Why Do People Judge RS So Much Differently Than Other Video Games?

[Deletion]

You took a comment that was a clear generalization and not directed at your situation and replied with a sarcastic comment relating to your own circumstances. In my mind, that is making it personal.

 

I'll admit that I hadn't read over your previous posts and extrapolated your position. But given that the thread as about how Runescape is more of a time waste that other videogames, I don't think it was completely unjust. I assumed (incorrectly) that you were taking the position of saying Runescape IS more of a waste of time than other videogames, and applied my thoughts on the matter directly to you and I apologise.

 

Of course your welcome to your own opinions, and I don't completely disagree with you. Runescape is a grind-fest. The point I'm making (and not directed at you, but in general) is that because a person spends their time playing one game, it doesn't make this time any more wasted than playing a different game. Again, not directed at you, but a persons personal opinion on a hobby doesn't give someone the right to berate another person taking part in that hobby.

 

I'm sorry for replying as though you had attacked me personally.

[stonewall337]

Good on games like WoW/LoL requires practice, time, and knowledge. Good on RS just takes time really.

[Fallstar]

Practice comes through time, so that doesn't really matter. And the knowledge required for those games is also just acquired through time. There's nothing conceptually difficult in learning how to to play any MMO. Anyone can learn everything about the game - given enough time.

 

At least with RS you have interesting quests to do as a break from the grind, in many MMOs the quests are some of the worst parts of grinding.

[stonewall337]

It's not the same. Most people can only get so good at something even given time. It's why in a game like WOW you have so many bad players.

[Ginger_Warrior]

Agreed, and just linking stonewall's point about WoW back to my original point--those players in RuneScape who are bad get found pretty quickly when they play minigames or start Dungeoneering. Because those activities require something more than skill levels and expensive equipment.

[Randox]

I think MMO's in general have a negative rep, even compared to other forms of gaming.

 

Most people in lets say from 30 and down (the average age of gamers is someplace around there) play computer games, but the MMO's excepting WoW have never been mainstream (with the younger generations), at least not in North America or, as far as I know, Europe. So while the stigma for a lot of gaming is on the decline, MMO's seem to have been left as the 'weird' fringe games. The most accepted are the browser and app games (think iPhone and facebook), then you've got all your 'normal' games (racing, action, strategy, and so on), and then you have your fringe games like MMO's and most of the indie games, with the difference being that indie games lack most of the negative stereotypes that every other genre has been collecting for decades.

 

And I think at the end of the day, stereotypes are still a large part of it. As some genres become more mainstream, they shed some of their stereotypes (and if your an online multiplayer, especially with voice chat, add new ones). MMO's don't have enough of a presence I find to really shed any of the old stereotypes, so they just attached the new one about online communication and called it a day.

[Viv]

The mmo genre as a whole requires more time than most genres. Most of the magic from mmos comes from making friends, ect and many people don't just play it for entertainment but also with an escapist mentality. Instead of beating the game people make their own goals in the game.

 

The reason people judge rs worse than upcoming mmos is because of its age and many people have memories of it from long time ago but still current rs vs current new mmos rs is worse in most peoples opinions.

 

There is a stigma

I think MMO's in general have a negative rep, even compared to other forms of gaming.

 

Most people in lets say from 30 and down (the average age of gamers is someplace around there) play computer games, but the MMO's excepting WoW have never been mainstream (with the younger generations), at least not in North America or, as far as I know, Europe. So while the stigma for a lot of gaming is on the decline, MMO's seem to have been left as the 'weird' fringe games. The most accepted are the browser and app games (think iPhone and facebook), then you've got all your 'normal' games (racing, action, strategy, and so on), and then you have your fringe games like MMO's and most of the indie games, with the difference being that indie games lack most of the negative stereotypes that every other genre has been collecting for decades.

 

And I think at the end of the day, stereotypes are still a large part of it. As some genres become more mainstream, they shed some of their stereotypes (and if your an online multiplayer, especially with voice chat, add new ones). MMO's don't have enough of a presence I find to really shed any of the old stereotypes, so they just attached the new one about online communication and called it a day.

Yea people probably won't call someone a nerd for playing tetris or something but mmos have a much higher time investment.

 

Aren't indie games just combining a couple genres or part of a genre but with a type of developer that can try new things instead of just the same old?

 

Runescape also is a game widely tried but people don't put enough time to get into it or see that the large time investment ins't worth it. I have 15k hrs in this game did I waste it? Maybe. Generally Rs doesn't have as much action as other games 1k hrs on scape vs 1k hrs on another game would have a different feel. So if you are used to other types of games RS may not be your type of game.

[Tui]

Actual players of Runescape either know these things aren't true, don't care about them, or find them entertaining, whereas people with no to little experience with the game will judge it completely by how it outwardly appears: which is an outdated, skill-less, grind-fest.

I hate to break it to you, but actual players usually believe those things as a necessity to their continuation of the game. You don't see many contradicting opinions because those people, based on their opinions, have left. Also, you can't generalize all or most people who've quit as simply not having gotten far enough into the game to appreciate it.

[Deletion]

I hate to break it to you, but actual players usually believe those things as a necessity to their continuation of the game. You don't see many contradicting opinions because those people, based on their opinions, have left.

 

That doesn't disagree with what I said in the slightest.

 

Also, you can't generalize all or most people who've quit as simply not having gotten far enough into the game to appreciate it.

 

And this isn't relevant to anything I have said. I clearly stated that's how I believe "people with no to little experience" perceive the game. Yes, I skipped over the middle group who have played the game and quit, for what ever reason.

 

The thread is about why Runescape is looked down upon compared to other games, and I gave my thoughts as to why it is this way. I never said they were wrong, hell you're probably right. But don't kid yourself into thinking that your time spent playing other games is less wasted than my time spent on Runescape. Which is what the original post was trying to get across.

[Tui]

You didn't seem to understand my points, but whatever, you can easily argue that even among games some are better. There's the rl common interests argument to be made, along with certain games teaching certain skillsets to a small degree. These points are pretty trivial in the grand scheme of things. I do think there are much better escapism tactics than most games, so my main point in this thread, once again, is:

Even though lots of people aren't facing life much better than you, that's no excuse.

 

No, it's technically not the topic of this thread, but it's the obvious conclusion of such a discussion.

[chenw]

I don't think RS is getting picked on specifically, but rather the entire MMO is perceived rather 'poorly' from gamer's perspective, and RS is just an unfortunate scapegoat representative of the whole genre, probably not without reason.

 

This is what I believe to be the public opinion on MMO's (again, I stress this is entirely my perception).

 

We all know and love the concept of having a 'life' outside of cyberspace, many people take it very 'seriously', as in they want to be perceived as having a 'life' rather than having 'no-life' by staring at a computer/TV screen the whole day. While the exact definition (if it is actually definable) of the word 'life' and take it as it is, then you are consciously taking into account that you don't want to play 10+ hours a day (or can't), but still want to play a decent game without too much time invested (single player) or just simply kick some asses (Multiplayer), that leaves with pretty much every other game, except MMO's, due to MMO's massive time requirements (the exact amount varies, WoW and RS are two opposing ends of the spectrum here). Hence, MMO's are generally perceived as games that people who 'have no life/social skills/loners/other derogatory terms' play. 1 Down for MMO

 

Second, most MMO's involve getting high quality gear AND improving your play skill overtime, rather than just simply playskill for most other games, bar RPG, but even then the gear component of those isn't anywhere near as prominent as MMO's. But, people might see the game as 'Gear = win' games, when most of the time it isn't just about gear. But gear, unlike skill, is highly visible (IE as long as it looks 'OMFG!' gear, it is probably good gear), and notoriety of people selling their found/made gear online for cash have probably raised a perception that either they spent an insane amount of time getting those items, or paid a load of RL money for them, directly or indirectly. Neither of which were perceived positively. Why is this not an issue for other games? Because many games, getting gear is either trivial or just outright impossible (FPS being a prominent one), so only skill is left, not so for MMO's. 2 Down for MMO.

 

Lastly, MMO's generally can only be played on PC. PC gamer is, from my own experience, generally more shunned upon than console players (from outside of gamer society that is, inside it isn't such a big difference), why? Probably because PCs are associated with people like hackers, programmers, fat no-life gamers (the latter courtesy of the media) and other negative/derogatory things, when the reality is very different. Also, like some people have said: Consoles can be played from a sofa, which can fit several people, PC cannot (the anti-social argument).

 

My 2cents.

[Blutters]

RS really isn't a game I'd consider starting today. I don't recommend it to my friends, but they know I play and many have played it before. Few of them criticize(d) me for it, and I've used similar arguments to yours as retaliation (that other games are equal wastes of time (or just no argument at all lol idgaf mostly)). I do feel, as you mentioned, that RS has had some decent enough dividends that extend to my life, such as my now impressive typing speed, and an at-least basic economic understanding (which I might even say helped me in my college econ courses). I've often been inspired by the creativity that goes into the game's story and elements, and feel that it's helped me become a more creative writer. Lastly but certainly not least, if not for RS I would've never come to TIF, which means I would've never received the practice I have over the years from simply typing and expressing my opinions.

 

However, I can't defend the grinding. Thankfully I realized long ago (but, perhaps, not early enough) that grinding for XP (or MA ranks, or what have you) wasn't fun and didn't feel rewarding enough to justify it after a certain point, hence why I'm nearly a 10-year veteran without maxed skills.

The question then becomes, "Why am I still here?" And the answer is that RuneScape has original value that can't possibly be done justice by its specific vehicle of presentation. RS has and, hopefully, always will have its own style, theme, and lore that make it worth coming back to for me. It's simply the unfortunate case that that particular charm can't be easily understood or experienced just by looking at the game, and a great deal of RS's originality (read: fun) can't be experienced without climbing the strenuous walls of grind.

 

I still staunchly believe that the originality RS has could be transferred to an appropriate platform and made into a true work of art akin to say, Bioshock, or Dishonored, that goes far beyond a simple video game.

[Sylpheed]

Lastly, MMO's generally can only be played on PC. PC gamer is, from my own experience, generally more shunned upon than console players (from outside of gamer society that is, inside it isn't such a big difference), why? Probably because PCs are associated with people like hackers, programmers, fat no-life gamers (the latter courtesy of the media) and other negative/derogatory things, when the reality is very different. Also, like some people have said: Consoles can be played from a sofa, which can fit several people, PC cannot (the anti-social argument).

 

Going way off topic but I disagree with this. The gulf between console and PC players even within the community is pretty large. The reasons why PC gamers are perceived as super nerdy is because of elitism.

 

Obviously the media and the public love to exaggerate but stereotypes don't just appear out of nowhere. PC gamers are almost always hardcore, tech-savvy individuals who build their own custom spec PC's. All you have to do is visit a message board for any multi-platform release and you will see the kind of holier than thou attitude that a lot of them have.

[stonewall337]

Few reasons why.

 

1.) No good ways to judge the relative skill of players. To get high stats all you need is time, you don't even need to use that time well (Green098). To get good gear all you need is time. Or you can buy gear/skills or bot.

 

2.) The other line of being known as a "good" player is peer concensis. People like Woox are well known for being "pro" PVE'ers. People like ChrisArchie are known for making RS vids.

 

Games like WOW or league have far better ranking systems. Want to know how good you are at WOW? Do rated BGs, PVP, or PVE, and check your ELO, Parses on worldoflogs, or guild progress. Want to see how you compare to another warrior? Check worldoflogs and wowheroes. Want to see what rank your guild is? wow progress has you covered.

 

For league, check ELO. Easy enough and done.

 

RS is much more personal, where achievements are based on how you felt about them.

[The Sorrow]

I find myself agreeing with a lot of the posts on this thread. I'm a 10 year vet without maxed skills as well, simply because I normally cant stay focused long enough for the grind. I get that some people base their opinions on old stereotypes that a lot of the time are no longer true. True enough, there is a significant grind to get better at this game, and true the graphics arent great compared to some modern games, but in order to have those 1080p realistic graphics it would change the entire style of rs. RS isnt meant to be completely realistic. That being said there are massive improvements being made to the graphics, I'm personally really looking forward to the HTML5 update and what they choose to do with it.

 

Due to the stigma that seems to be attatched to RS I have personally kept it a secret that I play to everyone other than a select few who I really trust with that knowledge, and honestly I'd like to be able to tell more people, but until we can move past these stupid stereotypes of the "fat nolife gamer" that seems to be perpetuated by both the media and the community, I don't see it happening.

[Mercifull]

I don't keep it a secret from my friends that play but I find it amusing one particular friend who takes the piss out of me playing online games before going on championship manager every wakeable hour of the weekend.

[Travis D]

I think it's from personal experience and word of mouth. A lot of my friends from middle school who used to play rs and "moved on" will look down on rs or make fun of people who play it. That's how it is for people I know at least.

[Drazhor]

Yeah, most people I know IRL who played the game at one point have since then moved on; so they feel the need to look down on RS for being a 'childish game'.

Needless to say they still don't know that I play.

 

Although, to be fairly honest, I only really play for the community (Aka for TIF and the HYT noobs :P )

[Jonanananas]

A lot of posters here have commented on how Runescape doesn't take much skill, doesn't challenge you and how the only deciding factor is mostly time. They have a point with that, but I also feel like they're missing something. You don't have to play Runescape in that way.

 

Of course, there is no "right" way, and how I've spent my time on RS is probably quite different from your average player, but one of the biggest reasons Iike Runescape is how diverse it is. You can do so much different stuff from just grinding skills. If you just want to grind skills, there's nothing wrong with that. But if you criticize the game, it shouldn't be just on that topic, and honestly, I've never seen Runescape as a game made for competition. There are other games suited so much better for that, as really the only big deciding factor is indeed time.

 

I never enjoyed grinding and I never did much of it (usually just to get some quest requirement). When I did spend long hours training a skill which I didn't enjoy I regretted if afterwards, but that didn't really happen often. I've still very much enjoyed my time on Runescape and wouldn't hesitate to go back if I had the time.

[Platinum_Myr]

I think that there is quite a lot of good competition, and skill required to get best xp rates in many skills. Some of the best methods require insanely good APM and concentration.

 

But at first blush runescape looks simple and people don't see that diversity.

 

Also, you can't "beat" (max) runescape in a reasonable amount of time as you can on other games, which some people see as a detriment and others see as a wonderful feature.

[Ginger_Warrior]

A lot of posters here have commented on how Runescape doesn't take much skill, doesn't challenge you and how the only deciding factor is mostly time. They have a point with that, but I also feel like they're missing something. You don't have to play Runescape in that way.

 

Of course, there is no "right" way, and how I've spent my time on RS is probably quite different from your average player, but one of the biggest reasons Iike Runescape is how diverse it is. You can do so much different stuff from just grinding skills. If you just want to grind skills, there's nothing wrong with that. But if you criticize the game, it shouldn't be just on that topic, and honestly, I've never seen Runescape as a game made for competition. There are other games suited so much better for that, as really the only big deciding factor is indeed time.

 

I never enjoyed grinding and I never did much of it (usually just to get some quest requirement). When I did spend long hours training a skill which I didn't enjoy I regretted if afterwards, but that didn't really happen often. I've still very much enjoyed my time on Runescape and wouldn't hesitate to go back if I had the time.

OK, sure, but put evidence to that point. What is there to do in RuneScape that doesn't require me to have already ground my skills up to a certain benchmark level in order to ensure a reasonable amount of success?

[Viv]

runescape isnt something you broadcast to the world like i can say to almost anyone "omg im now addicted to kongregate" (more addicting than runescape) but If i said to anyone "omg im addicted to runescape" theyd be like "wierdo"

 

dungeoneering is only skillbased thing

[Platinum_Myr]

I've found that doing quests and daily activities and such can be quite fun and rewarding until you've done them all.

[Jonanananas]

A lot of posters here have commented on how Runescape doesn't take much skill, doesn't challenge you and how the only deciding factor is mostly time. They have a point with that, but I also feel like they're missing something. You don't have to play Runescape in that way.

 

Of course, there is no "right" way, and how I've spent my time on RS is probably quite different from your average player, but one of the biggest reasons Iike Runescape is how diverse it is. You can do so much different stuff from just grinding skills. If you just want to grind skills, there's nothing wrong with that. But if you criticize the game, it shouldn't be just on that topic, and honestly, I've never seen Runescape as a game made for competition. There are other games suited so much better for that, as really the only big deciding factor is indeed time.

 

I never enjoyed grinding and I never did much of it (usually just to get some quest requirement). When I did spend long hours training a skill which I didn't enjoy I regretted if afterwards, but that didn't really happen often. I've still very much enjoyed my time on Runescape and wouldn't hesitate to go back if I had the time.

OK, sure, but put evidence to that point. What is there to do in RuneScape that doesn't require me to have already ground my skills up to a certain benchmark level in order to ensure a reasonable amount of success?

 

Penguin hunting :P

 

Or, for a more widespread activity, questing(up to a point). There are a bunch of quests you can do without requirements and enough of those you will reach with not much effort. Or minigames.

 

Of course you'll have to train skills to get access to a lot of content. But that's not the point I wanted to make. What I wanted to say that it's perfectly possible to play Runescape without constant grinding. It undoubtedly is a part of it, but far from the whole, and I don't think it's exaclty fair to criticise RS for being a grindfest for the whole time. If you're fighting for highscore ranks it is, but you don't have to do that.

[Yoko Kurama]

My personal feeling is that part of the "prejudice" is justified. Stereotypes are rarely accurate or nice but there's usually a small kernel of truth to them. With regards to MMORPGs, the reason they are treated differently is because they are different, and different circumstances mandate different judgements. MMORPGs are inherently addictive, and the whole premise could be described as a life away from life.That's different from all the various other games because even though people may dash in packs slavishly waiting in line for the newest console game or whatever, and even though they might play it for several hours daily following the purchase, eventually there's an end to it, there's a finite amount of content, and it's sort of easy to leave. With MMORPGs, that's just not the case. Also the widespread addiction to MMORPGs in certain countries and all the "horror stories" from psychiatrists/parents probably doesn't do the game much favours. So naturally people who are on the outside, when they view us, they can sort of pick the signs and it's somewhat disturbing to them.

 

What I have described above is the reason that people harbour some sort of have some social prejudice against RS, if you're talking about why other gamers don't like them, well there're reasons for that too. The time commitment, lack of relative skill, repetitiveness, delayed gratification, historically inferior graphics; mind you some of these reasons are why I actually like ​the game, so I guess it's just a matter of different tastes.

 

Mind you, I am not at all saying that RS players are losers or whatever, I know quite a few people who are maxed, yet have great jobs, social lives, and are very fit physically and emotionally. But a certain amount of RS players(perhaps a minority) have serious issues that either stem from as a result of their interaction with the game or are exacerbated, and these are the sort of people that receive attention on the outside and their experiences are rightly or wrongly extrapolated into generalizations.