Something to Think About

[Sylpheed]

Before this topic begins, I want to make one thing clear, I have been playing this game since 2003 so if you want to start throwing around the already irritating and annoying statement of "L0L n00b u d1nt ev3n play 1n teh dayz of teh old wildeh" turn around and exit the thread. Another thing I want to point out, I am 100% indifferent about whether this update goes ahead or not. I used to enjoy pking a lot in the old wildy and nothing is quite as fun as pking at the mage arena.

 

Anyway, the topic at hand, a lot of my friends (myself included) have yet to cast a vote (not like it matters) on whether to say yes or no, not because we hate wildy but because of this; relocating existing content. Here's a list of the majority of the updates that have been released since 2007 that relate to the wilderness. (If I forget any, please remind me)

 

- Spirit of Summer/Summers End - Corporeal Beast

- All Fired Up - Beacon Network - Inferno Adze

- The Temple at Senntisten - Ancient Curses

- Clan Wars

- Wilderness Volcano

- Defender of Varrock - Armoured Zombies

- Stealing Creation

- Chaos Tunnels - Bork

- Penguins

 

Theres probably some I missed, but heres the thing. Aside from having to relocate quest areas, which will disrupt the lore of certain quests (whether you care or not, this isn't just a trivial matter) This will be a massive undertaking on Jagex's part to relocate all this content. Aside from essentially having to create entirely new areas of the map to relocate such areas as the castle used in Temple at Senntisten, the ruined farm used in the Summer quests or the entire minigame area of Stealing Creation, this is going to take up a large portion of possibly the most valuable thing in the world; time.

 

Most of these areas can't just be dumped in an already existing area outside of the wildneress, especially as the existing map is pretty full of content. So I ask you this, do you think the reintroduction of the old wilderness is going to have a major impact on new content that Jagex plan to make, do you think it's worth the sacrifice of new content so that Jagex can instead undertake this massive task?

[DiscoShazam]

Defender of Varrock would be the biggest pain of a quest to do, oh my god. .______.

 

And I doubt that they just wouldn't do anything about it, so I think it's better to let the updates happen and see how everything comes out to be.

 

:mellow:

[Wessan]

I just thought about what they may do with the introduction of "old wilderness". Ive been around RS since 2002, and as far back as I can remember the wilderness always had the same boundary line to Varrock and Edgeville. What if they didnt move the content, but rather the actual boundary line of the Wilderness?

 

This would make the Wilderness smaller albeit, but it is possible for them to do it. They could call the lands north of Varrock and Edgeville "Rogues Wasteland" and have all the wildy content we enjoy from updates between 07-now without the actual wilderness.

 

Probably wont happen because I think a J-Mod already said the content will be moved, but hey it could happen.

[Guthorm]

They can just instance everything.

 

I have no idea how long it would take though considering how much server space it can potentially take.

[Myweponsg00d]

They could just take everything and throw it off the East cost of the wilderness. Past Daemonheim

[#Free]

who the hell cares honestly do u not want free trade stake and wildy cuz ur quests wil be in like al kharid instead of wildy? noob

[Racer434]

who the hell cares honestly do u not want free trade stake and wildy cuz ur quests wil be in like al kharid instead of wildy? noob

 

mywepon is right

 

ot- the content will totally be a ordeal to move but i mean the volcano and clan wars can just be shifted underground. also you could get some sort of immunity when doing a quest in the wilderness for a period of time or somthing

Edited December 24, 2010 by Racer434

[Myweponsg00d]

who the hell cares honestly do u not want free trade stake and wildy cuz ur quests wil be in like al kharid instead of wildy? noob

 

holy crap, this is the exact reason it was great when some of the pking types left the game. stupid and annoying trolls once again run rampant.

 

I don't understand why people have the ability to spot a troll, yet they feed him anyway. If you are truly annoyed by trolls then stop giving them so much to feed off of by whining all day. Your tears only whet their apetite.

[Alphanos]

I had some trouble deciding how to vote; I'm uninterested in PKing and would find it a nuisance more than anything else, but I think free trade on the GE will potentially have some very nice market benefits, such as the elimination of junk trading. I eventually voted yes.

 

However, the point you make was definitely the biggest unknown. I would really prefer Jagex not spend their time on such things, but they can't exactly leave things unchanged either (if the updates go ahead). I'll give my opinion on each item you mentioned.

 

Spirit of Summer/Summers End - Corporeal Beast: This should be moved somehow. Apart from the irritation of getting PKed during the quests themselves, I don't think corpers need to deal with PKers on top of everything else. Lorewise probably the best place to move this to would be somewhere in Morytania, though I think Drakan would take notice of something like Corp showing up on his doorstep :razz:.

 

All Fired Up - Beacon Network - Inferno Adze: For sure something should be done about this. For just the purposes of getting the reward items it would be manageable, though thoroughly frustrating, but this is also one of the only semi-interesting new ways to train firemaking (even if it's slow). Maybe some of the high wildy beacons can be pushed farther west and accessed via paths from Trollheim/Trollweiss.

 

The Temple at Senntisten - Ancient Curses: This is a toss-up. I think the quest would be manageable left where it is, since you really only need to get to the temple once or maybe twice, and it's considered non-wilderness. However, putting Ghorrock firmly in PKer territory would eliminate its additional use as a nice place to fight iron and steel dragons.

 

Clan Wars: Since this is currently a safe area with a direct teleport to it, I assume the problem would be for the PKers, not the people using clan wars. In terms of lore this could be easily moved, maybe becoming part of the duel arena, but I don't know how much work that would be.

 

Fist of Guthix: Similar to the above. Although this doesn't have a direct teleport, there's a bank which equivalently solves the issue for non-PKers. Lorewise it might be better to move this one to the Lumbridge caves near Juna, but I don't think Jagex would like to do that since it would make the minigame quest-restricted. Movement options are limited since this is also one of the F2P minigames I believe.

 

Wilderness Volcano: These creatures could be moved into a dungeon without too much trouble.

 

Defender of Varrock - Armoured Zombies: I don't see how it would be possible to move this without massive effort. To prevent the training spot from becoming near-useless, perhaps a tunnel could be found linking Zemouregal's tunnels to the Chaos Tunnels and/or the tunnel leading to the Chaos altar.

 

Stealing Creation: Similar to Clan Wars and Fist of Guthix, this isn't much of a problem for the minigame players, since you can't bring in any equipment anyway. The lore tie-ins for Stealing Creation are fairly tenuous, so this could be moved without too much trouble - the play areas are already somewhere off the main map. Lorewise this could make a lot of sense to put on Lunar Isle, but Jagex won't want this to be quest-restricted.

 

Chaos Tunnels - Bork: It would make sense to connect the Chaos Tunnels with Edgeville dungeon and/or Varrock Sewers. Although it would be irritating to have a longer route to Bork, it would be manageable. I think the bigger issue would be for PKers, who wouldn't want these 5 major exit points in the middle of the lower wilderness. I think with some hand-waving Jagex could leave the Chaos Tunnels themselves as-is, but move the entry/exit rifts outside the wilderness; they'd be linked via mysterious chaos magic or some such. This could arguably let the rifts go just about anywhere on the map, even scattered everywhere.

 

Penguins: While getting PKed during penguin hunting would be irritating, I think this would be manageable due to the size of groups like World60Pengs. If anything this could produce some fascinating results if a PKing clan decided to try attacking World60Pengs... would greater numbers or greater PKing focus win out?

 

Treasure Trails: This is a biggy that you didn't mention. I know, trails existed in the old wilderness too, and I remember doing some. The difference is that most of the clue scroll rewards are near-worthless these days, so the risk/reward balance is shifted. If wildy clues stay as-is, I might seriously consider just dropping a clue that needed me to head next to the mage bank - you rarely get anything good from clues anyway, so why bother? It would be fairly trivial to just remove wilderness clue locations from the rotation.

[Pete Party]

They might create a new land that will be marked as ancient wildernis, where they can relocate everything to without the big adjustment of the storyline, they can just change it to ancient wildernis.

 

In this wildernis there is no pvp possible so no pking.

 

That is the thing that pops up in my head first.

[Sylpheed]

[hide]

I had some trouble deciding how to vote; I'm uninterested in PKing and would find it a nuisance more than anything else, but I think free trade on the GE will potentially have some very nice market benefits, such as the elimination of junk trading. I eventually voted yes.

 

However, the point you make was definitely the biggest unknown. I would really prefer Jagex not spend their time on such things, but they can't exactly leave things unchanged either (if the updates go ahead). I'll give my opinion on each item you mentioned.

 

Spirit of Summer/Summers End - Corporeal Beast: This should be moved somehow. Apart from the irritation of getting PKed during the quests themselves, I don't think corpers need to deal with PKers on top of everything else. Lorewise probably the best place to move this to would be somewhere in Morytania, though I think Drakan would take notice of something like Corp showing up on his doorstep :razz:.

 

All Fired Up - Beacon Network - Inferno Adze: For sure something should be done about this. For just the purposes of getting the reward items it would be manageable, though thoroughly frustrating, but this is also one of the only semi-interesting new ways to train firemaking (even if it's slow). Maybe some of the high wildy beacons can be pushed farther west and accessed via paths from Trollheim/Trollweiss.

 

The Temple at Senntisten - Ancient Curses: This is a toss-up. I think the quest would be manageable left where it is, since you really only need to get to the temple once or maybe twice, and it's considered non-wilderness. However, putting Ghorrock firmly in PKer territory would eliminate its additional use as a nice place to fight iron and steel dragons.

 

Clan Wars: Since this is currently a safe area with a direct teleport to it, I assume the problem would be for the PKers, not the people using clan wars. In terms of lore this could be easily moved, maybe becoming part of the duel arena, but I don't know how much work that would be.

 

Fist of Guthix: Similar to the above. Although this doesn't have a direct teleport, there's a bank which equivalently solves the issue for non-PKers. Lorewise it might be better to move this one to the Lumbridge caves near Juna, but I don't think Jagex would like to do that since it would make the minigame quest-restricted. Movement options are limited since this is also one of the F2P minigames I believe.

 

Wilderness Volcano: These creatures could be moved into a dungeon without too much trouble.

 

Defender of Varrock - Armoured Zombies: I don't see how it would be possible to move this without massive effort. To prevent the training spot from becoming near-useless, perhaps a tunnel could be found linking Zemouregal's tunnels to the Chaos Tunnels and/or the tunnel leading to the Chaos altar.

 

Stealing Creation: Similar to Clan Wars and Fist of Guthix, this isn't much of a problem for the minigame players, since you can't bring in any equipment anyway. The lore tie-ins for Stealing Creation are fairly tenuous, so this could be moved without too much trouble - the play areas are already somewhere off the main map. Lorewise this could make a lot of sense to put on Lunar Isle, but Jagex won't want this to be quest-restricted.

 

Chaos Tunnels - Bork: It would make sense to connect the Chaos Tunnels with Edgeville dungeon and/or Varrock Sewers. Although it would be irritating to have a longer route to Bork, it would be manageable. I think the bigger issue would be for PKers, who wouldn't want these 5 major exit points in the middle of the lower wilderness. I think with some hand-waving Jagex could leave the Chaos Tunnels themselves as-is, but move the entry/exit rifts outside the wilderness; they'd be linked via mysterious chaos magic or some such. This could arguably let the rifts go just about anywhere on the map, even scattered everywhere.

 

Penguins: While getting PKed during penguin hunting would be irritating, I think this would be manageable due to the size of groups like World60Pengs. If anything this could produce some fascinating results if a PKing clan decided to try attacking World60Pengs... would greater numbers or greater PKing focus win out?

 

Treasure Trails: This is a biggy that you didn't mention. I know, trails existed in the old wilderness too, and I remember doing some. The difference is that most of the clue scroll rewards are near-worthless these days, so the risk/reward balance is shifted. If wildy clues stay as-is, I might seriously consider just dropping a clue that needed me to head next to the mage bank - you rarely get anything good from clues anyway, so why bother? It would be fairly trivial to just remove wilderness clue locations from the rotation.

[/hide]

 

Those are good points. However, this thread is just as much about your points as much as it is about the developments time this will take to implement. Time that will be taken away from creating new content.

[Myweponsg00d]

[hide]

I had some trouble deciding how to vote; I'm uninterested in PKing and would find it a nuisance more than anything else, but I think free trade on the GE will potentially have some very nice market benefits, such as the elimination of junk trading. I eventually voted yes.

 

However, the point you make was definitely the biggest unknown. I would really prefer Jagex not spend their time on such things, but they can't exactly leave things unchanged either (if the updates go ahead). I'll give my opinion on each item you mentioned.

 

Spirit of Summer/Summers End - Corporeal Beast: This should be moved somehow. Apart from the irritation of getting PKed during the quests themselves, I don't think corpers need to deal with PKers on top of everything else. Lorewise probably the best place to move this to would be somewhere in Morytania, though I think Drakan would take notice of something like Corp showing up on his doorstep :razz:.

 

All Fired Up - Beacon Network - Inferno Adze: For sure something should be done about this. For just the purposes of getting the reward items it would be manageable, though thoroughly frustrating, but this is also one of the only semi-interesting new ways to train firemaking (even if it's slow). Maybe some of the high wildy beacons can be pushed farther west and accessed via paths from Trollheim/Trollweiss.

 

The Temple at Senntisten - Ancient Curses: This is a toss-up. I think the quest would be manageable left where it is, since you really only need to get to the temple once or maybe twice, and it's considered non-wilderness. However, putting Ghorrock firmly in PKer territory would eliminate its additional use as a nice place to fight iron and steel dragons.

 

Clan Wars: Since this is currently a safe area with a direct teleport to it, I assume the problem would be for the PKers, not the people using clan wars. In terms of lore this could be easily moved, maybe becoming part of the duel arena, but I don't know how much work that would be.

 

Fist of Guthix: Similar to the above. Although this doesn't have a direct teleport, there's a bank which equivalently solves the issue for non-PKers. Lorewise it might be better to move this one to the Lumbridge caves near Juna, but I don't think Jagex would like to do that since it would make the minigame quest-restricted. Movement options are limited since this is also one of the F2P minigames I believe.

 

Wilderness Volcano: These creatures could be moved into a dungeon without too much trouble.

 

Defender of Varrock - Armoured Zombies: I don't see how it would be possible to move this without massive effort. To prevent the training spot from becoming near-useless, perhaps a tunnel could be found linking Zemouregal's tunnels to the Chaos Tunnels and/or the tunnel leading to the Chaos altar.

 

Stealing Creation: Similar to Clan Wars and Fist of Guthix, this isn't much of a problem for the minigame players, since you can't bring in any equipment anyway. The lore tie-ins for Stealing Creation are fairly tenuous, so this could be moved without too much trouble - the play areas are already somewhere off the main map. Lorewise this could make a lot of sense to put on Lunar Isle, but Jagex won't want this to be quest-restricted.

 

Chaos Tunnels - Bork: It would make sense to connect the Chaos Tunnels with Edgeville dungeon and/or Varrock Sewers. Although it would be irritating to have a longer route to Bork, it would be manageable. I think the bigger issue would be for PKers, who wouldn't want these 5 major exit points in the middle of the lower wilderness. I think with some hand-waving Jagex could leave the Chaos Tunnels themselves as-is, but move the entry/exit rifts outside the wilderness; they'd be linked via mysterious chaos magic or some such. This could arguably let the rifts go just about anywhere on the map, even scattered everywhere.

 

Penguins: While getting PKed during penguin hunting would be irritating, I think this would be manageable due to the size of groups like World60Pengs. If anything this could produce some fascinating results if a PKing clan decided to try attacking World60Pengs... would greater numbers or greater PKing focus win out?

 

Treasure Trails: This is a biggy that you didn't mention. I know, trails existed in the old wilderness too, and I remember doing some. The difference is that most of the clue scroll rewards are near-worthless these days, so the risk/reward balance is shifted. If wildy clues stay as-is, I might seriously consider just dropping a clue that needed me to head next to the mage bank - you rarely get anything good from clues anyway, so why bother? It would be fairly trivial to just remove wilderness clue locations from the rotation.

[/hide]

 

Those are good points. However, this thread is just as much about your points as much as it is about the developments time this will take to implement. Time that will be taken away from creating new content.

 

Too bad you didnt speak up 3 years ago. Maybe they would have realized that instead of taking time to design the GE, two versions of BH, new duel tournaments, PvP worlds, incremented trade limits, the lending system....they could have used that time to develop new content.

 

They already wasted a lot of development time to make the game worse...they might as well spend some time implementing changes that will make it better.

[Kimberly]

Some of this content doesn't exactly need relocating, in my opinion. The Inferno Adze is an incredible item that gives you the woodcutting speed of dragon without the cost. It needs a little bit more risk. The same applies with curses, being they are the best offensive ones of the game offering a lower drain-rate--not to mention it's simple to get to with the right teleports. The wilderness volcano is completely desolate, with better areas for killing those monsters existing in safe areas.

 

The ones I'm not really sure about are ones like Defender of Varrock, which has later become an amazing training spot, but in the quest itself carries little to no risk. Or if it does, what you need to carry to complete those legs are inconsequential to lose. Considering this spot offers 100k exp/hr with the addition of a gain of 50k gp/hr and a large amount of charge, it could do with a bit of danger.

 

The Stealing Creation spot wouldn't exactly needed to be moved, rather change the Games Necklace teleport from Wilderness Volcano (which is no longer an activity) or to within Stealing Creation. Arguably, that should've been done ages ago! It made no sense to maintain the wilderness volcano teleport, save for the fact that clans used it. To give them the same benefit, they could simply move the banker from the Volcano into Stealing Creation and make it a safe area as it is in PvP. Not to mention Fist of Guthix also already has a direct teleport into safety. It's one of those things that don't need to be changed.

 

The Chaos Tunnels are a safe area anyway and wouldn't be more difficult than, say, the Abyss to access. There are multiple entrances into these caverns and pkers certainly won't be camping all of them. Same for Penguins, the wilderness ones could just get an extra point or two in value to compensate. They don't need to be removed from the area.

 

I don't think that these things will happen as I dictate. Hell, they may very well move them around, I guess. I just think that if they do take the effort to shuffle them all about, then that would be pretty ridiculous and an awful big waste of time.

[Sylpheed]

[hide]

I had some trouble deciding how to vote; I'm uninterested in PKing and would find it a nuisance more than anything else, but I think free trade on the GE will potentially have some very nice market benefits, such as the elimination of junk trading. I eventually voted yes.

 

However, the point you make was definitely the biggest unknown. I would really prefer Jagex not spend their time on such things, but they can't exactly leave things unchanged either (if the updates go ahead). I'll give my opinion on each item you mentioned.

 

Spirit of Summer/Summers End - Corporeal Beast: This should be moved somehow. Apart from the irritation of getting PKed during the quests themselves, I don't think corpers need to deal with PKers on top of everything else. Lorewise probably the best place to move this to would be somewhere in Morytania, though I think Drakan would take notice of something like Corp showing up on his doorstep :razz:.

 

All Fired Up - Beacon Network - Inferno Adze: For sure something should be done about this. For just the purposes of getting the reward items it would be manageable, though thoroughly frustrating, but this is also one of the only semi-interesting new ways to train firemaking (even if it's slow). Maybe some of the high wildy beacons can be pushed farther west and accessed via paths from Trollheim/Trollweiss.

 

The Temple at Senntisten - Ancient Curses: This is a toss-up. I think the quest would be manageable left where it is, since you really only need to get to the temple once or maybe twice, and it's considered non-wilderness. However, putting Ghorrock firmly in PKer territory would eliminate its additional use as a nice place to fight iron and steel dragons.

 

Clan Wars: Since this is currently a safe area with a direct teleport to it, I assume the problem would be for the PKers, not the people using clan wars. In terms of lore this could be easily moved, maybe becoming part of the duel arena, but I don't know how much work that would be.

 

Fist of Guthix: Similar to the above. Although this doesn't have a direct teleport, there's a bank which equivalently solves the issue for non-PKers. Lorewise it might be better to move this one to the Lumbridge caves near Juna, but I don't think Jagex would like to do that since it would make the minigame quest-restricted. Movement options are limited since this is also one of the F2P minigames I believe.

 

Wilderness Volcano: These creatures could be moved into a dungeon without too much trouble.

 

Defender of Varrock - Armoured Zombies: I don't see how it would be possible to move this without massive effort. To prevent the training spot from becoming near-useless, perhaps a tunnel could be found linking Zemouregal's tunnels to the Chaos Tunnels and/or the tunnel leading to the Chaos altar.

 

Stealing Creation: Similar to Clan Wars and Fist of Guthix, this isn't much of a problem for the minigame players, since you can't bring in any equipment anyway. The lore tie-ins for Stealing Creation are fairly tenuous, so this could be moved without too much trouble - the play areas are already somewhere off the main map. Lorewise this could make a lot of sense to put on Lunar Isle, but Jagex won't want this to be quest-restricted.

 

Chaos Tunnels - Bork: It would make sense to connect the Chaos Tunnels with Edgeville dungeon and/or Varrock Sewers. Although it would be irritating to have a longer route to Bork, it would be manageable. I think the bigger issue would be for PKers, who wouldn't want these 5 major exit points in the middle of the lower wilderness. I think with some hand-waving Jagex could leave the Chaos Tunnels themselves as-is, but move the entry/exit rifts outside the wilderness; they'd be linked via mysterious chaos magic or some such. This could arguably let the rifts go just about anywhere on the map, even scattered everywhere.

 

Penguins: While getting PKed during penguin hunting would be irritating, I think this would be manageable due to the size of groups like World60Pengs. If anything this could produce some fascinating results if a PKing clan decided to try attacking World60Pengs... would greater numbers or greater PKing focus win out?

 

Treasure Trails: This is a biggy that you didn't mention. I know, trails existed in the old wilderness too, and I remember doing some. The difference is that most of the clue scroll rewards are near-worthless these days, so the risk/reward balance is shifted. If wildy clues stay as-is, I might seriously consider just dropping a clue that needed me to head next to the mage bank - you rarely get anything good from clues anyway, so why bother? It would be fairly trivial to just remove wilderness clue locations from the rotation.

[/hide]

 

Those are good points. However, this thread is just as much about your points as much as it is about the developments time this will take to implement. Time that will be taken away from creating new content.

 

Too bad you didnt speak up 3 years ago. Maybe they would have realized that instead of taking time to design the GE, two versions of BH, new duel tournaments, PvP worlds, incremented trade limits, the lending system....they could have used that time to develop new content.

 

They already wasted a lot of development time to make the game worse...they might as well spend some time implementing changes that will make it better.

 

World 2 trading was terrible, the Grand Exchange was an update that should, and probably would have happened regardless of if they had taken away free trade and old wildy. As for making the game worse, thats a pretty pointless opinion that not many people are going to share with you unless said people are also pkers themselves.

[Necromagus]

This is a friendly holiday reminder that there are better ways to debate than to call people morons, and to keep things on topic :).

 

-Necromagus, Tip.It Mod.

[Logdotzip]

who the hell cares honestly do u not want free trade stake and wildy cuz ur quests wil be in like al kharid instead of wildy? noob

 

holy crap, this is the exact reason it was great when some of the pking types left the game. stupid and annoying trolls once again run rampant.

 

I don't understand why people have the ability to spot a troll, yet they feed him anyway. If you are truly annoyed by trolls then stop giving them so much to feed off of by whining all day. Your tears only whet their apetite.

 

I don't think it's a troll. I think it's just a (With respect to Necromagus) "not too smart person".

 

The difference between a troll and a "not too smart person", is that a troll is typically an educated person, who tried to get a rise out of you by throwing logical fallacies at you, or just by trying to make you angry in general.

 

I literally think that guy is just a "not too smart person".

 

 

OT - I personally think nothing should be relocated, but perhaps just tweaked. Maybe a "safe route" to Corp, etc.

[Myweponsg00d]

 

I don't think it's a troll. I think it's just a (With respect to Necromagus) "not too smart person".

 

The difference between a troll and a "not too smart person", is that a troll is typically an educated person, who tried to get a rise out of you by throwing logical fallacies at you, or just by trying to make you angry in general.

 

I literally think that guy is just a "not too smart person".

 

0phathead0 was a well known and respected member of the PKing and dueling community before the trade updates happened. There is no doubt that he has returned to troll the people who are opposing this update. He is definitely a smart person and a skilled player.

 

He clearly is an effective and un-obvious troll

[ikon]

As Jagex said, they are going to relocate some of those activities and as mentioned above, there are some certain places which do have room for a mini-game or two or maybe for a dungeon. Some activities such as Clan Wars and Wilderness Volcano can be reached with a cheap tele and tbh I don't think they need relocating. If u don't wanna waste your items or time on dying, then u better use that 0,125*duel ring price to teleport to FoG. Then of course there are some things which are not meant to be as dangerous as it would be after the comeback of Wildy (although Revs were created to make wildy as dangerous as it was b4? Well they failed @ that.)

 

But the most imprtant point in this post: Some activities need to remain dangerous and there's no point to relocate them! Clues were a perfect example before 2007 Dec but penguins are able to wander in the Wildy to make that D&D even little more dangerous; there should be a little risk when trying to reach such ultimate boss such as Corp best or an extreme training spot like Armored zombies. Although even I think that it's not fun doing quests like Spirits of the Summer when some kid is running after you in mystics trying to get free stuff with a poor blitz - dds combo.

 

During the last years Jagex has made RS more and more safer (gravestones?) and tbh I think the danger and the risk of losing wealth is one of the most exciting things in MMORPGS, not that poor grinding for pure exp. I personally think that Runescape should be more dangerous and there should be more activities that give you better results than the "normal activities" and safe training methods. Even glory hunting @ Zammy mage won't be possible because most of the RCers will be using ZMI or Graahk method. To find the old glory of RuneScape, Jagex should make this game as dangerous and exciting as it used to be.

 

And after all if every world has PvP ability (like wildy does, lol) it's not going to be so hard to dig up a clue scroll or reach some certain training spot. Actually even nowadays when there are only few pking worlds available it's pretty easy to access MB, common clue location or training spot as long as u seem to be just a poor noob with black d'hides or something. And even if someone finds you, the chances to get killed are pretty slight if you've prepared well. If you haven't, it's your problem and free pixel for pkers.

 

If the Wildy won't come back, I don't think this is the reason since there are many bigger issues such as incerasing amount of bots and RWT.

[Drazhor]

Hopefully they will make some "Safe worlds" where you can't be killed in the wilderness by other players, where you can do specific quests and treasure trails etc.

Also, what will happen with brawlers? They could end up being much easier to use...

[Alphanos]

[hide]

I had some trouble deciding how to vote; I'm uninterested in PKing and would find it a nuisance more than anything else, but I think free trade on the GE will potentially have some very nice market benefits, such as the elimination of junk trading. I eventually voted yes.

 

However, the point you make was definitely the biggest unknown. I would really prefer Jagex not spend their time on such things, but they can't exactly leave things unchanged either (if the updates go ahead). I'll give my opinion on each item you mentioned.

 

Spirit of Summer/Summers End - Corporeal Beast: This should be moved somehow. Apart from the irritation of getting PKed during the quests themselves, I don't think corpers need to deal with PKers on top of everything else. Lorewise probably the best place to move this to would be somewhere in Morytania, though I think Drakan would take notice of something like Corp showing up on his doorstep :razz:.

 

All Fired Up - Beacon Network - Inferno Adze: For sure something should be done about this. For just the purposes of getting the reward items it would be manageable, though thoroughly frustrating, but this is also one of the only semi-interesting new ways to train firemaking (even if it's slow). Maybe some of the high wildy beacons can be pushed farther west and accessed via paths from Trollheim/Trollweiss.

 

The Temple at Senntisten - Ancient Curses: This is a toss-up. I think the quest would be manageable left where it is, since you really only need to get to the temple once or maybe twice, and it's considered non-wilderness. However, putting Ghorrock firmly in PKer territory would eliminate its additional use as a nice place to fight iron and steel dragons.

 

Clan Wars: Since this is currently a safe area with a direct teleport to it, I assume the problem would be for the PKers, not the people using clan wars. In terms of lore this could be easily moved, maybe becoming part of the duel arena, but I don't know how much work that would be.

 

Fist of Guthix: Similar to the above. Although this doesn't have a direct teleport, there's a bank which equivalently solves the issue for non-PKers. Lorewise it might be better to move this one to the Lumbridge caves near Juna, but I don't think Jagex would like to do that since it would make the minigame quest-restricted. Movement options are limited since this is also one of the F2P minigames I believe.

 

Wilderness Volcano: These creatures could be moved into a dungeon without too much trouble.

 

Defender of Varrock - Armoured Zombies: I don't see how it would be possible to move this without massive effort. To prevent the training spot from becoming near-useless, perhaps a tunnel could be found linking Zemouregal's tunnels to the Chaos Tunnels and/or the tunnel leading to the Chaos altar.

 

Stealing Creation: Similar to Clan Wars and Fist of Guthix, this isn't much of a problem for the minigame players, since you can't bring in any equipment anyway. The lore tie-ins for Stealing Creation are fairly tenuous, so this could be moved without too much trouble - the play areas are already somewhere off the main map. Lorewise this could make a lot of sense to put on Lunar Isle, but Jagex won't want this to be quest-restricted.

 

Chaos Tunnels - Bork: It would make sense to connect the Chaos Tunnels with Edgeville dungeon and/or Varrock Sewers. Although it would be irritating to have a longer route to Bork, it would be manageable. I think the bigger issue would be for PKers, who wouldn't want these 5 major exit points in the middle of the lower wilderness. I think with some hand-waving Jagex could leave the Chaos Tunnels themselves as-is, but move the entry/exit rifts outside the wilderness; they'd be linked via mysterious chaos magic or some such. This could arguably let the rifts go just about anywhere on the map, even scattered everywhere.

 

Penguins: While getting PKed during penguin hunting would be irritating, I think this would be manageable due to the size of groups like World60Pengs. If anything this could produce some fascinating results if a PKing clan decided to try attacking World60Pengs... would greater numbers or greater PKing focus win out?

 

Treasure Trails: This is a biggy that you didn't mention. I know, trails existed in the old wilderness too, and I remember doing some. The difference is that most of the clue scroll rewards are near-worthless these days, so the risk/reward balance is shifted. If wildy clues stay as-is, I might seriously consider just dropping a clue that needed me to head next to the mage bank - you rarely get anything good from clues anyway, so why bother? It would be fairly trivial to just remove wilderness clue locations from the rotation.

[/hide]

 

Those are good points. However, this thread is just as much about your points as much as it is about the developments time this will take to implement. Time that will be taken away from creating new content.

 

Unfortunately, despite Jagex's own numbers stating that only around 10% of runescape players show interest in PKing, it looks like they'll be spending a great deal of their development time on this. I wish they'd had two polls - free trade and old wilderness. Free trade will probably take a few hours of coding to re-implement, whereas people don't seem to realize that restoring old wilderness will take a whole lot longer to get even close to right...

[Sylpheed]

 

I don't think it's a troll. I think it's just a (With respect to Necromagus) "not too smart person".

 

The difference between a troll and a "not too smart person", is that a troll is typically an educated person, who tried to get a rise out of you by throwing logical fallacies at you, or just by trying to make you angry in general.

 

I literally think that guy is just a "not too smart person".

 

0phathead0 was a well known and respected member of the PKing and dueling community before the trade updates happened. There is no doubt that he has returned to troll the people who are opposing this update. He is definitely a smart person and a skilled player.

 

He clearly is an effective and un-obvious troll

 

Except im not opposing the old wilderness coming back. I'm simply asking other people their opinions on this topic. It's probably my own fault for not making the topic clear enough but this is more about the development time its going to take to do this rather than what they are actually going to do with it. To me, this doesn't look like an easy thing to do and the more development time it takes to do, the less time Jagex are going to have to create new, interesting content.

[i_D_r]

I think pretty much all the quests etc. should be left alone (maybe up the beacon xp). Jagex had a philosophy in the earlier days of RS to make the wilderness tantalizing to non-pkers. I know no one probably agrees with me though.

[ikon]

Sylpheed: 10% doesn't sound realistic to me. >:| Pking might not be the 1st priority activity for medium level people who can't afford losing stuff and their pking skills are not good enough to get your own stuff back but later when they achieve higher levels and gain more money and experience on pking they will find it enjoyable and fun. Ofc there are some ppl who will never try pking or they won't pk because they just don't like it but still it's a enjoyable activity for many people and even more people like to watch those videos. I would never say that improving PvP or bringing back the Wildy is waste of time or resources. Afaik there are loads of pkers who play ONLY for the pvp system which is the best I've ever seen and it's always offering something to learn because no matter how good you are there's always somebody who's better. I've never seen such good PvP system as the Wilderness was and I'd love to see it in 2011 even if it causes botting, price crashes/rises and RWTing.

 

Also if ONLY free trade was brought back, pkers would start immediately a huge rage about that: why wasn't the Wilderness brought back when it was originally removed to prevent RWTing.

 

i_D_r: I totally agree with you ;o

[opeious]

Even though I want free trade back, I don't want the current PvP system, brawlers, PvP armour, the conent you mentioned, the Grand Exchange, arm zombs, corporeal beast or the revs to go. I just hope they have some worlds which have the original content (post 2007) as they are.

 

PS: I voted for yes for free trade. :cry:

[Peronix]

This is my biggest concern with the return of the wilderness, and one reason I think they should consider simply bringing full loot to PvP worlds instead, though nowhere near reason enough to vote no to free trade.

 

There IS a lot of sea east of the wilderness though, so that could potentially turn into a huge new addition to the wilderness which could be a non-pvp area where revenants roam, separated by some kind of barrier between the two areas. In that case they wouldn't even have to move Demonheim as it could retain its position on the new landmass.