Out of Touch

[Michaael]

Before I start, this is not a Jagex bash thread, this is simply a discussion of updates and if we as players know what the game needs more than they do. Please leave all your negativity towards Jagex here, or back it up with reasoning.

 

 

 

 

 

Looking at today's update as well as a lot of recent updates, I'm asking myself the question "does Jagex really know their own game?"

 

 

 

Sure, they know how to code and create within their studio, but do they understand the interactions and mechanics we face as players?

 

 

 

My personal answer to this question is, no, unfortunately. As of right now, you can only buy spirit shards in increments of 500, and the maximum is (correct me if I'm wrong) about 65-67k shards per store.

 

 

 

You would think they know that summoning requires more shards than 67k, and that 500 is a ridiculously low amount to purchase in. Any employee with a half decent account would know this is a problem, but yet it came through in the update today. It's going to take FOREVER to train summoning if you have to spend hours just buying the shards.

 

 

 

It's my opinion that although Jagex has been making attempts to reach out to their community (which I applaud), they have lost touch with the design part of the game. I wouldn't say they're stupid people, but are simply unaware of what they're doing to their game with each update. I guess I could call this a "guess and check" method, PvP ringing a bell anyone?

 

 

 

So what do you think? Has Jagex lost their grasp of how their game works for us as players?

[Needaname]

I personally think the same, the shops where nice as they where anyways, how many people buy from the stores?

 

Only 3 i can think off actually does:

 

Culiomancer Chest

 

Spirit shards stores (theres like 3 of them)

 

And the meat store on ooglog.

 

There may be more, but i see the infinite ammount on each a very good way on this all, also the Buy X option, now they remove this, NOW ''WE'' have to waste our time on some shops like the Spirit shards ones, some people could buy from GE but. now theres a possibility that the spirit shard becames a item with price range (24-26 gp can be the start but only you can buy 10k per 4 hours) so going to shops will be the main deal.

 

Now we gotta waste your time collecting charms, buying the shards and then making the pounches.

 

 

 

Also makes me think this, JaGeX wants to put a limit on how many time we can waste(time and cash) on skills, especially summoning? They putting us limits!

[Stewie_Griffen]

I know it's not exactly the 50k at a time we had with infinite stock, but before infinite stock people had to buy 10 at a time. Think about how magic or even fly fishing was then.

[Zachneap]

we had bots for that.

[SirLegerity]

I completely agree. For a while Jagex seemed oblivious to the fact that manipulation clans are ruining the economy as well as 26/76kers were ruining the economy for most of the summer. Jagex seems to make many half-baked, buggy updates nowadays because they've been trying to please everyone (pkers, skillers, merchants, etc.), which isn't possible and shouldn't be attempted.

[Michaael]

I completely agree. For a while Jagex seemed oblivious to the fact that manipulation clans are ruining the economy as well as 26/76kers were ruining the economy for most of the summer. Jagex seems to make many half-baked, buggy updates nowadays because they've been trying to please everyone (pkers, skillers, merchants, etc.), which isn't possible and shouldn't be attempted.

 

 

 

I'm not sure what their problem has been this year. The "upgrades" as they call them have been nice, but are too few and far between to be remembered for long. What will remain, is the memory of havoc and general anger at the changes they make to a game WE pay to play.

 

 

 

Shouldn't we, the customer be the ones telling them what to do?

 

 

 

They just have too much on their plate with what problems they've caused, but IMO problems that need dealt with in order:

 

1. PvP tricking and in general - and get it right this time

 

2. Merch Clans

 

4. Even out the combat system, overhaul it at that

 

3. Get high level content into the game, something to work for

[mrph3r]

Looking at the history of Jagex personnel, I'm starting to think it's Iddison's fault for ruining the thing the game had going, and it's going to take a while to clean it up.

 

 

 

His experience was 'big internet business' experience, which of course is all about the profits. As suspected, most of Jagex's revenue probably does not come from 'intelligent', 'high-leveled', or even necessarily 'honorable' players, and the most vocal often do not fall into this category either. The updates that came during his tenure reinforced this supposition, and so the updates since then have assumed that these are the typical RS players, leaving people like me (skiller, 1999 total, anti-merch) farther and farther out. As long as Jagex has 21 extremely dedicated players, the rest of us mid- to high-leveled older players can go switch to a more incentive-laden game, such as Minesweeper.

 

 

 

I finally quit in about July of 2008 due to the fact that things such as the Exchange were frustrating me to the point that I just didn't care so much anymore. My membership lapsed for about 9 months as I did other things - and when I came back in May of this year, most of my friends had either quit or had deleted me. However, to my surprise, most of the ones that were still active when I quit (probably only about 70 or 80 out of 180...I'm horrible about cleaning old names) had done the exact same thing as I had - gotten furious with the direction RS was taking, left for several months, and come back, mostly in a diminished capacity, for various reasons.

 

Jagex doesn't even seem to have noticed such a relatively large group of people leaving the fold, because it's -not a relatively large group-. If we want to really do anything about it, the thing would probably be to become even more annoyingly vocal about it than those who are more ignorant. And also to vote in the RS Machinima contest to send somebody to Cambridge who will give Jagex a piece of their mind about this issue XD

[Suiku]

I think they don't have time to look after all the minimal things every update and just wait a few days until they fix it, in the meantime train other skills

[jcube69]

im sure the shards will be fixed in either the amount needed per pouch or the shards will be put to infinite...or a faster buying amount and respawn time

 

 

 

summoning came out after infinite shops from what i remember...this skilll would almost be impossible to train if it continued like this as i just used 500k shards 2 days ago going from 70-79...

 

all og get thats a MINIMUM of 200 hours..thats bs for 9 levels that was only like 900kxp?

 

 

 

94-99 could take thousands of hours just to buy the shards? charms take long enough bs

 

 

 

no way in hell will it be kept this way i gaurntee it will change or at least the shop will have 500k+ stock and respawn fully withing an hour or 3

[X3EN]

Yes, it seems jagex really forgot two things:

 

 

 

Summoning

 

Broad bolts

 

 

 

I completely agree untradable charms take way too long for jagex to even think about adding another obstacle to train summoning.

 

 

 

Broad bolts are going to skyrocket, since the demand is huge, while making them needs 300 slay points AND they give very low XP. Now you wont be even able to buy them normally...

[Saru Inc]

Just give it time. ;)

 

 

 

Hopefully it'll be fixed.

[kingbrooks]

Just give it time. ;)

 

 

 

Hopefully it'll be fixed.

 

 

 

I agree, it's easy to forget that some items need to have a large stock (though this doesn't excuse shards through my eyes as that is very obvious), however Jagex has already promised to alter bird meat stock, maybe other stocks will be changed to? Make a post on rsof and hope for the best. :thumbup:

[jonni]

selling 500k shards lol!!!!? \

 

 

 

Looking at the history of Jagex personnel, I'm starting to think it's Iddison's fault for ruining the thing the game had going, and it's going to take a while to clean it up.

 

 

 

 

I agree, I think if jagex had been under MMG when the time came in 2007 to end rwt things would've been a lot different - i.e. asking the players for solutions etc.

[Maximusa]

Although I do feel they are out of touch.. I however feel that your main point was an oversight rather than an 'out of touch' issue.

 

 

 

We are so used to the unlimited stock in shops we forgot that it isnt meant to be that way. It was a quick fix.

 

 

 

Now they fix it properly and they overlooked some of the shops that dont have enough inventory/function very well to fully support the players. Considering all the shops and items its not hard to overlook shards, bird meat etc.

 

 

 

Now its just a matter of are they going to fix it or not.

[NukeMarine]

So let me get this straight: Jagex has brought back a technique in Runescape that's been missing, the low level item merchant, and you're complaining?

 

 

 

With Max and Min prices lifted on these items, you now can buy out your stock daily and build up for a nice profit by selling on the exchange to those that need it. On the other hand, if you can't buy enough shards from the store, buy them on the exchange from players that collected them and are selling them for a reasonable profit.

 

 

 

The infinite stock solved some problems, but it ruined the ability for low level players to do grunt work for high level players, and get some cash for it.

 

 

 

Oh, and it removes junk prices from the game. With no minimum limits in the GE, bye bye junk trades (look for big rants on this soon, I'm sure).

[Yoko Kurama]

So let me get this straight: Jagex has brought back a technique in Runescape that's been missing, the low level item merchant, and you're complaining?

 

 

 

With Max and Min prices lifted on these items, you now can buy out your stock daily and build up for a nice profit by selling on the exchange to those that need it. On the other hand, if you can't buy enough shards from the store, buy them on the exchange from players that collected them and are selling them for a reasonable profit.

 

 

 

The infinite stock solved some problems, but it ruined the ability for low level players to do grunt work for high level players, and get some cash for it.

 

 

 

Oh, and it removes junk prices from the game. With no minimum limits in the GE, bye bye junk trades (look for big rants on this soon, I'm sure).

 

 

 

No, there were a huge series of updates that were short-sighted--all addded today. Aside from, this whole year has been testament to how out of touch they are, so I concur with the originally poster.

[oropher]

So let me get this straight: Jagex has brought back a technique in Runescape that's been missing, the low level item merchant, and you're complaining?

 

 

 

With Max and Min prices lifted on these items, you now can buy out your stock daily and build up for a nice profit by selling on the exchange to those that need it. On the other hand, if you can't buy enough shards from the store, buy them on the exchange from players that collected them and are selling them for a reasonable profit.

 

 

 

The infinite stock solved some problems, but it ruined the ability for low level players to do grunt work for high level players, and get some cash for it.

 

 

 

Oh, and it removes junk prices from the game. With no minimum limits in the GE, bye bye junk trades (look for big rants on this soon, I'm sure).

 

 

 

Why would this affect junk items? The one thing these items have in common is that no one is able to sell them in ge, because noone wants them... If they dont get sold, price wont change.

[3hitm4g3u]

Are we FINALLY going to be able to buy rope on the GE when we need it?

 

 

 

And yes, Jagex is definately out of touch.

[PolarBearBlue]

Jagex is a little out of touch but not because they aren't trying. many factors go into why these updates came to be but they are trying to fix it. You can't expect a perfect game. if jagex was to turn everything back to old Runescape were the wild is the wild, no Grand Exchange, done away with Bounty Hunter and everything that was pre 2007, you'd find people who will then complain. We can't expect this game to be perfect... Give it time. Instead of wondering what this year is about wait and look forward to the new year. they are trying to listen. we just need to help them a little more...Or if you don't like the game just stop playing and come back when you feel like it.

[Everyonedies]

I am nearly always the last to ever say anythign bad about jagex but they gave up unlimited supplies at stores to fix one problem but then we got used to hey i can go and buy those 500 pots with soil i need for the 500 willow seeds i just bought. Now it seems you will have to slowly stock pile seemingly trivial items in your bank over time so that later you can use for whatever it is your going to be training. They really are a little out of touch when it comes to how people prepare to level up thier skills. Buts its easy to get used to just everyay go to the store and buy out the supply and then come back the next and repeat for as many days as it take to get what you need.(not the best way but it will have to do) Or try buying on the GE for extra money.

[NukeMarine]

 

 

 

Oh, and it removes junk prices from the game. With no minimum limits in the GE, bye bye junk trades (look for big rants on this soon, I'm sure).

 

 

 

Why would this affect junk items? The one thing these items have in common is that no one is able to sell them in ge, because noone wants them... If they dont get sold, price wont change.

 

 

 

Well, think about it ...... ok, long enough. It was the price floor limit that was set that made it to where items like unstrung bows and various potions and whatever to not go to a price that players were willing to buy it. So you had an item the game claimed was worth 400 gp that no one would pay 400 gp for. Yet it stayed at 400 gp minimum. Removing the price floor means such items will begin to drop since no one is buying them on the GE. An unstrung maple bow worth 6 gp on the GE isn't useful as a junk trade item. So yeah, bye bye junk trades.

 

 

 

In a month, there will be rants galore on how no one can rent their items for 100k gp.

 

 

 

By the way, this is a good thing. I was against floor limits and ceiling limits for a long time. That this fixes junk trades is even better.

[Michaael]

Ok, so maybe the summoning shops isn't the best way to describe them as out of touch. What about releasing godswords for a mere level 75 requirement? They can nearly 1 hit players, at that rate level 99 weapons (if we ever live to see them) will easily overkill players.

 

 

 

Or we can look more in depth at PvP. They've messed up time after time with it, and although I know they try, they need to think like criminals when designing it. Players are greedy when it comes down to it, but they have let players milk the system since they last updated PvP to give direct cash rather than monster drop items.

[redstarmafia]

For the most part I've always like the updates. I hated the GE at first, but now I appreciate it. I agree that it seems really frustrating to higher lvls to have that shard limit, but im confident in jagex that they will fix this.

[Michaael]

That's the problem I have with Jagex lately though. I don't pay them for "guess and check" method updates, I want them to get it right the first time and not worry about fixing it with next weeks update.

[Platinum_Myr]

I think that they should reduce the cost of shards from the shops, and then de-link shards in the GE from shards in the shops. Then you can buy from GE in large large quantities, but for more than it costs to get from store. This allows a simple merchanter to buy shards from the store and sell on GE for a profit. However, I do think more than 75kish shards should be in the shops.