Computer playing up - Real Problem

[samari81]

My main home computer (Advent T9204)

 

Has recently been playing up a lot

 

I bought it around the end of 2005

 

So it's only 2 years old

 

 

 

The problem is, it keeps freezing and then resetting itself, sometimes it doesn't even reset itself.

 

I took it back to the shop where I bought it from (Pc-World) as I pay monthly insurance on it. I left the computer with them for a week and they checked it all over and said that they could not find one problem with the computer and that when they were using Hi-Def, powerful programs they had no problems. They then said that it could be something to do with the plug socket that the computer uses, we changed all of our sockets and the extension lead (4 plug points) to ones that were recomended and were capable of keeping on top of powerful electricals. Thus far this has made no difference.

 

 

 

I want to know your opinions on it.

 

Considering that when the computer freezes the computers fans and what not become very loud, there is not much memory being used on the computer, only about 500 songs and photoshop are the biggest things. There are no games of any sort that are played on it except for RuneScape.

 

 

 

[hide=Specs]

 

Intel Pentium 4 HT Processor 540 3.2 GHz

 

Dual Layer DVD Re-Writer

 

16x DVD drive

 

250GB Hard Drive (7200 RPM)

 

1024 DDR Memory

 

Dual Channel Memory

 

ATi Raedeon X600 Pro PCI-Express graphics card

 

56k V.90 PCI Data-Fax Modem

 

Stereo TV and FM tuner card (Never used)

 

Wireless LAN PCI card 802.11G

 

[/hide]

 

 

 

If any other information is needed then just say so and tell me where I can get it from

 

 

 

Many thanks,

 

Samari

[Nadril]

When it freezes up does it give you any sort of error message, like a blue screen of death or something else?

[samari81]

When it freezes up does it give you any sort of error message, like a blue screen of death or something else?

 

 

 

Nope no blue screens.

 

Just freezes on whatever I'm on and of there is any audio then that freezes too and it sounds like when a CD is skipping.

[Nadril]

When it freezes up does it give you any sort of error message, like a blue screen of death or something else?

 

 

 

Nope no blue screens.

 

Just freezes on whatever I'm on and of there is any audio then that freezes too and it sounds like when a CD is skipping.

 

 

 

Are you able to do anything like Ctrl + alt + del to get to the task manager or does the entire PC literally just freeze up.

 

 

 

 

 

And this is a bit of a longshot considering you had it looked at, but you have scanned for any possible virus's right? Also does it lock up on random or during something specific (like while listening to music, or in photoshop, or ect.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just trying to think up of something that a tech support wouldn't think of. :-k :-k

[samari81]

When it freezes up does it give you any sort of error message, like a blue screen of death or something else?

 

 

 

Nope no blue screens.

 

Just freezes on whatever I'm on and of there is any audio then that freezes too and it sounds like when a CD is skipping.

 

 

 

Are you able to do anything like Ctrl + alt + del to get to the task manager or does the entire PC literally just freeze up.

 

 

 

 

 

And this is a bit of a longshot considering you had it looked at, but you have scanned for any possible virus's right? Also does it lock up on random or during something specific (like while listening to music, or in photoshop, or ect.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just trying to think up of something that a tech support wouldn't think of. :-k :-k

 

 

 

Nope, can't do anything. Everything just freezes

 

 

 

I have Norton Anti-virus and that never seems to pick anything up. The computer just freezes randomly, it can be anywhere from the start up screen, logging in, listening to music, browsing the web, playing RS or even just when it's left on the desktop with no programs running

[blade995]

It sounds like a faulty power supply, overheating or bad ram.

 

 

 

Download the program Speedfan. Run it, and post a screenshot of the it running. This will show you the temperatures of the computer and your power supply voltages. Try to take the screenshot after your computer has been on for a while or doing something computer intensive.

[Nadril]

Yeah its probably one of those that blade has mentioned, sadly.

 

 

 

I would think it would usually produce a BSoD for faulty ram though, wouldn't it? Or does it not always do that... :-k

[samari81]

Right ok then, is This the correct program and website? And is it trusted?

[blade995]

Right ok then, is This the correct program and website? And is it trusted?

 

 

 

Yes, that was the exact link I was going to post, but I'm lazy :P .

 

 

 

I would think it would usually produce a BSoD for faulty ram though, wouldn't it? Or does it not always do that... Think

 

 

 

Not always, sometimes if it's just a few bad blocks in the operating system space then it may lock up. Without a blue screen this would be the last bet over a power supply or overheating.

[samari81]

Right I'll have to do that tommorow as it's getting late, I'll keep you both posted, many thanks

[Errdoth]

Blade, I just downloaded speedfan on my new rig, are these okay temps?

 

 

Processor: Q6600 @ 2.4ghz (Overclocked to 3.4 through fsb)

 

Vid card: 8800gts

 

 

 

Don't mean to steal the thread, but just wondering.

 

(I just exited out of crysis so the temps might be higher)

[blade995]

Errdoth, those are not way full load temps unless you have water or phase change cooling system. What you need to do is run your computer under full load. Plus you have a quad core and Crysis does not use 4 core fully, so it will not simulate full load.

 

 

 

For full load download the program Prime95 and run the progrm on each core. Then after 15 minutes runnig 4 instances then see what Speedfan says.

 

 

 

For your system temp which is your northbridge should be under 55c.

 

 

 

For the cpu anything under 65c is acceptable. The idle temp (what you posted) shows pretty much nothing.

[Errdoth]

Okay cool. I ran prime95 when I first overclocked (to make sure it wouldn't crash), but I think that temp gauge on the front of my case might have been off a little. What are the temp1 temp2 temp3 temp on speedfan?

 

 

 

EDIT: It kept well within the temps you said =)

[MageUK]

Blade, I just downloaded speedfan on my new rig, are these okay temps?

 

 

Processor: Q6600 @ 2.4ghz (Overclocked to 3.4 through fsb)

 

Vid card: 8800gts

 

 

 

Don't mean to steal the thread, but just wondering.

 

(I just exited out of crysis so the temps might be higher)

 

 

 

Just a quick "non-hijack" post again. Looks like you have a faulty (or missing) temperature sensor (the AUX is a known dodgy one on Speedfan) and the -48s. I have a Q6600 as well and you should be able to edit the gauges on speed fan to give you the temperature of each core as well as the overall CPU temp. You need to offset it by 15 though. To be honest, for raw CPU data you should be using CPU-Z for voltages etc. and CoreTemp 0.95.4 for temperatures of the individual cores as it has the correct TJunction max.

 

And for a good idea of temperatures, the TJunction Max on a Q6600 is 100 celcius. You can probably run it at around 55-60 without many issues at all, but of course cooler is better. 30-40 is best.

 

 

 

A quick run down (here's my screenshot for reference) :

 

 

System = Ambient Case Temp

 

CPU = Overall CPU Temp

 

HD0 = Hard Drive

 

Core 0 = Self explanatory, and already edited to add 15C to it

 

Core 1,2,3 = Same

 

Core = Graphics Core

 

Ambient = Graphics Ambient

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Back to the original topic, it sounds exactly like a failing power supply (not uncommon with shop bought PCs) or dodgy RAM. The best way to check RAM is to take out the sticks individually and see if you still get the crashes, but if you're still under warranty then opening the case will probably void it.

[deep_pain]

Samari, as you may or may not know PC world techs are terrible.

 

 

 

so might be worth starting with the basics.

 

 

 

Do you have any errors on your system log on start-up shut down or around the time of the crashes?

[Nadril]

Samari, as you may or may not know PC world techs are terrible.

 

 

 

so might be worth starting with the basics.

 

 

 

Do you have any errors on your system log on start-up shut down or around the time of the crashes?

 

 

 

 

 

Nope no blue screens.

 

Just freezes on whatever I'm on and of there is any audio then that freezes too and it sounds like when a CD is skipping.

 

 

 

reading the thread is awesome.

[deep_pain]

Samari, as you may or may not know PC world techs are terrible.

 

 

 

so might be worth starting with the basics.

 

 

 

Do you have any errors on your system log on start-up shut down or around the time of the crashes?

 

 

 

 

 

Nope no blue screens.

 

Just freezes on whatever I'm on and of there is any audio then that freezes too and it sounds like when a CD is skipping.

 

 

 

reading the thread is awesome.

 

 

 

 

 

Where does that mention his system log?

 

 

 

dont carry your argument with me from another thread here..

 

 

 

system log contains much more than just BSOD error codes.

 

 

 

You asked specifically if any error codes are given when he crashes, like BSOD, these come up on screen, I am asking does he have any errors on his log anywhere.. startup.. shutdown.. during the crash...

[das1330]

The problem is, it keeps freezing and then resetting itself, sometimes it doesn't even reset itself.

 

 

 

The bold makes it sound like its not a power supply going bad. While shops are known to use cheap PSU's to keep costs down, a computer that has a power supply problem will lock up and shut down consistently, not "sometimes shutting down and sometimes not." A memory error sounds most likely to me. As said above, taking out one stick of memory at a time and checking for random shut downs will work, but (I think)Memtest might do the job as well. It scans your computer's memory for bad sectors.

 

 

 

but if you're still under warranty then opening the case will probably void it.

 

I know for a fact that both the US and UK have laws against voiding the warranty of a computer just for opening the case. If you somehow break something

else then it's not covered, but as long as you use common sense, that shouldn't happen.

[Makoto_the_Phoenix]

It could very well be a memory error, or it could be a hard disk error. Windows uses something like a "swap" partition to give the computer more virtual memory (which, of course, it at the speed and mercy of the hard disk alone).

 

 

 

How full is your hard disk? Most problems like that occurring usually happen when people use up more than 90% of their hard disk.

[samari81]

Deep_Pain - There are no errors at any point, (except for a dodgy installation on my printer but that's unrealted)

 

Snipersas - I refuse to open up the computer as I wouldn't have a clue what I'd be looking at/for xD

 

Makoto_The_Phoenix - My hard disk is practically empty, as stated in my OP the main things on the computer are about 500 songs and photoshop

[das1330]

Deep_Pain - There are no errors at any point, (except for a dodgy installation on my printer but that's unrealted)

 

Snipersas - I refuse to open up the computer as I wouldn't have a clue what I'd be looking at/for xD

 

Makoto_The_Phoenix - My hard disk is practically empty, as stated in my OP the main things on the computer are about 500 songs and photoshop

 

 

 

In that case, try downloading and running memtest at http://memtest86.com

[deep_pain]

Hi samari, there are no errors on your system log at all? (event viewer?)

 

 

 

This doesn't sound software related, it does sound like a hardware problem, but even hardware problems should leave some telltale signs in your system log. You are accessing system log in admin tools or run yah?

 

 

 

 

 

You should at the very least have this error

 

 

 

Event ID 6008

 

 

 

I would agree this most likely looks like a PSU problem, Although that isnt garunteed. A good way of being able to tell is looking at the time of your next restart or freeze and looking at your log when you reboot. A PSU problem is likely to have no errors or warnings at all before reboot. Yet have all the usual reports/warnings you would expect of an unexpected shutdown/restart. It should definately have at least a warning on the log at system start up.

 

 

 

A software or some other hardware problems will have errors or warnings pre-reboot, and may or may not have them on start-up. (these dont neccesarily pop up, you have to look for them in event viewer.

 

 

 

One other question, you may have mentioned it already I didn't see, is the socket or gang you are running the computer from surge protected and does it still have its surge protection light on?

 

 

 

I once found a simular problem that I was sure was PSU related, we ended up tracking it down to the guys fridge, everytime it kicked in his computer reset. Don't ask me how I'm no electrician, but it was obviously causing some kind of surge.

 

 

 

The reason I mention that is the one thing that does seem odd, is as bad as PC world are at tech support, I would think they would notice a PSU problem.

 

 

 

If they say it didnt reboot at all whilst there then it could possibly be a problem with your electrics somewhere. It is more likely they missed a PSU problem if there is one, so dont worry, just a thought.

[samari81]

Hi samari, there are no errors on your system log at all? (event viewer?)

 

 

 

 

Could you please remind me of how to access the event viewer/log?

 

 

 

 

This doesn't sound software related, it does sound like a hardware problem, but even hardware problems should leave some telltale signs in your system log. You are accessing system log in admin tools or run yah?

 

 

 

 

I'm not the brightest when it comes to what's actually inside computers, could you please enlighten me further, make it a little easier like "Computers for dummies" really :XD:

 

 

 

You should at the very least have this error

 

 

 

Event ID 6008

 

 

 

 

I've never had this error appear

 

 

 

One other question, you may have mentioned it already I didn't see, is the socket or gang you are running the computer from surge protected and does it still have its surge protection light on?

 

 

 

Yes I do have a power surge protection extension lead and the light is still on :)

 

 

 

I once found a simular problem that I was sure was PSU related, we ended up tracking it down to the guys fridge, everytime it kicked in his computer reset. Don't ask me how I'm no electrician, but it was obviously causing some kind of surge.

 

 

 

Lol at that evil :twisted: fridge :XD:

 

 

 

 

If they say it didnt reboot at all whilst there then it could possibly be a problem with your electrics somewhere. It is more likely they missed a PSU problem if there is one, so dont worry, just a thought.

 

 

 

My dad is an electrician so I doubt there are many problems and there are none at the socket as I've tried plugging it into a different socket in the house before and the same problem occured.

 

 

 

 

 

Your input is much appreciated :

 

Samari

[deep_pain]

No problem

 

 

 

ohh btw: YNWA :-$

 

to get the event viewer up:

 

 

 

Start>Run if you are on XP

 

or

 

Start> and type in the search on vista

 

 

 

type in: eventvwr

 

 

 

basically If I remember rightly you are on XP?

 

 

 

After you reboot after a crash look in your system log there.

 

 

 

 

 

there's a more detailed overview on how to use it here:

 

 

 

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/308427

 

 

 

But we are basically looking for the most recent events in system log that are either warnings or errors.

 

 

 

Chances our this wont tell us much as the problem is likely to be PSU, but it may help us confirm that.

[samari81]

 

 

 

A quick screenshot

 

Luckily I wrote down the url of the imageshack upload just before my computer froze, so now I've typed it up on my laptop.

 

 

 

The screenshot is of the log literally on reboot after it had just frozen,

 

 

 

Hope this helps,

 

Samari