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Runescape Dying? [Discussion/Observation]


Pat_61
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Well yeah the tutorials would just cover the basics with more advanced ones being as brief as possible.

 

My idea was more centred around the fact of breaking it up so it's not a massive ass tutorial that tries to show you everything in one go; instead you have the basic guidance that to access when you please OR it'll pop up the first time you go to use a skill.

 

As in you do not remotely see a mining tutorial at all unless you click in to it or when you go to mine your first rock it'll pop up and give you an overview of the process.

 

Would offer the freedom to explore and learn as you please, with the little nudge of a tutorial as and when you come to use a skill with the possibility of extra tutorial fragments at later points to cover more breadth of the skill that becomes relevant.

 

Ergo the lvl 6 hunter tutorial would introduce some of the other basic hunting types and the fact there are other areas just to add to what the basic burthorpe f2p polar area explained.

A level 6 farming tutorial could just cover that there are other types of patches for different uses.

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Well yeah the tutorials would just cover the basics with more advanced ones being as brief as possible.

 

My idea was more centred around the fact of breaking it up so it's not a massive ass tutorial that tries to show you everything in one go; instead you have the basic guidance that to access when you please OR it'll pop up the first time you go to use a skill.

 

As in you do not remotely see a mining tutorial at all unless you click in to it or when you go to mine your first rock it'll pop up and give you an overview of the process.

 

Would offer the freedom to explore and learn as you please, with the little nudge of a tutorial as and when you come to use a skill with the possibility of extra tutorial fragments at later points to cover more breadth of the skill that becomes relevant.

 

Ergo the lvl 6 hunter tutorial would introduce some of the other basic hunting types and the fact there are other areas just to add to what the basic burthorpe f2p polar area explained.

A level 6 farming tutorial could just cover that there are other types of patches for different uses.

 

A breif explination that theres more out there will do. As you said on the end. That seems a good way to go about teaching them theres more out there. And nudging them to exploration to find and level to get there.

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...People really hate the tutorial we have now?

 

It explains everything, directs you to skill guides, and gives you a good preface to each skill while being a part of the actual game lore.

 

If people don't like the trail system it exibits, it's really no different than the flashing arrow we had on the minimap directing us through tutorial island. I really don't understand how people can hate the tutorial we have now when it's such an improvement on what we had before, both with function and immersion.

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The tutorial itself isn't all that bad. My son just went through it (with no help from me, and he's never played before) and rather enjoyed it, especially the 'let them eat pie' quest. The problem is combat, the academy really doesn't explain much so I had to explain the basics of it to him. They really need to rework that so it explains things better.

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I don't dislike the tutorial we have atm; I think it does do a good job for all bar combat.

However I do see how it is a bit too much and having ALLLLLLLL that in one go can be overwhelming and just leave people confused, hence my idea about breaking it down so you get the tutorial as and when you go to that skill.

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Operation Gold Sparkles :: Chompy Kills ::  Full Profound :: Champions :: Barbarian Notes :: Champions Tackle Box :: MA Rewards

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Both Tutorial Island and Troll Warzone share the same problem. They were long and made you do everything at once. That's the only problem I see them suffer from. But aside from nostalgia, I guess people prefer Tutorial Island because it didn't immediately throw you into a story you feel you need to follow. It was just "This does that, and here is some text as to why this happens and what you need it for." Also, there were no P2P skills in Tutorial Island.

 

It's nice they have to option to allow you to skip the thing entirely, but I much prefer Sy's idea of breaking it up into chunks. An NPC comes along and you ask him where you are. He tell you you are on Gielinor, or better known as Runescape...

 

Player: "What is Runescape."

NPC: "The world, what else?"

Player: "But what excatly is this world."

NPC: "A world created by a god where all types of mortals live, interact and go on adventures"

 

At that point you have a series of options where if you ask him what you can do he gives a explanation skills and moving and friends and such, then points you to try a random generated task or keep talking to him. Or you could ask him about adventures and he explains quest and/or the task system, to which he points you to your first quest, or to continue talking to him, and so on...when an individual tutorial pops up, you can view/do it or skip it and even return to skill adviser to repeat it if you want. Or at the very beginning you could tell the NPC "I think I've done this all before", to which Jagex can throw in some witty breaking the forth wall type humor, throw you a skill lamp or two as you would have gotten and send you on your way.

 

Of course I also feel Jagex needs to do a bit better on the combat tutorial.

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Well but it is broken up into chunks. There's nothing stopping you from doing other things and coming back to the Troll Warzone tutorial. That's why they've got separate chapters. Did they change that when they made it f2p, or what?

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Well but it is broken up into chunks. There's nothing stopping you from doing other things and coming back to the Troll Warzone tutorial. That's why they've got separate chapters. Did they change that when they made it f2p, or what?

No. You can stop and go off to do other things at pretty much any point.

 

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THE place for all free players to connect, hang out and talk about how awesome it is to be F2P.

So, Kaida is the real version of every fictional science-badass? That explains a lot, actually...

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Well but it is broken up into chunks. There's nothing stopping you from doing other things and coming back to the Troll Warzone tutorial. That's why they've got separate chapters. Did they change that when they made it f2p, or what?

No. You can stop and go off to do other things at pretty much any point.

 

But how would a new player know this. Would they feel that had to do what they are saying. Its harder to vision how a person would first feel entering runescape.

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Well but it is broken up into chunks. There's nothing stopping you from doing other things and coming back to the Troll Warzone tutorial. That's why they've got separate chapters. Did they change that when they made it f2p, or what?

No. You can stop and go off to do other things at pretty much any point.

 

But how would a new player know this. Would they feel that had to do what they are saying. Its harder to vision how a person would first feel entering runescape.

 

^ This

 

Nothing actually prevents you from leaving and doing other stuff but nothing actually tells you that you can either.

Without fore knowledge the way it is constructed makes it feel very much as though you have to keep going til you hit the end because that is what you are told to do at each stage and traditionally you can't skip tutorials.

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Operation Gold Sparkles :: Chompy Kills ::  Full Profound :: Champions :: Barbarian Notes :: Champions Tackle Box :: MA Rewards

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If people are explicitly told they can skip the tutorial, most will and it won't help player retention either. The tutorial reaches a compromise by leaving it up to the player by how its structured: we must choose to start the next chapter, we see Ozan specifically mention going to Draynor during the opening sequence, we're taught about world map usage, etc.

 

It's set up to allow the player to explore or stick with an on-rails tutorial using the trail system.

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Why not compromise, and offer a very basic combat abd skilling tutorial, with optional tutors for more advanced stuff?

 

I think that is what Sy was getting at. Tell the new player what they need to know right now, then as they explore and decided to try, say mining, an option for a tutorial appears.

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"Goals dont have a deadline." -xxxgod quoting Lady Shahdie

[slayer "Essentials"][click pic for main blog][click quote for mini blog][Worthwhile Auras]

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Why not compromise, and offer a very basic combat abd skilling tutorial, with optional tutors for more advanced stuff?

 

I think that is what Sy was getting at. Tell the new player what they need to know right now, then as they explore and decided to try, say mining, an option for a tutorial appears.

 

Very much so, to me for the initial tutorial all you really need is:

1) Moving, camera controls and world map

2) Brief overview of skills as in covering the basic types of skills (gatherer, artisan, combat, support) and what sort of things they offer

3) Basic overview of combat (classes, weaknesses, idea of abilities with emphasis on momentum)

4) Friends list, clan chats that sort of thing.

 

Then later tutorials as you go to use a skill can cover the details of the mining process and pickaxes or w/e.

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Operation Gold Sparkles :: Chompy Kills ::  Full Profound :: Champions :: Barbarian Notes :: Champions Tackle Box :: MA Rewards

Dragonkin Journals :: Ports Stories :: Elder Chronicles :: Boss Slayer :: Penance King :: Kal'gerion Titles :: Gold Statue

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Well but it is broken up into chunks. There's nothing stopping you from doing other things and coming back to the Troll Warzone tutorial. That's why they've got separate chapters. Did they change that when they made it f2p, or what?

No. You can stop and go off to do other things at pretty much any point.

 

But how would a new player know this. Would they feel that had to do what they are saying. Its harder to vision how a person would first feel entering runescape.

This is an example.

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Well but it is broken up into chunks. There's nothing stopping you from doing other things and coming back to the Troll Warzone tutorial. That's why they've got separate chapters. Did they change that when they made it f2p, or what?

No. You can stop and go off to do other things at pretty much any point.

 

But how would a new player know this. Would they feel that had to do what they are saying. Its harder to vision how a person would first feel entering runescape.

This is an example.

 

Its odd that he went to an outside source for help. But then again he maybe a regular reddit user and is comftable on there for gaming discussion.

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[hide]

Well but it is broken up into chunks. There's nothing stopping you from doing other things and coming back to the Troll Warzone tutorial. That's why they've got separate chapters. Did they change that when they made it f2p, or what?

No. You can stop and go off to do other things at pretty much any point.

 

But how would a new player know this. Would they feel that had to do what they are saying. Its harder to vision how a person would first feel entering runescape.

This is an example.

 

Its odd that he went to an outside source for help. But then again he maybe a regular reddit user and is comftable on there for gaming discussion.

[/hide]

 

Not so much, at least I don't think. For me, my help would have been to turn to the all mighty Google and searched Runescape help. Hell, that's how I found about Tip it. I wanted to learn more about mining, and I didn't know how to use Jagex's site other than logging in at the time.

 

 

[hide]

Why not compromise, and offer a very basic combat abd skilling tutorial, with optional tutors for more advanced stuff?

 

I think that is what Sy was getting at. Tell the new player what they need to know right now, then as they explore and decided to try, say mining, an option for a tutorial appears.

 

Very much so, to me for the initial tutorial all you really need is:

1) Moving, camera controls and world map

2) Brief overview of skills as in covering the basic types of skills (gatherer, artisan, combat, support) and what sort of things they offer

3) Basic overview of combat (classes, weaknesses, idea of abilities with emphasis on momentum)

4) Friends list, clan chats that sort of thing.

 

Then later tutorials as you go to use a skill can cover the details of the mining process and pickaxes or w/e.

[/hide]

 

I would also like to ask, at what point should new players learn about NIS? Right then and there, or do we get them to use the default layout a bit?

29386_s.gif

"Goals dont have a deadline." -xxxgod quoting Lady Shahdie

[slayer "Essentials"][click pic for main blog][click quote for mini blog][Worthwhile Auras]

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[hide]

Well but it is broken up into chunks. There's nothing stopping you from doing other things and coming back to the Troll Warzone tutorial. That's why they've got separate chapters. Did they change that when they made it f2p, or what?

No. You can stop and go off to do other things at pretty much any point.

 

But how would a new player know this. Would they feel that had to do what they are saying. Its harder to vision how a person would first feel entering runescape.

This is an example.

 

Its odd that he went to an outside source for help. But then again he maybe a regular reddit user and is comftable on there for gaming discussion.

[/hide]

 

Not so much, at least I don't think. For me, my help would have been to turn to the all mighty Google and searched Runescape help. Hell, that's how I found about Tip it. I wanted to learn more about mining, and I didn't know how to use Jagex's site other than logging in at the time.

 

 

[hide]

Why not compromise, and offer a very basic combat abd skilling tutorial, with optional tutors for more advanced stuff?

 

I think that is what Sy was getting at. Tell the new player what they need to know right now, then as they explore and decided to try, say mining, an option for a tutorial appears.

 

Very much so, to me for the initial tutorial all you really need is:

1) Moving, camera controls and world map

2) Brief overview of skills as in covering the basic types of skills (gatherer, artisan, combat, support) and what sort of things they offer

3) Basic overview of combat (classes, weaknesses, idea of abilities with emphasis on momentum)

4) Friends list, clan chats that sort of thing.

 

Then later tutorials as you go to use a skill can cover the details of the mining process and pickaxes or w/e.

[/hide]

 

I would also like to ask, at what point should new players learn about NIS? Right then and there, or do we get them to use the default layout a bit?

 

Oh hot damn. I forgot about a NIS tutorial. Even more complex :')

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Its odd that he went to an outside source for help. But then again he maybe a regular reddit user and is comftable on there for gaming discussion.

 

In 04 it would've been odd but now adays its not, because the whole internet community has massively changed. If I started a game infamous for being complicated like Eve online I would probably ask a neutral forum site what I need to know and if its worth playing.

 

I think it would be based off the player. If easily frustrated they'll likely leave. If they like to give things a good go they'll google.

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I think it would be based off the player. If easily frustrated they'll likely leave. If they like to give things a good go they'll google.

That's sort of the heart of the casual/hardcore divide. Do you want a game that's fun from the start or one that's only fun after you invest lots of time in it?

 

Scape seems to have gone from the former to the latter, but has almost no few resources for newer players.

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I think it would be based off the player. If easily frustrated they'll likely leave. If they like to give things a good go they'll google.

That's sort of the heart of the casual/hardcore divide. Do you want a game that's fun from the start or one that's only fun after you invest lots of time in it?

 

Scape seems to have gone from the former to the latter, but has almost no few resources for newer players.

 

From the start, the game skills and quests should be made interesting. As time goes by they'll naturaly encounter and research the rest. Such as boss' and minigames.

 

It needs to be simple so that it gets people straight into the world whilst giving them the basics on what to do.

 

Its based off someone with a mindset that doesnt know anything, he doesnt know if its a game he will be playing for years on end.

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I started playing scape in 2004, and while I dislike the periodic 'RS is dying' dramas as much as the next guy, I don't think it's ever been closer to being true than now. I stopped playing regularly about 3 years ago (blame league of legends), and since then I feel like I've watched the average number of players online decrease slowly but continuously. Some of that is the removal of bots of course, but it used to make it to 200k at peak times (summer, evening). Right now it's summertime and there's like 50k people online; the most populous world has 1100 people in it. There's like 3 worlds over 1000. There were a lot of bots, but I'm pretty sure they didn't constitute the majority across the entire game. I would argue that the population drop also has a lot to do with people not wanting to play scape anymore.

 

I think people left for a lot of reasons: better free/cheap games, the removal of the successful PvP system (by the time it came back the community was largely gone), and a long period of time without many interesting updates. It felt like for multiple years Jagex was just trying to provide adequate replacements for the old Wilderness (volcano bounty hunter, clan wars, pvp servers, bounty hunter pvp servers, removal of pvp servers blah blah), and as a result worked really hard on content that really didn't satisfy the old pvp customers. As a result, people not interested in PvP, but rather quests and monster hunting (myself) went a long time without much new content (corp beast and nex were 2.5 years apart) and eventually moved on.

 

Jagex's new business model seems to be: small customer base, get lots of money per customer, instead of the old have a massive number of members all paying a little bit. Even though they're still making a lot of money, ultimately I don't see that ending well because you can't count on someone to shell out tons of money forever - they will need to recruit new players, and so far as I can see they aren't, really. The F2P is massively outclassed by other F2P games and they really need to spend time on it to make it competitive. Until then the attrition will continue.

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I started playing scape in 2004, and while I dislike the periodic 'RS is dying' dramas as much as the next guy, I don't think it's ever been closer to being true than now. I stopped playing regularly about 3 years ago (blame league of legends), and since then I feel like I've watched the average number of players online decrease slowly but continuously. Some of that is the removal of bots of course, but it used to make it to 200k at peak times (summer, evening). Right now it's summertime and there's like 50k people online; the most populous world has 1100 people in it. There's like 3 worlds over 1000. There were a lot of bots, but I'm pretty sure they didn't constitute the majority across the entire game. I would argue that the population drop also has a lot to do with people not wanting to play scape anymore. ...

 

 

As I post:

 

36,523 Players Online

 

In all fairness, this is probably the deadest part of the day.

 

The people who are left must be spending a considerable of money above and beyond membership for all that eye candy.

 

To sum it up:

 

The community as we all knew it is dead.

 

The game may or may not be dying (it depends on how much money the remaining people are spending on nicknacks and other stuff via microtransactions).

 

Jagex lives on.

PvP is not for me

In the 3rd Year of the Boycott
Real-world money saved since FT/W: Hundreds of Dollars
Real-world time saved since FT/W: Thousands of Hours

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