Defalt Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 I have the void+virtus setup with deflector currently, and I'm curious as to if investing into the rest of the virtus set is worth it, I'm about 10m off. Which setup is most effective? Thanks in advance for the help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaaps1 Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 I would imagine full Virtus would be as it lets you use the CSB which grants the double damage every 4 or 5 hits without moving. That's a lot of increased DPS if you know how to play it. In fact I'm not so sure Void + Virtus top is better than Void + CSB, unless you need that LP boost which I'm sure at this point you don't. ~It's Super Effective! (The Zaaps Blog)~My YouTube Channel, where you get to watch me go around and make a fool out of myself and all comp capersGuides:~Yeah I wrote them once~Suggestions:~Yeah I made those once~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 Virtus>ahrim>void Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defalt Posted July 29, 2012 Author Share Posted July 29, 2012 I'm working on a new chaotic, so CSB is out of the question. Thanks for the help so far! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 If you plan on glacoring a lot, get a csb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defalt Posted July 29, 2012 Author Share Posted July 29, 2012 Alright I'll put some thought into it, so in that case if I got a CSB full virtus would be best? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 It'd be the best even without a csb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHappySeeker Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 Void mage is trash tier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quyneax Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 Void mage is trash tier.Void melee is great though. Magic accuracy isn't all that valuable on glacors, and I doubt Ahrim's is much better than void. Void does require additonal switches (barrows gloves/deflector/melee helm/fury/rapier for void gloves/csb/mage helm/arcstream/sol). Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions 99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011) 99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012) 99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012) 99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013) 99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013) Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace 30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHappySeeker Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 Melee dps vs glacytes is practically the same in str gear and void due to their low def. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quyneax Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 +137 str in max void. +201*1.1 = ~221+146 str in max virtus. +210(both ragefires, imbued berserker, fury, barrows gloves, tokhaar-kal)So void is a dps increase of about 5%. It's like a +11 strength switch for the price of two switches. Not spectacular but significant. Meanwhile magic:+48 mage attack in void. +112*1.3 = ~145+116 mage attack in virtus. +180So about 24% higher magic attack roll. The void mage effect is hypothetical of course.You do have quite a bit over 50% accuracy even in void.With the base +80 hit, you have a max hit of up to 995 or something. That means about 80/(915/2 + 80)th, let's say 8/50 or 16% of your dps is accuracy-indepentant. More if you use a staff of light.I don't know the accuracy for void mage, but I think it's probably 70% or a bit higher, where magic attack is starting to get less and less relevant.And of course, Ahrim's would have only +170 magic, so 17% higher magic attack roll.I wouldn't go calling void trash tier, as it performs pretty well, and it's very cheap since it's undegradeable. Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions 99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011) 99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012) 99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012) 99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013) 99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013) Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace 30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Can you clarify how you got your max roll numbers, because they're way off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHappySeeker Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I should have scienced this. I'm a bad person. Please take over for me, Meredick. You have my blessing. Godspeed, my child. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quyneax Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Can you clarify how you got your max roll numbers, because they're way off.They are not max rolls, but max roll equivalents, you need to multiply them with effective level, which should be the same in all cases. At the same level, attack bonus increases and void bonus increases can be compared, barring rounding which is pretty small at this scale. That's why it says 'about' everywhere. Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions 99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011) 99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012) 99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012) 99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013) 99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013) Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace 30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MVP Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Generally Virtus is worth it from personal experience. The whole set, there are other benefits you recieve that aren't just damage based, think about all the extra LP + boost from Unicorn healing or extra HP from brewing. Insert deep and insightful quote here to appear intelligent, put it in italics to add a dash of more intelligenceMVP - 136 Combat - Maxed 95 Prayer 88 Summoning - Lux Tenebrae - Good Game eSports - Master Level Terran Player Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quyneax Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Generally Virtus is worth it from personal experience. The whole set, there are other benefits you recieve that aren't just damage based, think about all the extra LP + boost from Unicorn healing or extra HP from brewing.Except that you don't brew or use a unicorn at glacors... the only reason I use Virtus is in the slight hope it saves me from a ten-second game freeze with an icycle and exploding unstable (happens ever 30 mins approx). Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions 99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011) 99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012) 99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012) 99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013) 99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013) Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace 30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHappySeeker Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 What Q said. It's only good as a buffer for lag or laziness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Can you clarify how you got your max roll numbers, because they're way off.They are not max rolls, but max roll equivalents, you need to multiply them with effective level, which should be the same in all cases. At the same level, attack bonus increases and void bonus increases can be compared, barring rounding which is pretty small at this scale. That's why it says 'about' everywhere.The number you multiply by the effective level is going to be a small number. It's equal to Void*(1+Bonus/64)*Multiplier. You have to do it in that order and floor the returned value each time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quyneax Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I know what the formula is, I can't find Obliv's thread to check the rounding though (even though I have it bookmarked). Wiki (sorry) doesn't list any rounding before attack bonus is multiplied into level, which would mean it doesn't really matter whether you compare effective attack bonus or attack roll. If it did round the (x+64)/64 part, you'd see accuracy in increments, being either 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5x level (5x would already require +256 attack bonus, that's possible at Nex I guess, pretty sure +320 is not possible). Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions 99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011) 99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012) 99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012) 99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013) 99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013) Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace 30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 That still doesn't explain where you got your numbers, specifically +114 and +180. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quyneax Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 That still doesn't explain where you got your numbers, specifically +114 and +180.That's not hard to imagine is it... the formula is 1 + attack bonus/64. The alternative is (attack bonus + 64)/64. Those numbers are the attack bonusus with the 64 base included. The /64 * level is the same for both, so they can be compared without doing the actual multiplying because I cba. If you want to know what equipment I used, I assumed: tokhaar, ragefire, arcstream, csb, wealth/imbued zerker (no mage attack anyway), cstaff. Sol might be better than cstaff but that's only +1 less anyway. For the Virtus setup, I assumed neit/barrows gloves. Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions 99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011) 99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012) 99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012) 99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013) 99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013) Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace 30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Oh, you just added 64 to the magic attack bonus. You might want to check your math. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quyneax Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Oh, you just added 64 to the magic attack bonus. You might want to check your math.... It'd help if you just posted what you think is wrong with it. Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions 99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011) 99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012) 99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012) 99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013) 99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013) Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace 30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 146 + 64 = 210 not 21248 + 64 = 112 not 114 Sorry about all that trouble. I didn't realize it was just a simple adding error >.< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quyneax Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Right, that's what you get when adding numbers in a hurry. Shouldn't change the conclusions much (slight increase in melee dps advantage for void and slight increase in mage attack advantage for virtus), but fixed. By now you really ought to be familiar with my way of comparing rolls, you've asked about it before :P. Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions 99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011) 99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012) 99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012) 99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013) 99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013) Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace 30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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