200M in all Skills

[Xcxcxcxcxc]

Let's assume we discard any of the "buyable" skills, and just not count them. I still think Suomi is way ahead.

Okay so goodbye crawlers, prayer, herb, crafting, summoning, construction, firemaking, woodcutting, slayer even..... I think you will be surprised, 115m runecraft subtracted as result of crawlers. I probably forgot something as well. In either case if you subtract all buyables you're likely wrong, but it would be unreasonable to do that anyways.

 

Edit- farming

[Gemeos2]

Going to the G.E and flipping few items once a day would almost be just as hard as taking donations...

 

You obviously don't know what you are talking about when you mention Flipping. So why just even talk about it?

 

There's a risk involved when Flipping. Even a really high risk depending on many factors. And it consumes more time, rationality and knowledge.

 

What's the risk of donations? Where's the time spent? Where's the knowledge required?

 

 

Suomi non-buyables have a really huge value (except Woodcutting, Slayer, Melee skills). On the other hand, his buyables means exactly nothing.

Just my opinion and I guess everybody agrees that's a fair opinion.

[Thai_tong]

I'm hoping SUOMI get's an NPC named when he gets 200m all Skills, a Statue in the center of every major city, and a special cape to show that he's the best scaper there ever was.

 

I doubt he'll even get a mention in the news. Jagex will probably just troll him and raise the exp cap when he's almost done.

Probably they will make a sellout of him, try to make something out of it like 200m accounts. Finnish themed capes on sof this week only.

[asfcjfdyitfhglh]

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[Platinum_Myr]

Donations definitely account for how far he is now, but his dedication is the reason for how far he is at all. No other player has consistently done these types of training methods for as long as Suomi does. How many of those players were offered donations and turned them down? Can you even know that?

[Uade]

Just a few people off the top of my head no specific order; Zez, Zarfot, Telmo, Elias, The Old Nite, Fat Wrecked, Larryr, N0valyfe, Aclaw, Skateenjoi. All of them I consider to be better scapers then suomi.

You're just naming names for the sake of arguing. The last few players you mentioned were simply the first to 200M in a partcular skill.

 

•Larryr specialized in Runecrafting, and was a good person, but in no way was the best scaper.

•You're mentioning The Old Nite and Fat Wrecked just because they died, not because of their gains.

•Telmo, Elias, Nova, Zarfot, and Zezima are all good scapers, but none of then have accomplished what Suomi has.

 

I don't understand how else you'd judge the 'best player' other than total xp (perhaps in total non-buyable xp? Buyable xp isn't viable because many dicers would then rank, despite relatively low total xp), but regardless, the best scaper has the most xp. Suomi currently has the most xp, so he's the best. It's not hard.

 

I judge the "best player" by how they play. And Zarfot's nickname is the King of Efficiency for a reason. He only played like 6-8hrs a day but had over 2B exp. If he hadn't of quit I bet he could have been 2nd or third to achieve max exp.

 

SUOMI is a great player yes, and so was Zezima, but honestly Zarfot is #1 in my book.

[asfcjfdyitfhglh]

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[Lethe_Keres]

Just a few people off the top of my head no specific order; Zez, Zarfot, Telmo, Elias, The Old Nite, Fat Wrecked, Larryr, N0valyfe, Aclaw, Skateenjoi. All of them I consider to be better scapers then suomi.

You're just naming names for the sake of arguing. The last few players you mentioned were simply the first to 200M in a partcular skill.

 

•Larryr specialized in Runecrafting, and was a good person, but in no way was the best scaper.

•You're mentioning The Old Nite and Fat Wrecked just because they died, not because of their gains.

•Telmo, Elias, Nova, Zarfot, and Zezima are all good scapers, but none of then have accomplished what Suomi has.

 

I don't understand how else you'd judge the 'best player' other than total xp (perhaps in total non-buyable xp? Buyable xp isn't viable because many dicers would then rank, despite relatively low total xp), but regardless, the best scaper has the most xp. Suomi currently has the most xp, so he's the best. It's not hard.

 

I'm not naming names for the sake of arguing. Nor was I naming them for 200m in a certain skill. Larryr made a buisness out of rc and she gave away gps to random players out of kindness. I mentioned Nite and Fat Wrecked because I was close friends with them when they played and they were always friendly helpful people to everyone. They weren't cocky. They were respectful players.

As for Telmo, Elias, Nova, Zarfot, and Zezima they don't have Suomis gains because he plays 2x as much as all of them and had to beg for bils of gp to accomplish what he did. None of them ever begged for cash. And they were ahead of him for the longest time. Put it into the perspective that if free trade never came back, Suomi wouldn't even be on the front page high scores. You can give anyone bils of gp and they can easily coast to the front page exactly like he did. So he isn't even close to the best scaper in this game. Exp means nothing in 2k12 where a company supports RWT, Botting, RAF, SoF. I've played this game from the beginning and this isn't even close to the game that Andrew and Paul envisioned.

[Thorgmir]

You guys are seriously debating if Suomi is best or not? wow

 

He will be fist to "beat" the game, EOD

Nobody is debating that. It's the methods he used to get there.

I honestly doubt he would have been ahead of Elias, Elvis and maybe JD if he hadn't received donations.

 

According to the last time calc update, SUOMI is more than 7000 hours ahead of all those players. Even if he spent 4000 hours bossing to make the 20B or so all 200M costs, he'd still be hugely ahead of them. Come back when any of those three are even halfway to 200M fishing, mining, or agility. kthxbai.

[Xems]

The reason I would put SUOMI as the greatest player as of now is simply because he has the most amount of xp (while gaining it all in a RS legal way). Now Zarfot was great in his time...(I don't quite remember the reason for quitting)...but he quit. Whether he couldn't keep it up or simply didn't want to do it any longer puts him below #1. SUOMI has been playing all these years at the same pace consistently for years now. Him playing 2x as many hours than the other top players is what makes his mindset remarkable (not saying it's healthy, but in regards to RS, it's unbelievable.)

 

As far as Larryr, Nite, or Fat Wrecked being the greatest...There is no way you can claim that they are better. Sure they may have been the nicest players but what does that have to do with this debate.

 

Now if Zarfot started playing tomorrow and reached 200m in all skills a solid 2 years or so after SUOMI with no donations, then sure SUOMI would be bumped down to 2nd greatest. Or say a few years from now, couple of the top players finally maxed out all skills with no donations, then SUOMI would be bumped down a few notches. I value the effort put forth into the account more than the donations. But despite SUOMIs donations, I feel like he has still exerted the most effort into his account. So in my books, SUOMI is still the greatest until someone has equaled SUOMIs success with out donations.

[asfcjfdyitfhglh]

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[Thai_tong]

Playing within the spirit of the game might also constitute how good a scaper is.

I've already explained what constitutes the best player

You sound very cocky here

[Uade]

Exp means nothing in 2k12 where a company supports RWT, Botting, RAF, SoF. I've played this game from the beginning and this isn't even close to the game that Andrew and Paul envisioned.

 

Not trying to go off topic here, but Jagex doesn't support nor do RWT.

[Robert_R]

Look guys I think you're all wrong obviously Dragonseance is the best player of all time.

 

 

 

[Jebrim]

Lmao are u guys being serious? Suomi's non-buyables speak for themselves, everyone is so concerned about donations that they forget the amazing accomplishments suomi has had zezima for one would not come close to suomi with or without donations in terms of consistency, nor will anyone else imo

^This

 

You guys forget that Suomi has every slow skill at 200m Xp atm. No other player out there has more than 2 slow 200m's. If Elvis, Jake, Elias, or Jdel had spent their time doing slow skills like Suomi, they wouldn't be anywhere near him. He would have a huge lead over every other player to 200m all skills in terms of hours regardless. Even if you pretend he had no buyable 200m's done at all and looked solely at his non-buyables, they'd still be far more impressive than anything the other top players have.

[Jebrim]

The problem is that most skills involve some buyable aspect these days.

 

You've got the obvious: Herblore, Prayer, Crafting, Cooking, Fletching, Construction, Summoning, Farming that are typically viewed as 'buyables'.

 

Then you've also got the cost of Slayer, in cannonballs, scrolls, chaotic repairs, prayer pots. That comes to well over 1b over the course of 200m. (Assuming you make ovls for herb and that cost is counted in herb not slay)

 

Suomi's C2 method of woodcutting also involved him paying 5m/hr was it? That makes WC what, 20 gp/xp? Even if people were willing to do it out of the goodness of their heart, your average player couldn't have people clearing dgs and finding skill plots. If people did it for free, a lot of it comes down to Suomi being #1, which is a result of the donations. I'm not sure what the cost of superheat mining is, but over the course of 200m xp you're going to be spending around 500m on nats.

 

Then there's fishing and agility, Suomi did barb fishing and agility at barb. But fishing is faster to do with the C2 clearing method too, so the actual fastest way of training turns fishing into a buyable too. I have no idea if Suomi used a horn or not, but paying front page BA players to fill your horn takes agility from 65k/hr or w/e it is now to 80k+ on average. (That includes time spent filling the horn.) So when it comes down to it, the most efficient way of training to 200m makes almost every skill expensive to train. Hell, paying for 4s1l dungeoneering is the fastest, if not most fun, way of doing dg.

 

Only Thieving, Hunter, Dungeoneering, (if you don't leech) and Runecrafting don't have significant costs.

 

So if you discount buyables, Suomi would barely be touching 1b total xp right now. Making the gp for 200m all without buying a dice rank or getting lucky in the DA is almost as large a component as training the skills themselves. I remember reading in Zarfot's merchanting guide that at the height of his flipping, he averaged 50m/day. That's when he had the huge amounts of capital needed to invest effectively.

 

Discarding the buyable aspect is basically impossible.

 

Okay, that's just stupid lmfao. He did not use any money to increase his Fishing, Agility, or Mining gains except for bait for Fishing and pouches for Fish/Mine, which is all negligible and made up from banking anyways. He did not do BA.

 

Something I don't think you guys are understanding is that for the past few years, Suomi has had the 2nd most hours/year put into RS out of every player in the game. If you've stalked Runetracker enough, this should be obvious. On top of that, though, he is also one of the biggest players in refusing to waste time/Xp on RS, meaning no standing around or partying or even ranking up people in your friends chat. He's always been super picky about all that. He has by far surpassed every player in RS and imo is the first person to hold rank 1 that I truly believed deserves it. I've long criticized many of the buyable noobs who held #1 that simply got cheap Xp without having put in as much work as some lower ranks (like Suomi at the time).

[asfcjfdyitfhglh]

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[Jebrim]

You sound very cocky here

 

I'm sorry if it came across that way. Feel free to tell me if there is another way to measure it - I was simply saying what I could see as a viable option for determining the 'best' player. My reasoning is that while one's personality may be great, the nicest person every could play RuneScape and if they were inefficient, they simply would not be the best RuneScape player. What other ways to measure are there, save efficiency or total xp?

 

Well I judge by the amount of effort required for all of their stats, not just by Xp. I valuate both the Xp rate they took for various skills, their skill in getting a high rate in said method, and how afk said method was. How much they could nolife is also another plus. Another important factor is how much time overall was required for their total stats. Someone with 200m Rc from ZMI and 200m Agility from Barb and 200m Mining from LRC superheating (200m Mage and 200m Smith) would be better than pretty much every player under 2b Overall Xp, in my opinion, and even better than some of those over it.

[stonewall337]

Suomi didn't have to spend any(much) time to make the gp. Anyone else would still be making the gp now.

 

Seriously.. the GP involved is probably the smallest part. He would've done it without donations if no one had chosen to fund him. But people want to help. The shear amount of time and dedication involved not to mention his skill with maintaining high levels of efficiency for hours on end is the reason that he's come so far.

I'm not saying anything about that. It's the fact the statement 'great'. A 'great' scaper wouldn't need donations. That's all I'm saying.

 

That's a rather interesting statement to make, considering how the word "great" can mean so many different things. A Great "scaper" could mean most efficient, nicest, most skilled, richest, fastest, first to X goal, etc etc etc. Don't make your claims of what is/isn't great and then refuse to define and defend what you mean by "great". That's just stupid.

 

A "great" scaper is one who achieves 200m in all skills before anyone else, being the only person in the world to have done so (be definition).

 

See what I did there? Now prove me wrong, or counter define. Defending a term you refuse to define is what we call a "moving target". Since you haven't yet told us what you mean by "great", at any time, to save your argument, you can counter my argument by saying "that's not what I meant I meant X instead." It doesn't work like that. At this point you have to both defeat my definition and establish your own, or else your entire statement loses absolutely all validity. Logic. Use it.

[stonewall337]

Playing within the spirit of the game might also constitute how good a scaper is.

I've already explained what constitutes the best player

You sound very cocky here

 

That's not an argument. It's what I call the "shut up now" reply. Like "you mad bro" when you say something in a video game. There is no good way to answer it, because the other person will just reply "lol mad" again. You refuse to argue the issue and just try and mock the other person.

 

"'Logic!' said the Professor half to himself. 'Why don't they teach logic at these schools?"

[Zeni]

You sound very cocky here

 

I'm sorry if it came across that way. Feel free to tell me if there is another way to measure it - I was simply saying what I could see as a viable option for determining the 'best' player. My reasoning is that while one's personality may be great, the nicest person every could play RuneScape and if they were inefficient, they simply would not be the best RuneScape player. What other ways to measure are there, save efficiency or total xp?

 

You can measure the "best" scaper by whatever definition you choose, and thus, this is a pointless argument. I could say that, in my opinion, Castle Wars is the best scaper because he was the first to achieve a trimmed completionist cape. Also, efficiency (at least as I understand it) is only a measure of how effectively you achieve your goals. So, a person who was the nicest ever would be very efficient, if being the nicest player was his/her goal.

 

In relation to this thread though, being about players reaching 200m xp in all skills, you probably would need to define "best" by gameplay hours remaining to 200m in all skills. However, you could put as many restrictions on that as you want to in your definition of "best", from no exploiting glitches (which I believe is a given), to no accepting donations, to doing the whole thing DIY style. Depending on how you restrict it, SUOMI may or may not be the best scaper.

[muggiwhplar]

I don't see the logic in bashing the people who ask for donations to fund their goals.

 

It'd be different if he was FORCING people to donate money somehow, but that's obviously not the case here.

 

The problem here is that people see a guy with almost 5B XP, and they're unimpressed because he was smart about achieving it. Accepting donations doesn't mean his achievements are meaningless; it means he's smarter than the people too stubborn to maximize their time and efficiency.

[Donnie]

if carlos slim (richest human on the world) would spend 95% of his money (69 billion dollars -5%) on squeel of fortune spins. WOULD HE HAVE 200M ALL SKILLS?!?!?!?!??! and how rich would he be on rs? (just in general if he ever gunna play it or not)?

 

or he can buy Jagex for 1/100th the cost and wipe everyones stats for the hell of it

[Alex_PFC]

if carlos slim (richest human on the world) would spend 95% of his money (69 billion dollars -5%) on squeel of fortune spins. WOULD HE HAVE 200M ALL SKILLS?!?!?!?!??! and how rich would he be on rs? (just in general if he ever gunna play it or not)?

 

or he can buy Jagex for 1/100th the cost and wipe everyones stats for the hell of it

 

Gamed

[Fallstar]

The problem is that most skills involve some buyable aspect these days.

 

You've got the obvious: Herblore, Prayer, Crafting, Cooking, Fletching, Construction, Summoning, Farming that are typically viewed as 'buyables'.

 

Then you've also got the cost of Slayer, in cannonballs, scrolls, chaotic repairs, prayer pots. That comes to well over 1b over the course of 200m. (Assuming you make ovls for herb and that cost is counted in herb not slay)

 

Suomi's C2 method of woodcutting also involved him paying 5m/hr was it? That makes WC what, 20 gp/xp? Even if people were willing to do it out of the goodness of their heart, your average player couldn't have people clearing dgs and finding skill plots. If people did it for free, a lot of it comes down to Suomi being #1, which is a result of the donations. I'm not sure what the cost of superheat mining is, but over the course of 200m xp you're going to be spending around 500m on nats.

 

Then there's fishing and agility, Suomi did barb fishing and agility at barb. But fishing is faster to do with the C2 clearing method too, so the actual fastest way of training turns fishing into a buyable too. I have no idea if Suomi used a horn or not, but paying front page BA players to fill your horn takes agility from 65k/hr or w/e it is now to 80k+ on average. (That includes time spent filling the horn.) So when it comes down to it, the most efficient way of training to 200m makes almost every skill expensive to train. Hell, paying for 4s1l dungeoneering is the fastest, if not most fun, way of doing dg.

 

Only Thieving, Hunter, Dungeoneering, (if you don't leech) and Runecrafting don't have significant costs.

 

So if you discount buyables, Suomi would barely be touching 1b total xp right now. Making the gp for 200m all without buying a dice rank or getting lucky in the DA is almost as large a component as training the skills themselves. I remember reading in Zarfot's merchanting guide that at the height of his flipping, he averaged 50m/day. That's when he had the huge amounts of capital needed to invest effectively.

 

Discarding the buyable aspect is basically impossible.

 

Okay, that's just stupid lmfao. He did not use any money to increase his Fishing, Agility, or Mining gains except for bait for Fishing and pouches for Fish/Mine, which is all negligible and made up from banking anyways. He did not do BA.

 

Something I don't think you guys are understanding is that for the past few years, Suomi has had the 2nd most hours/year put into RS out of every player in the game. If you've stalked Runetracker enough, this should be obvious. On top of that, though, he is also one of the biggest players in refusing to waste time/Xp on RS, meaning no standing around or partying or even ranking up people in your friends chat. He's always been super picky about all that. He has by far surpassed every player in RS and imo is the first person to hold rank 1 that I truly believed deserves it. I've long criticized many of the buyable noobs who held #1 that simply got cheap Xp without having put in as much work as some lower ranks (like Suomi at the time).

 

I know he didn't use money for those skills, but it was inefficient for him not to do so. Efficiently training those skills turns them into buyables, which was the point of my post. (That you cannot simply disregard the buyable aspect.)