Hegemony

[Resistance]

I'm not sure if you're trolling now.. Or just an idiot.

You know Ad Hominem isn't the best way to argue, you might want to get checked for narcacistic personality disorder if you think that anybody who disagrees with you is an idiot or a troll, you're reasoning is weak and circular and you're wondering whether I'm an idiot/troll.

 

Scotland was conquered.... We didn't 'merge' with them. So that completely destroys your 'scotland arguement'

But as it proves, despite Scotland having massive cultural differences (moreso then France) there isn't a problem with the two Governments uniting economically and politically. A British man can live for seventy years and never meet a French person, the change is only governmental and economical, the two countrys are seperated by sea. The issue about cultural differences could only occur if the countrys weren't seperated.

The risk of people commiting Faux Pas due to cultural differences won't matter, the change is governmental.

 

MINOR? Are you serious? The student loans were a minor riot, this would a major riot. People WILL get ahold of guns, people will get ahold of other weapons and people will use them.

But they won't.

When people learn it won't affect them they won't risk a life in prison for it, recently people have been losing pensions and having to pay more for universitys; two very direct things that directly anger the person. A governmental grouping of France and Britain does not directly affect them so although people may feel strongly about it but as it does not affect them directly they're not going to do anything. This is why the protests about Britain advancing on Libya were so small and insignificant.

Even if there are riots the likelyhood of sane normal people getting attacking with guns is so small, less then a fraction of a percentage. Especially in England where guns are almost impossible to get hold of, people will only be able to get hold of rifles, pistols and other guns illegally and people will only be able to get other guns if they were previously a gunowner (have been assessed for whether they're allowed a gun and there reasons).

Are you seriously suggesting that normal people will be able to get hold of guns without gang affiliations, and are you seriously suggesting that normal people are going to murder police?

I'll give you the fact there will be rioting, however you are exaggerating the severity of the violence greatly. At the most it'll be as severe as the student protests but as its just a legal complexity it means the newspapers can safely say: "How will this affect us? It won't"

 

Scotland's national currency is still the GBP

I haven't actually mentioned currency yet, I will reveal that later. I think its better to refer to this as the Jersey Argument; Jersey is English but has a different currency which is used actively. The argument you made about currency shouldn't matter because I haven't mentioned currency.

The issue of currency changing will be dealt with later when that issue arises.

The problem hasn't arisen yet, you're assuming stuff about what might happen in the future.

 

Just because it's mutually beneficial, does not mean people will do it. It's mutually beneficial if all war was stopped and everyone was ruled under a perfect government...

Non-corrupt governments usually do what is best for there people, this is mutually beneficial for both of the countrys and so the government (not the people) have decided to sign it.

As I have stated before the change is economical and political, it won't affect the people of Brtain anymore then politicans having an affair, people may not like it but in the end, after a fortnight the fuss will die down and people will realise that nothing has changed.

 

 

And the fact the french guy will have to give up his power is SOOOO obvious, that he will see it coming and wont agree...

You are yet again mentioning things that could potentially happen in the future, its irrelevant until the situation arises.

The problem hasn't arisen yet, you're assuming stuff about what might happen in the future.

 

And for the last time, an alliance does not equal the right to merge with someone..

Yes it does.

 

It makes NO sense as to why the French government would sign off ALL their power of their country, to a foreign nation so that their economy could suddenly become better (which in my mind sounds perposterous anyway) France's national currency is the Euro, isn't it? So they would have to convert to the British pound, which they wont do...

They're not signing any of their power to Britain, they're sharing power of France and Britain. I haven't said anything about the power being signed over yet and so until I make that statement then the power of France will remain in French control. The French aren't proud of the Euro like British are of the Pound so I don't see the issue here however as the issue hasn't arisen yet it isn't worth discussing.

The problem hasn't arisen yet, you're assuming stuff about what might happen in the future.

It just doesn't make sense.

[Icuownage]

You heard it from here folks, France is more British than Scotland is... Even though their main language is French..

 

I'll get my narc personality disorder checked out soon, don't worry.

 

And no.. Just no. You're saying basically, because of the channel, a French man and an English man MAY OR MAY NOT interact with eachother, so it is perfectly fine to unite the two countries, completely ignoring that it is actually extremely common to meet French people if you're in the UK. Oh and the change is only governmental, my mistake, for a second here I thought you were changing the country..

 

Yeah, this is completely [developmentally delayed]ed.

 

Because you're saying, merging with a country will not effect the lives of the countrymen of either country... While you are incorrect, it is a huge change, people will realise it is a huge change, people who don't like the French will rise up, people who are nationalist and will think they will lose their culture to french will rise up, businesses who feel the French market may ruin their business will rise up. There are many different factions of people who can rise up and say no to this, and you think they will just let you do it because you're in charge... You know being in charge doesn't just give you the right to say what is right.. People DO have opinions and people VOICE their opinions a lot.

 

And you will get newspapers stating the complete opposite to your views, so that's a pretty piss poor reason to say the citzens auto agree, because the government doesn't fully control the media in Britain.

 

I am assuming stuff that happens in the future BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT YOU DO WHEN THINGS BEGIN TO CHANGE. YOU HAVE TO THINK WHAT WILL HAPPEN SO YOU CAN EFFECTIVELY DEAL WITH IT WHEN IT ARISES.

 

Although you say it's 'mutually beneficial' so the governments auto sign for it and all goes according to plan, I am saying, that the people may not agree with it, and other government parties may not agree with it.

 

And no it doesn't Resistance, you're an idiot

 

By your logic

 

I make an alliance with the

Uk

China

India

Russia

USA

Spain

Mexico

Brazil

Argentina

Italy

Australia

Etc etc

 

And they all merge with me, because we are BFFL's and totally this seems like a good idea, I mean it would be amazing if we all just could just like work together? You know XD?

[Resistance]

wow, extreme stupidity and we're on the second page. if you honestly think that any significant group of french people would be willing to give up their autonomy as a country based on trivial similarities with a country that they probably consider a natural rival, then you're very, very wrong.

 

a series of projects will be emailed to archi soon.

You didn't read it all, its a political change that means I don't have control of France atm and its for economic reasons not trivial similarities -.-

 

 

You heard it from here folks, France is more British than Scotland is... Even though their main language is French..

 

I'll get my narc personality disorder checked out soon, don't worry.

 

And no.. Just no. You're saying basically, because of the channel, a French man and an English man MAY OR MAY NOT interact with eachother, so it is perfectly fine to unite the two countries, completely ignoring that it is actually extremely common to meet French people if you're in the UK. Oh and the change is only governmental, my mistake, for a second here I thought you were changing the country..

 

Yeah, this is completely [developmentally delayed]ed.

 

Because you're saying, merging with a country will not effect the lives of the countrymen of either country... While you are incorrect, it is a huge change, people will realise it is a huge change, people who don't like the French will rise up, people who are nationalist and will think they will lose their culture to french will rise up, businesses who feel the French market may ruin their business will rise up. There are many different factions of people who can rise up and say no to this, and you think they will just let you do it because you're in charge... You know being in charge doesn't just give you the right to say what is right.. People DO have opinions and people VOICE their opinions a lot.

 

And you will get newspapers stating the complete opposite to your views, so that's a pretty piss poor reason to say the citzens auto agree, because the government doesn't fully control the media in Britain.

 

I am assuming stuff that happens in the future BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT YOU DO WHEN THINGS BEGIN TO CHANGE. YOU HAVE TO THINK WHAT WILL HAPPEN SO YOU CAN EFFECTIVELY DEAL WITH IT WHEN IT ARISES.

 

Although you say it's 'mutually beneficial' so the governments auto sign for it and all goes according to plan, I am saying, that the people may not agree with it, and other government parties may not agree with it.

 

And no it doesn't Resistance, you're an idiot

 

By your logic

 

I make an alliance with the

Uk

China

India

Russia

USA

Spain

Mexico

Brazil

Argentina

Italy

Australia

Etc etc

 

And they all merge with me, because we are BFFL's and totally this seems like a good idea, I mean it would be amazing if we all just could just like work together? You know XD?

 

So you're saying that culture is all to do with Language, are you [developmentally delayed]ed? While language may play a part in how people are percieved it has nothing to do with the culture of the people. France does have culture that is very different to that of England but there isn't any significant or conflicting differences that would pose a problem so there is little chance of arguments due to cultural differences.

There is a chance that French and British people will meet in England and it is very high already so you've highlighted that there won't be cultural difference problems.

It is a governmental change in the sense that it only affects the government, it will have no effect on the people this year and I won't have control of France just yet.

 

The point still stands that ordinary people, especially businesses people will not be illegally getting hold of guns and attacking the government. The market is free and France already ruins English business with its market so thats not a possibility. The number of people who are going to illegally get gun and murder people and spend the rest of there life in prison is so small I could count it one hand, and even so most of them won't even be able to get a gun due to not having gang affiliations. I have accounted peoples opinions, there is minor rioting.

 

It can control the media in Britain if it wants to, either way when newspapers attempt to report the actual problems with this its going to be very hard for them to find any.

 

But you're assuming things in an unrealistic way for example assuming that I'm going to dominate over the French because I'm a player and they're an NPC or I'm going to change my currency. They're all opinions that you're only taking because this is a game.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JapanKorea_Annexation_Treaty

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/German_reunification

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Mediatisation

 

 

But you quite obviously won't because you don't have extremely good relations with them as I do with France, infact you have bad relations with Russia and China.

[The_Mather1]

Res, no. This is not how the game works, trust those of us who played the original. Now I kindly ask you to act realistically or GTFO.

[Grim_]

Italy spits on your feeble oriental blood (and lies, can't forget the lies).

[Resistance]

-You may as of now expand your nations. However, taking over a country will take ATLEAST 3 days (if it is unpopulated) and potentially weeks if the other player retorts.

Yes it is how the game works, its a reasonable action that is being ridiculously exaggerated. Also you can't kindly ask me to GTFO because then it isn't kind.

 

How the [bleep] is the original hegemony relevent? I'm acting reasonably and to the rules., I'm not going to act differently because you're nostalgic.

 

Please post the formula you're using for budget.

[The_Mather1]

Res, for political annexation you have to give the target a reason to join you. Or you need some extremely good relations with it.

Norway annexing Sweden/Denmark = realistic.

UK annexing France = Implausible.

[Grim_]

-You may as of now expand your nations. However, taking over a country will take ATLEAST 3 days (if it is unpopulated) and potentially weeks if the other player retorts.

Yes it is how the game works, its a reasonable action that is being ridiculously exaggerated. Also you can't kindly ask me to GTFO because then it isn't kind.

 

How the [bleep] is the original hegemony relevent? I'm acting reasonably and to the rules., I'm not going to act differently because you're nostalgic.

 

Please post the formula you're using for budget.

He's using population, average income from jobs and tax rate to generate his own GDP. I would say that that method is flawed because YOU'RE COUNTING CHILDREN IN YOUR POPULATION. CHILDREN DO NOT WORK. ERGO THAT METHOD IS STUPID AND SKEWING YOUR RESULTS. JUST USE 10% GDP LIKE THE REST OF US.

 

EDIT: Italy supports the autonomy of France and begins talks with France about a defensive alliance.

[Resistance]

The UK have extremely good relations with France, it is one of Britains main allies and since the early 19th century they have supported each other and continue to do so. With the dissolution of the EU it seems only naturally that the two countrys with extremely good relations would continue to do so.

You obviously haven't read the past argument as it isn't a political annexation.

 

Edit:

 

Budget 1: $2,231,150,000,000

 

Budget 2: $2,231,150,000,000

[Grim_]

It's 10% of your PPP GDP (look it up on wikipedia) again, mather tries to do some [cabbage] to (at least in my opinion) give him self an advantage over those others who don't use his system.

[Resistance]

Grim, in response to pact.

 

At the moment political tension is high and the two leaders have agreed not to make any agreements that could alter the political mood.

 

 

Budget 1: £1367 billion

Assigned to:

Research 500 billion

Military 867 billion

 

Budget 2: £1367 billion

Research 500 billion

Military 867 billion

[The_Mather1]

He's using population, average income from jobs and tax rate to generate his own GDP. I would say that that method is flawed because YOU'RE COUNTING CHILDREN IN YOUR POPULATION. CHILDREN DO NOT WORK. ERGO THAT METHOD IS STUPID AND SKEWING YOUR RESULTS. JUST USE 10% GDP LIKE THE REST OF US.

No I'm not, I divided tax income and export income by the population then used that as the base value for each of them, used the GDP-tax income-export income, divided it by population and added it as base value for other, summarized the three incomes and added that as GDP. What I could've done would be to just divide GDP by population and use it as a single base value, but this way I can modify the numbers individually as avg. income and fortune, trade and industry changes to take that into account as well as the linear increase caused by population growth.

 

Population 5 099 000,00

 

Taxation $107 284 234 750,00

Export $125 050 833 420,00

Other $29 333 833 140,00

 

GDP $261 668 901 310,00

 

Budget $26 166 890 131,00

 

Saved $25 530 550 775,00

[Resistance]

Rocco, you haven't read anything. Tell me what I have done.

[Resistance]

proposing even remotely that either the uk or france would for any reason join together in anything more than the most no-strings-attached military alliance

 

has been discussing the mutually beneficial thought of the merging of France and Britain

 

literally would never even come close to happening ever.

The No-Strings-Attached military alliance already exits :lol:, France and GB have been allies from the early 19th century. France will aid Britain in wars.

 

Basically this is a state of increased power over the other country and the French on me. The merging was something that could happen in years to come but as of now its just the 'twinned countrys treaty' which is a route to a much better alliance.

[The_Mather1]

Rocco, I am using 10% GDP, I've just factored in economical growth in a more complex way which alone gives me no benefit alone.

[Retech]

Breaking News: French President Nicholas Sarkozy is defeated by extreme rightists concerned with the safety of the nation from foreign powers like Britain

 

German Chancellor Angela Merkel has flown secretly to France to meet with the new leaders. After she had safely returned to Berlin, a joint announcement was made to recreate the Continenal System, under joint French-German rule, a throwback to the days of Charlamagne.

[Resistance]

Estimated price of a solider?

[Icuownage]

[hide]

 

http://chickencrap.com/media_images/1203.jpg?826

[/hide]

 

So yeah... Anyway, that doesn't really make sense for France to give you money (which is basically what you are saying they are doing)

 

 

It seems the majority are against you anyway... So... It doesn't happen regardless.

 

 

Reposting first post with changes

 

GDP

$5.458 trillion

Or

5,458,000,000,000

 

Budget

545,800,000,000

 

I'm not sure how to factor in growth, is it (populationgrowth*population)*GDP Per Capita?

 

Our first act of business is to rebuild the navy, as this is the first line of defense if any foolish attacker were to attempt to attack our glorious islands

 

A large proportion of Japan's budget is now spent on the naval revival project, allocating around 300,000,000,000 spent over 10 years. Meaning 30,000,000,000 a year.

 

We hope to have a sizeable navy after the 10 years

 

We're going for atleast one big battleship (which will be our flagship), 10 submarines, 5 minelayers/sweepers, 5 destroyers, 5 escorts, 3 smaller battleships, 10 missile cruisers, 3 aircraft carriers.

 

Does this seem reasonable, that's 42 ships in 10 years, pretty much 4.2 ships a year.

 

I would also like to know if I can push that higher. As that is like 300 billion man.

 

 

Our remaining budget goes into improving infrastructure, as our large population density has caused traffic jams which we would like to stop, this will also create jobs to improve our economy.

 

We hope to see a yearly increase over the years and a future increase after the project is completed for a few years after - Let's say 1% increase for 10 years and then 2% for 5 years after that.

 

So 240,000,000,000

 

1% of that each year for 10 years, and then 2% increase of entire GDP or just the 240,000,000,000, I'm pretty much asking you guys to answer this for me, if you don't I'll just go with the GDP.

[archimage_a]

I would imagine a solider would demand whatever the normal wage was in your country, plus weapons.

 

I would imagine the first bit effects their loyalty and second bit how well they fight.

Though you are free to say other stuff and I will take anything reasonable into consideration.

For example:

"I am being invaded, so soliders rise up to defend their homes. They are loyal even though I am not paying them very much, and the money I am paying them is for weapons and food."

 

Similarly

"I control Arabia, Alaska, a large part of Russia, Texas and the East Indies, so I stop Oil sales to my enemies." can be used.

[jasignhagj]

After increasing pressure from the left, President Obama has agreed to pull all troops out of both Afghanistan and Iraq, effectively ending the 11 and 9 year old wars. Several new taxes have been raised in an attempt to balance the deficit, which are accepted by the public largely thanks to a massive propaganda campaign showing America under control of debt holding nations. New taxes include a tax on all recently legalized Marijuana products; excess taxes on jewelry, cars over a certain pricepoint and other luxuries; and 'fat' taxes on junk foods and unhealthy drinks.

 

Research money is being poured into science and technology, aiming to keep America the most developed country in the world. Projects in schools are attempting to make these fields more attractive to students, and University tuition is being subsidized for students with abilities but no means.

 

A new law has been passed that effectively bans new coal power plants, and makes it illegal to operate one starting in 2025.

 

OOC: Just to clear things up, is today 2011 or 2012?

[archimage_a]

Vague idea:

Each page represents 1 year?

 

 

 

Elsewise it is 2012.

[The_Mather1]

Similarly

"I control Arabia, Alaska, a large part of Russia, Texas and the East Indies, so I stop Oil sales to my enemies." can be used.

Oh god, if someone did that then my export income would just about double. :mrgreen:

[Guest Rob]

After increasing pressure from the left, President Obama has agreed to pull all troops out of both Afghanistan and Iraq, effectively ending the 11 and 9 year old wars. Several new taxes have been raised in an attempt to balance the deficit, which are accepted by the public largely thanks to a massive propaganda campaign showing America under control of debt holding nations. New taxes include a tax on all recently legalized Marijuana products; excess taxes on jewelry, cars over a certain pricepoint and other luxuries; and 'fat' taxes on junk foods and unhealthy drinks.

 

Research money is being poured into science and technology, aiming to keep America the most developed country in the world. Projects in schools are attempting to make these fields more attractive to students, and University tuition is being subsidized for students with abilities but no means.

 

A new law has been passed that effectively bans new coal power plants, and makes it illegal to operate one starting in 2025.

 

OOC: Just to clear things up, is today 2011 or 2012?

 

Just so you know, I dibbed the USA about 4 posts before yours.

I'll post plans as to what I'm doing this year shortly, I'm at work right now and probably shouldn't be on tif at all :lol:

[jasignhagj]

After increasing pressure from the left, President Obama has agreed to pull all troops out of both Afghanistan and Iraq, effectively ending the 11 and 9 year old wars. Several new taxes have been raised in an attempt to balance the deficit, which are accepted by the public largely thanks to a massive propaganda campaign showing America under control of debt holding nations. New taxes include a tax on all recently legalized Marijuana products; excess taxes on jewelry, cars over a certain pricepoint and other luxuries; and 'fat' taxes on junk foods and unhealthy drinks.

 

Research money is being poured into science and technology, aiming to keep America the most developed country in the world. Projects in schools are attempting to make these fields more attractive to students, and University tuition is being subsidized for students with abilities but no means.

 

A new law has been passed that effectively bans new coal power plants, and makes it illegal to operate one starting in 2025.

 

OOC: Just to clear things up, is today 2011 or 2012?

 

Just so you know, I dibbed the USA about 4 posts before yours.

I'll post plans as to what I'm doing this year shortly, I'm at work right now and probably shouldn't be on tif at all :lol:

 

...

 

All my raeg

 

EDIT: Luxembourg then

[The_Mather1]

Population 5 226 475,00

 

Taxation $109 966 340 618,75

Export $128 177 104 255,50

Other $30 067 178 968,50

 

GDP $268 210 623 842,75

 

Budget $26 821 062 384,28

 

Saved 1 $25 530 550 775,00

Saved 2 $26 166 890 131,00