Bird Problems.

[Guest User]

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[Bloodstain]

Whats wrong with dogs outside 24/7 :? (if they have acces to a shelter)

 

 

 

Dogs are animals. Yes, everyone understands this point. But what people fail to grasp apparently, is that they are bred for DOMESTICATION. That means relying on humans to take care of them, not ignoring them and leaving them outside exposed to the elements and god knows what else. Ticks, disease, sickness. Anything.

 

 

 

Who said he is ignoring the dogs?

 

 

 

Dogs are pack animals, they NEED to be with their pack (you and your family). Leaving them outside and visiting them once a day do not cut it. Most people who own outdoor dogs do not walk or exercise their dog (which some in this thread think that dogs outside do get exercise.) They do not let them in during hot days or cold days. That most certainly is ignoring them, borderline neglecting them.

[scn64]

Train your dogs to catch and eat birds. Then, when you come out to feed them, they'll be getting a double meal.

[Guest User]

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[unkn0wnwarrior]

However, they have fur, they are animals.

 

They don't have fur covering the pads of their feet. And if those get damaged in any way, it is an excruciating amount of pain for a dog.

 

 

 

Dogs need space to run, as you stated, and they sure won't get that inside now will they?

 

They will when you let the outside for a while. I have had dogs my entire life, more or less. They were primarily inside dogs, but they were allowed outside when we were. They have always been in great shape because we let them out daily. Walks, runs, fetch, whatever. Generally speaking, inside dogs in this area are far healthier and seem much happier as a result.

 

 

 

On topic, I don't have any suggestions that haven't already been, er, suggested.

[Zierro]

The only problem I have with outside dogs is when they keep barking which disturbs the neighbors. But if your dog knows how to shut up, I see nothing wrong with them living outside as long as they have some form of shelter from the sun.

 

 

 

PS: It's funny how this thread got so serious all of a sudden. :lol:

[Guest User]

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[Bloodstain]

Therefore, me going outside and playing with them, taking them on walks, etc. IS better than a non-existent dog park.

 

 

 

I mentioned the dog parks because it is the best off leash (or on leash) exercise that I know of, but walking is good also. If you take your two dogs for more than an hour walk a day then good, because a labrador is going to need a hell of a lot of exercise every day to be happy.

 

 

 

 

Two dogs, two dog houses, to each his own. We put cedar shavings in their as well for insulation during the winter, and if it does get to cold, we allow them to come into the basement for warmth. However, they have fur, they are animals. When it gets hot during the summer months, we set up a tarp for extended shade. Underneath that tarp we set up a pool. They get hot, they jump in. Instantly cooled.

 

 

 

Unless those dog houses are heated for the winter months then they really should not be outside during the winter. Do you know anything about a dogs diet, a dogs fat reserves, or they amount of calories extra required for winter outside? Because I'm guessing you don't, and to top it all off you are probably not giving them a very good food for winter. They have fur, but they are bred not to be outside all the time. Dogs have not had to live outside during the winter for many, many years, your dogs are not fit to live outside during the winter. Any type of outdoor shelter you can provide for them will pale in comparison to indoors, so why the hell don't you let them indoors?

 

 

 

If you do have a lab like you said, IT SHOULD NOT BE OUTSIDE FOR LONG PERIODS OF TIME DURING WINTER! Their coats are very thin, they come from a place that has VERY VERY mild winters. Dogs as a whole should not stay outside during winter, but people who leave common short hair dogs like labs outside during winter are just stupid. I mean, I would understand how someone can mistake that a husky would be ok outside during winter, but a freaking lab?

 

 

 

How often do you change the pool water? Dirty water is a breeding ground for various bacteria and bugs. During the summer heat, warm water does not get absorbed as quickly as cold water, and unless you are changing the water for your dogs every hour on the hour during summer, all their water will be warm.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Somebody will not take my dogs. One of them will bite somebody trying to take them. The other will go along, but why would they want him. How are they going to sell him? He isn't worth anything of monetary value. Dogs need space to run, as you stated, and they sure won't get that inside now will they? As for the vet, when it is scheduled they go, they go. So to whomever may have called me or others bad dog owners, what the hell?

 

 

 

People take dogs for more reasons than just to sell them. I've heard from someone who had their pitbull stolen from their backyard while they were out shopping, and considering it was a pitbull and in a not so great part of America, it was no doubt stolen for dog fighting. Pitbulls aren't the only dog that is fought. Hell, on the radio a couple months ago there was a lady sobbing because someone stole her dog out of her yard, they DID get the dog back eventually though (a person heard her on the radio, then was confronted by some guys who wanted to know if he would like to buy a dog, a dog that matched the exact description of the lady's. He bought it from them and gave it to her).

 

 

 

Dogs aren't running machines, if you exercise them sufficiently then they will not need to be left outside. A backyard isn't even enough space to run in. I let my dog outside, only difference is I actually do activities with him when he is outside, although I do sometimes let him just lay out on the deck. Inside dog does not mean never outside, it means they live inside and get outside exercise. Best of both worlds, none of the problems of either.

 

 

 

 

To comment on your other posts. Domestication does not mean inside. Are cows not domesticated? What about pigs? How are they going to get hurt within the premises of my backyard? Jump out of a tree? Your dog is 20lbs. My dog, not so much. If my labrador weighed 20lbs, THEN I would agree with you that I am the worst dog owner on Earth. However, he is of a healthy weight. Loves it outside. Your mind might explode if you lived where I do. It seems nearly every dog is an outside dog. Some are even chained up. :ohnoes:

 

 

 

P.S. It's nearly 80 degress outside and :ohnoes: they are outside! Poor things...

 

 

 

Cows are domesticated to be livestock, to be eaten. Dogs are bred to be companions, or working dogs (which your dog isn't). They can get hurt any variety of ways, eating stuff they shouldn't, eating dead things (my dog has found dead birds in my yard before), dogs or cats or other animals coming IN, people throwing [cabbage] over your fence because they don't like your dog (happens more than you'd think, anti freeze is a good one), cutting paw pads, anything. It is better to let them live inside where it is safe, and either let them outside while you are home and can atleast watch them some what and let them in when it gets dark (this if IF exercise is too much of a hassle for a dog owner, even though rehoming would be best).

 

 

 

You know what? My dog likes the smell of chocolate. You know why I don't let him eat it? Because it is dangerous for him and he is a stupid dog, he does not know what is and isn't dangerous. My dog also likes to eat dead, decomposing things, so should I let him eat them? No, because that is stupid. Dogs are stupid, he might like the outdoors but he isn't going to be miserable if you make him live inside and let him outside (if you aren't too lazy to give him enough exercise a day).

 

 

 

30 celsius is [bleep]ing hot for a dog, congrats on taking horrible care of your dogs.

[Bloodstain]

However, they have fur, they are animals.

 

They don't have fur covering the pads of their feet. And if those get damaged in any way, it is an excruciating amount of pain for a dog.

 

 

 

Dogs need space to run, as you stated, and they sure won't get that inside now will they?

 

They will when you let the outside for a while. I have had dogs my entire life, more or less. They were primarily inside dogs, but they were allowed outside when we were. They have always been in great shape because we let them out daily. Walks, runs, fetch, whatever. Generally speaking, inside dogs in this area are far healthier and seem much happier as a result.

 

 

 

On topic, I don't have any suggestions that haven't already been, er, suggested.

 

 

 

I assume it is the difference of location. In addition to the fact that they are animals, dogs don't smell like roses which to me don't smell good to begin with. I don't want my house smelling like dog when you walk in. Because you can always smell when somebody has an inside dog.

 

 

 

Obviously, if my dogs weren't well taken care of two things would have happened.

 

A. The birds would be eating them because they dropped dead.

 

B. My neighbors would have called the aninmal rescue joint on me.

 

 

 

And no, they don't bark constantly through the night, or even the day.

 

 

 

They are animals, but why does that mean you need to treat them like crap? You bought them, you took responsibility for them, now take care of them. Dogs don't have a smell if you take good care of them, groom them, feed them GOOD food (food can make a HUGE HUGE HUGE difference between a LOT of things for a dog. Bad food can cause anything from a greasy coat to farting.). Don't like how a dog "smells" inside? Don't get a dog you aren't prepared to take care of.

 

 

 

 

 

YOU are an animal, so go spend 72 hours outside. 30 celsius heat, no AC, no fresh water on demand, lets see how long you last. Oh, and wear a sweater to simulate dog fur

[unkn0wnwarrior]

Don't get me wrong, I was just pointing out my own local situation. I am not saying you or anyone is a bad dog owner, as I don't know the full situation in each case. But I have to say, you can't always tell by the smell who has a dog. Most people can't tell I have one, for example, unless they see the dog or it's bed/toy basket.

 

 

 

Also, I know people who have very healthy outside dogs, including one with a dog who is about to turn 15. As long as it has enough shelter, it is generally okay to keep it outside, although inside is better in the coldest and hottest months.

[indy500fan]

I bet you were one of the people complaining about dogs being left behind during the hurricane Katrina evacuation when there were still plenty of people to rescue.

[Bloodstain]

 

Also, I know people who have very healthy outside dogs, including one with a dog who is about to turn 15. As long as it has enough shelter, it is generally okay to keep it outside, although inside is better in the coldest and hottest months.

 

 

 

My problem is this. You got a dog, take care of it. Anything you can provide them shelter wise will never be as good as a house. Dogs are pack animals, they need to be with their pack. If people can't handle having a dog in the house, or exercising it, or training it, or anything, then get rid of it and give it to someone who will. It might appear happy, but how would you like to spend every day of summer in boiling heat with a sweater on by yourself? Looking healthy and being deemed healthy as a vet are different things, although as you said I don't know their situation. A dog will always, always, always be healthier living as indoor dog rather than an outdoor. Why bother having to pay for vet bills caused by having an outdoor dog when you can just keep an indoor dog? That is assuming the people who own outdoor dogs can even notice the injury or sickness, and then if they even take the dog to the vet instead of "letting him stay for a while and see if it goes away"

[Bloodstain]

I bet you were one of the people complaining about dogs being left behind during the hurricane Katrina evacuation when there were still plenty of people to rescue.

 

 

 

I do not know the Katrina thing, but human lives > dogs, but if you can save both then do it. You seem to mistake me for someone who is a PETA freak, rather than someone who actually knows how to take care of dogs.

[unkn0wnwarrior]

 

Also, I know people who have very healthy outside dogs, including one with a dog who is about to turn 15. As long as it has enough shelter, it is generally okay to keep it outside, although inside is better in the coldest and hottest months.

 

 

 

My problem is this. You got a dog, take care of it. Anything you can provide them shelter wise will never be as good as a house. Dogs are pack animals, they need to be with their pack. If people can't handle having a dog in the house, or exercising it, or training it, or anything, then get rid of it and give it to someone who will. It might appear happy, but how would you like to spend every day of summer in boiling heat with a sweater on by yourself? Looking healthy and being deemed healthy as a vet are different things, although as you said I don't know their situation. A dog will always, always, always be healthier living as indoor dog rather than an outdoor. Why bother having to pay for vet bills caused by having an outdoor dog when you can just keep an indoor dog? That is assuming the people who own outdoor dogs can even notice the injury or sickness, and then if they even take the dog to the vet instead of "letting him stay for a while and see if it goes away"

 

I'm not sure the pack argument works very well, as most dogs will be alone on average one third of the day either way. Most parents work and most children have school. In many cases, school and work come at the same time. So the dog will inevitably be alone either way. All cases I brought up were based on veterinary visits, so they were all quite healthy by the vet's own words. And everybody I have mentioned both loves and takes care of their dogs like a part of the family, apart from living outside in those cases.

 

 

 

By the way, I agree with your response regarding the Katrina thing. If you can save the dogs, you should.

[Zierro]

YOU are an animal, so go spend 72 hours outside. 30 celsius heat, no AC, no fresh water on demand, lets see how long you last. Oh, and wear a sweater to simulate dog fur

 

 

 

That's a bad comparison. Humans are naturally whiny animals. Dogs eat off the floor and there's nothing wrong with it - they don't really care. A person eating off the floor is a lot different. Just because we don't like eating off the floor is no argument against dogs eating off the floor.

[Bloodstain]

 

Also, I know people who have very healthy outside dogs, including one with a dog who is about to turn 15. As long as it has enough shelter, it is generally okay to keep it outside, although inside is better in the coldest and hottest months.

 

 

 

My problem is this. You got a dog, take care of it. Anything you can provide them shelter wise will never be as good as a house. Dogs are pack animals, they need to be with their pack. If people can't handle having a dog in the house, or exercising it, or training it, or anything, then get rid of it and give it to someone who will. It might appear happy, but how would you like to spend every day of summer in boiling heat with a sweater on by yourself? Looking healthy and being deemed healthy as a vet are different things, although as you said I don't know their situation. A dog will always, always, always be healthier living as indoor dog rather than an outdoor. Why bother having to pay for vet bills caused by having an outdoor dog when you can just keep an indoor dog? That is assuming the people who own outdoor dogs can even notice the injury or sickness, and then if they even take the dog to the vet instead of "letting him stay for a while and see if it goes away"

 

I'm not sure the pack argument works very well, as most dogs will be alone on average one third of the day either way. Most parents work and most children have school. In many cases, school and work come at the same time. So the dog will inevitably be alone either way.

 

 

 

Yes, but when you are home the dog will likely be with you at all times, or near you. As opposed to an outdoor dog who likely only gets interaction with its family only a couple times a day for less than an hour two. Dogs are pack animals, it's a pretty well known fact. That doesn't mean you need to be together at ALL times, just that there needs to be an establish hierarchy that you often cannot have with an outdoor dog. The dogs also need to be around their "pack" for reliance and companionship, affection, etc.

 

 

 

Really, I can't seem to find a reason NOT to keep a dog inside, aside from being too lazy to exercise, not wanting to train, and stupid excuses like shedding where they should not have got a dog.

[Bloodstain]

YOU are an animal, so go spend 72 hours outside. 30 celsius heat, no AC, no fresh water on demand, lets see how long you last. Oh, and wear a sweater to simulate dog fur

 

 

 

That's a bad comparison. Humans are naturally whiny animals. Dogs eat off the floor and there's nothing wrong with it - they don't really care. A person eating off the floor is a lot different. Just because we don't like eating off the floor is no argument against dogs eating off the floor.

 

 

 

The floor? What the hell are you talking about? You are telling me that dogs LIKE being in 30+ celsius weather with a fur coat on their back? Do explain. I'm not giving it as a comparison, I'm saying you THINK they enjoy it, then go do it for yourself and see how bad it is.

 

 

 

edit: I can understand that dogs like outdoors. If my dog wants outside, he goes outside. However, if I am going to be somewhere or doing something that makes me unable to check on him every ~15 minutes, he comes inside. Making a dog live outside though is just stupid

[Zierro]

I'm saying you THINK they enjoy it, then go do it for yourself and see how bad it is.

 

 

 

Didn't my post completely go over this? You can't compare what a dog likes/dislikes to what a person likes/dislikes. Really, we're just gonna go in circles if you keep this up.

[Guest User]

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[Bloodstain]

I'm saying you THINK they enjoy it, then go do it for yourself and see how bad it is.

 

 

 

Didn't my post completely go over this? You can't compare what a dog likes/dislikes to what a person likes/dislikes. Really, we're just gonna go in circles if you keep this up.

 

 

 

Tell me how in the hell a dog would ENJOY being in 30+ celsius weather wearing a fur coat? Does it like being over heated? Does it like being incredibly hot? No animal would like being over heated, and a human is certainly no exception

[Guest User]

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[Zierro]

Tell me where in my post did I say or even imply that they liked being overheated. I just said it was a horrible example. Humans would complain about eating off the floor - something dogs have no problem with. If they are going to complain about something as simple as that then it's not a good idea to compare them.

 

 

 

Humans also don't like the taste of dog food. Does this mean we should feed dogs steak every night and that any other food is wrong? Oh yeah and people don't like using the grass as their bathroom.

 

 

 

Dogs =/= Humans. That's the bottom line here.

[Bloodstain]

 

 

 

My dogs have had to live outside for many, many years. So I think you are mistaken. Do you have a veterinary license or certification or anything??? Did you even read my statement that I LET THEM INTO THE BASEMENT FOR WARMTH WHEN IT GETS TOO COLD FOR THEM DURING THE WITNER. :wall:

 

 

 

Unless you are letting them in ever night, then you are not letting them in enough. call your vet, ask general questions about forcing a dog to live outside. Ask about cold winter, hot summer, diet during winter, behavior, and pack mentality.

 

 

I love the fallacies within your argument. You have resorted to attacking me, calling "stupid", instead of defending your position. And do tell me, how is it a husky isn't fine in the winter outside? Are those not the sled dogs in Alaska and colder countries around the world? So to you, I assure you, I am not stupid.

 

 

 

What fallacie? There is a difference from huskys you find at pet stores and rescues and shelters and the ones bred and raised in Alaska for the purpose of being sled dogs. Sled dogs also have more than 5 other dogs to huddle up with when on sled expeditions, that is if they don't get some sort of shelter brought with them. When not sledding and at home, I highly doubt they are left outside, and at the very minimum have heated shelters.

 

 

Again, I'm not stupid. I know what dirty water looks like. I know how to change the water in the pool. Personally, warm water is better than no water. And, have you ever been swimming at a pool? The water tends to remain relatively cool. Much cooler than the air temperature. Seems to cool them off just fine.

 

Dirty water doesn't just look dirty. If I took a leak in your pool you would never know it. Know what the difference between your pool and a human in ground pool is? Heating and cooling in the pools (and chemicals that keep it relatively clean). Know what's better than a pool? A house with AC. I also have a kiddy pool for my dog.

 

 

Dog thievery isn't much of a problem around these parts. So if he does get stolen.. he was free. :lol: Attack me on that statement please. Tell me I don't love my dog enough.

 

 

 

It is still a risk though, why would you continue taking this risk when you could just let him inside?

 

 

 

 

Have you seen my backyard? No. And again, what problems are there with staying outside. They seem to be doing fine at the moment.

 

 

 

Unless your backyard is some monstrous fenced in yard then I doubt it's enough. Walking and running around a yard every now and then isn't enough exercise. The elements are also a problem. Everything I've said so far, it's like you're getting me to repeat everything I've already said.

 

 

 

 

So what do you say to the people who have working dogs?? Physical labor for a dog, oh my. My dogs have caught birds before. They are still alive. If somebody is throwing anti-freeze in my yard, they are going far out of there way to do it, and they better hope they don't get caught. My dogs are not afraid of the dark. They will fair well at night.

 

 

 

Working dogs are awesome. Dogs like border collies that are bred to herd love to herd. It's great exercise for them and they love doing it, and they get to spend all day with their owner. Your dogs aren't afraid of the dark, oh my, I guess that makes it ok then!

 

 

 

 

Where did I say he was going to be miserable inside? I didn't. I don't want them inside. They stink. They are animals. The outside is where they are, and where they shall remain. Oh, and my dog is pretty smart.

 

 

 

Those are all reasons not to get a dog in the first place. You got a dog, take care of it, that means providing adequate shelter, socialization, stimulation, and exercise. Not just throwing them outside and going to visit when it is convenient. Your dog is no smarter than any other dog, and I would assume stupider do to the lack of exercise, obedience, training, and mental stimulation

 

 

30 celsius is [bleep] hot for a dog, congrats on taking horrible care of your dogs.

 

86 FahrenheitI converted all by myself. Geez I'm so stupid. is "[bleep] hot". Seriously? Add another 5 of your degrees to that thirty and that's how hot it is supposed to get next week.

 

 

 

 

 

I'm from Manitoba, it gets down to -40/-50 during the winter and usually only up to 30 or 40 C during the summer. Regardless, it is damn hot for anything.

[Zierro]

It is still a risk though, why would you continue taking this risk when you could just let him inside?

 

 

 

It's also a risk to keep them inside because of house fires.

[Bloodstain]

Tell me where in my post did I say or even imply that they liked being overheated. I just said it was a horrible example. Humans would complain about eating off the floor - something dogs have no problem with. If they are going to complain about something as simple as that then it's not a good idea to compare them.

 

 

 

Humans also don't like the taste of dog food. Does this mean we should feed dogs steak every night and that any other food is wrong? Oh yeah and people don't like using the grass as their bathroom.

 

 

 

Dogs =/= Humans. That's the bottom line here.

 

 

 

How is it a horrible example? I am saying nothing likes being incredibly hot, and if you think the dog does then just go out and see what it's like.

 

 

 

We don't like the taste of dog food, dogs do, it is healthier for dogs than steak, so we give them dog food

 

 

 

Dogs can eat off the floor because they have more bacteria in their body that protects them against different things that can be found on the floor

 

 

 

Dogs do not = humans, I know. But dogs are not self aware, they do however have instincts and sensations. Heat is heat no matter what animal you are, and excessive heat is not fun.