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Was it really EoC that ruined RuneScape?


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#41
HunterDexter
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Given the nature of the PVPcommunity: I'm glad they are mostly gone now.

Given the nature of the effiency crowd, i'm glad how Jagex made it all much too easy now.

 

Really? After a long day you don't love to unwind with a few other people? Shame man, minigames and free for all is so much fun. 

 

 

Nope, don't like getting screamed at just because I owned them in combat. I don't want to know what they've supposed to have done to my mother, what I should do with their genitals, how much I know how to hack into their computer/Jagex computers. And certainly don't want their entitlement that all RuneScape is about is PVP and thus everything should be catered to them when they start crying.

 

I do love minigames, but I don't like the macho-crybaby culture involved within the PVP scene.



#42
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That's just competitive gaming.



#43
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Concidering 80% of the pole wanted legacy. I would say EoC contributed heavily to people abandoning the game.

The people who voted for legacy != 100% of the people who quit because of EoC.

If the poll was for completely replacing EoC with Legacy mode, the results would have been much more different, mind you.

 

 

 

Completely agree. Voted for legacy because I didn't see the harm in it and many people would enjoy having it. I however like EOC and have no intention of really using legacy. Saying 80% voted for it is not the same as 80% wanted to use it and definitely isn't the same as 80% think EOC ruined the game.

 

80% wanting it a year later AND without quitters votes is pretty big... I also did NOT say that was the statistic to how many people didnt want/left because legacy. Its a good guide line though. its the only honest figure we know.

 

The fact a combat beta had to happen is a great indicator that they messed up big time.

 

You ignore the pre eoc side of it and and manipulate facts to suit your opinion. In reality theres both sides of the story. The polls during the eoc beta were clearly maniplutive in what was being asked.

 

If the poll was to completely remove it, I expect it to be a big poll like the freetrade/wild was.



#44
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Given the nature of the PVPcommunity: I'm glad they are mostly gone now.

Given the nature of the effiency crowd, i'm glad how Jagex made it all much too easy now.

 

Really? After a long day you don't love to unwind with a few other people? Shame man, minigames and free for all is so much fun. 

 

 

Nope, don't like getting screamed at just because I owned them in combat. I don't want to know what they've supposed to have done to my mother, what I should do with their genitals, how much I know how to hack into their computer/Jagex computers. And certainly don't want their entitlement that all RuneScape is about is PVP and thus everything should be catered to them when they start crying.

 

I do love minigames, but I don't like the macho-crybaby culture involved within the PVP scene.

 

Theres idiots everywhere, not just PVP. Dont go judging people. I don't assume every black guy steals watermelons because its their life and soul and I don't expect every PVPer is an a hole that has his way with alot of mothers. When opinions conflict you all get crybaby culture. Me, you. This threads full of it.



#45
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You don't get it; 80% isn't 80% of people who want it, it's 80% of people composed of people who want it and people who simply don't mind it.

#46
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You ignore the pre eoc side of it and and manipulate facts to suit your opinion. In reality theres both sides of the story. The polls during the eoc beta were clearly maniplutive in what was being asked.

Can you follow your own advice?



#47
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10k players, especially those with pure accounts that got "ruined" or made useless by EoC, can be much more than 30k accounts.

When I took a 2 year hiatus from RS it would show 8 accounts leaving the game as well as 20-30 page views/day. I'm not saying there aren't a few other variables I left out nor do I deny over-simplifying the issue.

 

But take a moment in my shoes:

Keep in mind this game has been "dying" since the "economy crisis" of 2003.

It's been "dying" since the transition to RS2.

It's been "dying" since the release of "useless monkeysink/no thought/useless skills" like Construction and Slayer.

It's been "dying" since Godwars/Dclaws/PvM-centric gameplay.

It's been "dying" since the removal of the Wilderness in 2007.

It's been "dying" since the introduction of Bounty Hunter.

It's been "dying" since Bounty Hunter was removed.

It's been "dying" since Free Trade was re-introduced.

It's been "dying" since EoC landed.

 

 

It's been "dying" for a goddamn long time - and some of us are just sick of hearing the wild theories behind why. Here's the truth starting from 2005:

 

Nearly all MMO's have taken a hit. The next generation of players simply aren't patient enough for MMO's and play immediate gratification games like Meatboy or Angry Birds where levels are a few minutes long - not a few days of grinding.

 

There is more competition in "fast action" games like Battlefield or Call of Duty as well that give a "better thrill" than Runescape PvP. This isn't 2003~2006 where consoles still kinda sucked to play online with (PS2 was mostly racing games, Xbox live was shoddy)

 

The PS3 was released in late 2006. Xbox 360 was released in late 2005. The funny thing about RS's largest "downhill trend" was the new competition from the 360 and PS3 in 2006-2007 as the consoles started gaining a larger consumer base. Whenever a new major title is released for a console - Runescape takes a small hit in players for a week or two while everyone is playing those games.

 

There is simply a lot more competition resulting in less growth of a new playerbase. The game still gets new players (I see them quite often on one of my noob accounts!) but that number is a lot less than in 2004-2005. As older players leave the game, getting busy with college, family, or just bored with the game after 8-10~ years of playing - that huge influx of players from 2004-2006 are finally leaving the game.

 

The 2004-2006 players simply aren't being replaced as quickly as they had joined. This isn't something to be overly worried about. It's actually quite expected and seems to be stabled out. It's less than in 2004-2006 but with increased competition and less young player interest (due to more instant gratification or faster paced games being out) that should be expected.

 

 

 

When Jagex is making more money per year than they've ever made in the past - having less players isn't TOO big of a deal because those players are paying Jagex more money than older players.

 

1) They aren't paying "grandfathered" membership prices.

2) They are buying SGS items, Runecoins, Spins, and Bonds in quite large amounts.

 

I've paid over what I would have paid Jagex in an entire year in the past just buying spins once for the Farming outfit. That means just on me alone they've increased their profits by 200%. Another friend of mine has spent $350~ in spins in the past 6 months. Considering they used to only make $60/month off this player - that's nearly a what.. 700% profit? And it isn't even the end of the year yet. 

 

e:

Some typos fixed.


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#48
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It's quite modest compared to the self-destructive community in Tekken. Ofcourse that's a game where every mistake and misstep you make, you get punished and thus with this knowledge you go on. Then again I feed on the souls of children and their anger.

 

x'D


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#49
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Given the nature of the PVPcommunity: I'm glad they are mostly gone now.

Given the nature of the effiency crowd, i'm glad how Jagex made it all much too easy now.

Really? After a long day you don't love to unwind with a few other people? Shame man, minigames and free for all is so much fun.
Nope, don't like getting screamed at just because I owned them in combat. I don't want to know what they've supposed to have done to my mother, what I should do with their genitals, how much I know how to hack into their computer/Jagex computers. And certainly don't want their entitlement that all RuneScape is about is PVP and thus everything should be catered to them when they start crying.

I do love minigames, but I don't like the macho-crybaby culture involved within the PVP scene.
I think you're just too sensitive to participate in competitive activities. It's human nature to be aggressive under such circumstances.

I'm not naturally a competitive person but I would always trash talk my opponents in PvP simply because I knew that certain people were inexperienced and/or too sensitive, and trash talking throws them off and makes them a lot easier to dominate

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#50
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I think you're just too sensitive to participate in competitive activities. It's human nature to be aggressive under such circumstances.

You'll see the same thing in competitive Pokemon: a game that, by its very nature, requires you to turn in your Man Cardtm

 

:twss:



#51
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I think you're just too sensitive to participate in competitive activities. It's human nature to be aggressive under such circumstances.

You'll see the same thing in competitive Pokemon: a game that, by its very nature, requires you to turn in your Man Cardtm

:twss:

I'll trade my man card for a 1st edition charizard any day.

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#52
HunterDexter
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I think you're just too sensitive to participate in competitive activities. It's human nature to be aggressive under such circumstances.

 

 

Might be, I play because I can relax, not to get insulted constantly. I think most non-PVPers would feel the same way.



#53
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I think you're just too sensitive to participate in competitive activities. It's human nature to be aggressive under such circumstances.

Might be, I play because I can relax, not to get insulted constantly. I think most non-PVPers would feel the same way.
If your goal is to relax then you should stay far away from competitive activities. Dangerous PvP is like, the opposite of relaxing lol.

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#54
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Put chat off

 

Put TS on

 

ahh, the good life

 

Been insulted everywhere, I should quit all my activities if that's your reasoning. Nomore visiting GE :(


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#55
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Haven't been insulted ingame since 2007, so you understand why I like the wilderness empty. :P



#56
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^I do so wish they would stop pretending legacy is anything more than original momentum buffed up to what it should've been (comparable to full manual, but still not quite as good) with a nice shiny reskin to make it look like pre-NIS and hide ability bar.

 

After all all the other 'features' are nothing to do with legacy and are just general fixes to eoc (combat formula, poison tweaks, specials, changes to armour stats etc)

Even with momentum abilities randomly get used by your character.


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#57
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^I do so wish they would stop pretending legacy is anything more than original momentum buffed up to what it should've been (comparable to full manual, but still not quite as good) with a nice shiny reskin to make it look like pre-NIS and hide ability bar.

 

After all all the other 'features' are nothing to do with legacy and are just general fixes to eoc (combat formula, poison tweaks, specials, changes to armour stats etc)

Even with momentum abilities randomly get used by your character.

 

I said ORIGINAL momentum for a reason, the original implementation did not use abilities, that was tweaked in after launch and then expanded on with the ults.


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#58
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120k people online + 30k bots

- 30k bots = 90k people online

EoC hits = 10k people quit

OSRS = 20k go to OSRS

 

60k + 20k = 80k players +10k quitters + 30k bots = 120k people

 

There you go, mystery solved.

 

It's not quite that simple. All the data reveals, when I last looked at it, a MASSIVE reduction in the amount of players online, active accounts, traffic to the site, google hits. It was a lot more serious than just 10K quitters, and those who went to OSRS.

Between the bot nuke and the last day that the highscores were P2P exclusive the number of members went from ~575k to ~485k. A 16% drop over 30 months is not really what I would call "massive" considering the trends of the entire MMO market.

 

*I know using 2 data points is VERY bad, but the start and end of P2P only highscores had very similar bot numbers and the time in between had a lot of crazy things happening with bots, trial memberships, and the like.



#59
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Given the nature of the PVPcommunity: I'm glad they are mostly gone now.

Given the nature of the effiency crowd, i'm glad how Jagex made it all much too easy now.

 

Really? After a long day you don't love to unwind with a few other people? Shame man, minigames and free for all is so much fun. 

 

 

Nope, don't like getting screamed at just because I owned them in combat. I don't want to know what they've supposed to have done to my mother, what I should do with their genitals, how much I know how to hack into their computer/Jagex computers. And certainly don't want their entitlement that all RuneScape is about is PVP and thus everything should be catered to them when they start crying.

 

I do love minigames, but I don't like the macho-crybaby culture involved within the PVP scene.

 

Theres idiots everywhere, not just PVP. Dont go judging people. I don't assume every black guy steals watermelons because its their life and soul and I don't expect every PVPer is an a hole that has his way with alot of mothers. When opinions conflict you all get crybaby culture. Me, you. This threads full of it.

 

 

There is no harm in judging people based on their behavior, often it is accurate and merited. The fact of the matter is that being a loudmouth douchebag was part of the PVP culture. It simply was. There is no point in trying to walk past this fact. That's just how the PVP community was, and they encouraged people to behave that way. Shouting profanities at people along the lines of "D clawz up ur mum's ass" and stuff of that sort, trolling people, griefing them, was very much the norm. Not all PKers were this way, but it was clearly a large part of the community. It is what it is.



#60
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Given the nature of the PVPcommunity: I'm glad they are mostly gone now.

Given the nature of the effiency crowd, i'm glad how Jagex made it all much too easy now.

 

Really? After a long day you don't love to unwind with a few other people? Shame man, minigames and free for all is so much fun. 

 

 

Nope, don't like getting screamed at just because I owned them in combat. I don't want to know what they've supposed to have done to my mother, what I should do with their genitals, how much I know how to hack into their computer/Jagex computers. And certainly don't want their entitlement that all RuneScape is about is PVP and thus everything should be catered to them when they start crying.

 

I do love minigames, but I don't like the macho-crybaby culture involved within the PVP scene.

 

Theres idiots everywhere, not just PVP. Dont go judging people. I don't assume every black guy steals watermelons because its their life and soul and I don't expect every PVPer is an a hole that has his way with alot of mothers. When opinions conflict you all get crybaby culture. Me, you. This threads full of it.

 

 

There is no harm in judging people based on their behavior, often it is accurate and merited. The fact of the matter is that being a loudmouth douchebag was part of the PVP culture. It simply was. There is no point in trying to walk past this fact. That's just how the PVP community was, and they encouraged people to behave that way. Shouting profanities at people along the lines of "D clawz up ur mum's ass" and stuff of that sort, trolling people, griefing them, was very much the norm. Not all PKers were this way, but it was clearly a large part of the community. It is what it is.

 

Sure, alot were like that. Unmissable. But to simply desregard peoples feelings towards eoc because of a few loud mouths? Idiotic. You don't throw a whole type of playerbase away over it. And it does not justify EoCs mistakes and damage






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