lobsta

How could you possibly know that there has to be an illogical answer to the question? Science has demystified much over the centuries, at a great cost to most religions. Why do you suppose that there is not a scientific explanation for the universe? If God does exist, he must have been a scientist to fine tune the universe to the way it is. Why are you so quick to claim that 'God did it', (but we won't know how he did it), yet you are un-willing to admit that the universe was born through natural causes that we are as yet (or maybe forever) unable to understand? A universe with purpose? What is purpose? Purpose is only a mechanism humans utilise to understand the world. It is an extremely vacuous argument to claim that just because you think that it seems more rational for their to be a purpose, there must have been a creator. I accept God as an extremely small probability, mainly as I can not disprove his existence. I do not 'know God exists'.

I think you will find that any scientist and hopefully any rational intelligent atheist will admit (or at least SHOULD) when they do not know how something occurs. Science after all is driven by ignorance and the quest of knowledge.

So in order to explain the Universe, the most complex physical thing, you're going to argue for the necessity of an even more complex consciousness that has existed eternally? Don't try and claim that God is less complex. God created the Universe apparently, he can't possibly be less complex. The attributes which you say the Universe cannot, or does not have, you give to God. If you're going to be making wild assumptions, why would you not just assume that the Universe has always existed? Why would you fathom a complex consciousness, with a load of other stuff to go with it, in order to explain something when you could come up with an infinite number of explanations that are less complex and more likely? There is also an infinite regression. You can't just say "God did it!", because who did God? Where did God come from? You're willing to say that God just exists, but you say this is impossible for the Universe? I agree with this. God always seems to get a 'get out of jail free card'. It is utterly absurd to believe that God is less complex than the universe. You never see a spear making a spear maker... Even if God were less complex than the universe, it still doesn't actually explain how the universe was created. How did God create it? How was something less complex able to make something more complex? God does not solve the problem of how the universe was created. God only aggravates the issue. How can anyone simply 'know' that God exists. Surely it is far better to admit that we do not know how the universe was created.

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No. It would be unwise not to respect the freedom for people to have beliefs. However, we do not necessarily need to respect the beliefs that other people have. It becomes very dangerous when we can not challenge ideas about the world. Religion should not warrant any form of immunity to criticism.

lol

If only countries poured as much resources into Nuclear Fusion as we do developing Nuclear Bombs. I wonder if we were able to utilise this power source a few years ago - would the U.S been concerned much by the Middle East? Nuclear fusion really would be a get out of jail free card at the moment.

Why is it important to define the orders of magnitude regarding atheism - in this context. Regardless of whether or not someone is a strong atheist or a weak atheist, the result is still the same. A lack of belief in God. An atheist does not make a leap of faith in anyway comparable to that of a theist. A theist believes something for which there is absolutely no evidence for. It is unimportant whether or not we define atheism as a belief system - because the human brain works on a series of beliefs, consciously and unconsciously. Im sorry, but getting technical about definition is a bit silly. God does not exist.

My Dad committed suicide just before christmas by hanging himself in the garage with a choke chain (which I now know, does what it is supposed to) attached to the fixture that holds my boxing bag. Unfortunately my younger sister saw him - so did my mum. I can not understand why he did it, as there was no suicide note (and it was very much out of the blue), but also the way in which he did it. He had a shotgun, he should have gone to some woods somewhere and blown his head off, because the image of seeing a dead parent or loved one is something that will stay with you for the rest of your life (I know someone else would have seen him). But I think this is testament to the irrationality of it - in this case anywhere. My opinion, is that we should not try to think of it too simply. The multiplicity of causations should not be overlooked. Perhaps genetics lead to a greater propensity for suicide in certain individuals. Certainly events in individuals lives can lead to it. Saying that suicide is not as bad as people say it is - is not correct. Until you get the phone call telling you that a loved one has killed themselves, until you see the emotional harm it causes on others, until you see the coffin that contains the dead body that used to be someone you know and until you wonder why someone chose death over living with you - might be the day that you change your view. Suicide as an alternative to the monotony of living? - Disgraceful.

If the laws of the universe were programmed any other way, chemical reactions necessary for life would not occur. If the earth were further away from the sun, it would be too cold for life, just as it would be too hot if the earth were closer to the sun. If the series of natural events that destroyed the dinosaurs did not occur, you may not be hereOf all the organisms before you, every single one of them successfully reproduced before being eaten or killed. If any one of those organisms made even the slightest decision differently, you may not be here now. You are extremely lucky to be granted such an infinitesimally short spark of consciousness - we should not belittle this by living for an afterlife, or believing we were designed by God. If we were designed, we were designed very poorly Our purpose is not futile or meaningless - for we live to reproduce - to grant other humans a chance at life. Why does a species so vastly intelligent need a God? We don't.

We know for sure that Dinosaurs existed. Did you really? Did i not say that we could see now? sheeesh, you quoted it ffs. But on the whole extinction of them, we cannot be sure, we can only make guesses and get them as close as we think possible. I apologise for not understanding you, you did not articulate yourself properly.

I must say sir, that this is the only thing that I agree with you about.

brilliant.

We know for sure that Dinosaurs existed.

You do not know how we got here, what makes your claims about the origin of the Universe any more relevant than mine? Is it evidence? Well there is plenty of that. http://www.godandscience.org/slideshow/sld001.html How do I know that God doesn't want puppets? It is written in the Bible that he gave man the freedom of choice to follow him or not. He can't make a sandwich so large he can't finish it because the statement contradicts itself and doesn't apply to God because it's nonesense. That's like saying "Can God make something so black that it's white?" It doesn't make sense. Why would God fear his own creations? Especially since he wields infinite power? My friend, It's a matter of opinion. You can't prove either side of the argument. It all has to do with the person and their own conclusions. This debate is already over. I will admit that there are many things in this world that I am ignorant about. I do not know how the Universe was created. I do not know the exact series of events that occurred that would eventually lead to our existence. But I do not pretend to know, or think that I know. It is important to admit when one does not know something - ignorance drives science. The problem is that you claim to know how the universe was created - well it is up to you to prove your assertions. Posting links to that spurious website is not evidence. (I am not getting into a debate about validity of sources) The questions are not stupid, because they are analogies to demonstrate the incompatibility of Omniscience and Omnipotence. For example; Does God have the power to change his future mind? My point is, even if God did exist, there is absolutely no evidence for him. Therefore, you can not make ridiculous assumptions about how he operates (scientifically). You do not know how God operates. If one thinks about the question logically and sensibly, with the facts that are present - one should only arrive at the conclusion that God does not exist. You claim that you can not prove either side of the argument - a vacuous statement. You can not prove that God exists. It is impossible to disprove the existence of anything, therefore Atheists can not disprove the non-existence of God. However, because there is absolutely NO evidence for the existence of God, one can only assume that he/she/it does not exist. And yes the debate is already over; God does not exist.