Kaur Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 However, I don't think that rewarding people for dying really fixes that. I'm not saying that everyone dies through their own stupidity, but those who do don't deserve to get all their items back. Because that way they will learn their lesson.I completely agree with you. I still believe the times before gravestones existed were the best times. You had your two minutes and after that it was game over. I recently happened to read a bunch of nostalgic comments on a runescape video, there were so many people talking about their first time they died with all of their stuff at the mages south of varroc and how they learned a valuable lesson from that. They wouldn't have it any other way... To counter the disconnections problem, perhaps make a system that force logs you out or teleports you to a safe area when the connection is lost. Don't they already check if you are still connected every 5 seconds or so? Shouldn't be too hard to implement if that was the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arceus Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 That has potential for so much abuse though. If you can quickly heal up to full health or to an extent that you survive the next X seconds, you would theoretically just log out, cut your internet connection, or do whatever and then avoid a death in either a PK situation or difficult boss encounter. "Fight for what you believe in, and believe in what you're fighting for." Can games be art? --- My blog here if you want to check out my Times articles and other writings! I always appreciate comments/feedback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alg Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Can we not have nostalgia guide game design, please? Especially in the form of a system that punishes players for doing nothing other than fighting a boss that griefers can manipulate? 1 I painted some stuff and put it on tumblr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze The Movie Fan Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Can we not have nostalgia guide game design, please? Especially in the form of a system that punishes players for doing nothing other than fighting a boss that griefers can manipulate? I'm not blinded by nostalgia at all. If I was I'd be playing old school RuneScape. In fact I prefer the evolution of combat system now over the older one. It makes the fights more intense and awesome. I mean sure special moves were cool, but the fact that you can do cool stuff with literally every weapon is even better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alg Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 That has nothing to do with the topic at hand...? I painted some stuff and put it on tumblr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arceus Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 I think Alg's comment might have been directed at Kaur and rather than you Blaze :P. "Fight for what you believe in, and believe in what you're fighting for." Can games be art? --- My blog here if you want to check out my Times articles and other writings! I always appreciate comments/feedback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
essiw Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 However, I don't think that rewarding people for dying really fixes that. I'm not saying that everyone dies through their own stupidity, but those who do don't deserve to get all their items back. Because that way they will learn their lesson.I completely agree with you. I still believe the times before gravestones existed were the best times. You had your two minutes and after that it was game over. I recently happened to read a bunch of nostalgic comments on a runescape video, there were so many people talking about their first time they died with all of their stuff at the mages south of varroc and how they learned a valuable lesson from that. They wouldn't have it any other way... To counter the disconnections problem, perhaps make a system that force logs you out or teleports you to a safe area when the connection is lost. Don't they already check if you are still connected every 5 seconds or so? Shouldn't be too hard to implement if that was the case. While I remember the good stuff about dying (also picking up loot from other players), there are also a lot of ragequit moments, which seems to be forgotten. I remember dying with an (for me) expensive armor at godwards and at contact when it came out... we mostly remember the good stuff when thinking back, we rarely remember the bad stuff. I personally think the systems should be combined. You have a short timer (2 minutes seems short? not sure) and after that you can buy your stuff back if you want to. That seems like a good compromis to me, and makes death more a penalty than it is now. http://sign.tip.it/1/2/79/260/essiw.png Retired item crew I would like to be credited as essiw at the website update & corrections forum. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze The Movie Fan Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 However, I don't think that rewarding people for dying really fixes that. I'm not saying that everyone dies through their own stupidity, but those who do don't deserve to get all their items back. Because that way they will learn their lesson.I completely agree with you. I still believe the times before gravestones existed were the best times. You had your two minutes and after that it was game over. I recently happened to read a bunch of nostalgic comments on a runescape video, there were so many people talking about their first time they died with all of their stuff at the mages south of varroc and how they learned a valuable lesson from that. They wouldn't have it any other way... To counter the disconnections problem, perhaps make a system that force logs you out or teleports you to a safe area when the connection is lost. Don't they already check if you are still connected every 5 seconds or so? Shouldn't be too hard to implement if that was the case. While I remember the good stuff about dying (also picking up loot from other players), there are also a lot of ragequit moments, which seems to be forgotten. I remember dying with an (for me) expensive armor at godwards and at contact when it came out... we mostly remember the good stuff when thinking back, we rarely remember the bad stuff. I personally think the systems should be combined. You have a short timer (2 minutes seems short? not sure) and after that you can buy your stuff back if you want to. That seems like a good compromis to me, and makes death more a penalty than it is now. Well, you shouldn't take something worth millions to a place you can get easily killed. That's just common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
essiw Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 However, I don't think that rewarding people for dying really fixes that. I'm not saying that everyone dies through their own stupidity, but those who do don't deserve to get all their items back. Because that way they will learn their lesson.I completely agree with you. I still believe the times before gravestones existed were the best times. You had your two minutes and after that it was game over. I recently happened to read a bunch of nostalgic comments on a runescape video, there were so many people talking about their first time they died with all of their stuff at the mages south of varroc and how they learned a valuable lesson from that. They wouldn't have it any other way... To counter the disconnections problem, perhaps make a system that force logs you out or teleports you to a safe area when the connection is lost. Don't they already check if you are still connected every 5 seconds or so? Shouldn't be too hard to implement if that was the case. While I remember the good stuff about dying (also picking up loot from other players), there are also a lot of ragequit moments, which seems to be forgotten. I remember dying with an (for me) expensive armor at godwards and at contact when it came out... we mostly remember the good stuff when thinking back, we rarely remember the bad stuff. I personally think the systems should be combined. You have a short timer (2 minutes seems short? not sure) and after that you can buy your stuff back if you want to. That seems like a good compromis to me, and makes death more a penalty than it is now. Well, you shouldn't take something worth millions to a place you can get easily killed. That's just common sense. Except that the most expensive armour/weapons are most useful in those area's (PvM). Not that I do those kinds of things, yet :P http://sign.tip.it/1/2/79/260/essiw.png Retired item crew I would like to be credited as essiw at the website update & corrections forum. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strilmus Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 on the whole, i think the dynamics of gear value versus risk have changed a bit since back in the "good ol days" and i'm not sure if it really applies anymore besides being a sort of shoehorned in way of reliving something that will never be the same, like every other nostalgic thing that people in this game cling to in the hopes that time will reverse itself 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaur Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 However, I don't think that rewarding people for dying really fixes that. I'm not saying that everyone dies through their own stupidity, but those who do don't deserve to get all their items back. Because that way they will learn their lesson.I completely agree with you. I still believe the times before gravestones existed were the best times. You had your two minutes and after that it was game over. I recently happened to read a bunch of nostalgic comments on a runescape video, there were so many people talking about their first time they died with all of their stuff at the mages south of varroc and how they learned a valuable lesson from that. They wouldn't have it any other way... To counter the disconnections problem, perhaps make a system that force logs you out or teleports you to a safe area when the connection is lost. Don't they already check if you are still connected every 5 seconds or so? Shouldn't be too hard to implement if that was the case. While I remember the good stuff about dying (also picking up loot from other players), there are also a lot of ragequit moments, which seems to be forgotten. I remember dying with an (for me) expensive armor at godwards and at contact when it came out... we mostly remember the good stuff when thinking back, we rarely remember the bad stuff. I personally think the systems should be combined. You have a short timer (2 minutes seems short? not sure) and after that you can buy your stuff back if you want to. That seems like a good compromis to me, and makes death more a penalty than it is now. Well, you shouldn't take something worth millions to a place you can get easily killed. That's just common sense. Except that the most expensive armour/weapons are most useful in those area's (PvM). Not that I do those kinds of things, yet :P Name a place you can't get back to in two minutes, I dare you. (Except the gwd killcount door which could be moved around a bit) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
essiw Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 ^Lots of quest area's. But that is why I said that I am not sure if 2 minutes is short, so not sure why you are asking me that :P http://sign.tip.it/1/2/79/260/essiw.png Retired item crew I would like to be credited as essiw at the website update & corrections forum. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HunterDexter Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Moss Le Harmless? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alg Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Chaos Tunnels too, probably I painted some stuff and put it on tumblr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arceus Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Now if they put a 2 minute timer in the Chaos Tunnels and made aggressive monsters attack you while trying to do the clues there...clue scroll from hell hehe. "Fight for what you believe in, and believe in what you're fighting for." Can games be art? --- My blog here if you want to check out my Times articles and other writings! I always appreciate comments/feedback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strilmus Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 honestly most of the tunnel monsters are kinda weak now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Inc Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 However, I don't think that rewarding people for dying really fixes that. I'm not saying that everyone dies through their own stupidity, but those who do don't deserve to get all their items back. Because that way they will learn their lesson.I completely agree with you. I still believe the times before gravestones existed were the best times. You had your two minutes and after that it was game over. I recently happened to read a bunch of nostalgic comments on a runescape video, there were so many people talking about their first time they died with all of their stuff at the mages south of varroc and how they learned a valuable lesson from that. They wouldn't have it any other way... To counter the disconnections problem, perhaps make a system that force logs you out or teleports you to a safe area when the connection is lost. Don't they already check if you are still connected every 5 seconds or so? Shouldn't be too hard to implement if that was the case. While I remember the good stuff about dying (also picking up loot from other players), there are also a lot of ragequit moments, which seems to be forgotten. I remember dying with an (for me) expensive armor at godwards and at contact when it came out... we mostly remember the good stuff when thinking back, we rarely remember the bad stuff. I personally think the systems should be combined. You have a short timer (2 minutes seems short? not sure) and after that you can buy your stuff back if you want to. That seems like a good compromis to me, and makes death more a penalty than it is now. Well, you shouldn't take something worth millions to a place you can get easily killed. That's just common sense. Uhh... what? I don't mean this in a hostile tone - but that's not common sense at all. Those things you spent millions on? Yeah, you spent that money so that you could go to places where you could be easily killed - otherwise you would be instantly killed, without them. And @Kaur's 2 minute comment: Can you really not think of any places? I can think of many. I can also think of the stress involved with dying somewhere. I can think of babies crying in the background, the phone ringing as you get red barred. Many, many things could prevent you from getting from point A to point B. If the entire world is seen though simple-colored lens, then yes - amazingly most of our troubles dissapear. Because, you know, for all non-max players who just lost their Drakan's medallion when they died - getting back to Barrows is so easy. 3 I have all the 99s, and have been playing since 2001. Comped 4/30/15 My Araxxi Kills: 459::Araxxi Drops(KC):Araxxi Hilts: 4x Eye (14/126/149/459), Web - (100) Fang (193) Araxxi Legs Completed: 5 ---Top (69/206/234/292/361), Middle (163/176/278/343/395), Bottom (135/256/350/359/397)Boss Pets: Supreme - 848 KCIf you play Xbox One - Add me! GT: Urtehnoes - Currently on a Destiny binge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevjumba Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 However, I don't think that rewarding people for dying really fixes that. I'm not saying that everyone dies through their own stupidity, but those who do don't deserve to get all their items back. Because that way they will learn their lesson. I completely agree with you. I still believe the times before gravestones existed were the best times. You had your two minutes and after that it was game over. I recently happened to read a bunch of nostalgic comments on a runescape video, there were so many people talking about their first time they died with all of their stuff at the mages south of varroc and how they learned a valuable lesson from that. They wouldn't have it any other way...To counter the disconnections problem, perhaps make a system that force logs you out or teleports you to a safe area when the connection is lost. Don't they already check if you are still connected every 5 seconds or so? Shouldn't be too hard to implement if that was the case.While I remember the good stuff about dying (also picking up loot from other players), there are also a lot of ragequit moments, which seems to be forgotten. I remember dying with an (for me) expensive armor at godwards and at contact when it came out... we mostly remember the good stuff when thinking back, we rarely remember the bad stuff. I personally think the systems should be combined. You have a short timer (2 minutes seems short? not sure) and after that you can buy your stuff back if you want to. That seems like a good compromis to me, and makes death more a penalty than it is now. Well, you shouldn't take something worth millions to a place you can get easily killed. That's just common sense.I think the point of expensive armor is so that you'd be able to survive better in dangerous places. I wouldn't bring rune armor to gwd, for example. Also @kaur, two minutes is fairly short as most aces will take that long or slightly less. When I died at hill giants in edgeville dungeon, I spent a good minute or two to get it back. Not to mention that most of the time, people have other distractions or are not 100% in he game. Even if two minutes were long in your opinion essiw said that the two minutes is up for consideration, so I'm not quite sure why you mentioned that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayc3399 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I like the idea overall. For everyone that is all fussed about it, give it 3 minutes to get back tax free and if you don't its with death. That gives people a chance to save it if they have everything unlocked from quests/minigames/etc. Much longer then that and its too easy. The game needs item and cash sinks if people want them or not. Quest Cape Achieved on November 14, 2007Items AcquiredCrystal Pick and HatchetBerzerker Ring x 33/28 Barrows Items Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze The Movie Fan Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Uhh... what? I don't mean this in a hostile tone - but that's not common sense at all. Those things you spent millions on? Yeah, you spent that money so that you could go to places where you could be easily killed - otherwise you would be instantly killed, without them. I'm such a damn moron. I didn't think of that, maybe it's because I almost never go boss hunting, but instead mostly kill monsters I can kill vast amount of in one trip. I really am sorry that I made such a fool of myself by talking about something I have no experience with. When I say something stupid it's not intentional, I assure you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoko Kurama Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 The suggestions for the pre-grave system are ridiculous. I have played since 2002, or maybe 2003, and as someone who has been PVM'ing at the all top bosses before the current system (ever since God Wars came out), I dare say my opinion counts for more than those who haven't. It's a terrible idea, and it's not even remotely comparable. Back in 2007, some of the best gear was extremely cheap (Rune, Black D Hide, Rune Crossbow, Whip, Dragon Weapons etc), and was cheap Welfare gear. You could do the best bosses in that gear (everything from DKS to KQ to KBD, to God Wars), and if you died, oh well, you lost maybe 300-500K, and if you were lucky you got drops such as Hilts which were worth 10's of millions. That is not in the least bit comparable to today's system where in order to make less money at top bosses you need to put in much more effort, have the best gear, which is either expensive or hard to come by, in several slots (instead of just 3-4 main items back then), you can't teleport out, and almost all bosses have KO abilities that kill even the best hunters on bad days, and servers are shit. Not even remotely comparable. And no, 2 minutes is not enough. It would be a narrow race to your grave every single time. DC? Lag? Gotta do something real quick? You just lost everything that you worked months if not years to get - as oppose to back in 2007 when you would lose a bit of rune and black d hide or some bolts at the most. Now, you have helmets, bodies, legs, gloves, boots, amulets, scrimshaws, capes, and expensive weapons. In those days, with black d hide top/bottom, Neitz, Rune Crossbow, Ava's accumulator, any gloves or just vambraces, glories, any boots or really cheap boots, I could have done Armadyl, teleport out, or even if I died I'd lose maybe 500K at most, and I'd be fine, and I'd be killing a boss where I could make tens of millions easily. I don't mean to be rude, but [bleep] nostalgia. I am completely fed up with people who clamor for nostalgia and want to cherry pick aspects of the game from 5-8 years, when it was a completely different time, place, and game (and this is important, really imporant), and they want to implant it to today's game, reflexively. It doesn't work that way. So yeah, [bleep] nostalgia. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wkw Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Lemme correct you there Until 2010 or 2011, a short bit after dungeoneering came out, whip was BIC, protected over most things, AND was best in class. If you died with it, you are probably going to lose it. Whereas barrows items, 4 items, were relatively cheap in comparison, had the most utility of anything (guthans), but if you lost the often lost piece, you are put back a lot. Runescape player since 2005 Ego Sum Deus Quo Malum Caligo et Barathum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoko Kurama Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Lemme correct you there Until 2010 or 2011, a short bit after dungeoneering came out, whip was BIC, protected over most things, AND was best in class. If you died with it, you are probably going to lose it. Whereas barrows items, 4 items, were relatively cheap in comparison, had the most utility of anything (guthans), but if you lost the often lost piece, you are put back a lot. You were easily able to welfare God Wars without barrows though. There were plenty of people in Rune at Bandos, or people in Black D Hide at Arma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze The Movie Fan Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Lemme correct you there Until 2010 or 2011, a short bit after dungeoneering came out, whip was BIC, protected over most things, AND was best in class. If you died with it, you are probably going to lose it. Whereas barrows items, 4 items, were relatively cheap in comparison, had the most utility of anything (guthans), but if you lost the often lost piece, you are put back a lot. Not to mention there used to be a time where the items kept depended on the high alchemy value instead of what they were worth. I don't have my zamorak platebody now, but at the time I lost it it was a big deal since back then it was worth over million coins. Nowadays I have a dragon platebdoy instead, even though I still worship Zamorak I don't need to show it with an item. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strilmus Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 that and we have overrides now :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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