z0diark
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Posts posted by z0diark
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more xp by ticking off f45-47 using thundy.
it needs no food.
Only if you have those floors open, for the other 75% of occults you wouldn't get better exp. And that's not even considering the shorter floor time you get doing flesh (ie less xp in less time means the xp isnt really better). As for food, flesh doesn't exactly do much damage, i rarely use more than 3 salve eels and that's before even considering soul split.
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As long as you tell the person when to open the door (right after you've attacked thundy), it's safe to have doorlag on thundy. The risk of getting trio/necrolord isn't really worth taking in my eyes.
This so much. Often people do flesh floors without having a hexer in the team and I personally think it's really stupid because you run the risk of getting necro. If you get two flesh and one necro you would lose any time "saved" by doing flesh, if you save any time at all. Most of us don't have hexes and most flesh teams don't have hexes, so necro really slows down floors.
It's not that hard for keyers and dpsers to coordinate while doing thundy.
OK. Firstly I'm gonna say that the majority of DGS' best dgers have hex and that in most of the decent DGS teams I'm in there will be another hexer. Obviously if your team doesn't have a hex then f45+ MAY be the better choice (no data so I can't really say either way) but if it does, consider these two scenarios where boss is found 3/4 the way through the floor and no gds available.
Thundy: So that nobody is idle, boss is started, 1/4 of map unopened so ~15 doors need to be opened. Assuming thundy specs every 30 seconds that's one door opened every 30 seconds when it's safe to do so. Ignoring the fact that the keyer is gonna end up dying repeatedly as he waits for calls from dpsers to open doors, and assuming thundy takes 2 minutes to kill, the keyer is able to open a maximum of six doors while his team kill the boss. This leaves 9 doors to be opened after boss dies.
Flesh: Boss is started and keyer can open doors as fast as he likes. Assume an average of ten seconds to open each of the fifteen doors and a time of around 2 minutes to kill flesh. This leaves only 2 doors to be opened after boss is dead and will knock over a minute off the floor time as well as reducing the number of deaths of both the keyer and the dpsers.
I encourage people to challenge what I've said, I really am interested in the choice between flesh and thundy.
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As long as you tell the person when to open the door (right after you've attacked thundy), it's safe to have doorlag on thundy. The risk of getting trio/necrolord isn't really worth taking in my eyes.
Necro is easy with hex(s). As for timing dl with thundy, it works a bit but it's pretty inefficient, there are quite large gaps between thundy's specs where the keyer would end up being idle. With flesh, doorlag isnt an issue at all so the keyer can open up the rest of the map at top speed which in my eyes will result in a far faster floor time. Unless I'm unaware of a way to time dl apart from when thundy is speccing...
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GRATS AYS@@@@@@!@!!
ARE YOU KIDDING ME
Haters.
Recently I've noticed that in lots of 3bo pro teams, flesh floors are far more popular than thundy ones. I have a feeling this is so that boss can be started earlier and the keyer can safely open the rest of the map while boss is being killed without killing the players in boss room. What do people think about this? In my opinion flesh is just as easy/fast as thundy (though I do have a hex so others may not agree) and it probably does speed up floor times, the only problem I can think of is that you're more likely to get annoying/slow bosses like trio but I'm wondering if that risk is worth taking.
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I recently got 89 dung, and i c1ed thundy until i could kill him without him maging or hitting me with his specs, but all this was on solo. What special things do i need to watch out for while killing him with a group?
Nice one, I'm always glad to hear of people practicing solo :D As well as what Tui said, the other main thing that's likely to make you mess up is people talking. This could be because you see their sentence and mistake it for one of thundy's specials or because you're busy typing a reply and your cursor isn't in the right place and you don't make it safe in time. Also be aware that door lag is likely to get everyone killed while killing thundy so if you have a door to open make sure you have someone in the boss room tell you when to open it.
@Callisme: Don't get your hopes up for a hex, they're extremely rare :P
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In other news, the weekly trivia has been updated.
OMFG dat noob Matt Marche gets credit for trivia when it was all my idea??????????
P.S. Grats on medal Chee <3
P.P.S. ILY rly Matt.
Oh and to make this non-spam, a suggestion to people doing the coloured blocks puzzle. If you're in the room and not under attack then it's really useful to get the vials ASAP. I often see people waiting until all the blocks are in place before grabbing the colours which is really innefficient, and if there are multiple people getting vials then make sure your teammate(s) know which colours you've already got so as to save time.
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A tip for people who struggle with the 'powering the central light' puzzle, if you click to charge the lodestones when the moving lights are at the stage just before they enter the centre, the light you have just clicked will be in time with previous moving lights.
I took a short video of this, I can make it into a gif if people want it.
Sounds like a good idea for the weekly trivia although they don't seem to want to update that atm for some reason :P
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A tip for people who struggle with the 'powering the central light' puzzle, if you click to charge the lodestones when the moving lights are at the stage just before they enter the centre, the light you have just clicked will be in time with previous moving lights.
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all looks good, exept for 1 line. the one about not hexing unless you have RIGOUR, wont rigour heal him?
Geomancer doesn't appear to regain HP from his prayer disabling attack unless you have a protect/deflect prayer up.
Sp you can use soul split/wrath etc without him healing?
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In the common abbreviations section, it says to not make bloodragers without scrolls. Since ragers are very useful to have in gds should this statement not be changed?
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That little GD discussion reminded me of something. Hobgoblins. Slash or crush?!
Although I haven't been noting anything down, I've been paying al fair bit of attention to which is better out of slash/crush on hobgobs and it seems to be crush with ba. If I have time tomorrow I'll probs do a bit of research but I have to pack all my stuff up to go home on friday so it may not happen.
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Right click the create gatestone spell, there is a "cast-now" option or something similarly worded to that. It lets you, for example, immediately create a new gatestone even if you have one dropped.
This or the fact you can create a new gatestone as you teleport to your previous one would make a good piece of weekly trivia :P
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On a note totally unrelated to the drama, this has reminded me of something which I don't know whether it is common knowledge or not, but you can make a gatestone once you are over halfway through the teleport animation, saves time as you don't need to do it after you've teleported.
Don't you need to use the quick-cast though? The gatestone only breaks after teleporting to said spot, iirc.
You don't need to quick-cast. After clicking to teleport, as soon as you see the 'Loading' sign, just click to cast a new gatestone and you'll have one in your invent when you arrive. I recommend watching dungeoneering videos to learn this sort of stuff, it's surprising how many random things you learn (like you can drop an item, for example a key, during the time you're group gatestone teleing).
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There are some people that make me wish I could have an ignore list on tif :/
On topic: I noticed the trivia hasn't been updated in a while, my suggestion would be pictures of primal warriors, one with chain, other with plate and instructions on which to attack with what. I've noticed alot of people get confused about this (including me sometimes).
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And yeah I was talking about 5:1 floors for c1s :P
5:1 is a 1:1 dungeon with 5 people, so the fact that you can solo the same dungeon in similar time means...
Means people dont have cosmics :P
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You highlight a pretty important point, I think non-hexers should be encouraged to hunt dinos for hexers, especially if the non-hexer in question has a decent hunter level. Personally, at 70 hunter I find that in many floors I'm actually unable to hunt the majority of dinos (mega/tyranno). It only takes 3 slots (or a minum of one if you dont want to carry needle n thread) to do this and it'll greatly improve the dps of the team as well as potentially saving the keyer a death or two.
Obviously hexers should still be hunting dinos but it would definitely help if another team member or two hunted as well.
On the contrary- it's much easier for a hex to make armor than someone who uses melee(standing in one place for melee isn't particularly useful), thus every hex should work on getting a higher hunter and craft level. As it has been discussed in private, lossless leather armor is very hard to make and almost impossible without a hex, thus it's not very high on the list of things to do, particularly for someone without a hex. If you do come across a gd that effectively allows for it, good for you, but otherwise there are much better things to be done.
As for the 54 sec c1, i've done a 55 second solo c1 in f2p on my newb with cosmics. Probably could do one in less than 40 seconds.
Tbh most of the time when hunting I'm actually meleeing (although I admit I normally hex dino for aggro), I just make sure I stand by a group of melee monsters and the dino is either caught or has destroyed the trap by the time im done killing there.
And yeah I was talking about 5:1 floors for c1s :P
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@ Zodiark, Tipsi, and Litterbug:
In regards to inventory space, a single person should NOT be making potions, making ragers, AND making dino armor. That's ridiculous. Drop the dino armor and start dropping herbs for other people to hold. Also keep in mind that three ores is the most efficient number, so if you're running around with six prom and ten herbs and some seconds and vials, you're doing something very wrong.
You highlight a pretty important point, I think non-hexers should be encouraged to hunt dinos for hexers, especially if the non-hexer in question has a decent hunter level. Personally, at 70 hunter I find that in many floors I'm actually unable to hunt the majority of dinos (mega/tyranno). It only takes 3 slots (or a minum of one if you dont want to carry needle n thread) to do this and it'll greatly improve the dps of the team as well as potentially saving the keyer a death or two.
Obviously hexers should still be hunting dinos but it would definitely help if another team member or two hunted as well.
You should really only be hunting dinos if you are 100% idle or not good at running paths. So often I see a door that is unopened with someone standing on a trap instead of running to open it. It basically lets the responsibility of furthering the map fall to the other 4 people - it is not lossless. If you are 100% idle, go for it unless you can do something about ragers.
When I'm talking about hunting dinos I mean doing it in active gds while clearing the room. Obviously if the only thing you're doing is hunting when there are doors to be opened/paths to be run/gds to be finished then you're doing it wrong.
EDIT: Can anyone beat (Furnished floor with 2 laws):
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@ Zodiark, Tipsi, and Litterbug:
In regards to inventory space, a single person should NOT be making potions, making ragers, AND making dino armor. That's ridiculous. Drop the dino armor and start dropping herbs for other people to hold. Also keep in mind that three ores is the most efficient number, so if you're running around with six prom and ten herbs and some seconds and vials, you're doing something very wrong.
You highlight a pretty important point, I think non-hexers should be encouraged to hunt dinos for hexers, especially if the non-hexer in question has a decent hunter level. Personally, at 70 hunter I find that in many floors I'm actually unable to hunt the majority of dinos (mega/tyranno). It only takes 3 slots (or a minum of one if you dont want to carry needle n thread) to do this and it'll greatly improve the dps of the team as well as potentially saving the keyer a death or two.
Obviously hexers should still be hunting dinos but it would definitely help if another team member or two hunted as well.
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im fine at not dieing just in warps its incredibly hard to not die and go fast at the same time.
idk about u but i have full inventory slots and space for about 4 fish at a time these days because i make unfs and try and make ragers etc and warp stuffs rape
edit: ill b more specific, im often carrying so much stuff such as unf potions and seconds etc so its rare for me to have lots of free spots for fish. As for keying i have more space... but well im keying and if the team is slow to gtgd, the 133 shade + pick + mage kills me (happened yesterday for example)
I know what you mean, I'm often in a similar position in terms of invent spaces, snaping and dino gear and other rager stuff defo takes up alot of space. From the sound of things what I said initially still stands, obviously shades rape but that's a given, remember to make the most of safespotting melee monsters and dragging your intended target behind a wall to minimise damage taken. If you're having to wait a long time for your team to gt to a gd then either they're a bad team and you need to take a few seconds out just to explain how important it is to gt promptly or you should just do your best to hide in the gd/an adjacent room while they come.
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I seem to never get survivor on warps (and im sick of often dieing 3+ times!!) and im close to c1'ing my abandons.
So what is dgs's opinion on getting 99 defence and swapping hood for sagittarian body.
Hood seems to be the best in abandons, but then its usefulness in occults is just 'after the mages in a gd are dead u can 1by 1 kill the skeletons/zombies..'
(also im breaking hood anyway at 120 when i see a blood necklace!)
The problem is your dging skills rather than your binds. I'm assuming that you means 3 deaths per floor keying, perhaps take a few days out to just focus on conserving hp dpsing and then try to incorporate those skills into keying. If all else fails just spam for teammates to heal you in gds n stuff =p
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So I got 89 Dg today, which is great. I've been in the clan since it was made, but haven't dged a lot. Acherhar took me and we did two small tf floors to get the hang of it, and I did alright.
So, I went to do a regular tf. When it got to the boss, I messed up twice. Two of the people on the team (one of them being a mod here on tif) were raging at me. One of them called me a f[bleep]ing [developmentally delayed], and told me to leave dgs and learn to tf.
I'm pretty mad about this, as Dgs is ACCEPTING ANYBODY WILLING TO LEARN. I was learning a new boss, and got this response. I told them it was my first tf and I'd probably mess up, and still get called a [bleep]ing [developmentally delayed].
The solution: do f45 c1 until you get a thundy boss. Unequip your weapon and punch thundy to death. Keep doing this until you can kill him without getting caught by either of his specials (come closer/true power) or his magic attack. If you want advice feel free to pm me in game, I'll help if I'm not in a floor at the time.
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Also, while we're on the topic of equipping/unequipping, is it worth unequipping range chaps/body (with hex bound ofc) while in melee gds for fewer misses or is that too much hassle?
Depends on the monsters in the gd. If it's just melee-able stuff left, yeah I would always take the armor off. More accuracy + deflect damage.
OK, I see why Grimy's so into getting people used to so many actions per minute, as you become better at dungeoneering there is so much more clicking that needs to be done :P
Oh and a final question before I go to bed (aimed at everyone), do many DGSers use F1-F5 keys while dging? I'm a bit noob at remembering what does what but they seem pretty useful.
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Also, while we're on the topic of equipping/unequipping, is it worth unequipping range chaps/body (with hex bound ofc) while in melee gds for fewer misses or is that too much hassle?
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I know everyone's in the habit of taking off their hood for thundy but what do people think about unequipping hoods for other bosses too (only while meleeing of course)? Although it provides a small defence bonus it also has negative attack bonuses for slash and crush, should people get used to unequipping their hood while meleeing a boss?
Well for Thunderous it also helps you deflect more damage. I don't think the same can be said for every boss, as Thunderous is really the only boss that will hit you with only 1 combat style that you can be completely protected against (assuming your team doesn't mess up).
Ya I know the reason for thundy is to increase chance of deflect damage, I know most bosses aren't 100% safe but that's kind of what I was asking, is losing the minimal defence bonus worth gaining the even smaller attack bonus? On an easy boss like flesh I'd say it was as you're unlikely to die but I'm unsure about others. Thoughts?
Thieving methods and exp rates
in Help and Advice
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I'm currently at 67 thieving and am planning to slowly train it up to 99 and am wondering about the exp rates for menaphite thugs/monkey knife fighters/pyramid plunder at 71/81/91 thieving. Thanks in advance :D