Doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of... I don't know... Every game on the planet? Every MMO at least. Sort of. Nah, I'd say every game on the planet. (This post isn't directly at you, Kimberly, or Wicked, but Firedruid and the point he made.) How many popular video games or online games do you know of that don't have some sort of leaderboard or highscores? If you look on sites like Miniclip or Addictinggames, every game has a highscores feature or something similar. Yes, you play games for fun. But no matter how much you play it for "fun", at some point it will get competitive. I can't think of a single example where a game started out just for fun, and stayed just for fun for its entire lifetime, that also wasn't a complete failure or otherwise totally unknown. I doubt when James Naismith invented a new game for his Physical Education students to play during the winter, he intended to create an internationally recognized Olympic sport that draws millions of viewers and thousands of competitors of all age levels. Yet today we have basketball that's just that, if not even greater. It's the simple fact that some people play games (sports included as a form of game) competitively because they enjoy playing it competitively. True, some may be in it because they simply think the game is fun, and yeah I'm not going to deny that there are those people who play just because they want to reap the rewards. But if you mean to tell me that every member of a varsity sports team is playing for the wrong reason, I'm going to have to flat out disagree. [hide=Aside] I know I'm drawing a comparison between games and sports, which may not be entirely a good comparison to make. However they are both essentially the same thing. Both are designed for "fun" on a very basic scale, but can be taken to very competitive levels. Thus, for the sake of this argument, they fall under the same category, and to say otherwise, although plausible, would forfeit the purpose of this argument. [/hide]