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Philosophy, Riddles and complete mind[bleep]s


Sam
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6: That was never my intention. Honestly, provided God's existance, He wouldn't want you to be forced to believe in HIM. All the more I hope is to show you that faith in God is reasonable. As long as you recognize that you are building your models based on faith in the base premise (NOT GOD) and that I am building my models based on faith in the base premise (GOD), and that the truth of either of our models depends primarilly on which of the two possibilities really is the case, then I am completely happy.

 

That's the thing with weak atheism. It pretends to be the neutral stance by formulating such a term, implying that we are all born atheists, a rock does not have belief in a god therefore is atheist, etc. Just look at the word "atheism". You have consciously built a set of beliefs based on the notion of god not existing. There's a difference between having the self-ascribed label "without god" and having a reserved opinion on theology. But I guess they really want that sort of leverage.

 

It's not that obscure, it's just a couple big words. It's not very specific either, but yes, Nihilism is a branch of Existentialism (meaning the study of existence), not to be confused with Existentialism (the branch of Nihilism that claims in a meaningless world one must find one's own meaning, through God or otherwise) or Pure Nihilism (my own term, referring to Nihilists who disagree with both Existentialists of the latter type and Absurdists, saying that there is never any reason to live at all).

 

I don't know if you got the point or not. Nihilism is about a lack of value when it comes to the nature of existence, yet in order to have such a position, you must first value knowledge. Therefore it is a paradox, suggesting high levels of obscurity.

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It's not that obscure, it's just a couple big words. It's not very specific either, but yes, Nihilism is a branch of Existentialism (meaning the study of existence), not to be confused with Existentialism (the branch of Nihilism that claims in a meaningless world one must find one's own meaning, through God or otherwise) or Pure Nihilism (my own term, referring to Nihilists who disagree with both Existentialists of the latter type and Absurdists, saying that there is never any reason to live at all).

 

I don't know if you got the point or not. Nihilism is about a lack of value when it comes to the nature of existence, yet in order to have such a position, you must first value knowledge. Therefore it is a paradox, suggesting high levels of obscurity.

That is correct. In fact, Nihilism is by definition a contradiction because, as humans, it is impossible for us to actually value nothing. To do so would require us to act the same way in every situation, which nobody does.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Nihilism makes sense. Though, if you say nothing exists then you are already saying that "nothing" exists. Therefore at least "nothing" exists, even if it is of absolute no value or purpose. If matter and space came from nothing, then that nothing must of been at least... there is no proper word for it, it must of at least been somehow "aware" of itself. Then somehow out of itself manifestations formed and eventually our brains formed to perceive that "nothing" as something. Basically, everything is made out of "nothing", it just seems like something to the brain, which itself was formed out of nothing. Yea.. it might be tough to grasp :P

99 Hunter - November 1st, 2008

99 Cooking -July 22nd, 2009

99 Firemaking - July 29th, 2010

99 Fletching - December 30th, 2010

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Nihilism makes sense. Though, if you say nothing exists then you are already saying that "nothing" exists. Therefore at least "nothing" exists, even if it is of absolute no value or purpose. If matter and space came from nothing, then that nothing must of been at least... there is no proper word for it, it must of at least been somehow "aware" of itself. Then somehow out of itself manifestations formed and eventually our brains formed to perceive that "nothing" as something. Basically, everything is made out of "nothing", it just seems like something to the brain, which itself was formed out of nothing. Yea.. it might be tough to grasp :P

 

That is Buddhism not Nihilism.

 

A Nihilist is closer to an athiest then a Buddhist.

Buddhists are atheists...

99 Hunter - November 1st, 2008

99 Cooking -July 22nd, 2009

99 Firemaking - July 29th, 2010

99 Fletching - December 30th, 2010

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Nihilism makes sense. Though, if you say nothing exists then you are already saying that "nothing" exists. Therefore at least "nothing" exists, even if it is of absolute no value or purpose. If matter and space came from nothing, then that nothing must of been at least... there is no proper word for it, it must of at least been somehow "aware" of itself. Then somehow out of itself manifestations formed and eventually our brains formed to perceive that "nothing" as something. Basically, everything is made out of "nothing", it just seems like something to the brain, which itself was formed out of nothing. Yea.. it might be tough to grasp :P

 

That is Buddhism not Nihilism.

 

A Nihilist is closer to an athiest then a Buddhist.

Buddhists are atheists...

 

Yes but it really comes down to how they live their life, a Buddhist would be dispassionate like a Jedi or something while an Atheist might still desire a permanent universe, system of government, etc.

 

I guess the main difference between the two is a Buddhist understands there is nothing and an atheist may say there isnt eternal life but may say something still is eternal.

 

A Nihilist may have a similar belief but how they live is closer to an atheist then a Buddhist

Ah yes, that's why I became attracted to certain teachings that can be considered Buddhist. More experiencing what I "believed", rather than just talking about it.

99 Hunter - November 1st, 2008

99 Cooking -July 22nd, 2009

99 Firemaking - July 29th, 2010

99 Fletching - December 30th, 2010

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  • 3 months later...

This thread has all but been abandoned. I almost remade it but I will just bring back the original.

 

 

Here is one I would like answered.

 

Ship of Theseus Riddle:

Information from Wikipedia

Greek legend

According to Greek legend as reported by Plutarch,

The ship wherein Theseus and the youth of Athens returned [from Crete] had thirty oars, and was preserved by the Athenians down even to the time of Demetrius Phalereus, for they took away the old planks as they decayed, putting in new and stronger timber in their place, insomuch that this ship became a standing example among the philosophers, for the logical question of things that grow; one side holding that the ship remained the same, and the other contending that it was not the same.

Plutarch, Theseus

 

Plutarch thus questions whether the ship would remain the same if it were entirely replaced, piece by piece. Centuries later, the philosopher Thomas Hobbes introduced a further puzzle, wondering: what would happen if the original planks were gathered up after they were replaced, and used to build a second ship. Which ship, if either, is the original Ship of Theseus?

 

The one made of new planks is the real ship. It was at one time the real ship and it will continue to be.

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Nihilism makes sense. Though, if you say nothing exists then you are already saying that "nothing" exists. Therefore at least "nothing" exists, even if it is of absolute no value or purpose. If matter and space came from nothing, then that nothing must of been at least... there is no proper word for it, it must of at least been somehow "aware" of itself. Then somehow out of itself manifestations formed and eventually our brains formed to perceive that "nothing" as something. Basically, everything is made out of "nothing", it just seems like something to the brain, which itself was formed out of nothing. Yea.. it might be tough to grasp :P

 

That is Buddhism not Nihilism.

 

A Nihilist is closer to an athiest then a Buddhist.

Buddhists are atheists...

 

Yes but it really comes down to how they live their life, a Buddhist would be dispassionate like a Jedi or something while an Atheist might still desire a permanent universe, system of government, etc.

 

I guess the main difference between the two is a Buddhist understands there is nothing and an atheist may say there isnt eternal life but may say something still is eternal.

 

A Nihilist may have a similar belief but how they live is closer to an atheist then a Buddhist

 

An atheist is a person who does not believe in a god or gods. Other than that, an atheist can think/believe/talk about anything. An atheist can be a communist, democrat, republican, anarchist, whatever. The only thing that atheism is is a disbelief of god. Talking about "atheists' desires" for a permanent universe or government system is totally silly.

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Guest Rob

This thread has all but been abandoned. I almost remade it but I will just bring back the original.

 

 

Here is one I would like answered.

 

Ship of Theseus Riddle:

Information from Wikipedia

Greek legend

According to Greek legend as reported by Plutarch,

The ship wherein Theseus and the youth of Athens returned [from Crete] had thirty oars, and was preserved by the Athenians down even to the time of Demetrius Phalereus, for they took away the old planks as they decayed, putting in new and stronger timber in their place, insomuch that this ship became a standing example among the philosophers, for the logical question of things that grow; one side holding that the ship remained the same, and the other contending that it was not the same.

Plutarch, Theseus

 

Plutarch thus questions whether the ship would remain the same if it were entirely replaced, piece by piece. Centuries later, the philosopher Thomas Hobbes introduced a further puzzle, wondering: what would happen if the original planks were gathered up after they were replaced, and used to build a second ship. Which ship, if either, is the original Ship of Theseus?

 

The one made of new planks is the real ship. It was at one time the real ship and it will continue to be.

 

I agree with this. If you replace one plank, it's still the original ship. if you replace 2 planks, it's still the original ship. I don't think this would ever stop.

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So udner the same logic, if I slwoly replaced small bits of your body with another person's body to keep your body running, would you still be you, even after your entire body had been replaced?

The only difference between Hitler and the man next door who comes home and beats his kids every day is circumstance. The intent is the same-- to harm others.

[hide=Tifers say the darndest things]

I told her there was a secret method to doing it - and there is - but my once nimble and agile fingers were unable to perform because I was under the influence.

I would laugh, not hate. I'm a male. :(

Since when was Ireland an island...? :wall:

I actually have a hobby of licking public toilet seats.

[/hide]
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Guest Rob

So udner the same logic, if I slwoly replaced small bits of your body with another person's body to keep your body running, would you still be you, even after your entire body had been replaced?

 

Until you replace the brain, it would be. But the brain really is the only thing that is "me". So, once you replace the one part that is no longer "me", then it's not me.

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So udner the same logic, if I slwoly replaced small bits of your body with another person's body to keep your body running, would you still be you, even after your entire body had been replaced?

 

Until you replace the brain, it would be. But the brain really is the only thing that is "me". So, once you replace the one part that is no longer "me", then it's not me.

So what makes a specific ship that specific ship? What part of it, once replaced, would change what it was?

The only difference between Hitler and the man next door who comes home and beats his kids every day is circumstance. The intent is the same-- to harm others.

[hide=Tifers say the darndest things]

I told her there was a secret method to doing it - and there is - but my once nimble and agile fingers were unable to perform because I was under the influence.

I would laugh, not hate. I'm a male. :(

Since when was Ireland an island...? :wall:

I actually have a hobby of licking public toilet seats.

[/hide]
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Guest Rob

So udner the same logic, if I slwoly replaced small bits of your body with another person's body to keep your body running, would you still be you, even after your entire body had been replaced?

 

Until you replace the brain, it would be. But the brain really is the only thing that is "me". So, once you replace the one part that is no longer "me", then it's not me.

So what makes a specific ship that specific ship? What part of it, once replaced, would change what it was?

There is none, which is why I think the one with the new parts would be the original still.

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So udner the same logic, if I slwoly replaced small bits of your body with another person's body to keep your body running, would you still be you, even after your entire body had been replaced?

 

This question really depends if you believe in a soul or not.

 

If you dont, then no replacing every bit of your body until there is no original left would make it different.

 

If you believe in a soul it would remain the same.

 

 

With the ship, its the same, if you believe it is the same when no original bits of it remain you believe that the soul of the ship is what makes it what it is [in this case the soul of the ship is the shape that the pieces meld together to make], but not the pieces.

 

If you dont think the ship would be the same, you believe that the materials that make up the ship are what make it what it is, not a "soul" of a ship

 

 

Your welcome to disagree with me but when I posted that I was curious if anyone would jump to ask what if it was a human instead of a ship, and what makes a human different then a ship if the answer is different.

 

I think that if you answer that they remain the same regardless of the materials that make them you believe in a soul of something, if you dont think so then it likely means you dont believe in a soul [again you are welcome to disagree with this].

It's all dependent on the ship's Machine Spirit obviously, and any attempts to dismantle it require much prayer to the Omnissiah and can only be done by a tech adept anyhow.

whalenuke.png

Command the Murderous Chalices! Drink ye harpooners! drink and swear, ye men that man the deathful whaleboat's bow- Death to Moby Dick!

BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD! SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE!

angel2w.gif

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  • 4 months later...

I disagree when he says if you hit someone across the room, you will fly across the room. I mean, a car doesn't fly away when it hits a cat. And the mass ratio would probably be similar if you had enough muscle to punch someone across the room, but that just opens up a whole bunch of other problems (Skeletal strength and the like- see explanations of why King Kong cannot be the size he is).

whalenuke.png

Command the Murderous Chalices! Drink ye harpooners! drink and swear, ye men that man the deathful whaleboat's bow- Death to Moby Dick!

BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD! SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE!

angel2w.gif

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