ISREAL63
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Posts posted by ISREAL63
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^ Point of information: Israel invaded Lebanon and occupied it for some 18 years. It's not exactly 'giving land back'. And Hezbollah do not run Lebanon, the land was given to the Lebanese government. As for Gaza, it was given to the Palestinian Authority (ie, not terrorists) in the Oslo Accords of 1993 and later taken over by Hamas in 2007. So neither of these lands were 'given' to terrorists.
First off do not play with my words i said they turned into Terrorist bases, Meaning after leaving it. Second You got your facts wrong Gaza was given in 2005.
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And if you dont negotiate with terrorists they terrorize. But if you talk to them and find out their greivences then you will have less terrorists.
So how do you negotiate with terrorists who terrorize you daily? Don't say give up more land because it isn't working don't forget Israel gave up the South of Lebanon and Gaza only to have both turned into a terrorist base for more terrorism.
Terrorist don't negotiate they terrorize. As i already said Israel can't negotiate with terrorists meaning the Palestinians terrorist organization Hamas. Please read the links it might help you understand.
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Did it ever occur to you that actually talking to the group who has the most support from the Palestinians might actually change something rather then treating the minority as if their opinions are the same as that of the majority? But no. Treating the majority of palastinians as if they dont exist seems to be the only thing Israel is capable of.
Did it ever occur to that Abbas head of the Palestinian Authority is not the majority. Abbas pushed of the the Palestinian election because he knew that he would lose and Hamas would gain control. This means that most Palestinians support a terrorist group that Israel can't negotiate with.
Lets not forget the Landslide victory of the Palestinian Election in 2006
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The way I see it, there should be talks with Hamas as well because although I disagree with much of their agenda and approach, they are a group which does unfortunately represent many Palestinians. However, the facts on the ground are that the two state solution has only really been negotiated by the Israeli government and the Palestinian Authority (represented by Fatah). You could argue that the unity deal means now that Hamas has a say but in reality that deal seems to have done nothing in practice and was just a means of pacifying a dissolusioned population.
As for Abbass going to the UN, I think it was important in two regards, one it made Fatah more popular which in turn gives Abbass a stronger footing within Palestine which ultimately will help Palestinian backing for the two state option that Abbass wants to make happen. Secondly, I think it gave the Israel, the US, the Quartet and the wider international community a shot in the arm and it pushed the Israel-Palestine issue back on to the agenda which can only be good in these circumstances. There were no negotiations ongoing because of the continued expansion which is a roadblock to talks (which Netanyahu is deliberately exploiting). These expansions undermine Abbass' position within Palestine which means he had no way of representing his people in peace talks anyway since you can't make a deal when you don't have the support of your people. The UN bid was more of a political move by Abbass to improve his popularity in Palestine and to get the issue back on the agenda rather than a real effort at statehood via the UN (since everyone knows the US will veto). I think it was a great move overall, Fatah is boosted (thus hurting Hamas, which is why they released Shalit) and the international community is pulling the finger out for a change.
you are right talks can only be through Israel and the Palestinians. However the Palestinian Authority is meant to represent all of the Palestinian and Israel can't make a deal with only part of them. As long as hamas the terrorist group represents a great part of the Palestinian, Israel can't negotiate.
What you are saying doesn't justify going against everything that already has agreed upon.
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How can you negotiate a deal when one side is committing terrorism daily and firing rockets at innocent civilians daily. It isn't a one sided street.
1) Israel is not negotiating a two-state solution with Hamas but with Fatah (as representatives of the Palestinian Authority). Hamas has been the predominant group that has been firing rockets into Israel not Fatah. Conflating the two seperate groups is just not a representation of what is really happening.
2) Your counter point completely failed to tackle the point I raised.
Getting back to the overall subject of the thread:
On a personal level, the release of Gilad Shalit is a wonderful thing for him and his family. However, the only people that benefit from this are the two groups that are intransigent and preventing any hope of a two-state solution Likud (and more widely Natanyahu's right wing coalition) and Hamas. The release of the 1,000 detainees will be a big short term boost to Hamas but they have played their last card now having clearly feeling threatened by the popularity of Abbas's actions at the UN. This release of 1,000 prisoners for 1 kidnapped Israeli soldier may convince them that capturing more soldiers in the future. Likewise, Netanyahu is using this to gain favour with the Israeli public which isn't helpful either considering how he deliberately circumvented the Oslo Accords (after vowing not to) and considering his willingness to undermine any hope of negotiation with the PA. Yet again, the warmongers on both sides win.
This where you are wrong Israel will not be negotiating a deal with only half of the Palestinians but with all of them. Meaning as long as hamas a Palestinians terrorist continues its terrorism Israel can't talk peace with them. The Palestinians are all one group of people its a 2 state solution not 3. One for the Jews and one for the Arabs not One for the Jews and 2 for the Arabs
Counter point is exactly correct to what you said.
As The Gabe said it is not Israel but Abbas who is undermining the peace process. Abbas going to the UN is against all agreements in till now.
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How can you negotiate a deal over division of land when one side is still expanding, it's an illogical position. It is like negotiating over how to divide a piece of cake while one person is still eating it up.
How can you negotiate a deal when one side is committing terrorism daily and firing rockets at innocent civilians daily. It isn't a one sided street.
My analysis of this situation: a trade of 1000 terrorists [who are forced to act as they do because they're animals backed into a corner]
.Among them are those responsible for the brutal massacres at the Dolphinarium in Tel Aviv (21 teenagers killed, 132 injured), the Sbarro Restaurant in Jerusalem (15 killed, 130 wounded), and the Park Hotel seder attack on the eve of Passover in Netanya (Thirty killed, 140 injured)No one is ever forced to act this way. You always have the chose if commit terrorism and murder or not.
for 1 well equipped terrorist that does what he does for the sake of a country that didn't exist 7 decades ago, and only survives because of its apartheid funded by the US.You are right the State of Israel didn't exist 70 years ago but neither did Palestine. But Israel did exist 2000 years ago but Palestine never existed at all. So i find it very ironic that "Israel was created out of thin air" because it wasn't but Palestine was created out of thin air.
I would just like to remind everyone that the entire Israeli-Palestine conflict was instigated by Zionists creating a country out of thin air. Jews were plentiful in Greater Syria and other parts of the Middle East pre-Israel and they were seen and treated as Arabs and equals as much as everyone else was. The conflict is not one based on Arab vs. Jew, it's Arab vs. Invader.Do i even need to say how antisemitic that sounds.
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I just asked what was your source.
I am not ignoring your argument but you are ignoring mine. You are leaving out how israel went out its way to warn Palestinians, which was a major part of the war. What country in the world tells people about its military operation before they happen, only Israel to avoid civilians deaths but again you like to leave this part out. The main point of the attack was to stop Hamas from bombing Israel. Are you trying to argue what Israel said? Its a fact. Yes i am pointing out how Hamas fought because of they way they did there was many more civilian deaths. The only one who is terrorizing the Gaza strip is hamas a terrorist organization
Here is the son of the founder of Hamas
You think Israel is the only country whose military warns civilians in advance to evacuate? You seriously think that basic military tactic frees their military of all consequences? It doesn't, and like I said even without extraordinary civilian casualties the attack was still able to cause widespread economic and moral harm to the general population. And I'm not trying to say Israeli leaders didn't say something, I'm saying that they are lying/not telling the whole truth and that they have motives hidden from general publicity, just like any government. I'd argue that an entity that dumps white hot phosphorous on the public is committing an act of terror, so Hamas is far from the only group terrorizing people.
Calling up saying, yes because you commit terrorism in your house please leave it so we can destroy it without killing you. No other country has done such a thing. It wasn't Israel fault that the economy was harmed it was the one that resorted to terrorism the Palestinians were. I alreadysaid 2-3 soldiers broke orders and broke international law but these is your only argument a few soldiers doing wrong when a whole terrorist organization commits terror which you seem to be leaving out.
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Ok, you doubt my sources?Here it is, moving on.
You're ignoring the argument I made that the entire point of the attack was less about destroying Hamas's physical ability to bomb Israel than it was about demoralizing, and yes, terrorizing the population in the Gaza Strip. You're arguing about the smaller picture for Israel, only looking at the individual soldiers while ignoring the military tactics as a whole, while scrutinizing Hamas's methods both at an individual and systemic level; that kind of biased reasoning and argument isn't going to work.
I just asked what was your source.
I am not ignoring your argument but you are ignoring mine. You are leaving out how israel went out its way to warn Palestinians, which was a major part of the war. What country in the world tells people about its military operation before they happen, only Israel to avoid civilians deaths but again you like to leave this part out. The main point of the attack was to stop Hamas from bombing Israel. Are you trying to argue what Israel said? Its a fact. Yes i am pointing out how Hamas fought because of they way they did there was many more civilian deaths. The only one who is terrorizing the Gaza strip is hamas a terrorist organization
Here is the son of the founder of Hamas
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Gaza Strip is a tiny gift compared to what could be given. And in case you're unable to read, I also said Palestine needs to make serious changes - dissolving/disarming Hamas also means a blanket ceasefire (enforced by some 3rd party).
I understood exactly what you said you said that "Israel needs to make the first move for peace", Israel did only to have it used for terrorism against Israel. The Gaza Strip is not a tiny gift. I know you said that the Palestinians needs to make serious change, and i agree, but in till this happen there can't be peace not when one of the peace partner daily act to destroy the other partner. It is the Palestinians turn they need to stop using the Gaza Strip to commit terrorism.
Why does it matter if it's the Gaza Strip? Why not Jordan or Syria or Lebanon or Egypt? Wouldn't attacks from there be just as bad?
At the pr sent only the Gaza strip is being used as a terrorist base. :wink:
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Gaza Strip is a tiny gift compared to what could be given. And in case you're unable to read, I also said Palestine needs to make serious changes - dissolving/disarming Hamas also means a blanket ceasefire (enforced by some 3rd party).
I understood exactly what you said you said that "Israel needs to make the first move for peace", Israel did only to have it used for terrorism against Israel. The Gaza Strip is not a tiny gift. I know you said that the Palestinians needs to make serious change, and i agree, but in till this happen there can't be peace not when one of the peace partner daily act to destroy the other partner. It is the Palestinians turn they need to stop using the Gaza Strip to commit terrorism.
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You appear to have misunderstood my post. It was meant to be read as a whole. The questions were rhetorical, edging sarcasm.
Oh ok when reading what someone wrote it isn't always easy to understand that is sarcasm. Anything in this thread i take seriously because it is a serious topic, sorry if i miss understood you.
You're claiming that brute force without regard for human life is the only way to fight, and that (apparently) these people aren't worth considering as equal human beings. Therefore you disrespect them and this would lead me to believe that you think the only possibility for peace is some form of reduced genocide?No i am not saying that they are not human, i have stated before how Israel before operation cast lead dropping hundreds of thousand of pamphlet warning about the raids and that if there houses were involved in terrorism they should leave it. The IDF made many calls warning people 5 minutes before bombing each building, the IDF also recorded every bombing on the satellite and later uploaded it to you tube for all to see. Israel has gone out its way to avoid civilian deaths.
Call me naïve, but I still say the Israeli government should apply other means which I know they have at their disposal. Military action is fine, when regard for human life is maintained.I am talking about operation cast lead in which Israel put up with the bombardment of rockets and mortars for years, but it started coming at 200 a day in which Israel finally responded.
The unnecessary killing of people only encourages blind hatred for the other side, ignorance, and more death. You are obviously affected as well (which is pretty much why I valued The_Gabe being reasonable so much).i don't think that there was unnecessary killing on the Israeli side there was mistakes but that happens in any war. i said above how Israel went out of its way to avoid such deaths.
Anyhow, I think people like these have the right mentality.Most of Israeli think this way to including me, they want to coexist. But the terrorist attacks are what keeps that from happening.
Maybe things can improve. But somebody has to take the first step - Israel needs to allow the right of return, and Hamas needs to dissolve or disarm. Hopefully with new generations the conflict will settle :mellow:
Israel already did the first step by giving up the Gaza strip only to have it used as a terrorist base. So why should Israel give more and still receive nothing but terrorism in return.
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He wasn't even talking to you specifically... Anyway, let's stay on topic.
You are right just the pro Israel posters which is basically me. Anyway you are right lets get back on topic
You're assuming that every single terrorist-Israeli confrontation is in some street with people shooting on each other, with terrorists using people for shields?No, but most civilian causalities are a result of that confrontation in which Israel is heavily criticized on when is isn't Israel's fault
What would your soldier be doing in this Palestinian street other than to kill terrorists in the first place?Israeli soldiers don't walk around anymore on Palestinian streets so i am not sure what your question is
I think we both know it's not that simple, and there are other ways to eliminate terrorists without choosing to kill that many innocents that happen to be in the general area. They may be more costly and take more time and effort to execute, but the ways are there nonetheless.
You are right it isn't that simple, but in war what can you do let the enemy win or destroy him?
I also think you may want to read my previous post again, because you seem to have missed my point.I understood your point and i support it, but i do believe that israel is good but it seems not because of how it is forced to fight. So i was explaining why it might seem bad
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I'm reasonably sure most TIFers know after a good five years of my account being active that I'm not trying to flame anyone, but thanks for the advice.
I'm just saying there is literally no reason to mention the Holocaust in a discussion about Palestine. I don't care what's been said, there's just no relevence.
I haven't brought up, even if The Holocaust it is relevant, but i haven't brought it up at all in this topic. But since it is brought it is a major player in Israel's right to exist whether you like it or not that is a fact.
ISREAL, that was uncalled for. Ginger_Warrior isn't flaming you at all. :blink:
That said, I agree that the Holocaust is of little relevance in this discussion, though it is relevant in that it has had a major influence on the Jewish who live in Israel (and therefore can explain mentality to some extend), it is irrelevant as far as Palistinians are concerned.
Edit: back to what you said in reply to my post:
Collateral damage has its limits. There is something to be said for getting the people on your side, rather than to consider them nothing but collateral.
You right he wasn't flaming me just accusing me for doing something i didn't do.
You are right Collateral damage has its limits but what do you do when someone threatens to kill you but hides behind civilians to do it, and it is the only way he fight do you let him keep on killing your soldiers or do you kill the terrorist so he can't try to kill again. So what is the limit when it comes to terrorism?
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Im not denying the holocaust however I am saying any proof thereof is an opinion.
Ignoring the past few posts of arguing, I'd just like to point out that this is one of the more cabbage remarks I've seen.
Although I see the point you're trying to make, I find your sentence quoted above rather insulting.
Also:
Both sides are biased, and influenced by media one way or another, though I believe Hamas is the only one brainwashing children into believing what the above posted videos would have them believe. It's beyond disturbing.
I doubt there are any Israeli children's cartoons like that.
Hamas is a terrorist group, the Israeli government is not, but governments also do things "above the law." Neither side (Palistinian/Israeli) is the good or evil one, however I would say Hamas is evil. Most of that was established in the first few pages of the thread.
Personally I think The_Gabe stated a number of valid points on this thread, but some people appear to only care about is arguing for the sake of arguing. Sigh.
I for the most part agree with you. The problem is that when fighting a terrorist organization Israel is forced to fight on the terrorist ground. The terrorist chose where they want to fight and they hide in UN schools and other places which doesn't leave Israel with much of a chose. In which is a lose lose situation because they can kill the terrorist and have a few civilian causalities due to the terrorist or they can leave the terrorist in which he can come back and commit terrorism again.
Why does every discussion on Israel turn back to the Holocaust, as if Nazi Germany was some kind of justification for their actions against Palestine?
The Holocaust has no relevence to the Israel-Palestine conflict. At all.
Please read the whole topic before picking a few words to post on :shame: . If you actually were posting with knowledge of what has been said instead of trying to flame me you would have noticed that it was brought up on the pro Palestine line :wink: . But anything to flame me instead of going on topic. :shame:
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Not going to deny that the Palestinians aren't being fed the same thing as you are. They just go about it differently. In Israel or even America its fed through, X amount of people were killed today by Y terrorist group, and through socialization fear and hatred for that group is established. In Israel and especially in America such information you hear about that is highly sensationalized and highly inflated with the motives of the people showing the information.
I really i don't understand what you are trying to say here
Im not denying the holocaust however I am saying any proof thereof is an opinion. Someone whos opinion is that it didnt happen would seek things to suit that opinion and vise versa, I personally dont argue its validity, just explaining the mentality behind those that do [or those who question 9/11 or other such events]. Even if they try to act like they are being objective, its just human nature. Whether its the existance of God, the nature of some group, conspiracy theory, etc.
Proof that the holocaust is a fact, i am not going to argue with you over that.
But about a freedom fighter killing civilians, I am sure you are familiar with Star Wars, Im sure the terrorist rebel alliance killed many innocent people on the Death Star. Im sure if there was an actual government this would be what they would be feeding the common man: "Evil terrorist organization called the Rebel Alliance blew up the Death Star [or perhaps some G-rated name for the viewers] and killed millions, including women and children!". Im sure this is what your government is feeding you.Again i really don't understand what you are trying to say here?
Im sorry for the personal attacks if you take it as such. However you dont have exhaustive knowledge about the Palestinians, so even if they resort to terrorism they may not be the bad guys after all. I think of Full Metal Alchemist [the original animated series] when I read your posts, and I think in that show the common man would be lead to believe that the Ishbalins (and other peoples) were evil and terrorists when in reality their own government was the evil ones.Resorting to terrorism does make them bad blowing themselves up to kill, firing rockets to terrorize the list goes on.
Edit: I dont see you as a bad guy I see you a victim as much as the Palestinians.Edit:Edit: Nor am I a big enough fool to think that I will change your opinions about something you have heard your whole life over a forum site. Just presenting the possibility though.
I would like to justify my rambling too. I dont argue the facts because the facts tend to be on the moon, as in they have no relevance since people already know which side they support before joining in a conversation.
I don't see you as a bad guy to :) but i am not a victim of anything but being a witness to the Palestinians terrorism. I do think that if you see enough proof you will slightly change your view.
Actually no i did, i understood. It was previously stated in this thread that the average deaths in a armed conflict is 10 civilian death for 1 combatant.
In Operation cast lead Israel went out of its ways dropping hundreds of thousand of pamphlet warning about the raids and that if there houses were involved in terrorism they should leave it. The IDF made many calls warning people 5 minutes before bombing each building, the IDF also recorded every bombing on the satellite and later uploaded it to you tube for all to see. Israel broke this 10:1 ratio and achieved a ration of 1:1.5 meaning for ever civilian that died 1.5 terrorist were killed. In every conflict there are civilian deaths but the fact that Israel achieved such a amazing ratio seems to be forgotten and left out
They also achieved that ratio by planning for the attack months in advance, even while they were negotiating with Palestine for a ceasefire; I wouldn't call that acting defensively. And despite the ratio, the fact remains that during Operation Cast Lead both sides committed violations of human rights and are guilty of war crimes. I'd also stand to guess that the crippled infrastructure from the bombings hasn't saved any lives; a sentiment echoed by the UN Fact Finding Mission:
Everyone before going to war plans but you are just trying to make Israel out to be the bad guy. Only 2-3 incidence involving 2-3 soldiers each time for israel is what you base your whole argument over. Yes a few soldiers didn't follow orders but in every army you have those types of soldiers i can show you many times in other army's where this has happened. Unlike the IDF who had a few men not following orders and breaking international law. The other side of the war fought by the Palestinians terrorist group Hamas, who consistently broke international law forcing israel to fight against them in UN schools there are many examples of how they broke the law. As a whole group they broke the law unlike the IDF which had individuals who did.
First off the UN fact finding mission was very bias not stating the 10 years of bombardment from rockets. It only criticized Israel. Second the writer of it later took it back saying he had mistaken. Also don't bring me a random quote or i am going to assume your wrote it without showing your source
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You misunderstand, I was never implying that Palestinians haven't committed acts of terror. Neither side can claim total moral superiority; but you said, "Israeli soldiers only kill when they are threatened." As per my previous posts, THAT IS A LIE. Oh, and thanks for taking all of my evidence out of my post when you quoted it, we wouldn't want anything like an honest debate here or anything
Actually no i did, i understood. It was previously stated in this thread that the average deaths in a armed conflict is 10 civilian death for 1 combatant.
In Operation cast lead Israel went out of its ways dropping hundreds of thousand of pamphlet warning about the raids and that if there houses were involved in terrorism they should leave it. The IDF made many calls warning people 5 minutes before bombing each building, the IDF also recorded every bombing on the satellite and later uploaded it to you tube for all to see. Israel broke this 10:1 ratio and achieved a ration of 1:1.5 meaning for ever civilian that died 1.5 terrorist were killed. In every conflict there are civilian deaths but the fact that Israel achieved such a amazing ratio seems to be forgotten and left out
See kids, this is how people brainwashed by their police state react. They are told to mindlessly hate a group and they will kill them withoutYou are making a random accusation, but nice try
Here is the true brainwashing. please find me anything lie this for Jewish children. Here is what Palestinians watch growing up. While Israeli children watch all American cartoons.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkNE__TiMZo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJDNXztFmS0
In the same way there can be proof that the holocaust was true and a lie at the same time there is proof that the Palestinians are freedom fighters and terrorists. In short anything you watch or read about is second hand evidence that can be construed by an individual to suit their motives. Dont believe anything you didn't witness with your own eyes, and even if you did witness it you still wont know the whole picture.
Are you denying the holocaust?
Freedom fighters? you mean terrorist but i guess you like to play with words these " Freedom fighters" fire daily rockets and mortars at Israelis civilians, that is called being a terrorist not a Freedom fighter.
The greatest achievements of democratic police states is that their citizens dont even realize they are being manipulated. That they subconsciously will seek evidence to support their opinions carefully crafted by the media at a young age, and enforced through socialization by society. I honestly feel sorry for you Israel63, maybe one day you and your countrymen will learn to love your neighbors even if they attack you (after all its hard for them to be nice to you after you stole their homes and forced them into the dog house). One day they will stop hating you, but this wont happen until you make the first step.You obviously don't read here you just randomly post i said before that i don't watch Israeli TV i watch American. But again you just like to attack me instead of going on subject.
As far as posting videos about their evils go, I think the person who threw the first punch is responsible for all the ones that come next. Only you can break the cycle of hate.Good you have your opinion, but you again seem to not read anything in this thread you just try to get a quick post to attack me. If you would have read before i said and proven how daily Palestinians terrorist attack Israeli civilians.
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No that is not 100% true in the end the Palestinians terrorist aim to terrorize threw murder. Israeli soldiers only kill when they are threatened, this is a big difference. You can say what you want but in the end you are the brainwashed one, who is to blind to see the truth.
You funny.
I guess you are are blind from the truth so i will show you a few videos of Hamas the terrorist organization firing rockets from UN schools.
Mortar Bombs Shot from UN School in Gaza 29 Oct. 2007, by Palestinians terrorist.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmXXUOs27lI&feature=player_embedded
Note the secondary explosion proof that there was weapons there.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwP_LusgPAw&feature=relmfu
The Palestinians terrorist chose to fight urban warfare fighting with civilians right next to them.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2m4HbiIKKA&feature=relmfu
Hamas terrorist attack IDF soldiers from a UN school.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvBf-Vh4pNg&feature=relmfu
Hamas Booby Trapped School and Zoo.
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In the end, they are both trained to kill. And by the way you talk about Palestinians being terrorists and out to kill the jews, when all they want is their lands back, I'd say they brainwashed you just as much as you say they brainwash their children.
No that is not 100% true in the end the Palestinians terrorist aim to terrorize threw murder. Israeli soldiers only kill when they are threatened, this is a big difference. You can say what you want but in the end you are the brainwashed one, who is to blind to see the truth.
The more you post the more I am convinced Israel is a police state where its media brainwashes you. Enjoy being seen as the new Nazi's after you are brainwashed to have a holocaust against the Palestinians.
I don't watch Israeli TV, i have a satellite connected to American TV nice try :shame: .
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Isreal63, if he/she is Israeli, either has already, or will be eventually serving in the Israeli Defense Force. It's mandatory for Israelis. My peace of mind comes when I see Israelis turning 18 and going to the army to learn how to kill, and on the other side I see Palestinians who are turning 18 and learning the basic nessesities of life. Apprenticeships to learn how to be a carpenter, or a metalworker, or a plumber. They may be less advanced in terms of their quality of life, but their coming of age isn't marked by training in killing. They aren't raised as killers, they are raised to have a passion for their lives and for their culture. Training to live and love, versus training to kill. Training to cultivate and be one with the land, versus training to take land. Training to preserve a culture, versus training to destroy one.
You are right later this year i am enlisting in the army, to protect my homeland from Palestinians terrorist organizations. We don't learn to kill we learn to survive, to stop a terrorist in his tracks so he can't kill us. You are wrong they join terrorist groups to commit acts of terror against the Israeli people. I am not saying all Palestinians are terrorist i am saying a good percentage of them are, One third of them support massacre as this one that is a big part of their people. Coming of age to some of them means a chance to fire rocket and mortars at Israeli civilians. As i said before they do raise killers not all but they do, as i said before 100,000 of the Palestinian youth will go to terrorist summer camps this year. To sum it up what you just said it a complete lie in order to serve your goal, that is not the way to debate. You debate on facts not on lie and your "personal experiences". I can give you many Jewish experiences to, but i prefer the facts then your word.
In israel kid grow up watching cartoons like the rest of the world in gaza they watch stuff like this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gi-c6lbFGC4&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTGbP55HGi8&feature=player_embedded
Here's the last thing I'll say in this thread.
Israel makes everyone have an army training by 18.
According to you, Palestinians do it earlier.
Where's the diference? Besides the age.
You are right every Israeli goes to the army, but only part actually have military training, in one of the most human armies in the world. They go to protect their families from Palestinians terrorist organizations who are sworn to destroy israel and deny Israel's right to exist. Unlike the Palestinians terrorist organizations who blow themselves up to kill Israeli civilians.
The difference from the age is they are brought up hating and wanting to die for terrorism from the birth, as oppose to Jews who Enlist in a army (at age 18 not 0) not a terrorist organization like Palestinians. The Jews enlist to protect their homes from these Palestinians terrorist organizations.
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You are right later this year i am enlisting in the army, to protect my homeland from Palestinians terrorist organizations.
I say that the Palestinians are the real children of Isaac. And who are you to challenge Gods people Mr. Pretender? Unless you can prove otherwise.
What does that have to do with anything i said? it doesn't have anything to do with each other if you want to say something say it but not by posting random stuff.
perception. Thin line between terrorist and freedom fighter.
First off nice posting something unrelated to what i post again. No it is not a thin line Terrorist aim to kill innocent civilian which is what Palestinians terrorist attempted to do daily
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You are right later this year i am enlisting in the army, to protect my homeland from Palestinians terrorist organizations.
I say that the Palestinians are the real children of Isaac. And who are you to challenge Gods people Mr. Pretender? Unless you can prove otherwise.
What does that have to do with anything i said? it doesn't have anything to do with each other if you want to say something say it but not by posting random stuff.
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Isreal63, if he/she is Israeli, either has already, or will be eventually serving in the Israeli Defense Force. It's mandatory for Israelis. My peace of mind comes when I see Israelis turning 18 and going to the army to learn how to kill, and on the other side I see Palestinians who are turning 18 and learning the basic nessesities of life. Apprenticeships to learn how to be a carpenter, or a metalworker, or a plumber. They may be less advanced in terms of their quality of life, but their coming of age isn't marked by training in killing. They aren't raised as killers, they are raised to have a passion for their lives and for their culture. Training to live and love, versus training to kill. Training to cultivate and be one with the land, versus training to take land. Training to preserve a culture, versus training to destroy one.
You are right later this year i am enlisting in the army, to protect my homeland from Palestinians terrorist organizations. We don't learn to kill we learn to survive, to stop a terrorist in his tracks so he can't kill us. You are wrong they join terrorist groups to commit acts of terror against the Israeli people. I am not saying all Palestinians are terrorist i am saying a good percentage of them are, One third of them support massacre as this one that is a big part of their people. Coming of age to some of them means a chance to fire rocket and mortars at Israeli civilians. As i said before they do raise killers not all but they do, as i said before 100,000 of the Palestinian youth will go to terrorist summer camps this year. To sum it up what you just said it a complete lie in order to serve your goal, that is not the way to debate. You debate on facts not on lie and your "personal experiences". I can give you many Jewish experiences to, but i prefer the facts then your word.
In israel kid grow up watching cartoons like the rest of the world in gaza they watch stuff like this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gi-c6lbFGC4&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTGbP55HGi8&feature=player_embedded
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So basically you are trying to say the Jewish State of Israel doesn't have a right to exist. Good to know where you stand.
Oh lawd, talk about putting words in one's mouth.
Please show me where I say anything about Israel not having a right to exist.
First off i didn't put words in your mouth so don't lie, i said what i understood from your post. You said if Israel just got up and left their would be know problem.
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I'm fairly sure that if you got up and left completely (to somewhere decently far away, like somewhere in Africa, Russia, Europe, etc.) then they would leave you alone.
So basically you are trying to say the Jewish State of Israel doesn't have a right to exist. Good to know where you stand.
old account
in Help and Advice
Posted
Hi,
i used to play runescape i stopped playing a few years ago. when looking for a new game on my phone i found out there is a runescape app. Awesome! i tried logging into my account that i spent years on to find out i have been banned for botting. i have tried to contact runescape directly but i cant get to anyone to talk to. Does anybody know a way to contact tsomeone to try to recover my account
Thank you!!!!!!