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Tip.It Times - Jagex Interview - 9th May 2010


Racheya
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If they want to impress me about Dung, how about F2P dungeons stop getting P2P requirements. Nothing more annoying than losing 6 bonus percentage of exp because some door have a thieving requirement.

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Looking back, there has been an interview with them back in April 2009, and probably some before this. I think it is a good gesture and though there isn't loads of info on future updates, it's still quite interesting :)

 

Q: Are there any plans in the future for dungeons that are 'instanced' or that make having well coordinated groups a larger benefit?

 

A: Team-play is something we always want to encourage, and as you say, increasing the benefit gained through cooperation is the best way to sell this. As for instanced areas, these allow us to create and modify a challenge uniquely for the players inside. The combination of these key features is something were looking into... and thats all I can say right now. -- Mod Trick

- I'm not proud of everything I've done, but I have no regrets

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If they want to impress me about Dung, how about F2P dungeons stop getting P2P requirements. Nothing more annoying than losing 6 bonus percentage of exp because some door have a thieving requirement.

+1

 

 

Also, remove the 90+ combat nerfed xp. Freaking level 3s get faster XP than their 90+ counterparts.

99 dungeoneering achieved, thanks to everyone that celebrated with me!

 

♪♪ Don't interrupt me as I struggle to complete this thought
Have some respect for someone more forgetful than yourself ♪♪

♪♪ And I'm not done
And I won't be till my head falls off ♪♪

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Hmmmmm..... all in all, this can all be boiled down to one word:

 

Epic!!!!!!!!

Greecl: agreed, mister Eskimo steroid wrestler black guy thingy.

Lite191: =] lol

Greecl: this is going on my siggy on tippit.

lite191: actually im a ninja Eskimo wrestler on steroids with a godsword… on fire.

Greecl: eating a Klondike bar. =p

lite191: yes but it melted=[

Greecl: aw…wish you weren’t on fire now, huh?

lite191 :no.

lite191: Still freaking awesome.me

Greecl: or as Greecl would say… Frosted flakes are better!!!

lite191: agreed.

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I think they themselves are kind of unsure about what they're planning to do next. They have a bunch of ideas but the plans are not concrete.

 

Which is why they can't give us any answers regarding such. They don't really have them.

 

Either way it's been a mostly positive step for them to be doing things that aren't boring ol RS conventional, and here's hoping that they consider their current near-success a positive indicator that is more than just "we'll do more of these if we happen to decide to do more of these". Also perhaps they might figure out combat rebalancing once and for all, and not just think it was a pipe dream to be able to bring about order. It would be such a shame and a waste (in that order) if they really think that when they rebuilt RS inside a dark hole in the ground free of the outside factors that they perceive to be holding them back from making progress, they would not be able to use any of that for their existing game.

 

....

 

Seriously I'm begging here. Please put something back into RS. It is an oppressive purgatory, and any mention of it brings immediate derision and shame. I feel the potential from this circling the drain.

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I think they themselves are kind of unsure about what they're planning to do next. They have a bunch of ideas but the plans are not concrete.

 

Which is why they can't give us any answers regarding such. They don't really have them.

 

Either way it's been a mostly positive step for them to be doing things that aren't boring ol RS conventional, and here's hoping that they consider their current near-success a positive indicator that is more than just "we'll do more of these if we happen to decide to do more of these". Also perhaps they might figure out combat rebalancing once and for all, and not just think it was a pipe dream to be able to bring about order. It would be such a shame and a waste (in that order) if they really think that when they rebuilt RS inside a dark hole in the ground free of the outside factors that they perceive to be holding them back from making progress, they would not be able to use any of that for their existing game.

 

....

 

Seriously I'm begging here. Please put something back into RS. It is an oppressive purgatory, and any mention of it brings immediate derision and shame. I feel the potential from this circling the drain.

 

Be interesting if there can be a PvP variant of Dungeoneering (no, not SC). That'll really show if the combat triangle is balanced inside dungeoneering. Also make for a nice proving ground to further tweek the triangle.

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Seems like a waste of time to train dungeoneering now when the xp rate is going to double or triple this year alone.

Leave it to Jagex to half [wagon] this like all the other new skills since construction.

Put something out that there that is incomplete or stinks and then take a year or two to make it better.

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He just successfully trolled you with "courtesy" and managed to get a reaction out of you. Lol

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Seems like a waste of time to train dungeoneering now when the xp rate is going to double or triple this year alone.

Leave it to Jagex to half [wagon] this like all the other new skills since construction.

Put something out that there that is incomplete or stinks and then take a year or two to make it better.

 

You mean you don't like it when Jagex releases half finished skills? Have at thee knave!

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Seems like a waste of time to train dungeoneering now when the xp rate is going to double or triple this year alone.

Leave it to Jagex to half [wagon] this like all the other new skills since construction.

Put something out that there that is incomplete or stinks and then take a year or two to make it better.

 

You mean you don't like it when Jagex releases half finished skills? Have at thee knave!

 

to me having one half is better than not having one half. Half empty, half full.

 

batch 2 of a skill also gives Jagex a MAJOR opportunity to fix bugs, and balancing of the skill, and see how it actually works, how the content is used, and how we like/dislike the skill.

 

Just look at the failure of Summoning batch 1 vs the massive success of summoning batch 2. Batch 2 couldn't have been successfull without the failures of batch 1.

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Seems like a waste of time to train dungeoneering now when the xp rate is going to double or triple this year alone.

Leave it to Jagex to half [wagon] this like all the other new skills since construction.

Put something out that there that is incomplete or stinks and then take a year or two to make it better.

That's what happens when you have a userbase largely comprised of credulous, undemanding teenagers.

Qeltar, aka Charles Kozierok

Webmaster, RuneScoop - Premium RuneScape Information for Expert Players -- Now Free!

Featuring the Ultimate Guide to Dungeoneering -- everything you need to know to get the most of the new skill!

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Seems like a waste of time to train dungeoneering now when the xp rate is going to double or triple this year alone.

Leave it to Jagex to half [wagon] this like all the other new skills since construction.

Put something out that there that is incomplete or stinks and then take a year or two to make it better.

That's what happens when you have a userbase largely comprised of credulous, undemanding teenagers.

 

No this isnt the player base's fault this is bad on Jagex.

 

No one was demanding Jagex release dungeoneering when they did, most of us were expecting to wait till June or even August for a skill to be released.

 

Its Jagex's own fault for the skills failness at the moment.

 

And Jagex's fault with Summoning too, they only released it early to make it an incentive to keep people from quitting with the trade/pvp updates

 

 

 

Oh and almost lvl 40 dungeoneering now, havnt trained since lvl 21 tears and penguins are great at this lvl :D

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My point is that Jagex knows they can do pretty much whatever they want, and 90% of their players will just accept it.

 

Even trying to raise pertinent concerns, issues or criticisms leads to a chorus of butt-kissers telling you stuff along the lines of "Jagex is successful so whatever they are doing must be right, stop being so mean!".

 

Most young people apply none of the skepticism or critical reasoning that is necessary to keep a corporation on its toes. And since Jagex knows this, and knows it has little competition, it has no incentive to do anything right the first time. They can just do whatever is easy and/or cheap, and most everyone will not only swallow it, they'll oppose anyone who doesn't.

Qeltar, aka Charles Kozierok

Webmaster, RuneScoop - Premium RuneScape Information for Expert Players -- Now Free!

Featuring the Ultimate Guide to Dungeoneering -- everything you need to know to get the most of the new skill!

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My point is that Jagex knows they can do pretty much whatever they want, and 90% of their players will just accept it.

 

Even trying to raise pertinent concerns, issues or criticisms leads to a chorus of butt-kissers telling you stuff along the lines of "Jagex is successful so whatever they are doing must be right, stop being so mean!".

 

Most young people apply none of the skepticism or critical reasoning that is necessary to keep a corporation on its toes. And since Jagex knows this, and knows it has little competition, it has no incentive to do anything right the first time. They can just do whatever is easy and/or cheap, and most everyone will not only swallow it, they'll oppose anyone who doesn't.

 

90%? you're saying 10% of players stop playing due to updates, or 10% of players stop paying for members due to updates?

 

my persontal estimate is that more than 99% of players accept the changes.

 

when you want to raise pertinent concerns, you must be willing to argue your corner rationally, not emotionally. Further, you must be able to convince others, thus avoid unneccessary hostility.

 

There are a host of concerns and benefits raised for the release of dungeoneering in 2 batches on this topic, and the massive 130+ page topic. most of the reasons for WHY two batches are a good idea, have not been examined in the least. Trying to convince people without debating their arguments is futile and pointless.

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A lot more people are unhappy with things than will bother to publicly discuss it. There are many business books that talk about the ratios of unhappy customers to unhappy *vocal* customers.

 

Yes, the 90% is just an off the cuff figure. But it would be false to think only those who speak out about things feel unhappy about unpopular changes.

 

Oh, and attempting to argue with people who are happy with mediocrity and who think that "Jagex is a big company so they must be right" is a valid argument, is equally futile and pointless.

Qeltar, aka Charles Kozierok

Webmaster, RuneScoop - Premium RuneScape Information for Expert Players -- Now Free!

Featuring the Ultimate Guide to Dungeoneering -- everything you need to know to get the most of the new skill!

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A lot more people are unhappy with things than will bother to publicly discuss it. There are many business books that talk about the ratios of unhappy customers to unhappy *vocal* customers.

 

Yes, the 90% is just an off the cuff figure. But it would be false to think only those who speak out about things feel unhappy about unpopular changes.

 

Oh, and attempting to argue with people who are happy with mediocrity and who think that "Jagex is a big company so they must be right" is a valid argument, is equally futile and pointless.

 

I'm basing my number on the "acceptance" part, not the fact that they are unhappy. it's actually doing something, like quitting the game, your membership, or uttering your opinion, that really matters.

 

arguing with irrationality: quitters never win or convince. you can at least respond to the rational arguments, which there are also plenty of (batch 2 for tweaking etc. etc. etc.). Grouping all arguments as irrational, is just as emotive an argument as unilaterally trusting Jagex. Ignore the emotive and irrational, argue the logic and factual.

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So Qeltar, if someone doesn't agree with you and thinks that Jagex's output is actually not too bad (or on balance less bad than good), then they are "credulous, undemanding teenagers" or incapable of critical thought, right?

 

You do love to poison the well don't you? Aren't there just a few possiblities you're missing out?

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All skills 70+ again 16/06/2010

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So Qeltar, if someone doesn't agree with you and thinks that Jagex's output is actually not too bad (or on balance less bad than good), then they are "credulous, undemanding teenagers" or incapable of critical thought, right?

That's not what I said.

 

I just happen to think that Runescape players are, on the whole, very undemanding customers, and they get what they deserve. Since most RS players are willing to accept shoddy gameplay balance testing, "surprise" updates, poor communication, the company strong-arming fansites, "customer appreciation" events where nearly all customers are excluded and the others pay for the event -- well, by golly, that's what they get.

 

I think that most of Jagex's output is pretty good myself. I just happen to believe it could be better, and that working for improvement is better than defending the status quo, usually with bogus arguments. I have grown weary of constantly being castigated as a "hater" or whatnot simply because, unlike most people it would seem, I value quality.

 

I'd love to see a real, legitimate poll of players about what they think of how Runefest is being handled, or the flagstaff, or the chopping up of the RSOF. My guess is that the numbers would not be particularly complimentary towards some of the decisions made in these areas, among others.

Qeltar, aka Charles Kozierok

Webmaster, RuneScoop - Premium RuneScape Information for Expert Players -- Now Free!

Featuring the Ultimate Guide to Dungeoneering -- everything you need to know to get the most of the new skill!

signew2.png

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So Qeltar, if someone doesn't agree with you and thinks that Jagex's output is actually not too bad (or on balance less bad than good), then they are "credulous, undemanding teenagers" or incapable of critical thought, right?

That's not what I said.

 

I just happen to think that Runescape players are, on the whole, very undemanding customers, and they get what they deserve. Since most RS players are willing to accept shoddy gameplay balance testing, "surprise" updates, poor communication, the company strong-arming fansites, "customer appreciation" events where nearly all customers are excluded and the others pay for the event -- well, by golly, that's what they get.

 

I think that most of Jagex's output is pretty good myself. I just happen to believe it could be better, and that working for improvement is better than defending the status quo, usually with bogus arguments. I have grown weary of constantly being castigated as a "hater" or whatnot simply because, unlike most people it would seem, I value quality.

 

I'd love to see a real, legitimate poll of players about what they think of how Runefest is being handled, or the flagstaff, or the chopping up of the RSOF. My guess is that the numbers would not be particularly complimentary towards some of the decisions made in these areas, among others.

 

Thanks for the clarification. Good to see.

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All skills 70+ again 16/06/2010

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Qeltar, I agree with you on everything you have said in the last months

 

When dungeoneering was released I found a stance keep, and an item smuggle in minutes.

Surely their QA team is better than some spotty teenager?

 

 

Also, I'm not going to train past 70 dungeoneering(stream necklace), because the other rewards aren't worth it and I'm not going to train it when I could do it in a few months at 3x today's rate.

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So Qeltar, if someone doesn't agree with you and thinks that Jagex's output is actually not too bad (or on balance less bad than good), then they are "credulous, undemanding teenagers" or incapable of critical thought, right?

That's not what I said.

 

I just happen to think that Runescape players are, on the whole, very undemanding customers, and they get what they deserve. Since most RS players are willing to accept shoddy gameplay balance testing, "surprise" updates, poor communication, the company strong-arming fansites, "customer appreciation" events where nearly all customers are excluded and the others pay for the event -- well, by golly, that's what they get.

 

I think that most of Jagex's output is pretty good myself. I just happen to believe it could be better, and that working for improvement is better than defending the status quo, usually with bogus arguments. I have grown weary of constantly being castigated as a "hater" or whatnot simply because, unlike most people it would seem, I value quality.

 

I'd love to see a real, legitimate poll of players about what they think of how Runefest is being handled, or the flagstaff, or the chopping up of the RSOF. My guess is that the numbers would not be particularly complimentary towards some of the decisions made in these areas, among others.

 

I would liken the situation to Buster Keaton movies from the 20's, then the 30's. In the 20's the movies were great, in the 30's their quality declined, but they made more money than the better movies that preceded it due to the name value and repuatition that he achieved.

 

These updates are not as good as in the past, but Runescape has such a high value to some people for what they've done in the past that people blindly accept what they do in the present.

This website and its contents are copyright © 1999 - 2010 Jagex Ltd.

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My point is that Jagex knows they can do pretty much whatever they want, and 90% of their players will just accept it.

 

Even trying to raise pertinent concerns, issues or criticisms leads to a chorus of butt-kissers telling you stuff along the lines of "Jagex is successful so whatever they are doing must be right, stop being so mean!".

 

Most young people apply none of the skepticism or critical reasoning that is necessary to keep a corporation on its toes. And since Jagex knows this, and knows it has little competition, it has no incentive to do anything right the first time. They can just do whatever is easy and/or cheap, and most everyone will not only swallow it, they'll oppose anyone who doesn't.

 

I agree to some degree that some updates that jagex releases are just #-o

 

But i generally like the updates they release.

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I agree with Qeltar on this matter.

 

I only voice my opinion on an update when I really don't like it. I'm also sure that most people would answer truthfully if there was a poll on the RS main page, about the new skill. The results would be interesting to say the least. Here's a poll that was on rs wiki as an example:

 

Considering the other skill ideas out there, are you satisfied with Dungeoneering as the new skill?

 

I would have rather seen Sailing as the new skill. 258 (6.72%)

I would have rather seen Necromancy as the new skill. 537 (13.99%)

I would have rather seen another popular idea as the new skill. 1824 (47.51%)

I am satisfied with Dungeoneering as the new skill. 1012 (26.36%)

Other/neutral 208 (5.42%)

 

In other words, 68.22% (first 3 options combined) don't like dungeoneering or prefer another skill, 5.42% are neutral, and only 26.32% like it as a skill. Polls speak volumes when no one is around to judge your decisions.

 

Also (in my opinion) I think it was a bad idea on Jagex's side to make levels 100-120 in Dungeoneering be included in your total level and hiscores. I had a dream [or goal] like everyone else in Runescape, to one day have all 99's. Or even be in the top 21 overall. Now that dream has been crushed because of a new level that would literally take me years of no lifing.

 

Sorry but I do not see myself getting 104M dung exp. Ever. I would rather get 200M slayer exp, and that's saying something. I do think skills should go up to level 120, but effecting your total level and hiscores? No. Just, no. I myself am going for 200M attack exp, but I wouldn't want any skills requiring level 120 to obtain maximum total level. It's just wrong. We have lives people! And 13.034M exp per skill should be all that is required to reach the maximum total level, not 104M. If all skills turn to this, I would expect it to be the end of Runescape - unless experience gaining methods are radically changed to make it easier for level 120 skills.

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I agree with Qeltar on this matter.

 

I only voice my opinion on an update when I really don't like it. I'm also sure that most people would answer truthfully if there was a poll on the RS main page, about the new skill. The results would be interesting to say the least. Here's a poll that was on rs wiki as an example:

 

Considering the other skill ideas out there, are you satisfied with Dungeoneering as the new skill?

 

I would have rather seen Sailing as the new skill. 258 (6.72%)

I would have rather seen Necromancy as the new skill. 537 (13.99%)

I would have rather seen another popular idea as the new skill. 1824 (47.51%)

I am satisfied with Dungeoneering as the new skill. 1012 (26.36%)

Other/neutral 208 (5.42%)

 

In other words, 68.22% (first 3 options combined) don't like dungeoneering or prefer another skill, 5.42% are neutral, and only 26.32% like it as a skill. Polls speak volumes when no one is around to judge your decisions.

 

Also (in my opinion) I think it was a bad idea on Jagex's side to make levels 100-120 in Dungeoneering be included in your total level and hiscores. I had a dream [or goal] like everyone else in Runescape, to one day have all 99's. Or even be in the top 21 overall. Now that dream has been crushed because of a new level that would literally take me years of no lifing.

 

Sorry but I do not see myself getting 104M dung exp. Ever. I would rather get 200M slayer exp, and that's saying something. I do think skills should go up to level 120, but effecting your total level and hiscores? No. Just, no. I myself am going for 200M attack exp, but I wouldn't want any skills requiring level 120 to obtain maximum total level. It's just wrong. We have lives people! And 13.034M exp per skill should be all that is required to reach the maximum total level, not 104M. If all skills turn to this, I would expect it to be the end of Runescape - unless experience gaining methods are radically changed to make it easier for level 120 skills.

 

Your analysis of the poll is clearly biased.

 

Just because people prefer another idea doesn't mean they don't like Dungeoneering, just that they like something else better. It might or might not mean they hate dungeoneering.

 

-------

 

I partially agree with your last point, in that Jagex shouldn't have 'forced' people to have to train Dungeoneering approximately 8 times as much as other skills.

 

But it's quite contradicting if you're aiming to get so much EXP in some other skills, and you claim you have a life. No one's forcing you to get 200M exp in Attack and get into the top ranks of RuneScape's hiscores, similarly, no one's forcing you to train Dungeoneering.

 

 

 

@Qeltar: What you term as 'bogus' arguments is completely subjective. Whether you care or not, many people also term your arguments as 'bogus' arguments.

 

And I find it rather ironic that you claim polls are an effective measure of the popularity of an update when you say that 90% of the community are undemanding and overly easy to please.

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