Jump to content

Welcome to Rune Tips, the first ever RuneScape help site. We aim to offer skill guides, quest guides, maps, calculators, informative databases, tips, and much more to help you get the most from the Massive Online Adventure Game, RuneScape, by Jagex Ltd © 2009.

Report Ad

Welcome to Forum.Tip.It
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
Photo

PSA: Death Rework LIVE next week!


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
45 replies to this topic

#21
Sy_Accursed
[ Display Name History ]

Sy_Accursed

    Post Junkie

  • Members
  • 16,851 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Norfolk, UK
  • Joined:22 December 2004
  • RuneScape Status:P2P
  • RSN:Sy Accursed

I've been playing for over 10 years and I've never died to server lag or dcs. I'm not saying it doesn't happen but I think it is over hyped sometimes.

In the end the game needs a refresh in terms of items and gp and any sink is a good one.

 

I don't think its true to say any sink is a good one because the issue with the game as a whole isn't that everybody has too much gp - the gp issue is very much pooled in a specific player subset within the end game. A sink aimed to hit everybody fairly ends up doing virtually nothing to the cash stack of those creating the need for gp sinks, but ends up a fairly decent chunk of bank for most others.

 

Really the only true way to actually refresh things in a decent way for items and gp alike would be to set up suitable sinks across the game, whilst removing ways of creating from nothing excessively, to a point where largely items maintain a status quo. Then purposefully and forcibly removing gold and items from the game in a very targeted manner.

 

Short of literally taking away peoples items and gold arbitrarily the only real way this could be done would be to create some heavy taxing systems:

For example making the GE eat 50% of items that are in excess.

Make banks charge tax based on a heavily weighted curve vs bank value - ie the curve would barely, if at all, charge people with little to nothing but the people who have the excessive hordes of gp that skew the economy would find themselves facing a significant tax until they got rid of a lot of their gold.

 

The only other really viable solution would be to essentially abandon ship on gp and create a new currency for the game - one that is much much much much more restricted in means of creation from nothing from day 1 and limit it in such a way that all the existing gp cannot be easily switched over and people will have to abandon wealth if they have excessive amounts. IE Everyone  gets x% of bank value up to a limit of Y once a week for 12 weeks and after that 12 weeks is up gp cannot be traded anymore - but at the same time have some grindy, diminishing returns, ways to convert extra gp just to give people a chance to salvage some more if they work.

 

It would sort out the economy in a meaningful way that a few sinks here and there can never really do, but of course it'd come at the expense of alienating and losing a lot of high end players.


Plv6Dz6.jpg

Operation Gold Sparkles :: Chompy Kills ::  Full Profound :: Champions :: Barbarian Notes :: Champions Tackle Box :: MA Rewards

Dragonkin Journals :: Ports Stories :: Elder Chronicles :: Boss Slayer :: Penance King :: Kal'gerion Titles :: Gold Statue


#22
Arceus
[ Display Name History ]

Arceus

    Araxyte Authority

  • Administrators
  • 7,092 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Joined:7 December 2010
  • RuneScape Status:F2P

What they could do is penalize untradeables on death somehow. I.e., you die with full void, you can pay a million to get it back from Death or start a whole new set with Pest Control rewards. Increase penalties/reclaim costs for those awesome quest rewards like the Asylum ring from Death's Door. Those are both things that siphon coins straight out of the game. If there is untradeable weaponry and equipment that is viable in dangerous situations (which there is) and a gold sink tied to dying with it, that would seem a good way to draw off some cash and maybe make a bit of a gold sink. Because no one is going to YOLO-Void GWD, right? :v


"Fight for what you believe in, and believe in what you're fighting for." Can games be art?
---

 

cWCZMZO.png
l1M6sfb.png


My blog here if you want to check out my Times articles and other writings! I always appreciate comments/feedback.

#23
Sy_Accursed
[ Display Name History ]

Sy_Accursed

    Post Junkie

  • Members
  • 16,851 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Norfolk, UK
  • Joined:22 December 2004
  • RuneScape Status:P2P
  • RSN:Sy Accursed

^ That still bears the issue of it doesnt really hit where needed.

 

A uber richie dying in void will just throw a tiny portion of their wealth at it and be done.

A poor player will suddenly find a sizeable % of their bank being charged to get it back.

 

The whole issue of a flat out sink system is it disproportionately hits the poor people who aren't causing the economic problems whilst being next to nothing to the uber richies who are.


Plv6Dz6.jpg

Operation Gold Sparkles :: Chompy Kills ::  Full Profound :: Champions :: Barbarian Notes :: Champions Tackle Box :: MA Rewards

Dragonkin Journals :: Ports Stories :: Elder Chronicles :: Boss Slayer :: Penance King :: Kal'gerion Titles :: Gold Statue


#24
Impaler99
[ Display Name History ]

Impaler99

    Scorpion Pit

  • Members
  • 561 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North Myrtle Beach
  • Joined:20 June 2004
  • RuneScape Status:P2P
  • RSN:Impaler99

I feel really bad for people with slower computers.  Load times alone will eat up their three minutes!


user1-dark.png


#25
strilmus
[ Display Name History ]

strilmus

    Moss Giant Whipper

  • Members
  • 2,910 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Joined:11 April 2006
  • RuneScape Status:P2P

overall, people saying death is too easy are really saying that newer/lower level/poor connection players should be punished more for existing, because otherwise we'd have to come up with an actually novel way to compensate for the old level of the flow of resources in a world where we no longer punish people for dying because there's no reason to do so anymore

 

optimum usage of time and access to resources are the main factors that death protects atm, and any other function outside the wilderness is largely insignificant

 

one of the few high priority reasons why i push for the invention system is that it would be a particularly convenient way to destroy massive amounts of resources and gold, by dumping it all into nontradeble non stat based advancement, but this was scrapped for closure and an area which could have arguably improved the game more if all of its features were used to update existing dead areas of the game instead of building a monument to today's runescape: short term gains, long term disappointment

 

instead, they used that concept in its mangled form for the spring cleaner, which itself is a cannibalized form of an item that would have been an invention feature, as part of a whole ecosystem in which the items being salvaged FROM the spring cleaner would cycle back into being converted into more invention fodder instead of eventually ending up as more gold

 

building an intelligent system allows for the attachment of many more separate ideas, instead of constantly putting out fires and letting dust collect on various projects which went nowhere and occupy more space in our pretty significantly large downloads. considering "any sink is a good sink" speaks of this mentality where we're living day to day like cavemen, where our "best effort" is the ninja team, a group tasked with resolving important, gamewide issues with a qtip and a rubber band

 

allowing the system as it is now to perpetuate more waste and more stockpiling leads to stagnation and decreasing satisfaction per effort, and trying to use death to solve this issue is using the wrong tool to solve a problem that is much larger than it could have even dreamed of attempting to solve, if it were actually suited to doing so


8f14270694.jpg


#26
Fire_Hawk154
[ Display Name History ]

Fire_Hawk154

    Bear Fur

  • Members
  • 385 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Joined:1 May 2010
  • RuneScape Status:F2P
  • RSN:Fire Hawk154
  • RSN2:Bud Bundy
  • Clan:CE, TLL, TR, FD

They could've also adjusted the amount of resources PvM brings into the game, or maybe remove the 200M prize from Treasure Hunter... And who will go to those KK masses with Jmods when half the people there get K0ed in mage phase? :huh:

 

What a bad update :mellow:


B71AkU0.png      Fire_Hawk154.png


#27
strilmus
[ Display Name History ]

strilmus

    Moss Giant Whipper

  • Members
  • 2,910 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Joined:11 April 2006
  • RuneScape Status:P2P

oh, they've already tried to adjust the resource flow, but then they keep undoing it to get more people to log in regularly, or to sell keys

 

also, even if they did slow it down, the bots are starting to trickle back in

 

and even IF they succeed, all they will really do is once again affect the people who don't have most of the money, because the people with the money also tend to have massive hoards of supplies

 

we need something that consumes large amounts of items that are normally converted to gold, and preexisting gold, and appeals to rich [wagon] chasing after minor gains to one up each other or show off more, and what does that better than a system that progressively requires increasingly more of those things in order to scratch that perfectionist minmaxer itch

 

if people will stand in a castle for several months just to get a cape trimmed, they'll certainly go for this


8f14270694.jpg


#28
Sy_Accursed
[ Display Name History ]

Sy_Accursed

    Post Junkie

  • Members
  • 16,851 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Norfolk, UK
  • Joined:22 December 2004
  • RuneScape Status:P2P
  • RSN:Sy Accursed

The idea of targetting compers, or the comper tendency, with sink runs into the exact same issue of being nothing to richies whilst wiping out the banks of poorer folk.

The only way you can target richies and only richies is by specifically taxing on bank value.

 

I mean I'm on my way towards trim now and sure my bank value may be triple digit mils, but that is all just basic gear I use in the day to day scaping not stored wealth. Plus my god it took my years and years, wasting some pay on bonds and some blind luck for me to get there and even have the gear I've got and still be kinda broke.

 

Of course invention does offer some good routes, but the only way it could really really really work is if the best in-game across everything required going through invention, but again you couldn't really balance in a way that sufficiently hits the rich folks without heavily penalizing the poorer folks.


Plv6Dz6.jpg

Operation Gold Sparkles :: Chompy Kills ::  Full Profound :: Champions :: Barbarian Notes :: Champions Tackle Box :: MA Rewards

Dragonkin Journals :: Ports Stories :: Elder Chronicles :: Boss Slayer :: Penance King :: Kal'gerion Titles :: Gold Statue


#29
Arceus
[ Display Name History ]

Arceus

    Araxyte Authority

  • Administrators
  • 7,092 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Joined:7 December 2010
  • RuneScape Status:F2P

So something like the Well of Goodwill, except a more permanent and substantial effect.  :-k


"Fight for what you believe in, and believe in what you're fighting for." Can games be art?
---

 

cWCZMZO.png
l1M6sfb.png


My blog here if you want to check out my Times articles and other writings! I always appreciate comments/feedback.

#30
Wkw
[ Display Name History ]

Wkw

    Ice Giant Melter

  • Members
  • 3,565 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Joined:25 February 2005
  • RuneScape Status:None
  • RSN:wkw

For money sinks, have the well of goodwill open for 6 months with a notice that says, in 6 months, for trim comp you need to dump 5 billion worth of gold, and for regular comp, 1 billion.

 

That way comp is valuable again, and a money sink. Everyone who has comp will work for it to dump money in.

 

 

Or, they can add exclusive time limited overrides and animations for people dumping into the well. But they won't because they already do mtx


aaaaauserbar.gif

Wkw.png

Runescape player since January 2005
Ego Sum Deus Quo Malum Caligo et Barathum


 


#31
Alg
[ Display Name History ]

Alg

    Troll General

  • Editorial Panel
  • 10,880 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:California.
  • Joined:5 August 2006

It would sort out the economy in a meaningful way that a few sinks here and there can never really do, but of course it'd come at the expense of alienating and losing a lot of high end players.

As opposed to the way they're currently alienating the lower tiers because of how stupid the barrier for entry is. My brother recently came back to find that he has to spend ~58m to get from 74 to 88 herb. When he quit he had a bank worth anywhere frorn 14-20, most of which was tied into gear that has since plummeted. So naturally he decided to buckle down and get to work, channeling the spirits of his hardworking ancestors to allow him to pull himself up from squalor and grasp the American Dream barehanded- Just kidding! He said "[bleep] that" and logged out.

#32
Sy_Accursed
[ Display Name History ]

Sy_Accursed

    Post Junkie

  • Members
  • 16,851 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Norfolk, UK
  • Joined:22 December 2004
  • RuneScape Status:P2P
  • RSN:Sy Accursed

 

It would sort out the economy in a meaningful way that a few sinks here and there can never really do, but of course it'd come at the expense of alienating and losing a lot of high end players.

As opposed to the way they're currently alienating the lower tiers because of how stupid the barrier for entry is. My brother recently came back to find that he has to spend ~58m to get from 74 to 88 herb. When he quit he had a bank worth anywhere frorn 14-20, most of which was tied into gear that has since plummeted. So naturally he decided to buckle down and get to work, channeling the spirits of his hardworking ancestors to allow him to pull himself up from squalor and grasp the American Dream barehanded- Just kidding! He said "[bleep] that" and logged out.

 

 

True, but alienating the high end players won't do them any favours unless they have rejuvenated the influx of new players in the first place.

As it stands if they alienate the high end players they'd pretty much sign the death warrant for the game.

 

It's the great catch-22 that results in the messy middle ground measures they keep pumping out - they fear alienating the high end players and killing the game, but face the prospect that not fixing the economy is alienating new players and stopping the game from growing effectively.


Plv6Dz6.jpg

Operation Gold Sparkles :: Chompy Kills ::  Full Profound :: Champions :: Barbarian Notes :: Champions Tackle Box :: MA Rewards

Dragonkin Journals :: Ports Stories :: Elder Chronicles :: Boss Slayer :: Penance King :: Kal'gerion Titles :: Gold Statue


#33
Saradomin_Mage
[ Display Name History ]

Saradomin_Mage

    The Two and Only

  • Members
  • 7,273 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Varrock Museum
  • Joined:13 November 2004
  • RuneScape Status:P2P
You don't have to make potions to get herblore levels, you know. You don't have to get them immediately either.

6Ij0n.jpg

In real life MMO you don't get 99 smithing by making endless bronze daggers.


#34
V O R K
[ Display Name History ]

V O R K

    Skeleton Shield

  • Members
  • 1,215 posts

What they could do is penalize untradeables on death somehow. I.e., you die with full void, you can pay a million to get it back from Death or start a whole new set with Pest Control rewards. Increase penalties/reclaim costs for those awesome quest rewards like the Asylum ring from Death's Door. Those are both things that siphon coins straight out of the game. If there is untradeable weaponry and equipment that is viable in dangerous situations (which there is) and a gold sink tied to dying with it, that would seem a good way to draw off some cash and maybe make a bit of a gold sink. Because no one is going to YOLO-Void GWD, right? :v

 

This sounds really good.

Put it on Runelab!

 

Would be nice if we could retrieve this from the Wilderness aswell. Wouldn't mind paying double costs for that either.

 

Just for nostalgias sake but since I don't play a lot anymore I certainly am inactive months on end because i'm not in the mood to retrieve my sets.

 

On the moneysink debate:

Implent Games room wagers on all of them.

Rework Rat pits

Put a x percent on Duel Arena wins that must be paid for using the Arena.


Sway all day, Butterfly flaps all the way!  tumblr_inline_mp4i2qAGS11qz4rgp.gif
✿ ♥‿♥)

#35
essiw
[ Display Name History ]

essiw

    Retired Crew

  • Members
  • 2,800 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Netherlands
  • Joined:15 November 2005
  • RuneScape Status:P2P
  • RSN:essiw
  • RSN '07:essiw
There is a way to make a item-sink. Just make it so that everything (except rares and the like) degrades to dust, not like the current system, just a really slow degration, like a year (real time, not usage time). Would be impossible to implent and no-one would like it, but it would solve the problem of having to many items.

Retired item crew
I would like to be credited as essiw at the website update & corrections forum. Thanks!
If you want to add me in game, add "essiw".

#36
Sorator
[ Display Name History ]

Sorator

    Dark Wizard Robe

  • Members
  • 786 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Sneaking up behind you.
  • Joined:9 May 2006
  • RuneScape Status:P2P
  • RSN:Sorator
  • RSN2:Zidian29
  • Clan:HYT

There is a way to make a item-sink. Just make it so that everything (except rares and the like) degrades to dust, not like the current system, just a really slow degration, like a year (real time, not usage time). Would be impossible to implent and no-one would like it, but it would solve the problem of having to many items.

 

Reminds me of Puzzle Pirates, which works much like this - all worn items last for a certain number of hours played before degrading to dust, regardless of whether or not you're using them. (Or it might be a week of realtime for most clothes - it's been a while since I've played.) You can store items in your house for long-term non-degrading storage, but if you're carrying it - even if you aren't wearing it - it degrades.

 

Edit: I don't actually think this would be a good fit for Runescape, though.


Edited by Sorator, 24 May 2015 - 09:22 AM.

Obtained quest cape and base 92 before obtaining any 99s! Currently finishing out my 99s with the (long-distant) goal of comp cape.

260pifq.jpg


#37
Arceus
[ Display Name History ]

Arceus

    Araxyte Authority

  • Administrators
  • 7,092 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Joined:7 December 2010
  • RuneScape Status:F2P

Something tells me that would be terrible for sentimental value/returning players or people taking a break though :P. "Oh, welcome back after 6 months - your Dragon has in the meantime degraded to dust! By the way do you want to buy some keys or bonds? Do you do you do you?"

 

Now, speaking of clothes, maybe if we made the TH skilling outfits tradeable and/or degradable, and require X coins to recharge for a week of time or what have you, we could solve our economic problems and sate Jagex with key revenue simultaneously. Because a 5% Herblore bonus for the set may be something that high levels/completionist tier people would indeed go for, but maybe it would be too little anyway.


"Fight for what you believe in, and believe in what you're fighting for." Can games be art?
---

 

cWCZMZO.png
l1M6sfb.png


My blog here if you want to check out my Times articles and other writings! I always appreciate comments/feedback.

#38
Miss_Kozlov
[ Display Name History ]

Miss_Kozlov

    Bear Fur

  • Members
  • 409 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Florida
  • Joined:24 April 2015
  • RuneScape Status:Semi-Retired
Bring back fatigue! :D
Back after a 5 year TIF hiatus. Please don't mind me too much.

#39
Ring_World
[ Display Name History ]

Ring_World

    Dragon Slayer

  • Members
  • 5,506 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Joined:13 October 2007
  • RuneScape Status:Retired

Bring back fatigue! :D

 

Runescape mobile version sells energy potions which reset your fatigue for the low low price of only $0.99 a use and allow you to skip the 12 hour rest time to recharge normally



#40
strilmus
[ Display Name History ]

strilmus

    Moss Giant Whipper

  • Members
  • 2,910 posts
  • Gender:Not Telling
  • Joined:11 April 2006
  • RuneScape Status:P2P

so, you want to take the TH skilling outfits, which were time degrade before, which were converted to not degrade, back into a different degrade mechanic, targeted at skillers, who are at the lower end of the economic scale

 

while we're at it, let's create the ninja ninja team, task them with fixing our grumpiness problem, and give them one person with a bag of crisps as their budget

 

sell cosmetic horse blinders in solomons so that people can continue to contribute to runelabs

 

add new prayers that increase power but lower accuracy so that we can increase the efficiency at which we keep missing the point entirely


8f14270694.jpg





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users