01-Jul-2011 - Behind the Scenes � July

[cyco]

Does it say anywhere what the slayer req. will be to get this new whip attachment? One of its requirements is 80 slayer, but it doesnt say what the monster will have.

 

 

My guess is it will be the jadinko that requires the highest slayer level to kill (91) that drops it. The lower ones might drop it too, just at a significantly lower rate. (I believe the slayer requirements for the other two are 80 and 86.)

 

Hm. They said that the vine is going to have a requirement of 80 slayer. If it's an untradeable drop from all three, that would give it that requirement...

 

This.

 

I think people are getting confused. Sounds like combat levels more to me.

[Sy_Accursed]

Yeah the whip has an 80 slayer req and it does say the new monsters can be assigned as a slayer task, it doesn't specifically say they are a slayer monster though.

And its ambiguous whether the level 80, 86 and 91 references combat levels or slayer requirements.

 

I think it's a safe bet if they are slayer monsters all 3 would drop the vine; after all why set the wield req at 80 if you can't obtained it til 91? This line of thought would also imply it will be untradable

[xpx]

Yeah the whip has an 80 slayer req and it does say the new monsters can be assigned as a slayer task, it doesn't specifically say they are a slayer monster though.

And its ambiguous whether the level 80, 86 and 91 references combat levels or slayer requirements.

 

I think it's a safe bet if they are slayer monsters all 3 would drop the vine; after all why set the wield req at 80 if you can't obtained it til 91? This line of thought would also imply it will be untradable

Or there will be 3 new slayer monsters with 3 new slayer drops, all tradeable. I doubt they are going to have a re-do on how the slayer skill works what with it being this popular and all.

 

The 80 slayer req seems to me as something to weigh against the chaotic weapons, requiring a similar sort of dedication to be able to wield. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the vine whip had exactly the same stats as the chaotic rapier, only with slash instead of stab.

[Sy_Accursed]

Yeah the whip has an 80 slayer req and it does say the new monsters can be assigned as a slayer task, it doesn't specifically say they are a slayer monster though.

And its ambiguous whether the level 80, 86 and 91 references combat levels or slayer requirements.

 

I think it's a safe bet if they are slayer monsters all 3 would drop the vine; after all why set the wield req at 80 if you can't obtained it til 91? This line of thought would also imply it will be untradable

Or there will be 3 new slayer monsters with 3 new slayer drops, all tradeable. I doubt they are going to have a re-do on how the slayer skill works what with it being this popular and all.

 

How would it be "redoing" the slayer skill in anyway?

 

All I said was it was unclear if it meant they were 80,86,91 combat monsters that CAN be a slayer task (like giants, daggs etc etc) or those level slayer monsters (like banshees, abbys etc.)

And not all slayer monsters have a new drop anyway so there's no reason to assume these three would have 3 new drops if they are indeed slayer monsters.

And there's no reason it HAS to be tradable; modern trend is high end gear you have to EARN not just buy, so untradable does kinda make sense

[xpx]

How would it be "redoing" the slayer skill in anyway?

 

All I said was it was unclear if it meant they were 80,86,91 combat monsters that CAN be a slayer task (like giants, daggs etc etc) or those level slayer monsters (like banshees, abbys etc.)

And not all slayer monsters have a new drop anyway so there's no reason to assume these three would have 3 new drops if they are indeed slayer monsters.

And there's no reason it HAS to be tradable; modern trend is high end gear you have to EARN not just buy, so untradable does kinda make sense

So having untradeable slayer drops isn't re-doing the slayer skill, you reckon? I very much disagree with this- tradeable slayer drops that can be used by everyone has always been one of the main points about the skill, and while not all slayer monsters have an unique drop, the large majority of them do and they've not abandoned this trend since the very release of the skill. The only new development about all this has been that you'd only be able to slay the monsters on task(which isn't the case this time).

 

I also don't think there is any way they meant the combat levels of these monsters, as it wouldn't make much sense according to the text(and judging by this thread, noone else seems to have understood the writing in that way).

[Sy_Accursed]

Slayer the skill is about doing assigned tasks for xp.

The drops aren't part of the skill itself, merely a bonus. Heck until this whip there's no items that are not slayer specific that even have a slayer req on them.

I would associate the drops with the slayer skill or as part of the skill because you don't NEED slayer for any of them; you just go and buy them.

 

I just think given the precedent of altered items being untradable (coloured whips etc), the trend for new high end gear to be earned not bought and the fact the whip requires 80 slayer and they loqest creature is possible 80 slayer it suggests its gonna be untradable.

[xpx]

Altered items untradeable? hello ornament kits(you did have colored whips as an example...). I see no reason for the vine whip to not be like this. Also, as far as i can tell, most high end items are tradeable, so i don't see a major trend developing here.

 

And even if drops haven't been a huge part of slayer recently, it has been one of the most important or the most important part of the skill at times. Without the unique drops, slayer wouldn't be half the skill it is, which is why it makes sense for them to try to re-conjure this.

[Sy_Accursed]

Yeah I'm not saying unique drops existing aren't part of the skill.

Just the items themselves aren't really part of the skill because you don't need the skill personally to own them

 

As for the trend of new stuff added in the past year or so only Nex and brackish blade have been tradeable (off the top of my head); compared to kosari, elite void, deflector, all the dg stuff, the top end herblore, the juju stuff etc.

The recent trend has been towards untradables making the player earn the reward opposed to buy it in my opinion at least.

[Sylpheed]

I agree with xpx on this. Saying that the Slayer skill isn't about the unique drops is just a nonsensical thing to say. If none of the unique slayer mobs had their own drops what would distinguish them from any other normal mob.

 

Also, every single unique slayer item is tradeable, (that I can think of anyway) why bother to upset peoples expectations now? When a new slayer monster is released discussion immediately moves to what it's new, sellable drop will be.

[Sy_Accursed]

The logic of why change would lead to a stagnating game.

 

Why change herblore and have untradable potions?

Why change the combat triangle with new higher gear?

etc.

 

I just get the feeling its gonna be an untradable, theres a trend towards more untradable items and players have asked for it for a while.

We'll find out either way in a few weeks time, its not like any of us know for sure and there is enough precedent for either case to be true.

[xpx]

Yeah I'm not saying unique drops existing aren't part of the skill.

Just the items themselves aren't really part of the skill because you don't need the skill personally to own them

 

As for the trend of new stuff added in the past year or so only Nex and brackish blade have been tradeable (off the top of my head); compared to kosari, elite void, deflector, all the dg stuff, the top end herblore, the juju stuff etc.

The recent trend has been towards untradables making the player earn the reward opposed to buy it in my opinion at least.

Well, if you consider top end armor and weapons, only chaotics are untradeable, and that's mostly because they are the only reward from the dungeoneering skill. Quest and minigame items have always had a place in the game, but i haven't really seen a major trend involving this- from legends cape and rune plate in rsc to dark gloves and korasi in rs2. The absolute best armor has never been untradeable, and although dungeoneering works in the way you are describing, i don't at all see them re-doing slayer to be in this way. Untradeable potions are quite different in that they can't be used in the wilderness, and juju potions offer no bonuses to combat.

 

Also, the 80 slayer requirement to wield and 80 slayer requirement to kill would be very suspect to me- why have the wielding requirement when you can't obtain it under that level.

[Sylpheed]

The logic of why change would lead to a stagnating game.

 

Why change herblore and have untradable potions?

Why change the combat triangle with new higher gear?

etc.

 

I just get the feeling its gonna be an untradable, theres a trend towards more untradable items and players have asked for it for a while.

We'll find out either way in a few weeks time, its not like any of us know for sure and there is enough precedent for either case to be true.

 

Yes, but giving Slayer an untradeable new drop isn't some creative new direction for the skill. Making a new, unique Slayer drop untradeable would be like only letting runes made by a player using Rc to be used by themselves and nobody else.

[Sy_Accursed]

Not really.

It'd just be 1 item; they are bound to have other drops.

It's not even like 90% of the slayer drops are particular good money, most slayer money comes from other drops.

 

But whatever this is all pointless I just have a hunch its gonna be untradable, or at the very least the whip will be once its upgraded. Just wait and see if it pans out that way or not.

[xpx]

Not really.

It'd just be 1 item; they are bound to have other drops.

It's not even like 90% of the slayer drops are particular good money, most slayer money comes from other drops.

 

But whatever this is all pointless I just have a hunch its gonna be untradable, or at the very least the whip will be once its upgraded. Just wait and see if it pans out that way or not.

I'd happily bet you one of those things if it were in some way possible in this argument.

 

It just seems highly suspect to expect them to completely ignore the focus of the slayer skill for this one item, particularly as it'd make the monsters undesirable to kill(you can't attach many of them, can you). There is no precedent for this, so it seems silly to expect there to be with no factual implications for it.

[Sy_Accursed]

There was no such skill specific precedent or "factual implications" for making high end herblore untradeable.

[xpx]

There was no such skill specific precedent or "factual implications" for making high end herblore untradeable.

There were no factual implications that nex gear would be tradeable, and you likely predicted that that, too, would be untradeable. See where i'm going with this?

 

If you are to read something out of what jagex tells us about the updates, it's very unreasnoble to predict something with no previous precedent. It's reasonable to say that if a unique slayer monster drop is added, it's likely tradeable, but unreasonable to predict it would be untradeable if there are no implications for it.

[IAmCyanide]

There was no such skill specific precedent or "factual implications" for making high end herblore untradeable.

 

The reason why Jagex made high end potions untradable was because people started to complain that it was a pointless skill.

 

I agree with xpx on this TBH.

[Sy_Accursed]

I'm not predicting anything, predictions require indepth reason and logic and clues to build; I'm just saying I've got a hunch, simple as that. You can waffle all you like about what you think and how you read precedent, it doesn't alter a thing.

This is all OPINION there is no facts because its not out yet.

 

Yes its perfectly reasonable to say slayer drops are likely to be tradeable based on prior monsters.

But it is just as reasonable to say people have been asking for more equipment you have to earn yourself and not buy and jagex has being doing this so it could be untradable.

It's just two different angles of looking at it. Neither is fact based as we don't have any facts until its out.

 

Personally I feel it may be untradeable; end of matter.

[xpx]

I'm not predicting anything, predictions require indepth reason and logic and clues to build; I'm just saying I've got a hunch, simple as that. You can waffle all you like about what you think and how you read precedent, it doesn't alter a thing.

This is all OPINION there is no facts because its not out yet.

 

Yes its perfectly reasonable to say slayer drops are likely to be tradeable based on prior monsters.

But it is just as reasonable to say people have been asking for more equipment you have to earn yourself and not buy and jagex has being doing this so it could be untradable.

It's just two different angles of looking at it. Neither is fact based as we don't have any facts until its out.

 

Personally I feel it may be untradeable; end of matter.

The question is, how confident you are and can be in that opinion. We all know that it'll be either tradeable or not, but would you be prepared to stake a large pile of cash on that hunch? To be honest, it just seems you are showing your personal preference of what the update should and could be like, instead of looking at it from an impartial, objective point of view- whether you like it or not, it's still highly likely that the vine whip add-on will be tradeable, and previous developments support that in every way possible.

[Stev]

I hope they are tradeable... 'Cause what's the point of getting more of them if you've already got one attached to your whip... Unless the vine attachment degrades/wears out?

 

There'd be a lot of cancelled tasks. :P.

[gspbeetle]

 

The question is, how confident you are and can be in that opinion. We all know that it'll be either tradeable or not, but would you be prepared to stake a large pile of cash on that hunch? To be honest, it just seems you are showing your personal preference of what the update should and could be like, instead of looking at it from an impartial, objective point of view- whether you like it or not, it's still highly likely that the vine whip add-on will be tradeable, and previous developments support that in every way possible.

 

But isnt that even if it turns out to be tradable or not, the risk of whip going to fall in price is rather small?

[xpx]

 

But isnt that even if it turns out to be tradable or not, the risk of whip going to fall in price is rather small?

I'd rather say that whatever the update brings, the content itself will have little to no effect on the price of whip- since the number of whips in game is so ridiculously large and there will never be a shortage compared to the new drop, meaning whips are unaffected. This, ofcource, does not mean that for many reasons, whips won't fluctuate for the upcoming weeks and months.

[Deathknell]

Methinks you guys are overanalyzing this.

[Sy_Accursed]

I wouldn't stake anything on a hunch, cause its just a hunch.

I don;t care if its right or wrong. I don't care if your personal analysis doesn't support it.

 

Hunches don't need to make sense, they are just what you feel.

[91soldin91]

I think its too hard to say with any degree of certainty, if this whip attachment will be tradable or not. On one hand, this is the first weapon attachment, and it is also the first slayer drop to require a slayer level to wield. Therefore, it is hard to compare it to other slayer drops. Players have also been asking for higher leveled, untradeable content. Jagex has listened by giving the attachment an 85 attack requirement; if they really did listen to the players it should be untradeable as well.

 

On the other hand, all other slayer drops have been tradable. Also, the 80 slayer requirement could be Jagexs way of allowing the attachment to be tradable, while still requiring the player to have the level to obtain it as a drop.

 

I am going with my gut and saying its going to be tradable because I think the precedent set by other slayer drops is the strongest argument in this case.