Birdd

I'm confused by your thought process. Jagex implemented the first poll that followed the 75% rule, do you want rares or not, and it passed. Now the poll is how. Therefore, although single questions may be yes or no, the entire poll is decided by a majority vote to see how they come back, not a 75% must pass for the limited time question. Unless Jagex has some backwards thinking, it should be whichever option is highest passes. Furthermore, how is broken down into a couple of options: Limited quantity/time Method of distribution and then in some cases, method of distribution is further broken down; such as holiday events: do you want separate holiday events or all at once? Inside each of those above questions, whichever option has the highest vote should win. So as it currently stands, they will be limited because that option has more votes, method of distribution should be holiday events, and there should be a separate event for each one. I agree that question is worded poorly, but it's still a how kind of question, not a yes or no kind of question. As for everyone saying the results are flipped, that's incorrect. Whichever option is winning is on top. Pretty simple. Confusing yes, but bugged - no. tldr; 75% has nothing to do with this poll as it's a how, not a yes/no - regardless of how poorly it's worded.

Just a headsup, Clan Citadels crash the game on beta.

From the description in the wiki it sounds like you get it from accumulating a certain amount of kills with those monsters to unlock it.

Like above, FoTS only gives penalties if you fail, and does stack with merchant. You cannot use it more than once as it greys out. There is no reason to not use it on your final storyline missions. I didn't take pictures when I did it, but if my word is good enough - I can confirm all that because I used it for my storylines.

You could probably get away with making attack/accuracy about how well-trained the character is in general, though, so it's not necessarily about technique in a specific style but combat-related knowledge as a whole. Weapon requirements could include it the same way defense (An even more general skill, in terms of flavor) is used for armor requirements. It's possible, but I see no advantage in changing attack over changing strength. Strength makes more sense, and is easier to do.

He has a super restore in top left, but super nice kill :D

Since all the above has been about EoC in DG or PvE, except a couple things I'll speak about the changes I'd like to see based on PvP. 1) One of Jagex's objective on EoC was to not have to worry about switching interfaces to be good. In order to achieve this, we need to be able to see what affects we have on us while our inventory is up. A status bar that hovers somewhere else would be very handy. Also one that shows our enemy. 2) Damage output is way too high. The "strategy" is lost when all you have to do is get up to threshold level and just keep using those making your opponent unable to do anything because they have to spam eat, keeping their own adrenaline down. The only real strategic fights that lead to death mathces come when both players use protect to reduce damage by 50%, and then you can't put out enough damage to KO. We need a happy medium. 3) Range has to risk almost nothing to be at tier 65 gear armor with a tier 80 weapon making it way overpowered for the risk. 4) Make the protect item mechanic also protect off hand if you choose to protect main hand, otherwise this is a huge disadvantage between 2h's and dual wield. 5) Give us some sort of actual non-risk PvP. Maybe a rated arena with small teams. Castle Wars and all is cool, except there's it's too big and no rank. We want to be able to see who's the best without losing a ton of stuff, which makes us not able to use top-end armour. 3v3, or 4v4's or something similar. Possibly reward tokens that give us PvP only armour usable only in safe minigames, similar to Hybrid armour. Maybe weapons too. Or split armours/weapons/abilities into PvP and PvE, and re-work all of EoC around that because I think Jagex is having a hard time building something that is balanced in both realms and have almost given up on PvP. (which to me is the only real end-game, that's why I'm playing 07 even though I enjoy EoC PvE.

[spoiler=Dat Quote Pyramid] Are ya serious Absolutely. Based on this topic, you guys (not you necessarily, but overall) don't like him very much. Still, he does what he wants, he plays the game his way, and as far as I know, he doesn't scam anyone, so he still gets an enjoyable experience out of it. Runescape has the great ability, that I don't find in other MMORPGs to actually let you do what the hell you want, and I think Vann takes that in stride. So if what he's doing embodies the spirit of the game, why are there Jagex-created discussion topics about curbing it on the RSOF, and why is Jagex actively trying to work against it through game updates, such as dice bag removal or silent muting? Not to mention he admitted to breaking multiple rules including RWT.. This has nothing to do with my point. This has everything to do with your point. How can you argue someone is playing the game in a manner that is befitting and supportive of the integrity and spirit of the game when the same player has used those means to fund activities that are almost 100% regarded as entirely destructive to the game (RWT), and have been from the beginning against the rules. The player clearly has no active interest in the game or the spirit of the game, only the interest of his own self-gain and what benefits him the most - so much to an extent that he has compromised the spirit of the game only to benefit himself and then justify it with "I got what I want, then I stopped so it's okay!" You have got to be kidding me if you believe that player is the spirit of the game, this game wouldn't exist if we all had his attitude. I understand the point you were making, I was merely remarking that it wasn't on the same map I was looking at. Second, I do not take the rules into effect when thinking about what the spirit of the game means, this was my counter point. Simply because the U.S. outlawed alcohol, didn't change the spirit of the U.S., the spirit of the U.S. still wanted alcohol, whether or not it is illegal. This isn't the best analogy, as citizens can vote to change laws, and players cannot; nor is the term 'spirit' used in the same sense. Just because you place a bird in the cage, doesn't mean it doesn't want to fly free. It may willfully stay in the house, and in turn stay in its cage because it knows it can be provided food social comfort, but it still wants to break free and fly. I am not saying that gambling with flower seeds is the spirit of the game. I am not saying that rule breaking is the spirit of the game. You're being too literal, well, I assume you're being too literal. Constrictor is partly right in that I'm saying the spirit of the game is what you make it. Now that I read Constrictor's post that reminded me I had a very similar argument on his topic as well. The spirit of Runescape isn't a tangible thing, sometimes you cannot see the spirit, but instead you can only see the anti-spirit, and from that you have to deduce where the spirit is. I don't like saying spirit so much, it makes me sound like a hippie. Brief example: 6/6/06, Durial321 changed the game a lot for that time period. How did Runescape react? I'm sure if you think about it (if you were around back then, I don't know your start date) there were two very different reactions to the "massacre." Now look at the next game changing event, and the next, and the next, (or going and look later than Durial, this is a starting point for some), do you see a pattern emerging? It's really not that hard to decipher, honestly. I am also aware that I stand at odds with some in the Tip.It community on this matter, so its perfectly possible we won't see eye-to-eye. I think Tip.It has the tendency to be entirely too legalistic in some cases; while this is usually for the better of the community, I do not think it applies in this case. I'm pretty lost what your point is - so maybe I am being too literal. I think your analogies are flawed because it is natural for a bird to fly, whereas (assuming natural is designated by the intended purpose given by the game designers) the purpose of mithril seeds is not naturally gambling. Not to say I'm against emergent gameplay, but if that aspect (gambling) of them is taken away it hasn't removed a large part (or any) of their original purpose, whereas taking away a bird's ability to fly freely has taken away a large portion of what makes a bird a bird. Alas, I have sidetracked greatly. I lol'd at your hippie comment. (: I will obtain my 10 year cape in November, as to how long I have been playing. I'm not entirely sure which pattern you are pointing to that started with Durial, I would love for you to lay it out more plainly - I'm not much of a decipherer. To me, he was a brief blip in Runescape's history that didn't make much of an impact. His only impact on me as a young teen was I learned that if people can screw other's over for no gain (or for the luls), they will. My opinion on the 'spirit' of the game is two-fold. On one hand, it's whatever you want to make it because it's a Role-Playing Game. On the other hand, it's also massively multiplayer. If you do not want to partake in some sort of community that sets bounds as to where the 'spirit' begins and ends then you're in the wrong genre of game. You can do whatever you want, as long as it does not hinder other's gameplay in a significantly negative fashion, breaks the rules set in place by the creator (this is not a democracy, as much as we wish it was), or as long as it does not tend towards the destruction of the game itself. How gambling fits into that, I think that it fits perfectly fine. I just think it's better done through a Jagex controlled method that tends away from allowing scamming. My only disagreement with you was your defense of Vann.

True. They could limit that system to items like chaotics or quest rewards to avoid it, though, like they've done with Balmung. Keeps them from being obsolete, or just plain useless out of the box. The idea being that you could get something like your rapier, use it until level 90 or whatever, then upgrade it. If you don't want to get a rapier or go through the process of upgrading it, you can get drygores. It could go along with their plan to make armor have different effects as well - One 90 set could have a crit bonus, the other could have an accuracy boost, and so on. Or in the given example of Drygore vs. Chaotic, KK would drop an item that could upgrade the Chaotic into an equivalent Drygore-tier weapon. Not in substitution of Drygore drops, as an additional. It would be a little less expensive, but not much because chaotics aren't hard to get, but still makes chaotics non obselete. Or the item dropped could be untradeable.

What are you guys talking about? I wanna be a part! [/leftoutkid]

This is what I'm talking about the community being divided. Neither game is better than the other as a fact, it is mere opinion and preference. So why can we not embrace members of both communities. I don't rage when someone else plays Call of Duty and try to convince them to play Halo, I just accept that to each his own and that doesn't make that person any less lovable or important or less human. Why is RS to RS07 any different? We have even more in common because we can talk about certain aspects, achievements, going ons and understand what the other person is talking about more.

I highlighted the important part. Saru Inc said that Vann *was* the spirit of the game, yet Vann admitted to breaking the rules. So, nah. The rest of what you said I agree with, although I'd argue that to some degree spirit of the game comes from what makes the game sustainable long term, and frankly, a few select players hoarding all the wealth does not encourage that because new players are so far behind.

I don't think I would count Tumeken, but aside why would the Gods who Guthix had no part in bringing/creating fit in his 'balance scheme'?

Are ya serious Absolutely. Based on this topic, you guys (not you necessarily, but overall) don't like him very much. Still, he does what he wants, he plays the game his way, and as far as I know, he doesn't scam anyone, so he still gets an enjoyable experience out of it. Runescape has the great ability, that I don't find in other MMORPGs to actually let you do what the hell you want, and I think Vann takes that in stride. So if what he's doing embodies the spirit of the game, why are there Jagex-created discussion topics about curbing it on the RSOF, and why is Jagex actively trying to work against it through game updates, such as dice bag removal or silent muting? Not to mention he admitted to breaking multiple rules including RWT.. This has nothing to do with my point. This has everything to do with your point. How can you argue someone is playing the game in a manner that is befitting and supportive of the integrity and spirit of the game when the same player has used those means to fund activities that are almost 100% regarded as entirely destructive to the game (RWT), and have been from the beginning against the rules. The player clearly has no active interest in the game or the spirit of the game, only the interest of his own self-gain and what benefits him the most - so much to an extent that he has compromised the spirit of the game only to benefit himself and then justify it with "I got what I want, then I stopped so it's okay!" You have got to be kidding me if you believe that player is the spirit of the game, this game wouldn't exist if we all had his attitude.

Are ya serious Absolutely. Based on this topic, you guys (not you necessarily, but overall) don't like him very much. Still, he does what he wants, he plays the game his way, and as far as I know, he doesn't scam anyone, so he still gets an enjoyable experience out of it. Runescape has the great ability, that I don't find in other MMORPGs to actually let you do what the hell you want, and I think Vann takes that in stride. So if what he's doing embodies the spirit of the game, why are there Jagex-created discussion topics about curbing it on the RSOF, and why is Jagex actively trying to work against it through game updates, such as dice bag removal or silent muting? Not to mention he admitted to breaking multiple rules including RWT..

I think perhaps some of your settings have limited you to 800 x 600, when that should not be the cap. Perhaps having it on minimum or not Direct-X, I'm not sure because I don't play full screen. But I know if some of the other graphics settings are too low it can cap the resolution on full screen.

Unstoppable by who? Are you referring to pking? If you are, who the hell pks in full nex and divine anyway? If you are referring to pvm, nex gear is not even the "top" gear. Void and chaotic shield/dual wield are often the best for pretty much every boss. And you can camp gwd with zero food in barrows gear with soul split, and get pretty damn close to the same kills per hour as any other gear. So please tell me what is so op about nex gear in the first place. He clearly said pre-eoc... 20 or so hours plus however long it takes to get chaotics and overloads/curses is free? :huh: Not to detract from anything, I've seen that one brought up in Codguy often enough to be wary around it. I think he meant the void is free. I could also agree with this, but make the armours only being able to be crafted from the resources gathered by smithers and a few unique pieces gathered by monster hunting in combination.

From the patch notes, is this a nerf to Drygore?

Although this is off topic, when I did it in Beta I just saved adrenaline from the two 360's then unloaded on him for insta win. I don't know how accurate this is now though with damage caps.

I personally think you over estimate how that data could be used in this situation. The issue is that botnukes bring patches. Which brings the servers down temporarily. For some players, when patches happen they assume it's going to take a while and go do something else, while for others it may take a long while due to bad connections to actually download the data(though I think this statistical anomaly can be ignored). The point being that there's more variables to consider in why the player base would drop. Now, away from our digression here. It was never my argument that the servers were already dead. No, my anecdote was to state that nostalgia doesn't last forever. Which is what I clearly stated upfront in my post. And based on nostalgia not lasting forever, I still think, and this is something observable in all walks of life, that the old server will slowly die off. If not due to nostalgia dying, then due to lack of future content by a community that is seemingly unwilling to allow the most minuscule changes to the game. Well that opinion aside (since it is only that, an opinion with no data to prove that 07 will indeed die [regardless of my personal thoughts on the matter] 07 is here and it is currently popular), I think the discussion at large here is - there is a rift in the community. I have been shunned by some of my more hardcore 07 friends just for getting on EOC to do my ports - Why/How do we/Jagex address it? Can we? While me and you can be logical, rational human beings and discuss a point without losing our cool that seems to be an attibute largely missed in the greater community of Runescape (and the Internet :P) I agree with some previous posts that a functional clan chat would be a step in the right direction, without of course avatars and citadels, etc.

I didn't realize a website existed with the data readily available. I should've assumed someone had made one by now and went and searched for it myself. Kind of a failure on my part. That being said, I think it's farfetched to say there's more bots on EoC than on 07. Just because there wasn't a mainstream bot released until recently(That's if you don't count SIMBA, but i'll let that slide), doesn't mean large amounts of players weren't botting. A color bot is easy enough to make, and a lot of people were sharing it privately. Not to mention a normal auto clicker worked. Lets face it, these gold farmers, chances are they can more than afford to buy a client off someone privately. And, chances are, they did. I'm not going to point any fingers(Yeah I am), but all you had to do was look at a few popular mining/woodcutting places. As those are 2 primary money makers with the easiest scripts to make. Now that there's a public bot out(a few actually), and now that 07scape's gold is more valuable than the main game's gold, I think it's safe to assume botting on both are at the very least equivalent. And quite possibly, there's more on 07scape. It's unfortunate we don't have any actual numbers on this and all I can do is speculate. But frankly if we knew how many bots there was on both server, we'd likely know who was botting as well :l... Well again you make a mistake in assuming the data is not easily extrapolated. You can see the "events" on that site that relate to both BotNukes in both games, the loss of online players in EOC on 02/26/2013 was roughly 10,086 (60,540 to 50,545 [only online players]) and the BotNuke in 07 on 03/04/2013 dropped about 5,371 (54,642 to 49,271 [only online players again.]) That's a difference of 4,715 or 46%. In my opinion, that means there was more bots in EoC to nuke but.. It could be argued one BotWatch was more effective than the other and Jagex planned on the EoC one longer than the 07 one, however I think it has more to do with the amount of bots available to target. Either way, that's way off topic and an argument no one can win since it's very biased opinions based on data - my point stands that approximately half the RuneScape population cannot be brushed aside and anyone who tries to say 07 is already dead with the logic of "my friends who came back already quit or joined EoC" is just ridiculous, only large statistically relevant data should be pertinent in a discussion such as this one, and up to this point I would say the data points to the (suprisingly) overwhelming support of 07 being a financially supportable and loved aspect of the overall larger Runescape community. :)

I agree with this, except the host (NPC) takes a cut everytime as a money sink. But this makes too much sense, won't be seeing that from Jagex.

Despite your anecdotal evidence, the playercount has stayed quite high, even higher than I expected. A lot of people do prefer 07scape to the live game, for a variety of reasons. Has you listened to the pro 07 server lovers, the playercount should be 300k pretty much 24/7. But I suppose that's me being cynical. That playercount, however, only stays high during the weekend and during peak hours. The moment week days start, and the moment it's class time for most people, the player count sits on 60-70k. Right around where it was for non-peak times pre-07servers release. Realistically speaking, however, the playerbase for EoC has increased as well. Where as now when I log in(peak playing hours ;3) there's more worlds with over 1k players on them, and some of the worlds getting into the 1500 and 1600 regions. This isn't mere anecdote, this is something you can observe yourself. Measure the amount of people on either 07 scape/ Runescape(calling the main game EoCscape is an insult frankly), and figure out how many are on each server. I'm more than willing to put my money on that EoC has the larger player base. Now, onto a side topic. PK'ing. Has anyone gone to random worlds in runescape and looked into the wild? Because here I am, playing EoC, strolling off to the GE, and I see a wildy that has a good 10-11 people in it on some of the more popular worlds(Say 600+ people on the world), and more if I go to even bigger worlds. My question about this is, how can you say EoC PvP is dead.... when there's people doing it? I enjoy 07 and EOC, and actively play both. That being said... To all previous posters regarding 07 "already dying out" or EOC being tons better or whatever, please find evidence for your claims before making them: http://www.misplaced.../2007online.php RS07 is very very close to EOCScape (sorry if that offends you, EOC defines the current game) in the term of players. The peaks and highs are consistent with normal distribution due to work day, it's irrelevant to compare low times of 07 vs. peak times on EoC. Don't disregard 07 because it has a slightly smaller player base (currently 50.61% vs 49.39% as of 11:16 central US) and I would argue there are more bots on EoC than 07 because of bots just now picking up in 07 - making the argument possible that the actual 'player' base (bots excluded) is higher on 07. On PvP - as someone who loved PvP during the golden years (imo 06-07) the wilderness is entirely dead compared. Your own evidence supports this, as 10-11 players is a laughable amount.

Are you attempting to do the Combat Academy? Did you pick up the mage gear from the stands - usually that is a requirement.

I think both models are broken. Untradeable top-end gear is long overdue in Runescape, two different classifications, those that can be used in PvP and then of course those that can be used in PvE, this removes Jagex's inability to make balanced gear to make harder monsters, because it's always completely outclassed anything before it making PvP unbalanced. This would also make current top tier still good because it's best tradeable, but more accessible because less demand. The untradeable armour would of course be crazy hard to get whether it's grinding or harder bosses or some only gained through PvP, or gained through high skills (similar to PoP, only higher requirements, maybe all the encouraged skills in PoP be required) You can upgrade the armour through more kills, and we need a PvP model that is not so high risk but rated in some form to give incentive to play. I hate to say this, but similar to WoW's arena system. Otherwise come up with a radically new idea, but I think the current armour model and the way they are gained and all tradeable is completely broken. PoP was a good step with the better ones being untradeable, but of course Jagex messed that up with making Nex armour better again.