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Tip.It Times - 7th November 2010 (Writing Contest Winners!)


Racheya

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I am rather surprised that they haven't limited the exp in a scaling fashion by now. Seems to me that the penalty could be cut back quite a bit even at 126 f2p combat seeing as members now have another 25 higher floors (even if the penalty didn't start scaling until level 71).

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A lot of great articles this week!

 

While I'm not F2P I agree with sees_all's points on high level F2P dungeoneering; Jagex needs to choose one stance and stick with it. I'm sure there's someway they could fix the xp cap without making it more worthwhile to train dungeoneering on F2P worlds, they just need to take the time to sort through their options instead of pushing it aside as being unimportant. Something as simple as making the monsters a lot tougher would even be better than the 50% xp penalty. Sure they only can use up to tier 5 equipment but, that shouldn't be stopping them from killing higher combat monsters, it would just be more difficult.

 

If anything open up a few extra tiers to F2P, as members we already get floors 38-60, more bosses, and more rewards, which is a lot more than F2P get.

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About the other articles; I never read fictionals, I'd rather read a novel. The quest article was a bit of a drag, couldn't be bothered to read it.

 

Ok, we get it, there are about 5 of you regulars who don't "waste their time" reading our fictional pieces. There is no need to remind us about it every week we post one. :wall:

 

I'm pretty sure there's a lot more than 5 people who skip the fictionals. Don't kid yourselves now ;)

 

 

... So I took some license on the number :roll: My point is, every time someone writes a fictional piece; there is a small minority who decides to tell them their efforts aren't even worth the time of day. If you don't read our fictionals, imagine how us fictional writers feel about reading your opinions.

[/hide]

 

TBH, I don't care if they just cold refuse to read my fictional right now. But I would care if, by the end of the 8-part story and the reviews are all positive, they'd still go "nah"...

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Thumbs up for the article on F2P dungeoneering. It really is a mess right now and it could definitely use some love. The flat out wham 50% cut is just insane :unsure:

 

I've not yet gotten around to reading the other ones, will do later!

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I completely agree with the first article; I'd like to do some dungeoneering with a few of my f2p friends, but NO WAY I'm going to pay over 50% of my xp for that

Before I'm going to waste any time playing dungeoneering in f2p, jagex'll have to fix it

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- 2nd Article - was good, I love stuff about the history of RS.

 

- 1st Article - was such a rant. Like come on? Here is some stuff to think about. At maxed F2P floors, a player with 90+ Combat can get anywhere from 70-100k exp/hr (last time I checked). That is given that they have members doors in large floors, the 50% decrease because of being level 90+, and other remaining factors. So even with all these "unfairly" added discriminates, a given individual with the right levels can still gain some of the fastest F2P experience. I don't think any other skills besides maybe the buy able skills (crafting, cooking, firemaking, smithing, magic) actually give more than 60-80k exp/hr in F2P. From my perspective, I personally don't like the members doors and exp cut for high combaters, but I personally think that without these things, the skill would be WAY to easy to train. I am assuming you could probably get 200k+ exp/hr without these things, so personally, I think that P2P'ers deserve to get more exp because they PAY FOR THE [bleep]ING GAME. The bottom line is, F2P'ers don't pay, so it is gonna be unfair. Who cares. Play the game for what it is.

 

Disclaimer: I am F2P and F2P only.

 

- 3rd Article - Not into fictional stuff, so can't give much input.

 

- 4th Article - See above ^^

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Even though I agree with Sees All's articles that the high combat penalty for F2Pers is bad, I find myself in a position that I just don't care.

 

I debated countless times with F2Pers that argued that P2P and F2P were separate games that I find myself not caring for the state of a game I'm being told I'm not playing. Against all logic and in conformity to the the opinion of those F2Pers that claim F2P is a game on its own and not a demo of some sort I will say this : there is no problem with dungeoneering in the game I play.

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Follow the progress of top players and my weekly updates here: 200M in all Skills

Latest Milestones Chart update : page 602

Latest top 15 update : page 602

6 slowest skills chart : page 563

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@Loving_Brah

I don't know how you're getting 70-100k exp/h in F2P, but could you please tell me how? Because that's at least tripple my average beyond anything I've gotten.

Also, Sees_All was not saying that F2P should have no exp limits, or disadvantages. Rather, he was saying that Jagex needs consistancy in how they impliment those limits. Why should only "5% of F2Pers" (even though the percentage of CB > 90 at Daemonheim is FAR greater then 5%) who have played the game for a long time be penalized while a newbie can get much higher exp rates? If Jagex is going to impliment exp reductions for F2P, make it for all F2Pers.

 

That being said, I personally don't think that Jagex needs so many reductions in F2P dungeons. We already have to deal with P2P puzzles, level 100+ skill doors, member skill doors, and up to T10 foes (I personally haven't seen T11, though I have a feeling it's possible). With all that already there, why should we get a further 50% exp reduction? Especially considering the way exp is calculated where the system tripple penalizes you for not doing something (level mod, base exp, and prestige exp are all lowered by leaving doors locked).

 

I've done plenty of dungeons and the most exp I've ever gotten was 42k from a F35C6 5:5. That was with all but 3 rooms opened due to P2P doors and all monsters killed in the rooms we opened. That floor took us very close to an hour and a half to complete and that was with competent team mates. I would have to say that the most exp/h you can assume in F2P is 25k/h including C1 rushes etc. In a skill where exp is supposed to be exponential, Jagex is cutting F2P off very early on that curve just from accessable floors alone. Not to mention all those extra reductions that we get.

 

Overall, good article. Not the 'best written article of the year', but it presented many good facts, opinions, and best of all; it wasn't a wall of text.

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- 1st Article - was such a rant. Like come on? Here is some stuff to think about. At maxed F2P floors, a player with 90+ Combat can get anywhere from 70-100k exp/hr (last time I checked). That is given that they have members doors in large floors, the 50% decrease because of being level 90+, and other remaining factors.

 

Enlighten me, where did you see those figures? Teach me to be that efficient, because In my personal experience the fastest anyone can finish a large dungeon is in 30 minutes. The highest experience I've ever received from a large dungeon is about 40k, but that dungeon had very few members doors (3 rooms that could not be unlocked).

Usually my XP is between 30-36k for large, floor 35, with an average party combat level less than 90.

 

Even if it was 40k xp for floor 35, every time, that still leaves the fact that there are only 6 large dungeons worth doing (f30-35), and the rest need to be cleared out (1-29).

In my experience, it takes 1 minutes to rush each floor (average) from 1-29. Since the settings are 5:1 c1, you get virtually no experience.

240k xp for 3 hours large dungeoneering, plus a half-hour for rushing nets at best 68k experience per hour. That's best case scenario though - we're ignoring the time it takes to form a team, ignoring the fact that large dungeons are nearly impossible to clear with a combat average of less than 90 in 30 minutes, and ignoring the fact that most large dungeons usually have many more impossible rooms than I've accounted for here.

 

 

Even if everything else was equal, its still faster for members to train past level 71 - they get higher prestige and higher floors. And that's where 99% of the skill's experience is, from levels 71 to 120.

 

 

If you'll notice my suggestion at the end - I either want all limitations in F2P to be removed (no XP cap, and no monster cap), or all limitations in F2P to be applied to everyone (XP cap for everyone, monster cap for everyone). Either way, P2P gets faster experience.

 

 

Even though I agree with Sees All's articles that the high combat penalty for F2Pers is bad, I find myself in a position that I just don't care.

...

there is no problem with dungeoneering in the game I play.

 

Woe is you if you ever lose membership. :wink:

99 dungeoneering achieved, thanks to everyone that celebrated with me!

 

♪♪ Don't interrupt me as I struggle to complete this thought
Have some respect for someone more forgetful than yourself ♪♪

♪♪ And I'm not done
And I won't be till my head falls off ♪♪

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Frankly, I couldn't care less about Dungeoneering. I dislike it as a skill. All I'm gonna do is get a Twisted bird skull necklace and perhaps an Arcane blast necklace, and then I'm outta there.

 

I feel that there is a lack of thought with the cap, though. It made it possible for level 3 skillers to leech off hard-working Combaters while they "share" the rewards. Not cool.

I think of it as a world where the Combaters are the ones who are doing all the hard labour and manual tasks while the skillers are just spoiling theirselves. This is the main reason why I am against Dungeoneering. To be honest, and I know this has been said many times before, it would have done better as a minigame.

 

With the title of Skill, many people tend to grind it. You've seen this in Telmo's and No Excuses' recent activity. The rewards are useful, the token system makes it seem even more like a minigame, and the general concept was great. Had Dungeoneering been a minigame that was shared by F2Pers and P2Pers alike, and there was no need for all the "You need a X level of >99" or P2P doors or that 50% XP Cap which makes a (usually) parasetic relationship between Combaters and Skillers, I think that it would appeal to a wider audience.

 

Hate it as a skill; love it as a minigame.

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Want fast experience rates of 60k per 20-30 minutes? Go to world 61 and join the chat there. That's if they even bother accepting you, and if you can stand playing with leechers who outnumber the skillers. Heh. I know for a fact that there are people on this forum who do use that world. (And if you GOP, you'll encounter the usual suspects from the guild.) Then there are the private permanent teams scattered across many f2p worlds.

 

Unfortunately the majority of f2p players are not up to such "elite" standards as demanded on w61. The "trash" are cast off to world 7 and world 1. Woo! :thumbsup:

 

The figure of 60k is from a banned level 3 leecher I know of who bragged about that number. I will not name the account - call him Mark - but he eventually got banned for botting. He claimed to have gotten 90+ dg in roughly two weeks through playing with a certain pure f2per. Oh, and he made another account straight away anyhow and got it back up to 90+. Whoop-de-doo. :rolleyes:

 

This is the state of what "elite" f2p dungeoneering has become.

 

Ah, and Langer? You shouldn't care at all anyway. You're p2p, and as such you're not affected by the penalty and your apathy toward the situation is understandable. So it shouldn't matter for someone like you. You've paid your money, so enjoy your game.

Prepare to Die! Path of Exile RPG

 

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"Think where man's glory most begins and ends, and say my glory was I had such friends." Yeats

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The first article was great. There were lots of discussion about the mathematical flaws of the cap system when dungeoneering first came out, and everyone more or less have an idea of how flawed it is. We just lack the numbers. However, I also think that it would be too late for Jagex to do anything about it, as is with many fundamental flaws that is too deeply embedded in the game.

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"Do you really want to go back to the time when Falador was grey, lesser demon look like goats, dragons look like cows, hellhound look like cats and your character stands as stiff as a statue?"

 

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Want fast experience rates of 60k per 20-30 minutes? Go to world 61 and join the chat there. That's if they even bother accepting you, and if you can stand playing with leechers who outnumber the skillers. Heh. I know for a fact that there are people on this forum who do use that world. (And if you GOP, you'll encounter the usual suspects from the guild.) Then there are the private permanent teams scattered across many f2p worlds.

 

Setup must be 2 maxed players then, and 3 leeches. Implementing a cap on all free players would harm their setup. Removing the cap/members doors for all free players would likely help them a minuscule amount (will hurt the leeches though, they might add another combat player), but it would help the vast majority of legitimate free players, and hurt the majority of leeches (we won't hurt ourselves if we kick you, no mutually assured destruction).

 

Also, 120k dungeoneering XP / hour sounds a bit like a fabrication. Coming from a cheater, I'm skeptical at best. At the very least it doesn't sound sustainable, until I remember its coming from maxed free players that are known to play for 8+ hours a day... I'm glad I don't have that kind of motivation/devotion.

99 dungeoneering achieved, thanks to everyone that celebrated with me!

 

♪♪ Don't interrupt me as I struggle to complete this thought
Have some respect for someone more forgetful than yourself ♪♪

♪♪ And I'm not done
And I won't be till my head falls off ♪♪

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Setup must be 2 maxed players then, and 3 leeches. Implementing a cap on all free players would harm their setup. Removing the cap/members doors for all free players would likely help them a minuscule amount (will hurt the leeches though, they might add another combat player), but it would help the vast majority of legitimate free players, and hurt the majority of leeches (we won't hurt ourselves if we kick you, no mutually assured destruction).

 

Also, 120k dungeoneering XP / hour sounds a bit like a fabrication. Coming from a cheater, I'm skeptical at best. At the very least it doesn't sound sustainable, until I remember its coming from maxed free players that are known to play for 8+ hours a day... I'm glad I don't have that kind of motivation/devotion.

 

I recall the boy was trying to convince we few from the "trash" world that the best world is w61, though the time is somewhere closer to 30-40 min than 20-30 min. None of them would want the 50% exp cap applicable to all f2p.

Prepare to Die! Path of Exile RPG

 

1emk2e.png

"Think where man's glory most begins and ends, and say my glory was I had such friends." Yeats

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Even though I agree with Sees All's articles that the high combat penalty for F2Pers is bad, I find myself in a position that I just don't care.

...

there is no problem with dungeoneering in the game I play.

 

Woe is you if you ever lose membership. :wink:

 

I don't lose membership, I would choose to not renew it. There's a pretty good reason for that, I don't like playing F2P. I seriously liked your article until you said Jagex shamelessly advertised membership with gnomecopters. You are good with facts but when your facts lose some appeal when you jump into opinions.

 

The fact is members have better training methods than non-members in almost every skill. Dungeon should not be different and it's not from my point of view. Since my point of view doesn't go into micro details (because this is not the game I play), I have no stake in it and have no opinion, even though your arguments are sound and valid. Another argument that could be made valid is that non-members don'T need as much tokkens as members, hence why they have no need to gain XP as fast.

langerkiller.png

 

Follow the progress of top players and my weekly updates here: 200M in all Skills

Latest Milestones Chart update : page 602

Latest top 15 update : page 602

6 slowest skills chart : page 563

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I don't lose membership, I would choose to not renew it. There's a pretty good reason for that, I don't like playing F2P. I seriously liked your article until you said Jagex shamelessly advertised membership with gnomecopters. You are good with facts but when your facts lose some appeal when you jump into opinions.

 

I'll have to look back through Jagex's archive, shameless might have been their word (or something similar). They were only apologetic about it when they removed it.

I don't mind advertising P2P, or the manor they did it way back when. I do mind that they're inconsistent with their policies though.

 

EDIT: The announcement of the removal of gnomecopters came in a forum post. In Q&A sessions, there was talk about "overtly advertising" for the membership section in runescape (from MMG).

I'm still calling it like I see it. :shades:

99 dungeoneering achieved, thanks to everyone that celebrated with me!

 

♪♪ Don't interrupt me as I struggle to complete this thought
Have some respect for someone more forgetful than yourself ♪♪

♪♪ And I'm not done
And I won't be till my head falls off ♪♪

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I don't lose membership, I would choose to not renew it. There's a pretty good reason for that, I don't like playing F2P. I seriously liked your article until you said Jagex shamelessly advertised membership with gnomecopters. You are good with facts but when your facts lose some appeal when you jump into opinions.

 

I'll have to look back through Jagex's archive, shameless might have been their word (or something similar). They were only apologetic about it when they removed it.

I don't mind advertising P2P, or the manor they did it way back when. I do mind that they're inconsistent with their policies though.

 

EDIT: The announcement of the removal of gnomecopters came in a forum post. In Q&A sessions, there was talk about "overtly advertising" for the membership section in runescape (from MMG).

I'm still calling it like I see it. :shades:

 

 

I might not agree with 100% of what you claim, but your passion is admirable.

langerkiller.png

 

Follow the progress of top players and my weekly updates here: 200M in all Skills

Latest Milestones Chart update : page 602

Latest top 15 update : page 602

6 slowest skills chart : page 563

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I for the life of me cannot understand why people keep suggesting ways of giving the xp cap to more players this does not benifit ANYBODY instead we should be making suggestions as to remove the xp cap or at the verry least reduce it. but in my opinion since i have proof that jagex lied about their being a level cap (in f2p had to solo a lv 120 forgotten mage on frozen that was wearing tier 9 and casting member spells) instead they should introduce a level cap but gradually increase the max lv of the monsters as your level increases.

Anybody can punch someone it takes guts to slap them

 

someone once said the f2p combat triamgle was 2% mages 13% rangers and 85% melerss.

I said no its 2% allies 13% anoying gnats and 85% walking dartboards with bronze daggers

 

mod poppy said:

Siciliae - posting about jumping into bathtubs with electrical equipment is not really cool.

Can you edit it out of any further iterations of your spam, er, I mean message.

 

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