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Miss Lioness

24 March 2014 - Fate of the Gods

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But that's the thing about it all. His goal never changed. He isn't going to build an empire this time by direct force, but he's still going to HAVE an empire, it'll just be that instead of people being forced or brainwashed into thinking that what he believes the world should be like by an oppressive mortal run regime, he's just going to make it so that the world IS what he believes, by changing the rules of the world to reflect that. There will be nobody to actually CHALLENGE HIM on his beliefs, ever, if he ousts all of the gods/strips them of any effective power and is the only one remaining in power. If any mortal ever goes against what he thinks should be right, they'll be made into an example by the world itself, because that's what he'll be controlling. (This is indicated by his stance on what to do with Sliske.) Everything in it will slowly become his own dollhouse, because they will have no choice in the matter.

 

Regardless of his intent, if he never has anybody who can challenge his beliefs on an even footing, then if he ever makes another huge mistake, there will be nothing to allow him to fix it until it is too late, and the mortals on Gielinor will pay the price, like so many others.

 

edit: i'm pretty sure the door puzzle is the same every time, because there's really no reason why it would be randomized

 


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Question inside[hide]i may have not seen it here or may have missed it in the chat options, was there a reason for may giving rise to zaros and seren? Was it just for giggles/ making a new elder artifact or was it some other reason?[/hide]

 

~~~legoman187~~~

 

 

 

Mah has a fractured and child-like mind and was left alone beneath the earth presumed dead by her sisters. After clawing her way to the surface and finding herself alone she made Zaros and Seren in her own image for companionship (both Zaros and Seren seem to agree on this) though Seren saw it more as a duty of care where as Zaros saw it as being her toys and wanted out.

 

It is also heavily implied the Mahajaratt's origin is that Mah missed Zaros and was trying to create a replacement, but lacked the strength to do so creating this lesser species.

 

 

 

 

But that's the thing about it all. His goal never changed. He isn't going to build an empire this time by direct force, but he's still going to HAVE an empire, it'll just be that instead of people being forced or brainwashed into thinking that what he believes the world should be like by an oppressive mortal run regime, he's just going to make it so that the world IS what he believes, by changing the rules of the world to reflect that. There will be nobody to actually CHALLENGE HIM on his beliefs, ever, if he ousts all of the gods and is the only one remaining in power. If any mortal ever goes against what he thinks should be right, they'll be made into an example by the world itself, because that's what he'll be controlling. (This is indicated by his stance on what to do with Sliske.) Everything in it will slowly become his own dollhouse, because they will have no choice in the matter.

 

Regardless of his intent, if he never has anybody who can challenge his beliefs on an even footing, then if he ever makes another huge mistake, there will be nothing to allow him to fix it until it is too late, and the mortals on Gielinor will pay the price, like so many others.

 

edit: i'm pretty sure the door puzzle is the same every time, because there's really no reason why it would be randomized

 

But he doesn't want to oust the other gods. He specifically states he just wants to bring them to heel, stop them fighting and causing destruction. He even says he'd like them to be his envoys if they'd listen and he does not say anything about altering the rules of the world at all. Simply nudging people from behind the scenes where needed leaving us to live as we do now doing as we please.

 
He doesn't remotely say or imply he's gonna outright change the world or forcibly control us, just going to help the stronger continue to grow so they can become something more.


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He words it that way because he believes that all of his actions are to the benefit of mortals, but the past seems to indicate that the ends don't always go as he planned, and some of those alternate cases have resulted in massive tragedies. How much subtle tweaking is too much subtle tweaking? Even in the quest log, the way that his "aid" is described vaguely sounds like he's engineered your entire series of actions to work the most in his favor, instead of considering that maybe your choice should have meant something? (For more details, watch The Truman Show.)

 

The way he talks about the other gods, it sounds like he is referring to them as his projects. If they come around to his point of view, great! If not, he'll just have to convince them somehow. He won't stop. Ever. If they cannot be convinced, then I guess it's just too bad if they die, right? No big deal. Everything in the name of progress. Progress cannot be questioned.

 

Should any being have the right to play god? What if this being is fallible?

 


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He words it that way because he believes that all of his actions are to the benefit of mortals, but the past seems to indicate that the ends don't always go as he planned, and some of those alternate cases have resulted in massive tragedies. How much subtle tweaking is too much subtle tweaking? Even in the quest log, the way that his "aid" is described vaguely sounds like he's engineered your entire series of actions to work the most in his favor, instead of considering that maybe your choice should have meant something? (For more details, watch The Truman Show.)

 

Should any being have the right to play god? What if this being is fallible?

 

 

You did have a meaningful choice. You had the choice to sabotage Zaros' return, or not do the quest at all, in which case he wouldn't return. 

 

As for whether any being should have that right, that seems like an uninteresting discussion. He's powerful enough to do, and that's really all that matters. He has never claimed to be infallible, but obviously he is intelligent and learned, and a keen observer. As for controlling things, he seems to suggest that he would basically watch from the shadows, and if things go wrong he will subtly step in as a corrective measure, or perhaps he will help mortals unleash their potential (like how he taught them agriculture during his rule in the 2nd Age). Doesn't seem sinister. He mentions that he doesn't even want to do this to everyone ('not all will heed my call, and not all will have to'). 

 

He is trying to save the world and possibly the galaxy from destruction and advocate on behalf of mortals - that seems like a far more important and noble thing to do than the younger gods, who are mostly involved in petty things like conquest, spreading their influence, gaining power, and what not...

 

One thing that is weird is that, if the threat Zaros describes is true, it sort of makes the younger gods and the god wars sort of look trivial and puts that in the background. Not sure how I feel about that. It also makes Guthix look stupid if he didn't have knowledge of this. He referred to the Elder Gods with some level of ignorance, and sort of appeared as if he was trying to carry on their project of perfecting the world. If they are destructive beings after all this time, it makes Guthix look stupid...

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If you do attempt to sabotage his return, it is likely that he would rely on all of his significantly powerful minions to shame you for making that choice (engineered consequence of his design, hint hint), plus doing so doesn't actually STOP him from returning, it just makes his goal slightly harder. The gamble vs the payoff (convincing you, the one being that he has zero ability to control directly (save for the elder gods, and I guess Seren) and the overseer of the planet he is attempting to gain control of, and the one being who is apparently able to survive being harmed by an elder god without being shattered into your component pieces) is actually a more vital part of his plan than a lot of other things. Turning the choice into a zero sum game for you is pretty good odds for him.

 

I believe that this is also why the decision to allow him to enter your body is impressed upon so vigorously by the dialogue choices (and why they would specifically create a situation that gives you that choice, with a clear incentive for making it in his favor with no readily apparent reason why you shouldn't do it), and why it is specifically noted in your quest journal. It might actually have some sort of consequence later on.

 

But like he says, you have to live with your choices, and move forward regardless of the outcome, so even if this does result in a bad consequence later on, you'll probably have some means to overcome it, as difficult as it may be.


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:thumbsup: At last...

 

Bakriminel needs moar buff pls :'(

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Sway all day, Butterfly flaps all the way!  tumblr_inline_mp4i2qAGS11qz4rgp.gif

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They did buff it but it could use more of it, yes

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Really enjoyed this quest. Was shorter than i expected, had a few fun combat moments, some fun puzzles.

Thanks to Gwyn for helping me on a few parts i got stuck on :D

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Inb4 the Elder Gods are actually Gielinor itself, just all huddled together to make a planet.


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If anyone is testing Bane ammo and wants to post results please do :P...

 

Haven't done the quest :$


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divine fishing locations are neat. I'll be waiting on a decent video guide to try the new quest


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Bane bolts are pretty crap, t75-80 apparently, but it might do more damage with ascension bows over Royal xbow. :wall:


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divine fishing locations are neat. I'll be waiting on a decent video guide to try the new quest

 

 

It is super straight forward, so there is practically no need for a guide. The only thing that a guide would do is ruin the experience of the dialogue, which I'm assuming that you really don't care about.


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“I had a feeling we weren’t coming back from this fight when it began.”

“Do you have any regrets?”

“I don’t. It seems surprising, I know, but I wouldn’t change a thing. This is how it was meant to be.”

“Huh, you never really notice how lovely the day is until you realize you’ll never see it again.”

“Mmmhmm.”

 

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I have yet to find these divine fishing locations. :s

 

 

They aren't locations in the world like the divination training areas, but are just a new type of what is called divine locations, like herb patches, divine rocks, trees, hunting boxes, etc.

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There is an "Earn" button on Solomon's store. "Click on the 'Earn' button to earn RuneCoins by watching adverts, completing surveys and shopping online."

That should be interesting Jagex....


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There is an "Earn" button on Solomon's store. "Click on the 'Earn' button to earn RuneCoins by watching adverts, completing surveys and shopping online

 

and instaling adware, spyware on your PC

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Silmarilli.pngSilmarils_Hc.png

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There is an "Earn" button on Solomon's store. "Click on the 'Earn' button to earn RuneCoins by watching adverts, completing surveys and shopping online

 

and instaling adware, spyware on your PC
the main point of the surveys lol

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I just do them in a sandboxed linux vm.

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Quest guide released. http://www.tip.it/runescape/news/view/3002-fate-of-the-gods-quest-guide

If you have any feedback or helpful extra info for the guide, please let us know! :)

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Want to help the Tip.It Crew? Visit the Website Updates & Corrections forum!

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At first I was like "how did you find out that the last Elder God is named Bik??????"

 

And then I realised it was posted on the Jagex wiki -__________-


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I guess Dramen isn't an elder god then

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I guess Dramen isn't an elder god then

 

Well, Dramen really couldn't have been the name anyway, right? It would have had to have been something like "Dra" due to the 3 letter naming convention.

 

It is kind of funny that Michelle just went and revealed that, probably without realizing it wasn't revealed yet, since originally it was supposed to have been revealed by the sleeper.


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i'm more concerned about this alleged "Great Revision" and this talk of "cycles". sounds like the universe is soon to be destroyed and reborn

 

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