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20-Apr-2011 - Dungeoneering Guide Competition


CharlieBrown

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Two pages isnt enough, can't make a good dungeoneering guide with such limited space.

I'm sorry, but I think you've got to learn a lot still if you think this is limited.

 

Less pages means obviously less specific data: but it does not mean the guide is worse, just that it targets a different audience. For my latest study I've been working on a torsion box of an airplane wing. (the "skelleton" where all forces act through).

 

This was a full year study (often 60+ hours a week), building, testing evaluating redesigning etc etc. I've gained more information than most textbooks handle. Yet I still am capable of writing an overview -which covers everything- in half a page, 2 pages, 10, etc etc (all the way to the full report of 150 pages). They are just handled for a different audience and hence are written in a different style & have a different level of detail.

 

The half-full page (summary) one will be send to managers who get 100's of designs, they print it down and spent at most 15 minutes a design it requires a style where you write in a quickly readable format, and cover the specifics of your box quickly. Than the 2-page (the introduction/conclusion/evaluations) are used to verify that you're a good candidate.. After which it is send further to specialists who read the 10 page thing. And only some specialists/acadimical people (less than 1% of the people who touch your report and started reading the summary) will read the full report from back to back.

 

What I want to say is that you will HAVE to be able to show quality in a short amount of text. Seeing these "2 page max" as a potential problem shows you lack experience and should get experience in this field. People don't have time, they are not there for you, and you have to show them -quickly- that you're worth spending time.

First they came to fishing

and I didn't speak out because I wasn't fishing

 

Then they came to the yews

and I didn't speak out because I didn't cut yews

 

Then they came for the ores

and I didn't speak out because I didn't collect ores

 

Then they came for me

and there was no one left to speak out for me.

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Two pages isnt enough, can't make a good dungeoneering guide with such limited space.

I'm sorry, but I think you've got to learn a lot still if you think this is limited.

 

Less pages means obviously less specific data: but it does not mean the guide is worse, just that it targets a different audience. For my latest study I've been working on a torsion box of an airplane wing. (the "skelleton" where all forces act through).

 

This was a full year study (often 60+ hours a week), building, testing evaluating redesigning etc etc. I've gained more information than most textbooks handle. Yet I still am capable of writing an overview -which covers everything- in half a page, 2 pages, 10, etc etc (all the way to the full report of 150 pages). They are just handled for a different audience and hence are written in a different style & have a different level of detail.

 

The half-full page (summary) one will be send to managers who get 100's of designs, they print it down and spent at most 15 minutes a design it requires a style where you write in a quickly readable format, and cover the specifics of your box quickly. Than the 2-page (the introduction/conclusion/evaluations) are used to verify that you're a good candidate.. After which it is send further to specialists who read the 10 page thing. And only some specialists/acadimical people (less than 1% of the people who touch your report and started reading the summary) will read the full report from back to back.

 

What I want to say is that you will HAVE to be able to show quality in a short amount of text. Seeing these "2 page max" as a potential problem shows you lack experience and should get experience in this field. People don't have time, they are not there for you, and you have to show them -quickly- that you're worth spending time.

 

You write me a guide on:

- The first 11 bosses and their mechanics

- The floors their monsters and their weaknesses

- The bind system, what to bind and why

- The puzzle rooms and how to solve them

- How to key (its a team guide remember)

- Dungeoneering lingo and termonology

- spreading gates and efficiency

- doors in dungeoneering and how to identifiy what tools you need

- skills in dungeoneering, useful things like mininig promethium.. what to loot (which prom mining isnt useful unless for binds that early).

 

In 2 pages, and I will take my hat off to you, I am familiar with short concise sentences thank you, as I did contribute to tip.it guides for many months.

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Two pages? More like two sentences.

 

Don't level in F2P. Use lamps, tears, and penguin points to level 33.

I still say you should, some of the rewards you can obtain in f2p are pretty darn useful.

 

Anyways, because of this stupid 2 page limit I'm not going to join this dungeoneering guide competition. The one guide that I made alone is over 20 pages long already <_<

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These are my ideas on a guide so far. :thumbup:

 

Page one - Maybe I could draw a big picture/map and have an arrow pointing where dung is. Then scribble it out - Point another arrow to where tears of guthix is located.

 

Then on page two - Give directions on how to find world 60 pengs on the forum and how to join their clan chat.

 

I could try fit in some info about quest rewards but I not sure I can fit that in if I draw a huge map on page one. I might have to abandon the huge map for a smaller one. Im not sure if this will overal lower the quality of the guide though.

 

This will take me upto atleast level 70. Maybe 80. Thats almost a quarter of the way to 99.

 

^ These are just my ideas atm. Im working on it. I presume this is the in-depth information they are seeking.

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- The first 11 bosses and their mechanics

- The floors their monsters and their weaknesses

In an overview guide like they want there there's absolutely no place to go into so much detail, quickly covering the moves from the bosses would be more than enough already - probably too much.. Floor monster's weaknes is absolutely ridiculous. If I read a quide and I want information quickly this is a complete waste of time.

- The bind system, what to bind and why
Can be summarised in a few sentences.. Basically "2h as it has most dps/good accuracy, while spear might be better the beserker ring makes up for this". - Shadow silk hood should be obvious.
- The puzzle rooms and how to solve them
Should also be able to done within a few chapters: notice you don't have to go into too much detail. The goal of a guide is NOT to tell a person what is best, the goal of a guide is to give a person the tools so he can starts discovering.
- How to key (its a team guide remember)
You can never catch practise in a guide, here one would link towards youtube videos & other resources, a written guide is simply not the correct media to write this.
- Dungeoneering lingo and termonology
this would be an excellent idea to just show a link towards an appendix, what would this be of benefit in the main body of a guide? - People who are just wanting a quick guide won't have interest in this.
- spreading gates and efficiency
remember the goal is 2 pages, so a guide which can be read fast and gives an overview. ("How to start this skill, and will I like this skill"). - This is just too much detail.
- doors in dungeoneering and how to identifiy what tools you need
, "click on it read the what it says, remember" - why do you even want to tell every little detail?
First they came to fishing

and I didn't speak out because I wasn't fishing

 

Then they came to the yews

and I didn't speak out because I didn't cut yews

 

Then they came for the ores

and I didn't speak out because I didn't collect ores

 

Then they came for me

and there was no one left to speak out for me.

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Toad - Why even bother reply lol >.<

 

-

 

These are my ideas on a guide so far. :thumbup:

 

Page one - Maybe I could draw a big picture/map and have an arrow pointing where dung is. Then scribble it out - Point another arrow to where tears of guthix is located.

 

Then on page two - Give directions on how to find world 60 pengs on the forum and how to join their clan chat.

 

I could try fit in some info about quest rewards but I not sure I can fit that in if I draw a huge map on page one. I might have to abandon the huge map for a smaller one.

 

This will take me upto atleast level 70. Maybe 80. Thats almost a quarter of the way to 99.

 

^ These are just my ideas atm. Im working on it.

 

Problem is I could show about 30 example of maps and start room positions and what you should do ideally.. but it's mostly gained from experience of doing it, where to put GGS is closer to GDs than anything and personal gate at key doors.

 

Problem is too, explaining prestige system, complexity.. floor size, bla bla bla.

 

- The first 11 bosses and their mechanics

- The floors their monsters and their weaknesses

In an overview guide like they want there there's absolutely no place to go into so much detail, quickly covering the moves from the bosses would be more than enough already - probably too much.. Floor monster's weaknes is absolutely ridiculous. If I read a quide and I want information quickly this is a complete waste of time.

- The bind system, what to bind and why
Can be summarised in a few sentences.. Basically "2h as it has most dps/good accuracy, while spear might be better the beserker ring makes up for this". - Shadow silk hood should be obvious.
- The puzzle rooms and how to solve them
Should also be able to done within a few chapters: notice you don't have to go into too much detail. The goal of a guide is NOT to tell a person what is best, the goal of a guide is to give a person the tools so he can starts discovering.
- How to key (its a team guide remember)
You can never catch practise in a guide, here one would link towards youtube videos & other resources, a written guide is simply not the correct media to write this.
- Dungeoneering lingo and termonology
this would be an excellent idea to just show a link towards an appendix, what would this be of benefit in the main body of a guide? - People who are just wanting a quick guide won't have interest in this.
- spreading gates and efficiency
remember the goal is 2 pages, so a guide which can be read fast and gives an overview. ("How to start this skill, and will I like this skill"). - This is just too much detail.
- doors in dungeoneering and how to identifiy what tools you need
, "click on it read the what it says, remember" - why do you even want to tell every little detail?

 

So basically link everything to an external site to avoid the 2 page limit? doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of the exercise.

 

Dungeoneering Guide - Google.com

 

Done!

 

Edit - can only bind one until 50, so not best to bind the hood ;)

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Ok I am making a fast level 1-80 guide. I just finished page one of my guide. Its a map detailing in great detail on how to begin.

 

I wont post image here as its bit big but link to photobucket source - http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae175/BazzaminxerRS/fdgdfgd.jpg

 

I will change dimensions later to fit a A4 page. Shouldnt be too difficult though maybe squashed.

 

Thats just page one mind you. I havnt completely finished yet.

 

Seriously I think I deserve a bag of sweeties for the effort I put into this.

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You write me a guide on:

- The first 11 bosses and their mechanics

- The floors their monsters and their weaknesses

- The bind system, what to bind and why

- The puzzle rooms and how to solve them

- How to key (its a team guide remember)

- Dungeoneering lingo and termonology

- spreading gates and efficiency

- doors in dungeoneering and how to identifiy what tools you need

- skills in dungeoneering, useful things like mininig promethium.. what to loot (which prom mining isnt useful unless for binds that early).

 

In 2 pages, and I will take my hat off to you, I am familiar with short concise sentences thank you, as I did contribute to tip.it guides for many months.

 

Hmm. A guide for that would have these things for me:

 

The first 11 bosses? Deal damage, pray/pray flash against strongest attack, and gatestone out to heal when low on hp until the boss is dead. Exceptions being the behemoth - tank it, and the ice fiend - walk in a straight line from one end of the room to the other to avoid taking any damage from the icicle special.

 

The floor monsters and their weaknesses? Just follow the combat triangle. If that fails, melee. Use obstacles to even things out into 1v1 combat when necessary. The bind system? Heh. Either spears or best crush/slash weapon and a blast/surgebox when found. Arrows are fine if you can grab a good bow from the starting table of each dungeon floor.

 

Puzzles? Just look up the wiki.

 

Keying: good memory, opening doors in the following order: door, key door, skill door, puzzle door, guardian door. Kill only guardian room monsters, puzzle room monsters if needed.

 

Dungeoneering lingo is nothing but shorthand that's easily parsed with some common sense, i.e. ggs gd is teleport to the group gatestone for a guardian door. As for gates and efficiency, obey the leader and offer to gate doors the leader hasn't a key to yet. Oh, and taking 3 minutes to identify a door with rocks in front of it is pretty silly. Always carry a toolbox.

 

Dungeoneering is an end-game skill so the ideal player is maxed or has high skills. Learn all the skill boosting potions.

 

All that for the first 11 floors. This assumes no hood, no level 50 2nd bind, and very basic class rings. I do find it unfortunate that people tend to miss the basics when they just use the "lamp method." Can't blame them though. The experience rates appear so horrid when starting out.

 

And Sonic, I'm assuming the guides are targeted at P2P. They definitely should not level in F2P because of the experience cap. It might seem easier to level in F2P for the first handful of levels but this is the point when people start getting into the habit of doing things a certain way. It's better if they remain in P2P.

 

EDIT: Oh, that reminds me. Always Complexity 6 when unlocked. Reset when all floors are marked. And never, ever let go of the group gatestone except leaving it outside the boss door. There's been so many bloody times someone picks up the group gate and dumps it in a dead end room full of monsters just because they want to mine the rocks or fish there. Hell, even I've used it to kill people.

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You write me a guide on:

- The first 11 bosses and their mechanics

- The floors their monsters and their weaknesses

- The bind system, what to bind and why

- The puzzle rooms and how to solve them

- How to key (its a team guide remember)

- Dungeoneering lingo and termonology

- spreading gates and efficiency

- doors in dungeoneering and how to identifiy what tools you need

- skills in dungeoneering, useful things like mininig promethium.. what to loot (which prom mining isnt useful unless for binds that early).

 

In 2 pages, and I will take my hat off to you, I am familiar with short concise sentences thank you, as I did contribute to tip.it guides for many months.

 

Hmm. A guide for that would have these things for me:

 

The first 11 bosses? Deal damage, pray/pray flash against strongest attack, and gatestone out to heal when low on hp until the boss is dead. Exceptions being the behemoth - tank it, and the ice fiend - walk in a straight line from one end of the room to the other to avoid taking any damage from the icicle special.

 

The floor monsters and their weaknesses? Just follow the combat triangle. If that fails, melee. Use obstacles to even things out into 1v1 combat when necessary. The bind system? Heh. Either spears or best crush/slash weapon and a blast/surgebox when found. Arrows are fine if you can grab a good bow from the starting table of each dungeon floor.

 

Puzzles? Just look up the wiki.

 

Keying: good memory, opening doors in the following order: door, key door, skill door, puzzle door, guardian door. Kill only guardian room monsters, puzzle room monsters if needed.

 

Dungeoneering lingo is nothing but shorthand that's easily parsed with some common sense, i.e. ggs gd is teleport to the group gatestone for a guardian door. As for gates and efficiency, obey the leader and offer to gate doors the leader hasn't a key to yet. Oh, and taking 3 minutes to identify a door with rocks in front of it is pretty silly. Always carry a toolbox.

 

Dungeoneering is an end-game skill so the ideal player is maxed or has high skills. Learn all the skill boosting potions.

 

All that for the first 11 floors. This assumes no hood, no level 50 2nd bind, and very basic class rings. I do find it unfortunate that people tend to miss the basics when they just use the "lamp method." Can't blame them though. The experience rates appear so horrid when starting out.

 

And Sonic, I'm assuming the guides are targeted at P2P. They definitely should not level in F2P because of the experience cap. It might seem easier to level in F2P for the first handful of levels but this is the point when people start getting into the habit of doing things a certain way. It's better if they remain in P2P.

 

EDIT: Oh, that reminds me. Always Complexity 6 when unlocked. Reset when all floors are marked. And never, ever let go of the group gatestone except leaving it outside the boss door. There's been so many bloody times someone picks up the group gate and dumps it in a dead end room full of monsters just because they want to mine the rocks or fish there. Hell, even I've used it to kill people.

 

The xp got improved (for starting levels) with the checking off floor system.

 

To say use lamps isn't really a guide to a skill though is it? that's like saying "effigys", guess it shows how lazy we have gotten :P

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The xp got improved (for starting levels) with the checking off floor system.

 

To say use lamps isn't really a guide to a skill though is it? that's like saying "effigys", guess it shows how lazy we have gotten :P

 

It's not much of an improvement.

 

It's not really being lazy. It's more like using your in-game time wisely. Thing is, the lamp method appears efficient because the player ends up unlocking so many floors prior to serious training, their prestige after c1ing all the floors they can do is an effective rocket start. They skip the tedium of leveling to their 2nd bind.

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"Think where man's glory most begins and ends, and say my glory was I had such friends." Yeats

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Hi I like to keep posting the same joke everyone else has felt the need to post over and over again.

 

Basically, to 33 you should do tears of guthix. Lol am I funny now?

 

 

On Topic- Isn't it a bit sad that Jagex expects people to explain their game better than they can?

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Eh. They're gonna pick a guide by someone who doesn't train efficiently, but who trains in the way Jagex wants people to. Lots of crap about why teaming is important, make armour to fight bosses easier, etc. :rolleyes:

 

I started training dungeoneering right away and soloed to level 50-60. Isn't really that bad, but yes probably the best idea to just use exp lamps and points lol.

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Hi I like to keep posting the same joke everyone else has felt the need to post over and over again.

 

Basically, to 33 you should do tears of guthix. Lol am I funny now?

The funny think about it is you not understanding it's not a joke. Using tog and penguins for low level dungeoneering is the most efficient method of leveling the skill as you can only realistically start doing large dungeons at level 60+, and solo xp is terrible.

 

I think the funniest thing about all this is that the guide that wins will be catastrophically terrible and useless for real dungeoneering purposes, which will further the demise of w117 dungeoneering. Great idea, jagex.

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"Hey Mod Whatever, our knowledge base seems to need a low-level dungeoneering guide, up for it?"

 

- "How much space, about what levels?"

 

"2 pages, lotsa pics, detailed information, levels 1-33 at least, how does that sound?"

 

- "Impossible! Also, useless."

 

"Hmm... let's consider some other options then... let's make this a contest for those stupid players! They've always been good at doing the impossible, no?"

 

- "Agreed. Do we still have that KBD poster some noob gave us at runefest? We could write 'Andrew Gowa' and 'rs is pro' in that and some other nonsense, and call it a prize."

 

"Splendid. Oh, it's tea time."

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9000+ dragon drops! Including draconic visage, d chains, d spears, d2h, d claws, d meds, d legs, d skirts... d bones, d hides :)?

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I want jagex to put resource dungeons and dungeoneering skill doors to dungeoneering floors so I can dungeon and get dungeoneering xp while I dg so I don't have to dg to get dg exp, but I can dg while I dg :)?

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MY GUIDE:

Go to a cave nearby your irl house. Stay inside the cave until your bear has grown like Gandalf.

 

Congratulations, you have reached level 33! (Add Rodduck tutorial npc rich guy voice to that)

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