that permits these sorts of destructive and wasteful activities. Furthermore, spending astronomical amount of time on an online game while your productive capacity, physical and mental health and social relationships deteriorates is not an "achievement". That's not a statement about the individual players, it's a statement about the inherent nature of the activity itself.

 

 

You'd think they'd realize that it's not their life, and that they don't know specific details around top players lives.

 

 

I didn't bring specific players about this, I brought up the environment which enables them to do what they did. It's about social attitudes, policy and culture. The fact that it's considered perfectly okay for people to spend 6 hours a day playing games is a sign of degeneracy(and I am talking about moderately successful RS players, not the top players who doubtless spend a lot more time).

 

 

 

RS, being an MMORPG, by its very nature entails a feeling of a "never beatable" environment, to keep players playing for years to come.

 

 

Right, I am opposed to these inherent aspects of all MMORPGs. The problem isn't the players, it's the game and culture which enables them to do these sorts of things.

 

 

 

 

Also unsettling is how a large portion of the community seems to back this arrogant, egotistical attitude and supports them with their own.

 

 

 

Sorry but I am not a liberal nihilist who thinks individuals should be able to do or encouraged at least, to do whatever the hell they want. There should be extremely strong and acute social pressure to lead them away from doing these sorts of things. There are social consequences(chief among them the rising obesity in certain developed nations) to these sorts of things and they should be dealt with, it's the responsible thing to do as a community.

 

 

 

But then the whole culture of "I'm better than you because I feel I'm more productive with my time even though I also play games, watch tv, etc" has finally become the norm here in the entire world over the past 15 years, I suppose this isn't the exact manifestation of that.

 

 

You make this unnecessarily personal. Also it doesn't help the fact you are attempting to poorly satirize my original post because simply replacing a few words here and there in my original post won't generate accurate or even coherent points. If intense social pressure and responsibility had been implemented as I advocate, then things wouldn't have nearly gotten as disastrous as they have gotten in the West. The impending obesity crisis and the fact sometime in the future there will be a generation of the kids, for whom the life expectancy is predicted to decline(for the first in a very, very long time), in developed nations no less, is truly frightening and horrifying. That you would try to trivialize that or personalize that, "These people should just be encouraged to do whatever the hell they want", is most telling.

 

 

PS Suomi is from Finland, not the West.

 

Suomi is not the only rank chaser out there. The community that supports him and his activities, the company that permits it to happen, and the culture surrounding it is entirely Western in nature.

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So every person who reach and strive for high ranks in these games are fat and socially inept who have their lives crumbling around them.

 

Nice strawman. Quote me where I made a remark to that effect. Like I stated, it isn't about individuals, it's about a general trend. In the context of RS, it was only very recently( a few years ago), that there emerged a culture where rank chasing and 200M'ing was encouraged, i.e, wasting large amounts of amounts of time on an internet game. That there are individuals who can handle this and still lead healthy and productive lives is beside the point(I hear Soumi runs several KMs a day), I am against the general trend. There will always be Zezima's and Zarfot's around(and I happen to actually admire them), but a subculture around these sort of people shouldn't develop.

 

And you wonder why people are taking this personally?

 

I don't understand what is so personal about this. Who, here, actually thinks it is a grand idea that it is considered acceptable for people to spend inordinate amount of time on these sorts of things. I am not talking about particular individuals or even particular games, RS is simply in the subset of a larger trend in Western society of internet addiction, and decline in health in recent decades decades. Pointing out that people should not be encouraged to spend 6 hours a day playing computer games is not about petty personal jealousy, but about taking responsibility as a society and simply applying social pressure(no one is talking about using coercion to stop these people, or outlawing their activities). If you think there is something offensive or odd about this, then I don't know what to say to you, I am genuinely puzzled.

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It doesn't matter how much time you spend on the game, only how much you give up to play it. Someone who blows off their friends to play RuneScape is "more pathetic" than someone who has neurotic parents that don't let them out of their house. If you know what I mean.

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It doesn't matter how much time you spend on the game, only how much you give up to play it. Someone who blows off their friends to play RuneScape is "more pathetic" than someone who has neurotic parents that don't let them out of their house. If you know what I mean.

 

Of course. I think the internet addictions are usually more symptomatic of other social problems. Once again, I am not talking about particular players(I am not saying Suomi came from negligent parents) but rather the general trends. Because of infeasibility of single-income households; both parents have to work(this started in the 70's) which means for a few generations now, in a lot of homes you have kids who no is watching or parentings(witness the phenomenon of latchkey kids). Then when Mommy and Daddy come home, they are too tired to cook a proper meal(understandably), so they grab something cheap and shove it in the microwave. It's things like that. There's definitely an economic ans social base to this problem. RS is a very, very tiny subset.

 

Also I should add, I am not really interested in the habit of moralising this or calling particular players names(though I might occasionally become frustrated), it is about the trend; if people are starting to put online gaming over their personal relationships(this is not exactly an uncommon phenomenon) then there is something terribly wrong and we have failed them at the social level. The solution is not to call them pathetic or anything but rather to help them.

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Precisely what social pressure would you apply? I mean, if someone has significant wealth and is capable of doing whatever they want with their time, what can you do to stop them? Equally, if someone has a full time job and has no problems supporting themselves but still manages to stay in the top 10 on the hiscores, (I know of one player for whom this is true, there is probably more than one) how can you stop them? The answer is you can't, at least in societies where basic personal freedoms are allowed. That player might view activities you take part in with the same level of disdain you evidently hold for them.

Asmodean <3

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Precisely what social pressure would you apply? I mean, if someone has significant wealth and is capable of doing whatever they want with their time, what can you do to stop them? Equally, if someone has a full time job and has no problems supporting themselves but still manages to stay in the top 10 on the hiscores, (I know of one player for whom this is true, there are probably more than one) how can you stop them?

 

I am not really interested in stopping particular individuals from engaging in self-destructive activities, there will always be such people. I am against subsiding or popularizing this sort of stuff or incenticiving this sort of behaviour. I think there should be a fierce public campaign against this and parents should be empowered to monitor and control the computer time of their children and encourage them to engage in healthy activities(such as reading, socializing, exercising) in addition to leisure activities. That way when they eventually become independent they will have been brought up in a culture where dicking around on the internet for 5-6 hours a day was not allowed or encouraged, and so they won't lean that way.

 

The answer is you can't, at least in societies where basic personal freedoms are allowed.

 

Of course you can. There was a time when the overwhelming majority of the USA(to use an example) was not obese or overweight(as it is now) and were doing fruitful things such as the ones that I mentioned above. How was that possible? It was because people actually assumed some measure of social responsibility and didn't just take it for granted that we should just let or encourage kids to sit for 6 hours watching TV. People aren't born wanting to do this sort of stuff; they will do whatever the culture tolerates/condones, hence it should be our responsibility to fashion such a culture where doing such harmful things isn't encouraged.

 

I am in favour of drug legalization too, but I am not in favour of encouraging people or not applying social pressure if large amounts of people decide to become crack addicts.

 

That player might view activities you take part in with the same level of disdain you evidently hold for them.

 

Perhaps. It's about whose agenda gets rattified first then isn't it. I would like it to be mine, of course, and I am sure they would like to be theirs(assuming some of them care enough to discourage/outlaw my activities). That's just the nature of life.

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Yoko, the world changes. The internet is everywhere, and entrenched. While social experience on the internet is not the same as social experience face to face, you can't simply right off everything done on the internet as useless. Let's assume that I work for 8 hours a day, and sleep for 6-8 hours a day. That leaves me with 8-10 hours with which to do what I want. While you may view runescape as a waste of time, (whether individually or socially) doesn't matter. I could hold the same opinion of people who practice track, or sports, or music, or art. Just because you can't understand how gaming can be part of the social sphere, doesn't mean it isn't. It is and will continue to be part of the experience of life.

 

Choosing to play runescape or any other video games isn't what is unhealthy. Blowing off relationship with people to do other stuff consistently is unhealthy. Want to know something? There are always people who will do this. There will always be people who make poor decisions, (drugs, theft, etc) I, for example don't really believe that going out every night with friends and drinking at clubs is any more productive than video games. I'd consider this more unhealthy for me.

 

I'm not trying to create a moral relativism, but what you seem to be going after happens in so many spheres already. Running around a track for thousands of hours in order to win time at a race.. That is pretty much about as useful as being #1 in a video game. Would you consider olympics and the culture we have around this to be any worse than video games? Because based on your arguments that is what it sounds like.

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I'm not trying to create a moral relativism, but what you seem to be going after happens in so many spheres already. Running around a track for thousands of hours in order to win time at a race.. That is pretty much about as useful as being #1 in a video game. Would you consider olympics and the culture we have around this to be any worse than video games? Because based on your arguments that is what it sounds like.

 

Just a quick thing to mention here; although running a track or some other sport has significant health benefits, nowadays the extremes of sport can involve taking drugs which create huge health problems. Similarly, spending time playing computer games or on the internet is only unhealthy in extremes. There's nothing special about the internet and gaming, most leisure pursuits are destructive when pursued to extremes.

Asmodean <3

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Running, even without any performance enhancing substances, is hard on the body. It's a great example of something that is a supposedly healthy productive way to spend time, yet it's speeding up the deterioration of the body.

 

You know what's really hard on the body? Getting one of those big computer company jobs developing programs all day long. 60 hr a week workweeks sitting at a chair on a computer clicking leads to the exact same place as gaming, except you're getting 6 figures a year and people think you're cool because you work at google.

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We shall now return to our regular updates of top players, their achievements and current activities and other interesting trivia related to the topic of 200m xp in (a large number of) skills.

 

We shall not discuss the moral/ethical or health aspects of this. Thank you.

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Suomi is not the only rank chaser out there. The community that supports him and his activities, the company that permits it to happen, and the culture surrounding it is entirely Western in nature.

Perhaps this is true of Runescape, but there are many other games where the community, company and culture are Asian in nature (e.g. South Korea has a very strong computer gaming culture). This is not simply a Western issue.
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Over 10 years.

 

soz about so short post but almost wasted a tick

My goal is to get 200M in all skills.

 

My Tip.it interview: http://tip.it/runescape/?times=640

 

My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/RsSuomi

 

I play Private Off most of the time but please send me private message here on Tip.it if you want to say or ask something.

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Thanks a lot :) I will be posting more again after 5B.

My goal is to get 200M in all skills.

 

My Tip.it interview: http://tip.it/runescape/?times=640

 

My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/RsSuomi

 

I play Private Off most of the time but please send me private message here on Tip.it if you want to say or ask something.

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Go get that 200m Firemaking today! I know you can do it =3.

Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, 'Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous?' Actually, who are you not to be?~ Marianne Williamson

 

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