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Krist115

Teams and Multiclanning

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Do you classify being in a team or country/community clan multi clanning?

Yeah.

 

What do you consider a correct definition of multi clanning?

 

I find being in a clan and a team multi-clanning because really teams are basically clans now. Most teams that

I can think of right now have wars, have forums, have a ts/vent. In those teams, there is really only one difference

a clan and them, and that is the word "TEAM" in their name.

 

I agree. :thumbup:

 

We see everything from our individualistic point of view, most of people posted are in a team, they wont agree they multiclan.

 

Teams are as good as a clan and does all the activity what a clan does, where's the difference?

 

I think it's fruitless debating what's multi-clanning and what's not, every week a new topic about multi-clanning is posted on TWR and RSC, the presentation differs the matter is still the same.

 

We know the problem but there is no remedy for it. And the only possible solution I can think off is too harsh too be implemented.

 

Surely you can agree that members in PVP clans and CWA clans are also multiclanners then? And if you do think teams are part of multiclanning, why don't you prevent your members from joining teams?

 

Well Jack, There is no Remedy for this chaotic problem that put the clan world into a slump of eternity. The only solution has to be HARSH PUNISHMENT, meaning DV would kick their members and slump even more and that is why they still seek another remedy.

 

It wouldn't be a punishment for many of them seeing as they have a second clan to fall back onto. :lol:


Genesis Leader

Ending Templar & Trial Caller of The Rising

Ex-Leader of Silent Ember - Ex-Leader of True Ownage - Ex-Leader of Legendz

Former Tip.It Clan Community Leader

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Well Jack, There is no Remedy for this chaotic problem that put the clan world into a slump of eternity. The only solution has to be HARSH PUNISHMENT, meaning DV would kick their members and slump even more and that is why they still seek another remedy.

 

This thread isn't about any specific clan. It's discussing the actions of the collective community. Keep it on topic, and that goes for everyone else.


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Okay, so let's say your own clan has members in TEAMS but you're really against it, surely you see multiclanning in more than one offical clan as well. You're highly against it which means theres no solutions for you but the following:

 

1. KICK ALL OF THEM, and make them re app with the new rules

2. Allow it to go on, but complain about other clans joining teams [ AKA Hypocracy ]

3. Close your clan


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Point is, we wouldnt do that Ever really,

 

Teams are there for a bit extra warring experience, just to add some lulz u could say, ur main clan is were ur main focus is on and thats what u put first before everything else, but if your in 2 MAIN CLANS then were does your attention go first?


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Do you classify being in a team or country/community clan multi clanning?

Yeah.

 

What do you consider a correct definition of multi clanning?

 

I find being in a clan and a team multi-clanning because really teams are basically clans now. Most teams that

I can think of right now have wars, have forums, have a ts/vent. In those teams, there is really only one difference

a clan and them, and that is the word "TEAM" in their name.

 

I agree. :thumbup:

 

We see everything from our individualistic point of view, most of people posted are in a team, they wont agree they multiclan.

 

Teams are as good as a clan and does all the activity what a clan does, where's the difference?

 

I think it's fruitless debating what's multi-clanning and what's not, every week a new topic about multi-clanning is posted on TWR and RSC, the presentation differs the matter is still the same.

 

We know the problem but there is no remedy for it. And the only possible solution I can think off is too harsh too be implemented.

You are absolutely right :thumbup:

 

Asking a community of teamers whether or not teaming should be considered multi-clanning is sort of like a cop asking a drug dealer if he deals drugs.

 

This debate is totally pointless, asking teamers if teaming should be allowed is completely absurd.


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Surely you can agree that members in PVP clans and CWA clans are also multiclanners then? And if you do think teams are part of multiclanning, why don't you prevent your members from joining teams?

 

Jack we are in the same boat.

 

when you see multi-clanning rule you think I am in a team, teams are made for fun, and I am in Clan Europe, well its a country clan, yea I dont multi clan, other's do!

 

If the rules have loopholes they will be exploited, you guys been making topic after topic about multi-clanning on TWR and RSC, has anything changed ??

 

Let some action be taken against multi-clanners, only then those who do it will think about doing it or not.


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Even though Northern Gods is a country clan, maybe about 10 from our 106 member are in international clan. But we still allow it.

 

It's everyone's own decidion.


Ex-leader of Northern Gods ~ ~ High council of Northern Gods

Ex-leader of Clan Europe ~ ~ Retired of Clan Europe

 

RuneScape since 2002. Part of clan world since 2004. The first clan; Clan Jaguar (meow).

 

Never trust anyone.

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So if all these clan officials have such a huge issue with teams, why aren't more clans disallowing teams? I know of only one or two clans that truly forbid teams. Why aren't there more, if there are really so many people who feel so strongly about this? If multiclanning is really a threat to main clans, you would think that people would outlaw this outright.

 

Is it just the Top 10 Flock Mentality? ie Corr/VR/EoS don't ban it so we won't. Or is it that people just don't see this as a threat, just more competition for members (which isn't always a bad thing)?

 

At this point teams are just too popular for a clan to ban their members from joining one. Like people have mentioned, you'd just end up with a ton of people leaving.


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So if all these clan officials have such a huge issue with teams, why aren't more clans disallowing teams? I know of only one or two clans that truly forbid teams. Why aren't there more, if there are really so many people who feel so strongly about this? If multiclanning is really a threat to main clans, you would think that people would outlaw this outright.

 

Is it just the Top 10 Flock Mentality? ie Corr/VR/EoS don't ban it so we won't. Or is it that people just don't see this as a threat, just more competition for members (which isn't always a bad thing)?

 

At this point teams are just too popular for a clan to ban their members from joining one. Like people have mentioned, you'd just end up with a ton of people leaving.

 

Yeah, but at the same time if people are so upset about this, then you're going to have to start making those unpopular decisions at first. Someone's got to take the first step, except everyone seems to be terrified over how many members they might lose to do so. It makes arguing about this useless, albeit for different reasons than others feel it is useless.

 

It's why I think this is part of the flock mentality. Clan A will block teams if they see Clan B/C/D/E/F/G/etc do it. God forbid they put themselves at a disadvantage for what they believe in. Because they want to preserve 'quality'.


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So if all these clan officials have such a huge issue with teams, why aren't more clans disallowing teams? I know of only one or two clans that truly forbid teams. Why aren't there more, if there are really so many people who feel so strongly about this? If multiclanning is really a threat to main clans, you would think that people would outlaw this outright.

 

Is it just the Top 10 Flock Mentality? ie Corr/VR/EoS don't ban it so we won't. Or is it that people just don't see this as a threat, just more competition for members (which isn't always a bad thing)?

 

At this point teams are just too popular for a clan to ban their members from joining one. Like people have mentioned, you'd just end up with a ton of people leaving.

 

Yeah, but at the same time if people are so upset about this, then you're going to have to start making those unpopular decisions at first. Someone's got to take the first step, except everyone seems to be terrified over how many members they might lose to do so. It makes arguing about this useless, albeit for different reasons than others feel it is useless.

 

It's why I think this is part of the flock mentality. Clan A will block teams if they see Clan B/C/D/E/F/G/etc do it. God forbid they put themselves at a disadvantage for what they believe in. Because they want to preserve 'quality'.

 

Firstly, I think its a growing notion that teams are a way to multi-clan. You should notice increasingly more and more topics related to this on different fan sites than ever before. When you are looking for larger clans for answers, you will not find it there. Since there are no teams as large as top clans, so there is no threat for them yet to take it into perspective. As I said in my previous post, it is relative. Moreover, when a large clan is involved in a team which is shared with many smaller clans, the larger clan benefits the most by absorbing new members even though the smaller clans benefit temporarily (strictly speaking when there are large difference of sizes with the clans involved) , and the smaller clans take the loss. Usually, no one notices the little man amongst giants. Its the little clans that make up the massive population in clanning world, although not involved so visibly on fan sites.

 

Secondly, multiclanning is more of a tradition than a trend in its different forms. Even when old wildy was around, people sought to be in multiple clans. It was a sort of popularity status. It is when these clans clashed in wildy for a rank or recognition, that is where this tradition was stopped or prevented by ladders and ranking systems to create fair means of competition OR simply to avoid endless arguments and disputes. The newer ranking systems allow this sort of multi-clanning and their rules are more relaxed in this regard. The larger ranking systems have so massive and powerful clans that no teams of that size can exist in them to be able to compete... unless they are a country clan, which is (with reference to my previous post) a larger version of a team/ multi clanning group. The flock mentality as you call it stops or starts with widely accepted ranking systems and their enforcements.


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So if all these clan officials have such a huge issue with teams, why aren't more clans disallowing teams? I know of only one or two clans that truly forbid teams. Why aren't there more, if there are really so many people who feel so strongly about this? If multiclanning is really a threat to main clans, you would think that people would outlaw this outright.

 

Is it just the Top 10 Flock Mentality? ie Corr/VR/EoS don't ban it so we won't. Or is it that people just don't see this as a threat, just more competition for members (which isn't always a bad thing)?

 

At this point teams are just too popular for a clan to ban their members from joining one. Like people have mentioned, you'd just end up with a ton of people leaving.

 

Yeah, but at the same time if people are so upset about this, then you're going to have to start making those unpopular decisions at first. Someone's got to take the first step, except everyone seems to be terrified over how many members they might lose to do so. It makes arguing about this useless, albeit for different reasons than others feel it is useless.

 

It's why I think this is part of the flock mentality. Clan A will block teams if they see Clan B/C/D/E/F/G/etc do it. God forbid they put themselves at a disadvantage for what they believe in. Because they want to preserve 'quality'.

 

Firstly, I think its a growing notion that teams are a way to multi-clan. You should notice increasingly more and more topics related to this on different fan sites than ever before. When you are looking for larger clans for answers, you will not find it there. Since there are no teams as large as top clans, so there is no threat for them yet to take it into perspective. As I said in my previous post, it is relative. Moreover, when a large clan is involved in a team which is shared with many smaller clans, the larger clan benefits the most by absorbing new members even though the smaller clans benefit temporarily (strictly speaking when there are large difference of sizes with the clans involved) , and the smaller clans take the loss. Usually, no one notices the little man amongst giants. Its the little clans that make up the massive population in clanning world, although not involved so visibly on fan sites.

 

Secondly, multiclanning is more of a tradition than a trend in its different forms. Even when old wildy was around, people sought to be in multiple clans. It was a sort of popularity status. It is when these clans clashed in wildy for a rank or recognition, that is where this tradition was stopped or prevented by ladders and ranking systems to create fair means of competition OR simply to avoid endless arguments and disputes. The newer ranking systems allow this sort of multi-clanning and their rules are more relaxed in this regard. The larger ranking systems have so massive and powerful clans that no teams of that size can exist in them to be able to compete... unless they are a country clan, which is (with reference to my previous post) a larger version of a team/ multi clanning group. The flock mentality as you call it stops or starts with widely accepted ranking systems and their enforcements.

^ :thumbup:

 

Couldn't have said it better myself, you have touched on some valid points there but I will have to disagree with you on how ranking systems affect the tradition of multi-clanning. Although widely acknowledged ranking systems now allow players to multi-clan/team, I still believe the main proponent of multi-clanning lies not within ranking systems and their enforcements, but within the players themselves. Going back to the days of old wildy, there were players out there who took it upon themselves to multi-clan even though it was shunned by both their respective clans and the ranking systems in which they competed. Yes there may have been consequences, but apparently consequences can only control multi-clanning to a certain extent because it is quite evident in my mind that there will always be people who don't have the capacity to commit to a single clan, even if it means they will have to try and get away with it afterwards in order to avoid any possible consequences. On the other hand, there are also players who prefer to focus their efforts into a single clan instead of joining multiple clans/teams just because the ranking system in question allows them to.

 

So the bottom line here is while ranking systems can tilt the favor for or against multi-clanning, the final decision always rests with the player. There will always be husbands who remain loyal to their wives even in the midst of constant temptation, and then there will always be another Jesse James who doesn't have the capacity to appreciate the beautiful academy award winning actress he was with. Even though there is no law against cheating on your partner, there are still people who will remain loyal. And if there was is a law against cheating on your partner, there are still going to be people who will cheat first and try to get away with it later. It's the same idea with multi-clanning, all I can do is stand here and try my best to convince people but as you have probably noticed, there are plenty of people on Tip.it like Jesse James and none of them appreciate my work. So just for your information, if you intend to oppose multi-clanning then this is the defendant's seat, multi-clanners/teamers are likely to troll and flame you all day long just like they did to me so be sure to choose your words carefully.

 

And before I finish just let me say that it certainly has been a while since I have seen a spark of brilliance within an entire sea of dull minds. If you ever happen to come out of retirement and would like to get back into clanning please don't hesitate to send me a PM, either that or you can just click on my signature to be redirected to Titans Revolution forums. We don't pride ourselves with skilling 24/7 to attain max level, but with possessing one of the most intelligent, dynamic and interactive communities out there and I have a feeling you would fit right in. And you don't have to join if you don't want to, you are most welcome to pop in and have a discussion with me or my fellow clan members in your spare time. My name is Darth Malkor and our IRC channel is #titans-rev, I'm sure our members would be more than happy to hear from you :grin:


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In RuneScape "Multi clanning", like "honour", is something that has been created by people to mean a specific thing, to realise the different perspectives that are around about multi clanning you have to both take that into account and then you have to look at the meaning at face value.

 

What's a clan?

 

Oxford English dictionary definition:

 

"a group with a strong common interest."

 

Based on that there would be no difference between a clan and a team and if you took the phrase "multiclanning" at face value then being in a team would definitely be multiclanning.

 

-----

 

Based on the Runescape meaning on the other hand, "clan" and "team" are different things

 

A clan is an group with a strong common interest that members are expected to prioritise above other things in RS.

 

Based on that definition (which I made up off the top of my head) a team is something different and while they ask for loyalty and to prioritise over most things in RS, they allow that clans come first.

 

That's a fundamental difference and you could argue that therefore being in a team can't be multiclanning as they are different things.

 

-----

 

The difference in opinion is completely down to interpretation of the meaning. I think it's as simple as that. In answer to the original question yes I do think being in teams is multi clanning, but that's because i don't like these RuneScape terms much.


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In RuneScape "Multi clanning", like "honour", is something that has been created by people to mean a specific thing, to realise the different perspectives that are around about multi clanning you have to both take that into account and then you have to look at the meaning at face value.

 

What's a clan?

 

Oxford English dictionary definition:

 

"a group with a strong common interest."

 

Based on that there would be no difference between a clan and a team and if you took the phrase "multiclanning" at face value then being in a team would definitely be multiclanning.

 

 

 

this, definition of it says it is, so how can runescape go challenging definitions such as that, it cant. if you've been clanning a long time ud know old school clans you fought for one team thats your own. I think old school clanners understand more that teams is clanning.

 

im tired so ill update more tomoz


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[FL]RuneScript *** [ URBAN ]: Definitions: 7 | "team" 2. Together Everyone Acheives More

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Do you classify being in a team or country/community clan multi clanning?

 

I do consider it multiclanning if the Clan/Team you are in does the same events. However if your main clan/team comes first, i don't see a problem.

 

What do you consider a correct definition of multi clanning?

 

I consider being in two Clans/teams/country clans, that does the same events and has a rule of "No Multiclanning" being a correct definition of Multi Clanning. Not just Clan wars/PvP clans but Castle wars Clans, PC Clans, SW Clans, GWD Clans, Corp Clans, Skilling Clans, Community clans, Stealing creation Clans, P2P Single Teams/Clans, Etc.

 

For example Character #1 is in "Downfall, Divine Castle wars, Elite SC" Spirit List2, i find that fine as those are different types of Clans and as long as you have a main clan which comes first incass your other clans/teams have events


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Do you classify being in a team or country/community clan multi clanning? No , because they are not Offical clans which means they are just teams of which friends fight togethers in difference clans.

 

 

 

What do you consider a correct definition of multi clanning?

A Runecape Account that are on 2 defferent Offical Clan's ML.

 

However, another one is if say you own 3 Runescape accounts and you are in 3 different clans with those accounts, but there is no control over that,.

 

 

 

 

Another thing.... if a member in your clan cares more about the team/COuntry clan they are in.... then why would you even want that member be in your clan? I mean Teams are great because they can fight along many friends that are in different clans. If certain members think they care about a team than their own clan? then those members should seriously think about their loyality.


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Another thing.... if a member in your clan cares more about the team/COuntry clan they are in.... then why would you even want that member be in your clan? I mean Teams are great because they can fight along many friends that are in different clans. If certain members think they care about a team than their own clan? then those members should seriously think about their loyality.

 

That's the team/country clan's responsibility to make sure that main clan comes before them no matter what. If people cared more about a certain team/country clan more than the clan itself, then I'd either talk with the team/country clan leaders to see if they have that rule enforced and if anyone skipped a T0 event for them then I'd consider pulling all members out from that specific team/country clan. Members loyalty can be an issue too, but with those rules enforced properly then it shouldn't be too much of one.


Genesis Leader

Ending Templar & Trial Caller of The Rising

Ex-Leader of Silent Ember - Ex-Leader of True Ownage - Ex-Leader of Legendz

Former Tip.It Clan Community Leader

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Another thing.... if a member in your clan cares more about the team/COuntry clan they are in.... then why would you even want that member be in your clan? I mean Teams are great because they can fight along many friends that are in different clans. If certain members think they care about a team than their own clan? then those members should seriously think about their loyality.

 

That's the team/country clan's responsibility to make sure that main clan comes before them no matter what. If people cared more about a certain team/country clan more than the clan itself, then I'd either talk with the team/country clan leaders to see if they have that rule enforced and if anyone skipped a T0 event for them then I'd consider pulling all members out from that specific team/country clan. Members loyalty can be an issue too, but with those rules enforced properly then it shouldn't be too much of one.

 

True Jack... but shouldn't it be the responsiblity of the members them selves to understand what comes first? I mean I don't think any Team Leaders will be dumb enough to tell some of the members that their Team are more important than their real Offical clans... but I could be wrong... :mellow:


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Another thing.... if a member in your clan cares more about the team/COuntry clan they are in.... then why would you even want that member be in your clan? I mean Teams are great because they can fight along many friends that are in different clans. If certain members think they care about a team than their own clan? then those members should seriously think about their loyality.

 

That's the team/country clan's responsibility to make sure that main clan comes before them no matter what. If people cared more about a certain team/country clan more than the clan itself, then I'd either talk with the team/country clan leaders to see if they have that rule enforced and if anyone skipped a T0 event for them then I'd consider pulling all members out from that specific team/country clan. Members loyalty can be an issue too, but with those rules enforced properly then it shouldn't be too much of one.

 

True Jack... but shouldn't it be the responsiblity of the members them selves to understand what comes first? I mean I don't think any Team Leaders will be dumb enough to tell some of the members that their Team are more important than their real Offical clans... but I could be wrong... :mellow:

 

Yeah, I agree however the leaders should make sure that they follow the rules for sure. This is where I'm worried about one team t0 members are in, as I've seen recently members of that team skip their main clans war to war for them. The leaders of the team shouldn't tolerate it at all, just creates so many problems.


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Ex-Leader of Silent Ember - Ex-Leader of True Ownage - Ex-Leader of Legendz

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Do you classify being in a team or country/community clan multi clanning?

na

What do you consider a correct definition of multi clanning?

being in 2 or more clans(except country) that does the same things


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Another thing.... if a member in your clan cares more about the team/COuntry clan they are in.... then why would you even want that member be in your clan? I mean Teams are great because they can fight along many friends that are in different clans. If certain members think they care about a team than their own clan? then those members should seriously think about their loyality.

 

That's the team/country clan's responsibility to make sure that main clan comes before them no matter what. If people cared more about a certain team/country clan more than the clan itself, then I'd either talk with the team/country clan leaders to see if they have that rule enforced and if anyone skipped a T0 event for them then I'd consider pulling all members out from that specific team/country clan. Members loyalty can be an issue too, but with those rules enforced properly then it shouldn't be too much of one.

I would like to respectfully disagree with you on that point. Why does a team care if the member is coming to their events over a clans? They don't, it's not their problem or their responsibility. The main clan should be monitoring whether or not their members are skipping for a team, the team doesn't and in fact shouldn't really care if a person skips clan events for them. The main clan leadership/whoever is in charge of war attendance should be making sure that this isn't happenning.


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Bring me the answers, and the road that leads to truth, reveal to me once and for all, how all of this will end.

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Another thing.... if a member in your clan cares more about the team/COuntry clan they are in.... then why would you even want that member be in your clan? I mean Teams are great because they can fight along many friends that are in different clans. If certain members think they care about a team than their own clan? then those members should seriously think about their loyality.

 

That's the team/country clan's responsibility to make sure that main clan comes before them no matter what. If people cared more about a certain team/country clan more than the clan itself, then I'd either talk with the team/country clan leaders to see if they have that rule enforced and if anyone skipped a T0 event for them then I'd consider pulling all members out from that specific team/country clan. Members loyalty can be an issue too, but with those rules enforced properly then it shouldn't be too much of one.

I would like to respectfully disagree with you on that point. Why does a team care if the member is coming to their events over a clans? They don't, it's not their problem or their responsibility. The main clan should be monitoring whether or not their members are skipping for a team, the team doesn't and in fact shouldn't really care if a person skips clan events for them. The main clan leadership/whoever is in charge of war attendance should be making sure that this isn't happenning.

 

If the clan leaders are letting their members be in teams then they shouldn't need to track what they do in that team. They could just easily pull their members out of the team or just say no more teams allowed. Therefore the team should know their place as 2nd in line and imply that with a ruling among their members putting their main clan events first.


Genesis Leader

Ending Templar & Trial Caller of The Rising

Ex-Leader of Silent Ember - Ex-Leader of True Ownage - Ex-Leader of Legendz

Former Tip.It Clan Community Leader

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lol


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~~~Proud Ex-Council of Tempted Killers, There Since Day One~~~

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CLAN EUROPE for example strictly enforces the rule that its Clan > team/country clan etc...

 

ur basically not allowed to skip,

in Silent Ember's application template is says

 

YOUR DEDICATION COMES LIKE SO:

 

YOUR OFFICIAL CLAN

 

SILENT EMBER

 

ETC..

 

now if Team leaders say that its TEAM>Clan

 

then they started the wrong sort of team


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Another thing.... if a member in your clan cares more about the team/COuntry clan they are in.... then why would you even want that member be in your clan? I mean Teams are great because they can fight along many friends that are in different clans. If certain members think they care about a team than their own clan? then those members should seriously think about their loyality.

 

That's the team/country clan's responsibility to make sure that main clan comes before them no matter what. If people cared more about a certain team/country clan more than the clan itself, then I'd either talk with the team/country clan leaders to see if they have that rule enforced and if anyone skipped a T0 event for them then I'd consider pulling all members out from that specific team/country clan. Members loyalty can be an issue too, but with those rules enforced properly then it shouldn't be too much of one.

I would like to respectfully disagree with you on that point. Why does a team care if the member is coming to their events over a clans? They don't, it's not their problem or their responsibility. The main clan should be monitoring whether or not their members are skipping for a team, the team doesn't and in fact shouldn't really care if a person skips clan events for them. The main clan leadership/whoever is in charge of war attendance should be making sure that this isn't happenning.

 

If the clan leaders are letting their members be in teams then they shouldn't need to track what they do in that team. They could just easily pull their members out of the team or just say no more teams allowed. Therefore the team should know their place as 2nd in line and imply that with a ruling among their members putting their main clan events first.

I agree on a lot of those points, however it's the clan's responsibility to know who is skipping and for what reason. I agree (and so does I think everyone) that the loyalty chain should be Clan>Team, however sometimes this isn't what happens. However what I am trying to say is this: The team isn't responsible for their members skipping their clans war to war with said team, sure they can put out warnings but they aren't asking whether or not you skipped a clan event to make it- they just assume you are free to war. Clans on the other hand need to be much more strict, and it is their responsiblity to strike and suspend people for skipping wars to war for a different team.

 

If a clan can't handle people skipping, then it is doing something wrong, ie) Not having enough PvP (or indeed too much PvP.) It isn't warring enough, it doesn't have enough events. If someone puts a Team>Clan then I would assume the team has something that the clan doesn't have.


I have lived my life to the best of my ability, but I have not been able to escape fate, anger, or pain.

Bring me the answers, and the road that leads to truth, reveal to me once and for all, how all of this will end.

Shadows cannot exist without the light. But without the shadows, the light has no meaning.

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