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Guest Rob

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Drugs - it's a term that describes any substance that when absorbed into the body, the substance would subsequently have a direct influence on a person's physical or mental state. We often use the term to refer to narcotic, psychoactive drugs that enhance recreational experience - many of which that are controversial for legal/cultural/religious reasons.

 

A drug in particular - Marijuana, has been subjected to great controversy. Due to state regulation, as well as federal regulation - the possession, distribution and use of Marijuana is strictly prohibited.

 

It's physically impossible to overdose on Marijuana, and its addictive nature is lower than that of caffeine. The use of marijuana has very few adverse effects on the mind/body - to a much lesser degree than that of legal drugs such as tobacco or alcohol. It calls into question; why is Marijuana illegal in the first place? Why shouldn't we legalize it?

 

A broader question still; Would it be a good idea to legalize all drugs?

 

For some extra insight on Marijuana use;

 

 

Discuss.

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I believe, wholeheartedly, that marijuana should be legalized. First and foremost, that belief stems from the fact that the Government have no right to tell you what you can, and cannot do with your body, provided what you do does not infringe on other people's basic human rights. Using marijuana as a recreational drug generally does not infringe on other people's rights. If you don't like the drug, by all means do not smoke it, or take it. Tolerate that other people want to use it, and that you have no say in how they use their body, when it doesn't affect you personally. Less important to my view is that should a government legalize marijuana (and other soft drugs like salvia divonorum or tobacco), they have an opportunity first to save money by emptying prisons of non-violent drug users, and secondly create money by taxing the product. Furthermore, a drug like marijuana, which has conclusively been proved to hold medical benefits has no role as an absolutely banned drug. To stigmatize and illegalize a medicine for illness, and a preventative for many other illnesses is immoral in the highest degree.

 

Am I asking all drugs to be legalized? Not at all. But it doesn't hurt to take a look at the impact of other drugs on society, and think of whether the role they hold is right. Should tobacco be so widely consumed? Should alcohol be so socially acceptable? Does LSD hold legitimate artistic merit? Etc. etc.

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Marijuana should be legal, but treated like alcohol is. If you get caught smoking and driving, you get a DWH (Driving While High), you go to jail for a certain time with a fine. The main thing about it is, Marijuana is more of a mind drug, it lowers your attention span and alertness. Alcohol affects you a lot differently than Marijuana does. Most 'highs' you can get rid of by simply munching on a snack. All of this legal, synthetic Marijuana, called K2, K3, K4, and so on and so forth, disguised as potpourri, I think just makes you sick and destroys your brain. Alcohol is worse for you than Marijuana is in my opinion. The fact that Marijuana is natural and tobacco is filled with chemicals surprises me. There are a lot of people wanting Marijuana legallized, I personally would prefer it to be legallized and tobacco to be made illegal. Your body, your way.

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Smoked pretty heavily for the past 2 months or so, and stopped cold -surprise I didn't slice my own head off or assault anyone. Still got decent marks in uni, did all the things I usually do etc etc, if you're a lazy unmotivated loser IT'S YOUR OWN FAULT. Take responsibility for your own [bleep]ing problems.

 

Weed isn't dangerous, and it doesnt make you dumb.

 

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I still follow the counterculture's idea of what a "drug" is. Drugs are bad for you. They harm your body. Alcohol, nicotine, heroine, cocaine, and other harmful substances fall into this category. Do I use drugs? Absolutely. I smoke cigarettes and a drink alcohol in large quantities, but it is my choice to do something that harms my body.

 

"Dope" is not a drug and is not harmful. Dope refers to LSD, peyote, psylocybin (mushrooms), and marijuana (among other hallucinogens). These drugs do not cause physical harm in and of themselves. Does it put you in an other-worldly state? Yes. Do you get lazy and want to do nothing but play Xbox, listen to music, and eat Cheetos? Yes. Does this go against the Puritan work ethic that America values? Absolutely.

 

The resistance to marijuana legalization is slowly waning. Just this year Gallup released a poll saying that for the first time, 50 percent of Americans think the U.S. should legalize pot.

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First and foremost, that belief stems from the fact that the Government have no right to tell you what you can, and cannot do with your body, provided what you do does not infringe on other people's basic human rights.

Am I asking all drugs to be legalized? Not at all. But it doesn't hurt to take a look at the impact of other drugs on society, and think of whether the role they hold is right.

That appears to me to be a direct contradiction.

 

Marijuana should be legal, but treated like alcohol is. If you get caught smoking and driving, you get a DWH (Driving While High), you go to jail for a certain time with a fine.

I saw a post on r/trees a while ago, and one of the main problems with this is that it's not actually particularly easy to have a 'Breathalyzer' type thing for Marijuana, unlike alcohol. On a slightly unrelated point, I think one of the other reasons the US govt has a problem is because they've gone through various countries burning plants such as marijuana to stop supply to the US.

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Eh, all my friends are trying to get me to do pot. I'm not too keen on doing it yet.

 

 

Everyone's like "you can't get addicted to it!" Please. If you can get addicted to frito-lays, you can get addicted to weed.

 

 

That being said, I guess I would vote to legalize it. Though if I get killed by someone on the highway the next day who is high... I'll be in heaven. [bleep]ING PISSED.

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One of the primary reasons why some drugs are illegal (especially with the synthetic ones) is that they have adverse effects while they are active inside the body, such as hallucination, rush of energy all can contribute the loss of judgment and cause problems to other people and/or property that, had they not taken the drugs in the first place, would not have happened. Examples include hallucinogens like LSD.

 

Another reason why is that some of their withdrawal symptoms and side effects could be quite severe, again perhaps leading to loss of judgment or awareness and causing damage. Although one could argue that the severity of side effects is caused primarily by the impurities the drug dealers add to their poison to 'dilute' the actual product (chalk dust, rat poison, etc), and this is a result of actually banning the drugs.

 

I am impartial to what governments decide to do with drugs, as I will never be taking any of it. But what I would hope to see is, whatever they ultimately decide to do with them, they are able to deal with the consequences.

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I've seen plenty of people around me fall through the cracks in the life due to drugs. I think that's more to do with the criminality involved with the business of dealing banned substances, in which case I suppose legalisation would help. However, on the contrary, I oppose the legalisation of marijuana, having dealt with enough people who've taken it. In acute terms, it means people neglect their own safety because they're so high they're not bothered--I have literally been told by a person with half a unit pouring out of his head following a fall onto a large rock that I should not take him to hospital because there's nothing wrong with him and it'll only get the police involved--and in the long-term it creates a dependency which leads to whole load of psychosocial problems.

 

I don't think why it was banned is particularly relevent in the first place. What matters is whether it's safe to legalise it now, and when you treat marijuana on its own, I do not believe it is. Any references to alcohol, and especially tobacco, are valid as examples of judicial contradiction, but invalid as arguments which prove marijuana is safe for public consumption.

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First and foremost, that belief stems from the fact that the Government have no right to tell you what you can, and cannot do with your body, provided what you do does not infringe on other people's basic human rights.

Am I asking all drugs to be legalized? Not at all. But it doesn't hurt to take a look at the impact of other drugs on society, and think of whether the role they hold is right.

That appears to me to be a direct contradiction.

 

 

 

Just to clarify. The government have no say in what goes in your body, therefore it "it doesn't hurt to take a look at the [positive] impact of other drugs [apart from marijuana] on society" and reevaluate the position the drug has in the government, and in society. I'm curious though, as to how it appears to you as a contradiction.

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Reply from the last topic, for Ginger Warrior, etc.

 

First and foremost, that belief stems from the fact that the Government have no right to tell you what you can, and cannot do with your body, provided what you do does not infringe on other people's basic human rights.

Am I asking all drugs to be legalized? Not at all. But it doesn't hurt to take a look at the impact of other drugs on society, and think of whether the role they hold is right.

That appears to me to be a direct contradiction.

 

 

Just to clarify. The government have no say in what goes in your body, therefore it "it doesn't hurt to take a look at the [positive] impact of other drugs [apart from marijuana] on society" and reevaluate the position the drug has in the government, and in society. I'm curious though, as to how it appears to you as a contradiction.

 

 

I don't think why it was banned is particularly relevent in the first place. What matters is whether it's safe to legalise it now, and when you treat marijuana on its own, I do not believe it is. Any references to alcohol, and especially tobacco, are valid as examples of judicial contradiction, but invalid as arguments which prove marijuana is safe for public consumption.

 

It is a valid comparison, I believe. In your first paragraph, you state that you're opposed to the legalization because "people neglect their own safety because they're so high". However, I argue that people also neglect their own safety when they are drunk (drink driving, aggressive behaviour), and in the long-term people neglect their own safety through an addiction to nicotine. This idea of yours, that marijuana should remain illegal due to the safety reasons is illogical when considering alcohol and tobacco aren't illegal due to the safety issues surrounding them. Furthermore, I believe it is not your, or my place to tell an individual what they can and cannot do to their body. That is imposing on their liberty as a human being.

 

Had marijuana been legal, instead of illegal, this man in your anecdote would have had less of an issue with going to the hospital. The police needn't be involved, as he was doing nothing illegal in the first place.

 

I also argue with your statement that marijuana usage, "in the long-term it creates a dependency". First and foremost, it is literally impossible to create a physical dependency to marijuana. Your body never, ever will become physically addicted to it, where your body will become unwell due to withdrawal. Nicotine, and alcohol cause physical addictions, yet marijuana does not. However, I do acknowledge that it can create a psychological dependence, similar to chronic gambling, porn use or caffeine, for example. These dependencies are generally relatively harmless in comparison to a physical addiction, and can be broken quite easily. However, it is up to the individual, and not you, as to how a member of society treats their body, when their treatment does not impose on someone else. Since marijuana use doesn't, you have no right telling someone they cannot smoke or indulge in it, regardless of its potential for addiction.

 

/badly worded rant.

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Reply to the other thread:

 

I've never used Marijuana before, I've friends who have. Some who were even dealing it while going through school. I would completely disagree with legalising all drugs, as I've seen the impact the likes of Cocaine, Ecstasy, Heroin, etc. have had on people and how it has ruined the lives of those around them.

 

I don't think the argument about if it was legal it would lead to bad judgements is quite valid... Alcohol does that and it's legal.

 

There seems to be many studies that show that Marijuana can be a gateway drug, and lead to abuse of other more harder drugs. There's also some to say that no, it won't lead to the abuse of other drugs...My own personal opinion is that it would. If people were able to easily obtain it, and get the "high" from it, they could soon get bored of it. The idea of getting something more from the likes of Cocaine might be appealing.

 

Just reading from the Legalise Canabise Ireland website, it says:

 

Long-term effects

May damage your lungs and lead to breathing problems

Has been linked with mental health problems, such as depression and schizophrenia

May lower sperm count and suppresses ovulation so you may have problems getting pregnant

Regular use may affect your memory, mood, motivation and ability to learn

May cause anxiety and paranoia

May affect your coordination and reactions so you are more at risk of accidents, especially if you also drink alcohol

 

Certainly doesn't sound encouraging.

 

EDIT: To add the original post of this thread:

 

I'm perfectly fine with alcohol laws in Ireland. I don't think anything needs to be changed. I'm a somewhat heavy drinker, normally spirits. The only thing I'd like changed are the prices! If I'm with friends down at the pub, I can easily spend 100 euro in 3 hours on Vodka.

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It is a valid comparison, I believe. In your first paragraph, you state that you're opposed to the legalization because "people neglect their own safety because they're so high". However, I argue that people also neglect their own safety when they are drunk (drink driving, aggressive behaviour), and in the long-term people neglect their own safety through an addiction to nicotine. This idea of yours, that marijuana should remain illegal due to the safety reasons is illogical when considering alcohol and tobacco aren't illegal due to the safety issues surrounding them.

I pointed out it was a contradiction to have alcohol and tobacco legal, whilst marijuana is not. I'm not sure where this position differs to your own, apart from I think in an ideal world they should all be illegal, whereas you go the opposite way. The part you haven't validated, is proving that marijuana does not increase the chances of someone involving themselves in a serious accident. You've just talked about how alcohol and tobacco do the same and lazily dished that out as a response.

 

Furthermore, I believe it is not your, or my place to tell an individual what they can and cannot do to their body. That is imposing on their liberty as a human being.

So you're happy for all drugs to be legalised, and freely purchased over the pharmacists' counter? I'm not just talking your counterculture's definition of a "drug", I'm including everything that the British National Formulary has to offer. Antipsychotics... the lot. After all, it's my liberty as a human being to OD myself on lithium, right?

 

Had marijuana been legal, instead of illegal, this man in your anecdote would have had less of an issue with going to the hospital. The police needn't be involved, as he was doing nothing illegal in the first place.

The police needn't have been involved anyway. He has a right to medical confidentiality so long as he didn't break the law. He wasn't supplying, and he wasn't in possession of any marijuana at the time. I defy any police officer to bring a prosecution forward on the evidence of a head-injured man, in the company of a qualified first aider, turned up to hospital with a deep wound on the back of his skull, who just so happened to be stoned. An advice leaflet suggesting safer drug use maybe, but the police? Not a chance.

 

I also argue with your statement that marijuana usage, "in the long-term it creates a dependency". First and foremost, it is literally impossible to create a physical dependency to marijuana. Your body never, ever will become physically addicted to it, where your body will become unwell due to withdrawal. Nicotine, and alcohol cause physical addictions, yet marijuana does not. However, I do acknowledge that it can create a psychological dependence, similar to chronic gambling, porn use or caffeine, for example. These dependencies are generally relatively harmless in comparison to a physical addiction, and can be broken quite easily. However, it is up to the individual, and not you, as to how a member of society treats their body, when their treatment does not impose on someone else. Since marijuana use doesn't, you have no right telling someone they cannot smoke or indulge in it, regardless of its potential for addiction.

I don't even know where to start with this. The implication that psychological illnesses are all "up to the individual" about how they treat their body, and are inherently less serious than physiological conditions (bolded), or even that the two are mutually apart in the first place; that gambling addictions can be "broken quite easily"; or the "not imposing on someone else" when their treatment is paid for by National Insurance contributions from every wage-earning person in the country.* I can only hope upon reading this you put that paragraph down to an 'angry rant' and edit it approriately.

 

* I understand in the US, this doesn't apply so much. This applies more in countries were public funding goes directly into hospital care and management, and healthcare provisions.

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My Brother is the only person who has ever been even close to convincing me to smoke pot. It's probably because I actually trust him, and respect him, so I put a lot more stock in what he says than I might for other people. Also, he had a pretty easy time giving it up. I don't know if its because he didn't do as much as some people I know, or if its just a personality thing.

 

For alcohol, I don't have a problem with it. I drink, sometimes a little bit, sometimes more. As best as I can tell, I haven't lost any memory on more than 1 or two occasions, and I've never had more than the most minor of hangovers (as in not enough to cause more than an observation of some discomfort). As far as I am concerned, a drink or two can be a god send in some social situations. It facilitates my getting to know people when I am in that sweet spot where I am not nervous enough to keep me from being social, but not drunk enough to make me stupid (this would be the point before you can notice any effects, such as any co-ordination impairment, or actually observe yourself saying things you might not normally say, which is to say about one drink spread out over an hour for me). Heck, for all I know, at that low a dose it might just be a placebo effect. A drink or two also makes being around legitimately drunk people a lot more fun.

 

Sure, the idea of feeding yourself what is essentially a poison is kinda stupid. But it's reasonably harmless in moderation for most people, and it can be fun, as well as having some useful side effects. This assumes of course you have a personality that allows you to drink in moderation. Not everyone can really limit themselves to a couple drinks.

 

I'm not sure I will ever know why people smoke (cigarettes). I mean, I know most of the reasons (things like social pressure and weight loss), but unlike just about any other drug, they don't seem to do anything for you (except make you smell terrible and act as a huge turn off for a lot of people). Alcohol makes you loosen up, pot is just plain fun. Cocaine makes you feel like your kind of the world or something as I understand it, and shrooms at least take you for one hell of a ride (as does Salvia). But Cigarettes don't have those benifits. I have never heard anyone describe smoking as fun. I figured all that out years ago, so I've never been able to figure out why someone would go for that deal, knowing they aren't going to get anything from it going in. I'd actually be really interested to hear from someone who smokes about just why they started. I love to learn about why people do things :D

 

It's also worth noting I was never under any pressure to smoke, My parent's don't, my brother doesn't, and none of my friends ever did. I got asked if I wanted some pot way more often than if I wanted a cigarette, so maybe I missed out on how much pressure people can be under.

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Smoking cigarettes helps with weight loss? Huh?

Also, you have no problem with alcohol, but you have a problem with weed? Alcohol does far more damage than weed.

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I don't know if smoking really helps weight loss, or if that's just something some people believe. Either way, its something I've heard from a few people.

 

And I never said I have a problem with weed, I only said I don't smoke it. I can't say I'm too crazy about how it smells, but other than that I actually don't care.

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Oh yeah, I understand where you come from about smoking weed. I wouldn't want to smoke weed, I'd rather take it some other way.

"Let your anger be as a monkey in a piñata... hiding amongst the candy... hoping the kids don't break through with the stick." - Master Tang

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In acute terms, it means people neglect their own safety because they're so high they're not bothered--I have literally been told by a person with half a unit pouring out of his head following a fall onto a large rock that I should not take him to hospital because there's nothing wrong with him and it'll only get the police involved--and in the long-term it creates a dependency which leads to whole load of psychosocial problems.

 

You know, he very well could've been an idiot before he smoked the marijuana. Not to say people haven't done stupid things that were attributed to the drug, but an amount of personal responsibility is always present, especially in cases like these.

 

I guess my point is that the effect of drugs are not so cut-and-dry. Some people will become extremely meticulous and cautious after taking the drug, and then on the other hand, we have those who believe they can fly.

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It is a valid comparison, I believe. In your first paragraph, you state that you're opposed to the legalization because "people neglect their own safety because they're so high". However, I argue that people also neglect their own safety when they are drunk (drink driving, aggressive behaviour), and in the long-term people neglect their own safety through an addiction to nicotine. This idea of yours, that marijuana should remain illegal due to the safety reasons is illogical when considering alcohol and tobacco aren't illegal due to the safety issues surrounding them.

I pointed out it was a contradiction to have alcohol and tobacco legal, whilst marijuana is not. I'm not sure where this position differs to your own, apart from I think in an ideal world they should all be illegal, whereas you go the opposite way. The part you haven't validated, is proving that marijuana does not increase the chances of someone involving themselves in a serious accident. You've just talked about how alcohol and tobacco do the same and lazily dished that out as a response.

 

Furthermore, I believe it is not your, or my place to tell an individual what they can and cannot do to their body. That is imposing on their liberty as a human being.

So you're happy for all drugs to be legalised, and freely purchased over the pharmacists' counter? I'm not just talking your counterculture's definition of a "drug", I'm including everything that the British National Formulary has to offer. Antipsychotics... the lot. After all, it's my liberty as a human being to OD myself on lithium, right?

 

Had marijuana been legal, instead of illegal, this man in your anecdote would have had less of an issue with going to the hospital. The police needn't be involved, as he was doing nothing illegal in the first place.

The police needn't have been involved anyway. He has a right to medical confidentiality so long as he didn't break the law. He wasn't supplying, and he wasn't in possession of any marijuana at the time. I defy any police officer to bring a prosecution forward on the evidence of a head-injured man, in the company of a qualified first aider, turned up to hospital with a deep wound on the back of his skull, who just so happened to be stoned. An advice leaflet suggesting safer drug use maybe, but the police? Not a chance.

 

I also argue with your statement that marijuana usage, "in the long-term it creates a dependency". First and foremost, it is literally impossible to create a physical dependency to marijuana. Your body never, ever will become physically addicted to it, where your body will become unwell due to withdrawal. Nicotine, and alcohol cause physical addictions, yet marijuana does not. However, I do acknowledge that it can create a psychological dependence, similar to chronic gambling, porn use or caffeine, for example. These dependencies are generally relatively harmless in comparison to a physical addiction, and can be broken quite easily. However, it is up to the individual, and not you, as to how a member of society treats their body, when their treatment does not impose on someone else. Since marijuana use doesn't, you have no right telling someone they cannot smoke or indulge in it, regardless of its potential for addiction.

I don't even know where to start with this. The implication that psychological illnesses are all "up to the individual" about how they treat their body, and are inherently less serious than physiological conditions (bolded), or even that the two are mutually apart in the first place; that gambling addictions can be "broken quite easily"; or the "not imposing on someone else" when their treatment is paid for by National Insurance contributions from every wage-earning person in the country.* I can only hope upon reading this you put that paragraph down to an 'angry rant' and edit it approriately.

 

* I understand in the US, this doesn't apply so much. This applies more in countries were public funding goes directly into hospital care and management, and healthcare provisions.

 

1. My misunderstanding. I'm going to say this right now, our positions differ enough, that any intelligent debate is lost as you support making illegal both alcohol and tobacco.

 

2. Indeed, you have found a flaw in the idea of personal liberty. Where exactly do we draw the line? Hence, I believe that all recreational drugs use should be looked at by the government, and official position reconsidered. I do not pretend to have the answer. What I do think is that (and boy do I know you will debate this) low-harm drugs, with personal, inoffensive psychoactive effects move to being tolerated rather than made criminal. Having an system in place which serves to educate the population on drugs (of the positive and negative effects), letting them decide for themselves whether to use a drug in a recreational manner I think is key. And yes, it is fully within your right as a human being to take your own life. As long as you take it with proper regard to the consequences of your actions.

 

3. The very notion of the police, and criminal nature are what, it seems, helped fuel his reaction. Whether they would have been notified or not is irrelevant. The fear and social stigma is still there. Whether we should have that fear of criminal action, and social stigma is a completely different question and I say no.

 

4. While I may have been hasty in my reply, I stand by my notion that a physical addiction is worse than a psychological addiction. Yes, there is an added expense of public funding to help drug addictions. However, would this not be balanced out by a tax system in place on the drugs?

 

God, I don't even know where to start with telling you what is wrong with some of your beliefs.

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I might contribute more later, but I thought I would weigh in on the physical/mental dependency thing.

 

While I have no doubt that a purely mental dependency can be just as hard for someone to break, and likely just as painful as any physical dependency, there is one very key advantage to a mental addiction. The problem with a physical addiction is that if it is severe enough, going cold turkey can quite literally kill you. Once the body has decided that a foreign substance is one of its vital fluids, the consequences of not getting enough of that substance can not only cause a lot of very real pain, but it can land your ass in the grave.

 

A mental addiction can't do this. No matter how much pain or discomfort it might cause you, there is no way for a mental dependency to outright kill you, or even affect your physical well being in a direct manner. Now, withdrawal whether its mental or physical in nature is going to stress you out for sure, but this is regardless of what the nature of the addiction was. Physical addiction has every negative effect of a mental addiction, with the addition of the withdrawal symptoms having a very direct impact on your health.

 

For that reason, I would consider a physical addiction to be at least a bit more serious than a mental addiction. They are both a very serious problem, but at the end of the day only one can cause you direct physical harm, while both can cause psychological harm.

 

EDIT: I do realise that stress can have a very dramatic impact on your physical health, but my point is about the effects of physical addiction that go beyond what a mental addiction can cause.

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I thought psychological factors (such as stress) do play a large role in your body's physical health though. Even though they're practically synonyms, physiology and psychology still go hand in hand.

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Oh, for sure stress can have a huge impact on your health. Given enough time, it can shorten your life through factors such as reduced immune system performance, and just general being unwell. Stressed out people just seem to die sooner.

 

As it relates to the point I was trying to make though, both types of dependancy will lead to stress when you quit, but physical addictions have other physical, biological effects on your body, some of which are potentially fatal, and in a much shorter time span than stress. The fastest way for stress to kill you would be to make you suicidal, but I imagine that either type of addiction could lead down that path if its bad enough.

 

I guess my wording might have left something to be desired, so I'll edit in a clarification before that gets quoted as is.

 

Also, I am not referring to any particular type of drug in particular. An example though would be the very common corticosteroid prednisone. While this particular drug forms no real dependency that you would ever be aware of (except for generally causing fatigue either when weaning off of it or if you stop taking it all together), coming off of it too quickly can very easily land you in the hospital. Your body makes about 5mg of the hormone a day by default, but will stop making it all together as soon as you take more than that through medication (and people on it are normally at doses that are 8-12x what your body normally makes). The hormone is responsible for regulating parts of your immune system, in particular the parts that allow it to recognise and respond to threats. While a high dose is used to suppress certain immune responses, a total lack of the hormone can cripple your immune system to certain threats until your body starts making it again. Someone who goes from say a 40mg dose per day to nothing, and they gets an infection, is going to be totally unable to mount a normal response. Without the intervention of other drugs to try and make your immune system fight, this can cause an infection that would otherwise go away on its own to become life threatening.

 

Probably not the best example, especially for the purposes of this thread since the drug has no recreational use for most people (it provides some people with an enormous energy boost when they start on it. Some people have used this phenomenal burst of energy to do things like scrub their shower with a toothbrush for 4 hours strait), but its a drug where I am reasonably confidant I actually know what I am talking about, without needing to brush up on it.

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Slight digression; Do you drink for the taste, or the effect? Maybe both?

 

Not sure if that question is directed at everyone, but if so! I drink for both. I drink Vodka, so its all about the mixer for the taste. Beer's okay on a hot day, when outside... But not really a fan of the taste.

RIP Michaelangelopolous

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