Something doesn't seem to add up...

[ShadowTwisted]

 

But what were you looking for? Me saying that attack\strength have an effect on your combat? :?

 

 

 

I was looking for what exactly the effect was. In this case, attack actually does decrease number of zeros you hit and defense increasing the number of zeros hit against you. I knew it was something, as going from being able to kill 5 cockroach soldiers to being able to kill 20 with one inventory of food had to be accomplished somehow. Individual battles, as you mentioned, are pretty much useless in making the overall comparison. With the repetitive ways of combat, it's easy to lose interest in all the details of a battle, as far as how many times you hit vs getting hit. In the end, it's easy to lose track of the average. I seldom train more than a level or two in a stat before moving on to something else, so hardcore research into what exactly the effect is of a certain stat gets a little difficult. You'd mentioned before about punching in your numbers in a spread sheet. Can't think of a time I EVER did that. You tend to be more detail oriented (reminds me of my time in the service). So while the casual gamer may not take note of every little detail, there's usually someone who does. Thus why I had in a previous post dubbed you the "Guru of Runescape Facts and Stats".

[doomy]

Yeah tey do seem it, rune pures with 60 attack hit me almost as much as I hit them, I probaly average only 1 hit more in a complete fight...

 

 

 

And also strength doesn't only affect max hit, also the chances of hitting higher.

[ShadowTwisted]

Yeah tey do seem it, rune pures with 60 attack hit me almost as much as I hit them, I probaly average only 1 hit more in a complete fight...

 

 

 

And also strength doesn't only affect max hit, also the chances of hitting higher.

 

 

 

Hitting higher or more frequently? Because higher would generally just refer back to max hit. Also, the game probably uses complicated algorithms to keep each fight different, utilizing your stats versus your opponent's. Occasionally, you will have instances where your opponent gets the most favorable results, while you get the least favorable one.

[jimmyjames227]

Defence only effects the amount of TIME'S you are hit if you get hit a 1 in no armour with 99 defence and enemy has a godsword it wont be a 1 its more likly to be a 50.

[ultimatballr]

Does anyone remember the old Duel arena style of Boxing?

 

 

 

I am pretty sure that someone with 90 att 80 str and 99 defence beats out someone with 90 att 99 str and 80 def at least a majority of the time (7 out of 10 in that range)

 

 

 

With 99 defence and 92 att (@ 80 str) I can only remember losing a few boxing matches to people with 95 att 99 str and 70 defence. (in that general area)

 

 

 

I would agree with you though, str does seem to own all. Even with high attack it seems the pures with 70 att and 99 str beat out the opposite (both with 40 def)

[Cacmypants]

Bah, you people and your pety arguments...

 

 

 

Everyone knows that a balanced player in their BEST possible gear is always going to beat the equivilant pure.

 

 

 

Pures get a distinct advantage when their opponent is wearing crap compared to what they should be wearing (that's why they rule PvP)

[Huta]

Bear in mind, I am F2P and am referring to solely my F2P experiences

 

 

 

I must agree, strength is FTW! In no armour fights there is no comparison really -- strength comes out on top and attack and defence are rendered useless because they are based around armour.

 

 

 

Even in armour fights, strength seems to come out on top. I defeated Y Guy 4 Life who is 98 attack and low str/def with my medium atk/high str/low def in a full armour DM

 

Different stats do different things. If you have low attack, you'll still do fine against someone with low defence. But if you tried to use that low attack on someone in high defence with GOOD armor, you would fail miserably.

 

Tell me, how does that relate to what I said? I said:

 

- In no armour fights, strength comes out on top, no comparison

 

- In full (rune) armour fights, strength STILL comes out on top, even against someone with a high attack.

 

 

 

Maybe you didn't understand my example. I fought Y Guy, both using full rune and an inventory of tuna. I ran his food supply out and killed him with around 7-8 food still left. I KNOW this is only just one example but its not as if I only just beat him, there was a very clear margin.

 

 

 

In f2p, with the horribly low accuracy on rune weapons, attack is weaker than def. If he had low attack and str, with high defense, you would probably have lost.

 

 

 

Everyone knows that a balanced player in their BEST possible gear is always going to beat the equivilant pure.

 

 

 

True. But a balanced played is at a disadvantage against say, someone with 90 90 70 stats, or some mix in that area. Balanced players are pretty weak all in all, just pures are weaker and simply own because people are too stupid or too cheap to wear what's required to beat them.

[Cacmypants]

Everyone knows that a balanced player in their BEST possible gear is always going to beat the equivilant pure.

 

 

 

True. But a balanced played is at a disadvantage against say, someone with 90 90 70 stats, or some mix in that area. Balanced players are pretty weak all in all, just pures are weaker and simply own because people are too stupid or too cheap to wear what's required to beat them.

 

 

 

 

 

Well... actually, I used the combat calculator on this site, and a 90, 90, 70 pure is equivilant to a 85, 85, 85 balanced, doesn't seem like much of a disadvantage to me... (I'm excludeing prayer on both sides and they are both combat level 97)

[compfreak847]

Everyone knows that a balanced player in their BEST possible gear is always going to beat the equivilant pure.

 

 

 

True. But a balanced played is at a disadvantage against say, someone with 90 90 70 stats, or some mix in that area. Balanced players are pretty weak all in all, just pures are weaker and simply own because people are too stupid or too cheap to wear what's required to beat them.

 

 

 

 

 

Well... actually, I used the combat calculator on this site, and a 90, 90, 70 pure is equivilant to a 85, 85, 85 balanced, doesn't seem like much of a disadvantage to me... (I'm excludeing prayer on both sides and they are both combat level 97)

 

Yeah, the 85-85-85 will win by far. As you scale up even higher, that 99-99-45 pure that seems like such a great idea will meet a nasty death at the hands of an 87-87-87 player in torag's dd++. Been there, done that. DD++ won't hit that much on 87 defence + torags, but 45 defence and rune = 2-3 specced.

[Huta]

Everyone knows that a balanced player in their BEST possible gear is always going to beat the equivilant pure.

 

 

 

True. But a balanced played is at a disadvantage against say, someone with 90 90 70 stats, or some mix in that area. Balanced players are pretty weak all in all, just pures are weaker and simply own because people are too stupid or too cheap to wear what's required to beat them.

 

 

 

 

 

Well... actually, I used the combat calculator on this site, and a 90, 90, 70 pure is equivilant to a 85, 85, 85 balanced, doesn't seem like much of a disadvantage to me... (I'm excludeing prayer on both sides and they are both combat level 97)

 

Yeah, the 85-85-85 will win by far. As you scale up even higher, that 99-99-45 pure that seems like such a great idea will meet a nasty death at the hands of an 87-87-87 player in torag's dd++. Been there, done that. DD++ won't hit that much on 87 defence + torags, but 45 defence and rune = 2-3 specced.

 

 

 

I didn't show a rune pure, I showed a barrows pure.

[compfreak847]

Everyone knows that a balanced player in their BEST possible gear is always going to beat the equivilant pure.

 

 

 

True. But a balanced played is at a disadvantage against say, someone with 90 90 70 stats, or some mix in that area. Balanced players are pretty weak all in all, just pures are weaker and simply own because people are too stupid or too cheap to wear what's required to beat them.

 

 

 

 

 

Well... actually, I used the combat calculator on this site, and a 90, 90, 70 pure is equivilant to a 85, 85, 85 balanced, doesn't seem like much of a disadvantage to me... (I'm excludeing prayer on both sides and they are both combat level 97)

 

Yeah, the 85-85-85 will win by far. As you scale up even higher, that 99-99-45 pure that seems like such a great idea will meet a nasty death at the hands of an 87-87-87 player in torag's dd++. Been there, done that. DD++ won't hit that much on 87 defence + torags, but 45 defence and rune = 2-3 specced.

 

 

 

I didn't show a rune pure, I showed a barrows pure.

 

By the time you hit 70 defence, your hardly a pure, and you've lost all that 'cheap armor' advantage. Now it's just 99-99-70 vs. 99-90-85 - the extra 10 strength levels won't make up for the 15 defence levels (assuming the 2nd player only has 95 HP), as defence is more important then strength at that level unless your using veracs. A high level whip tank vs. whip tank fight goes something like 0-0-0-0-0-0-23-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-70-0-0-0-0-0-29-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-41 making attack and defence MUCH more important then strength, as you are hitting\being hit much less then 50% of the time. And that 85 defence will still help against dd++ specs that will do nasty things to 70 defence with 99 attack.

[Huta]

Everyone knows that a balanced player in their BEST possible gear is always going to beat the equivilant pure.

 

 

 

True. But a balanced played is at a disadvantage against say, someone with 90 90 70 stats, or some mix in that area. Balanced players are pretty weak all in all, just pures are weaker and simply own because people are too stupid or too cheap to wear what's required to beat them.

 

 

 

 

 

Well... actually, I used the combat calculator on this site, and a 90, 90, 70 pure is equivilant to a 85, 85, 85 balanced, doesn't seem like much of a disadvantage to me... (I'm excludeing prayer on both sides and they are both combat level 97)

 

Yeah, the 85-85-85 will win by far. As you scale up even higher, that 99-99-45 pure that seems like such a great idea will meet a nasty death at the hands of an 87-87-87 player in torag's dd++. Been there, done that. DD++ won't hit that much on 87 defence + torags, but 45 defence and rune = 2-3 specced.

 

 

 

I didn't show a rune pure, I showed a barrows pure.

 

By the time you hit 70 defence, your hardly a pure, and you've lost all that 'cheap armor' advantage. Now it's just 99-99-70 vs. 99-90-85 - the extra 10 strength levels won't make up for the 15 defence levels (assuming the 2nd player only has 95 HP), as defence is more important then strength at that level unless your using veracs. A high level whip tank vs. whip tank fight goes something like 0-0-0-0-0-0-23-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-70-0-0-0-0-0-29-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-41 making attack and defence MUCH more important then strength, as you are hitting\being hit much less then 50% of the time. And that 85 defence will still help against dd++ specs that will do nasty things to 70 defence with 99 attack.

 

 

 

You can't crunch numbers like that on pvp. I was a barrows pure for ages, and it did destroy balanced builds. My kills to deaths, no matter where I went, were around 3-1 easily on people my combat.

 

 

 

One of the things you're forgetting are that prayers raise skills by a percentage, which benefits people with one or two high skills over people with balanced stats.

[Cacmypants]

Everyone knows that a balanced player in their BEST possible gear is always going to beat the equivilant pure.

 

 

 

True. But a balanced played is at a disadvantage against say, someone with 90 90 70 stats, or some mix in that area. Balanced players are pretty weak all in all, just pures are weaker and simply own because people are too stupid or too cheap to wear what's required to beat them.

 

 

 

 

 

Well... actually, I used the combat calculator on this site, and a 90, 90, 70 pure is equivilant to a 85, 85, 85 balanced, doesn't seem like much of a disadvantage to me... (I'm excludeing prayer on both sides and they are both combat level 97)

 

Yeah, the 85-85-85 will win by far. As you scale up even higher, that 99-99-45 pure that seems like such a great idea will meet a nasty death at the hands of an 87-87-87 player in torag's dd++. Been there, done that. DD++ won't hit that much on 87 defence + torags, but 45 defence and rune = 2-3 specced.

 

 

 

I didn't show a rune pure, I showed a barrows pure.

 

By the time you hit 70 defence, your hardly a pure, and you've lost all that 'cheap armor' advantage. Now it's just 99-99-70 vs. 99-90-85 - the extra 10 strength levels won't make up for the 15 defence levels (assuming the 2nd player only has 95 HP), as defence is more important then strength at that level unless your using veracs. A high level whip tank vs. whip tank fight goes something like 0-0-0-0-0-0-23-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-70-0-0-0-0-0-29-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-41 making attack and defence MUCH more important then strength, as you are hitting\being hit much less then 50% of the time. And that 85 defence will still help against dd++ specs that will do nasty things to 70 defence with 99 attack.

 

 

 

You can't crunch numbers like that on pvp. I was a barrows pure for ages, and it did destroy balanced builds. My kills to deaths, no matter where I went, were around 3-1 easily on people my combat.

 

 

 

One of the things you're forgetting are that prayers raise skills by a percentage, which benefits people with one or two high skills over people with balanced stats.

 

 

 

Exactly why Piety kicks [wagon] for a balanced build, +25% defense please.

[compfreak847]

 

 

 

True. But a balanced played is at a disadvantage against say, someone with 90 90 70 stats, or some mix in that area. Balanced players are pretty weak all in all, just pures are weaker and simply own because people are too stupid or too cheap to wear what's required to beat them.

 

 

 

 

 

Well... actually, I used the combat calculator on this site, and a 90, 90, 70 pure is equivilant to a 85, 85, 85 balanced, doesn't seem like much of a disadvantage to me... (I'm excludeing prayer on both sides and they are both combat level 97)

 

Yeah, the 85-85-85 will win by far. As you scale up even higher, that 99-99-45 pure that seems like such a great idea will meet a nasty death at the hands of an 87-87-87 player in torag's dd++. Been there, done that. DD++ won't hit that much on 87 defence + torags, but 45 defence and rune = 2-3 specced.

 

 

 

I didn't show a rune pure, I showed a barrows pure.

 

By the time you hit 70 defence, your hardly a pure, and you've lost all that 'cheap armor' advantage. Now it's just 99-99-70 vs. 99-90-85 - the extra 10 strength levels won't make up for the 15 defence levels (assuming the 2nd player only has 95 HP), as defence is more important then strength at that level unless your using veracs. A high level whip tank vs. whip tank fight goes something like 0-0-0-0-0-0-23-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-70-0-0-0-0-0-29-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-41 making attack and defence MUCH more important then strength, as you are hitting\being hit much less then 50% of the time. And that 85 defence will still help against dd++ specs that will do nasty things to 70 defence with 99 attack.

 

 

 

You can't crunch numbers like that on pvp. I was a barrows pure for ages, and it did destroy balanced builds. My kills to deaths, no matter where I went, were around 3-1 easily on people my combat.

 

 

 

One of the things you're forgetting are that prayers raise skills by a percentage, which benefits people with one or two high skills over people with balanced stats.

 

 

 

Exactly why Piety kicks [wagon] for a balanced build, +25% defense please.

 

Of course a barrows build is going to own. Hardly anyone, including balanced players, wear barrows, so torags > rune. It is entirely possible to crunch numbers though, and the largest boost of any prayer goes to *ahem* defence.

[Huta]

I was talking about dominating anywhere, facing fully armored players, not edgeville pvp with rune and zerkers.

 

 

 

Don't ask me to explain it because I can't, but I've seen it happen enough to know the mindless balanced builds blow at pvp. You have to focus on one or two stats, and the best two combos are usually defense and strength, or attack and strength.

[compfreak847]

I was talking about dominating anywhere, facing fully armored players, not edgeville pvp with rune and zerkers.

 

 

 

Don't ask me to explain it because I can't, but I've seen it happen enough to know the mindless balanced builds blow at pvp. You have to focus on one or two stats, and the best two combos are usually defense and strength, or attack and strength.

 

If your talking about safe PVP, where the best armor\equipment are standard, I know that a balanced build is by FAR the best. I've spent hundreds of hours at pits\castle wars\clan wars, training from 65 to almost maxed melee stats while doing them (92-99 strength was almost all from fight pits).