Gemeos2

I'm good with whatever people do, as long as they have a choice to do something else, if they want to.

I have to sit down 99% of the time I work. And I choose to work around 15 hours per day (including weekends). If you can tolerate something, you can choose to tolerate anything you want. Some people tolerate laying down in bed at least 10 hours per day.

If you want to love RS, just think about something you love already and replace the picture by one related to RS. Yup, getting the state of what psychologists call "falling in love" is not that special. Anyway, it might take a way more than loving something or someone in order to not burn out from it. Excuse me, I loved my ex and I still broke up with him.

Honestly it's hard for me to gain an understanding of what it was for me. I was an elite athlete in a very demanding sport for a number of years. For me it was a determination and a fascination to improve and to see improvement. Every day I went out and did my training, but I also considered myself a 24 hour athlete - I made sure I made all the right decisions every day in order to achieve my goal which was the Olympics. Sport was an addiction for me, that I am most sure of, but I also loved the sport and what I did. My mental strategy wasn't really a strategy, of course you need to think of the best way to achieve your goal but for me it was just about getting to where I wanted to go. I felt very strongly about what I wanted to do and I would stop at nothing to get there. I see beliefs and mental strategies listed there. You might not be aware of it since it's an automatic (unconscious) proccess to you. I mean, some people don't know how they motivate themselfs to stand up from bed. Yet most people just start by insulting themselfs in a inner voice and make horrible pictures of consequences if they get late and just intensify them over and over again, until it feels too bad to stay at bed and finally stand up. And then they say they hate leaving bed and love sleeping - no surprise! When you thought about going out and do your training, what did you do internally right before? You needed to motivate yourself to do it, how did you do it? You believed that you were an "24hour athlete" - that's a good thing to believe. Most people just believe they suck and never go too far. How did you make the decisions? To feel so strongly about it, you had to put pictures in a certain place and probably hear your inner voice in a very motivational tone whenever you thought about it. I've helped some people get motivated to RS before. When they told me how their inner voice sounded... well, it was worse than Mickey Mouse tone of voice! I bet yours and every other top player inner voice is much different.

What's the mental strategy for every single top player to keep themselfs motivated and determined? Anyone that wants to achieve a goal that takes thousands of hours should be more worried about mental strategies instead of "physical" strategies. People from sports, etc know this.

You guys scare me.

Assuming that in a unrealistic world each tick occours each 0.6 secounds, broad arrows max XP rate is 675k XP/hr

But the point is happiness is subjective and your perceived concept of a perfectly happy lifestyle is just as wrong as the ones you are judging. People are unique and we all enjoy different balances of different things. Some people are asexual/aromantic for no reason other than they don't feel those emotions. Some people absolutely don't go out and party because they don't enjoy it. There is nothing wrong with these people, they are simply being themselves. Pretty sure his message is saying that most people most of the time would regret devoting 20-30k hours to runescape and that for any typical person to go after such a goal they would likely regret the years they put into it. Sure you can balance life with runescape but you really can't and be a top player. I have a problem with that "regret" thing people talk about so often and "unfinished business". Let's be honest about your time. Whatever you have done on the past is a proccess that ended. There's nothing to "finish" and nothing to "regret" because you will NOT be able to change it. If you wanna regret anything, choose regret spending your time on present feeling bad about something that you can't change. When my grandfather was dying from cancer he told me "If I regret anything that I have done, it is looking at my past while my future just pass by without me noticing it". And you can really change your future. Well, every time you do something, you are sacrificing another, whether you're aware of it or not. So, you're 24/7 sacrificing something that you could do instead. If choose to go through that, I would like you to save time and immediatly lock yourself into a mental hospital because that's what will happen to you if you bother with that too much. :D This is one of the reasons why you should focous on doing what makes you happy. Suomi, Drumgun, Forsberg, et al sacrificed their lives to gain xp so I'm not sure where these top 200m all contenders with balanced lives you speak of are. Last time I checked, it takes at least 20,000 hours to get 200M all without spins (over 30k for Suomi IIRC). Care to explain how one can remain a top contender for that achievement while playing in moderation? Be specific with your hours logged. If your point was that anyone can get 99 all skills in moderation these days, then yes I would probably agree with you, especially if they were buying spins. But 200m all skills? No way, Jose. How can you be this stupid? Do you have anything aside from meaningless ad hominems? Your assertion is completely delusional - the math and empirical evidence is completely against you. It is not possible to get the sort of experience gains that top players do within the timespan that they do by just playing in moderation. It is simply not possible no matter how much you want to believe otherwise. That's not an insult or indictment of top players, it's just a fact. Yes, to get top rank you'd have to sacrifice some aspects of your life, but I'm arguing against something you implied, that gaining exp requires it. You can play like 12 hours a day and don't have to sacrifice anything, so 200m all doesn't require sacrificing anything major, besides, in a year from now it will be 5k hours so it won't matter. I didn't say gaining experience requires it. I said gaining experience at the rate that top players do it and within the timespan they gain it in does. There's a different between those two statements and it's not subtle. Also, 12 hours is not 'moderate' gameplay even by generous definitions. That's more time than a full-time job, and half your day. It's completely astounding that you think people who sit at a computer (aside from say the well documented medical issues, such as say back problems, eye-sight, etc.) aren't sacrificing anything. They are sacrificing their health and a myriad of other things. You can argue that's their choice and that they have the right to do this, but it's completely unscientific, and not to mention pretty much contradicted by health sciences (physical and psychological), to claim that they aren't sacrificing anything. Again, it's not an insult, it's an observation. They have obviously chosen to do certain things, but it's obvious that they had to give up other things to do so. Even half that time, say 6 hours a day daily on a game is barely moderate. By historical standards or even contemporary standards (depending on what place you look at it), spending 12+ hours on a purely non-productive, purely leisurely, and mostly non-educational activity is not moderate. Ofc it's not scientific and not according to "health sciencies" and I'm glad I don't agree with those. Once I had an interesting client that proves that "health sciences" are crap. He told me that his routine before dating was work hard on his goals during the day and relax in his home for the rest of the day and he was a really happy guy. Then he started dating and was still happy and kept spending the rest of the day with in his home but with his girlfriend. So, they broke up and he felt terrible and decided to go to a psychologist (health science professional, right?). So, the psychologist made him feel better about the broke up proccess and then the psychologist insisted that the guy had to change his routines. The guy asked "why? I am happy!" and she said "well, you need to be social and communicate with lots of people otherwise you can't be healthy!!!". So the poor guy changed his routines and indeed started to have more and more friends but he was also about to suicide. So, he came to me and asked for my help. I told him "go back to your routine." He looked at me thinking that I was even more crazy than him but still decided to go back to his routine - what really made him happy. And he's now as happy as he was before dating and all the mess. See, Psychologists work are based on statistics. My question is "What do you do when someone doesn't work like most people?". Not even a single psychiatrist or psychologist gave me a answer to that one. No. It's a scientific fact that sitting on a computer for 12+ hours can lead you to have all sorts of health-related problems. Secondly, perhaps you don't take psychology seriously, but I do. That's not to say there isn't fluffy stuff in there (Freud anyone?), but there's also loads of useful stuff supported by evidence about things such as normal and healthy behaviours, what constitutes a well-adjusted individual, happiness and well-being. It's not merely mumbo-jumbo. Aside from that, your anecdote is just that, an anecdote. The whole of psychology is not made irrelevant because of one case (which seems to be the implication in your anecdote). There are always extreme cases or unique cases or outliers. That some people can lead healthy lives despite playing 12+ hours does not make the generalization that it is not healthy/moderate/appropriate for most normal people untrue. I definitely have a problem with the field of whatsocalled "Psychology". Probably because I take it in a more serious and respectful way than psychologists. Let me share with you one of my favorites about them: Once I went to talk with this psychiatrist and I just sat there with my arms and legs crossed which is my expression of "alright, show me what you got!" because I'm really open to new ideas. In fact, most of my clients has taught me a lot of stuff I know. The psychiatrist just looks at me and says "Mr. X! I see you have your arms and legs crossed!" and I said "Yea, I do. What's the problem?" and he said "Well, according to Sigmund Freud that means you're not open to new ideas!" I immediatly interrumpted him and asked "Excuse me? Sickman Freud? Just because I have my legs and arms crossed my brain and my ears won't work?" :D And from Freud came the idea that you can read behavour. "Reading body language" one of my favorite topics to laugh about when I want to hear some comedy. Anyway, I have more respect about human mind than psychologists because of many reasons. One of them is because I take into account that every single individual works differently. And every single client that I meet is the "proof" of that. Also, this is what makes me solve "uncurable" cases that psychologist and psychiatrist can't solve. So, please, don't tell me that I don't take human mind seriously. Also, I don't think that top players are "common cases". I believe they are what you guys call "extreme cases". (In my eyes every single human mind is different so every single one is extreme, I guess). So, why not talk about extreme stuff? Makes it more congruent. Aren't you training/studying to become a psychologist in the coming years? Ironic that this gets mentioned from you if what I asked is true. If I ever sign as a psychologist, please just kill me for incompetence.

But the point is happiness is subjective and your perceived concept of a perfectly happy lifestyle is just as wrong as the ones you are judging. People are unique and we all enjoy different balances of different things. Some people are asexual/aromantic for no reason other than they don't feel those emotions. Some people absolutely don't go out and party because they don't enjoy it. There is nothing wrong with these people, they are simply being themselves. Pretty sure his message is saying that most people most of the time would regret devoting 20-30k hours to runescape and that for any typical person to go after such a goal they would likely regret the years they put into it. Sure you can balance life with runescape but you really can't and be a top player. I have a problem with that "regret" thing people talk about so often and "unfinished business". Let's be honest about your time. Whatever you have done on the past is a proccess that ended. There's nothing to "finish" and nothing to "regret" because you will NOT be able to change it. If you wanna regret anything, choose regret spending your time on present feeling bad about something that you can't change. I agree with more or less everything you're talking about on a philosophical level. But with that said, I don't think these ideas are very realistic or accurate explanations of real human behavior. In other words, you're talking about how people should behave, I'm talking about how people actually behave. You're right that most of the time people feel regret for no logical reason. But that doesn't change the fact that they do feel regret. You should make a new thread for this discussion, it's fun to talk about. Also, if the guy was happy, then why did he go to the psychologist in the first place? That doesn't make any sense. >Breaks up w/ girlfriend, "feels terrible" >Goes to psychologist because he "feels terrible" >Psychologist advises him to change his routine such that he can feel happy instead of feeling terrible >Guy refuses to change his routine because he (suddenly) "feels happy" :huh: It was on this order: >Happy with his routines >Starts to date and still hapy without changing his routines >Broke up >Go to psychologist >Psychologist helps him "recover" from break up proccess >He feels happy again >Psychologist tells him to change his routines >He feels suicidal but with lots of friends (oh, the science) That was just me, kind of metaphorically, trying to exlpain that "science" and "normal" won't produce the same response for everyone.

But the point is happiness is subjective and your perceived concept of a perfectly happy lifestyle is just as wrong as the ones you are judging. People are unique and we all enjoy different balances of different things. Some people are asexual/aromantic for no reason other than they don't feel those emotions. Some people absolutely don't go out and party because they don't enjoy it. There is nothing wrong with these people, they are simply being themselves. Pretty sure his message is saying that most people most of the time would regret devoting 20-30k hours to runescape and that for any typical person to go after such a goal they would likely regret the years they put into it. Sure you can balance life with runescape but you really can't and be a top player. I have a problem with that "regret" thing people talk about so often and "unfinished business". Let's be honest about your time. Whatever you have done on the past is a proccess that ended. There's nothing to "finish" and nothing to "regret" because you will NOT be able to change it. If you wanna regret anything, choose regret spending your time on present feeling bad about something that you can't change. When my grandfather was dying from cancer he told me "If I regret anything that I have done, it is looking at my past while my future just pass by without me noticing it". And you can really change your future. Well, every time you do something, you are sacrificing another, whether you're aware of it or not. So, you're 24/7 sacrificing something that you could do instead. If choose to go through that, I would like you to save time and immediatly lock yourself into a mental hospital because that's what will happen to you if you bother with that too much. :D This is one of the reasons why you should focous on doing what makes you happy. Suomi, Drumgun, Forsberg, et al sacrificed their lives to gain xp so I'm not sure where these top 200m all contenders with balanced lives you speak of are. Last time I checked, it takes at least 20,000 hours to get 200M all without spins (over 30k for Suomi IIRC). Care to explain how one can remain a top contender for that achievement while playing in moderation? Be specific with your hours logged. If your point was that anyone can get 99 all skills in moderation these days, then yes I would probably agree with you, especially if they were buying spins. But 200m all skills? No way, Jose. How can you be this stupid? Do you have anything aside from meaningless ad hominems? Your assertion is completely delusional - the math and empirical evidence is completely against you. It is not possible to get the sort of experience gains that top players do within the timespan that they do by just playing in moderation. It is simply not possible no matter how much you want to believe otherwise. That's not an insult or indictment of top players, it's just a fact. Yes, to get top rank you'd have to sacrifice some aspects of your life, but I'm arguing against something you implied, that gaining exp requires it. You can play like 12 hours a day and don't have to sacrifice anything, so 200m all doesn't require sacrificing anything major, besides, in a year from now it will be 5k hours so it won't matter. I didn't say gaining experience requires it. I said gaining experience at the rate that top players do it and within the timespan they gain it in does. There's a different between those two statements and it's not subtle. Also, 12 hours is not 'moderate' gameplay even by generous definitions. That's more time than a full-time job, and half your day. It's completely astounding that you think people who sit at a computer (aside from say the well documented medical issues, such as say back problems, eye-sight, etc.) aren't sacrificing anything. They are sacrificing their health and a myriad of other things. You can argue that's their choice and that they have the right to do this, but it's completely unscientific, and not to mention pretty much contradicted by health sciences (physical and psychological), to claim that they aren't sacrificing anything. Again, it's not an insult, it's an observation. They have obviously chosen to do certain things, but it's obvious that they had to give up other things to do so. Even half that time, say 6 hours a day daily on a game is barely moderate. By historical standards or even contemporary standards (depending on what place you look at it), spending 12+ hours on a purely non-productive, purely leisurely, and mostly non-educational activity is not moderate. Ofc it's not scientific and not according to "health sciencies" and I'm glad I don't agree with those. Once I had an interesting client that proves that "health sciences" are crap. He told me that his routine before dating was work hard on his goals during the day and relax in his home for the rest of the day and he was a really happy guy. Then he started dating and was still happy and kept spending the rest of the day in his home but now with his girlfriend. So, they broke up and he felt terrible and decided to go to a psychologist (health science professional, right?). So, the psychologist made him feel better about the broke up proccess and then the psychologist insisted that the guy had to change his routines. The guy asked "why? I am happy!" and she said "well, you need to be social and communicate with lots of people otherwise you can't be healthy!!!". So the poor guy changed his routines and indeed started to have more and more friends but he was also about to suicide. So, he came to me and asked for my help. I told him "go back to your routine." He looked at me thinking that I was even more crazy than him but still decided to go back to his routine - what really made him happy. And he's now as happy as he was before dating and all the mess. See, Psychologists work are based on statistics. My question is "What do you do when someone doesn't work like most people?". Not even a single psychiatrist or psychologist gave me a answer to that one.

And I agree with your last sentence. My point that that X, Y and Z beliefs for me would be inappropriate, considering my personal history and my goals - therefore would give me unhappiness. For other people, it would be the best thing that ever happened to them - leading them to happiness.

People need to stop looking at others as they are broke. If people are still alive, they function perfectly. The person has beliefs for a reason. Either the person consciously like those beliefs or not - that's a different discussion. There's no such thing as "wrong beliefs" or "delusional beliefs". That's ludicrous. No one can say if a x decision from someone else is a good or not because you don't have his personal history. I might agree that this is going in a kind of off-topic direction. 99% of the thread is like that though.

Well, I think you guys are going into a spiral of misunderstandings again. First you need to understand the defenition of "better things" for EACH individual. See, if I ask every single person on the planet what's the best thing to do, every single time I will get a different answer (if they give me a well-formed sentence) - I can garantee you that. And with that comes the definition of shared reality. Once a psychiatrist told me that this had this "uncurable" patient (my favorite ones!) that drank blood every single day. I thought "finally they found a vampire!". So, I was extremely curious to know this new race and went to the mental hospital to see what I could do. I asked him "What are you trying to do for your behalf when drinking blood?" and he told me "Well, my tribe in Africa used to do that. It's one of our routines. I'm just making sure that I don't forget who I am". So we made an agreement that he could do it when he was alone on his home at night. See, the guy was already on hospital for years! Just because he was following a personal routine. If it was on Africa, it would be ok. Just because it was on the west world, it isn't. To me, the same thing applies to Top Players. I've had top players asking me "I play RS x hours. Do you think it's an addiction?! Do you think it's bad?!". All I ask them back is if they're happy with themselfs and they always answered me "yes". To me, that's all it's important. Top players can look at you guys and say "Omg, they go outside all the time. They must be freaks!" just like you do. So, please, stop trying to understand other people. It will not work. You will not ever understand them or anyone else. That's like trying to stop breathing while trying to keep yourself alive.

Please quit trying to understand other people. Psychologist have tried that for decades and keep failing on doing it. The best you can get is to understand yourself.

My buttocks stores the finest of information. Lol :P Also Desupty told me he would try to be the first to 5.4b XP if someone donated him 25b, do you think it's possible? I'll undeniably donate him my 28b gp that I accomulated back in 2011 or something.

Not 50% because you still have to do a lot of banking time.

I rember rcing with Forsberg888 at ZMI multiple times.

Cmon, that's not even a well-formed sentence! How, specifically, would you like to argue about semantics and the consequences thereof?

Be aware that the numbers used on those calculations are not mine, so I will not be responsible for their accuracy. If the credit for the concept has to go to someone, it should go to Thai Tong. He was the one who came up with the idea. Back then (some years ago), he used to calculate how long it took for top players to get 4.8b Overall XP assuming unreliable methods, even though they were the fastest ones on the game. After some discussion, I started to do my time calculators and probably Thai Tong realized that mine were probably more useful than his and stoped doing it. This is only a theory, I can't still read peoples mind through Internet accurately. Back then, some people thought that there was some kind of war between me an Thai Tong. I remember getting some private messages about it, which was kinda hilarious to me. Just to be clear, I belive we were both civil enough to not create a "war" between the two of us and me and Thai Tong are really really good friends nowadays. Oh the memories... All I try to do with my time calculator, is to give an accurate response to the requests I get. It seems to me that's not what others even try to offer though. That's why I'll be open to requests about it. Just because I might take a long time to post here sometimes, doesn't mean I won't - it just means how incredibly busy I am in real life :) TL;DR: Credit goes to Thai Tong.

About Chessy018, according to wiki "After the hack, she couldn't believe what happened (got hacked and lost most of gold) and quit RuneScape." I thought she got hacked long after she quit?

It seems funny to me how you get back to the spin of judging top player's options so quickly. Top players (and every other human) will always do the best choice they are aware of. If being "top player" means such a big thing for them, I hope they buy spins, otherwise they will suicide... and I don't like that idea, do you? People do things like this all the time in real life and you guys don't seem to get it, part of the reason why it amuses me. If you could cheat on a exam and you were 100% sure that you will get max grade and 100% sure that you won't get caught, would you do it? Of course you would! And that's even worse than buying spins since buying spins is legal and copying isn't. If that experience doesn't fit on your world, try something else. Just because you don't understand it, doesn't mean there's something wrong with them. Psychologists believed that homossexuals were broke and needed to get fixed. It took them many years to realize the opposite and now every single psychologist I've met says "Omg, can you believe that Psychology believed that homossexuals were broke? ahahahah!" And some years ago, they were the same ones that defended that homossexuals were broke as hard as they could! Now that they understand homossexuality, they go "oh, I really hate those guys that insult homossexuals you know!"

Drumgun - 464 Suomi - 1636 Jake - 2376 Forsberg888 - 2324 Jdelacroix - 3707 Dragonseance - 4156 Goud - 2525 Alkan - 4252 Almostlost - 6215 My Kingz - 5521 fors, jdela,host bart, dseance, richard and kingz has tons of bxp from sc Unless someone tells me how much bonus XP they have, there's nothing I can do.

Drumgun - 464 Suomi - 1636 Jake - 2376 Forsberg888 - 2324 Jdelacroix - 3707 Dragonseance - 4156 Goud - 2525 Alkan - 4252 Almostlost - 6215 My Kingz - 5521 My calculations are made assuming the methods that top players actually use, as opposed to some other calculators. It's up to you how you want to use the word "accurate", I guess.

Drumgun currently needs 483 hours to achieve 5.2b Overall XP.

Scuzzy5 currently needs 7800 hours to achieve 5.2b Overall Xp.