this is the rants forum, not the complaints forum

[Stallion4589]

why did the rant of the week get cut? i thought it was a good idea at the time, and the rants chosen were actually quality ones. and that, neo, was during your holiday. but how many stickies does it take til the rants forum looks messy? perhaps reinstating the rotw would help. and maybe not deleting threads would go down well too...

[swampjedi]

The impression I got when My Rant was stickied is that no one reads the stickies, so it didn't work.

[trunksrs]

The impression I got when My Rant was stickied is that no one reads the stickies, so it didn't work.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'll admit, when that rant got stickied, it took me a while to find it. Mainly because I had already read the "how to write a good rant" sticky, so I wasn't looking at the stickies for anything new.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe if common rants being stickied becomes common enough, it will attract more attention.

[swampjedi]

Yeah, that's what I mean, but you said it much more clearly.

[neogeo0823]

well, then lets not sticky the RotW then. look at the tip.it times article threads. theyre not stickied and they stay pretty popular for a while. heck, i just saw the thread for the T.i.T. article where we interviewed zezima on the front page of the general board today.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

hey, heres another idea. if the RotW is well written enough, why not feature it on the front page just below the tip.it times? hmm... that probably wouldnt happen...[/wishfulthinking]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

...err yeah. back to what i was saying. i think that if we want to get a rant of the week noticed and open for discussion, we would need to feature it in some way. it would be interesting to have a bi-weekly or maybe monthly tirad about things that annoy me in runescape... uhh that is, of course, if such a thing were to happen and i were made a monthly author... :-w

[sanday79]

Well, of course, I get tired of reading some of the dreck on this board (I don't want to single this guy out, I feel bad, but he was ranting about the fact that he died and the guy who looted his corpse wouldn't give him his stuff back).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

However, this remains called the "rants" board, whether you like it or not. The word "rant", as used in the expression "ranting and raving" or something like that, means to go on and on about something that's bugging you. At the core of it, that's what these people are doing, blowing off steam about something that's bugging them. You complain about how these people are just venting and not contributing anything to the boards. Perhaps this is true, but where did anyone say that you have to read or even respond to the rants? You can choose simply to ignore threads you deem stupid or dead-end and they'll quickly become obsolete (someone touched on that earlier).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree fully with the comments that just because you structure a rant and use correct grammar and nice vocabulary doesn't change the message, that you're upset about something.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Whoever's been talking about requiring people to be a certain level in order to post rants or whatever, shame on you! When you first joined Tip.It, whether weeks or months or even years ago, did you think your opinions were invalid? Just because someone is new to the forums doesn't mean they're new to Runescape, and even if they ARE new to Runescape, it doesn't mean they can't make perfectly astute observations or criticisms of the game or the people in it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Tired as I am of reading some of the sillier rants, I respect the poster's freedom to make those rants. Obviously, something is disturbing them, and they want to get it out, whether we all read it or not. Once again, this is the "Rants" forum, not the "Research-supported 5-paragraph essay on the shortcomings of Runescape" forum.

[Ard_Choille]

Once again, this is the "Rants" forum, not the "Research-supported 5-paragraph essay on the shortcomings of Runescape" forum.

 

 

 

Ha! Well said!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just to touch on a few things mentioned here, and I haven't made note of who said what this time.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The "good rants" also require maintenance. Some of the best ones we've had have been kept alive because moderators prune out the garbaggio and flames. Additionally, some of our good ones MAY be on the list of things not to post but if a rant is well crafted and the replies are in keeping with a good rant, it may be left on the forum.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Noob sticky seems to be faring well. If anything, I do think it's cut down on the number of "people who call others noobs stink" threads. Stickies in general, don't get read as often as we'd like. A lot of work has been done to reduce the number of stickies though, so it might be worth putting more topics up there. I'm going to move the rant guide up to announcement to see if that helps with the popularity of the stickies.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In regard to the disappearance of good rants, unfortunately accidents happen. If you think about how many times you've accidentally double posted, imagine the accidental things that could happen if you were managing a TON of threads at once. I realize it's not idea, but accidents happen. The server lag issues have been reduced, so hopefully we'll run into fewer situations like this.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Anywho...continue your discussion. I'm still paying attention, even if I'm not replying a bunch.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

\

[Stallion4589]

However, this remains called the "rants" board, whether you like it or not. The word "rant", as used in the expression "ranting and raving" or something like that, means to go on and on about something that's bugging you. At the core of it, that's what these people are doing, blowing off steam about something that's bugging them. You complain about how these people are just venting and not contributing anything to the boards. Perhaps this is true, but where did anyone say that you have to read or even respond to the rants? You can choose simply to ignore threads you deem stupid or dead-end and they'll quickly become obsolete (someone touched on that earlier).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

well, the idea is that we want to try to shift away from the normal ranting and raving. we still want people to vent their frustrations, but rather than a 1 line unreadable post, we would like a thread which provides a starting point for a decent discussion or debate, rather than the poster getting flamed for whinging about something silly or their poor use of the english/1337 language. the changes suggested previously mean that we will not only get less of the cruddy stuff, but more quality rants.

[Stihl]

Whoever's been talking about requiring people to be a certain level in order to post rants or whatever, shame on you! When you first joined Tip.It, whether weeks or months or even years ago, did you think your opinions were invalid? Just because someone is new to the forums doesn't mean they're new to Runescape, and even if they ARE new to Runescape, it doesn't mean they can't make perfectly astute observations or criticisms of the game or the people in it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I don't know if that's aimed at me or not, but I'll go ahead and address it anyway.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This train of thought is aimed at people who join, and immediately author threads, entirely ignoring the search button/stickies/rules. Their opinions may not be strictly invalid, but we'd like to minimize beating the dead horse and ignoring the regulations. This is precisely why I people who run around screaming "freedom of speech!", etc, frustrate me. In joining this forum, you agree to abide by certain rules and regulations. One of those is that you grant moderators the right to modify/delete/censor your words as they see fit. If you're posting here, that in itself is proof that you've signed away your precious "freedom of speech". Note that this applies to your comments on "freedom to rant".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

More relevant to your concern, I'd like to note that none of these stipulations are difficult to contend with. Three days isn't a life sentence, it's a chance for you to calm down, learn to use the search button (since you can still post on others's threads), and generally improve your arguments. The karma/post count suggestions would almost certainly follow the same principle. If you're sincere about ranting, whether or not your opinions are "valid", surely you can bear such a minor burden.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Quick analogy. Imagine a room full of professional chemists. Amongst them, a Chemistry 11 student (ie: grade 11) moves about, attempting to make some criticism or validate some theory. Nobody is going to take that student seriously, not because his/her words must be (by some pagan logic) invalid, but rather, because if those fellows stop to consider the words of every grade 11 student who thinks (s)he knows something, the science of chemistry would screech to a frightening halt. At some point, we have to draw a line and accept whatever losses that line incurs. If being patient enough to wait three full days before subjecting us to your (being general, no personal attacks going on here) threads is too much to ask of you, then to be honest, I don't think that having you here is worth the moderation involved, valid opinions or no. Callous, but realistic.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And, I did think my opinions were valid when I joined. It only took me about a week to realize both that much of what I had to say had already been said (in far clearer language), and that much of what remained of my thoughts were easily defeated in some older threads I found via the search button.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i just saw the thread for the T.i.T. article where we interviewed zezima...

Holy cow, neogeo0823 said a dirty word! :o

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hm. Is a separate board that hosts either the neogeo0823's "weekly tip.it rants", or Trojan_Zebra's "perpetually cleaned debates" totally out of the question? I know that's a truckload of work for the whole Tip.it team, but the direction of these latest ideas is giving me visions of a rather cluttered rants board.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Mixed feelings on the latest thoughts, but I've nothing better to suggest, so I'll leave it at that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

=D>

[Stallion4589]

Hm. Is a separate board that hosts either the neogeo0823's "weekly tip.it rants", or Trojan_Zebra's "perpetually cleaned debates" totally out of the question? I know that's a truckload of work for the whole Tip.it team, but the direction of these latest ideas is giving me visions of a rather cluttered rants board.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Mixed feelings on the latest thoughts, but I've nothing better to suggest, so I'll leave it at that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

=D>

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

how about splitting the current forum into a "rants" forum and a "debates" forum. all the older and mature people (not necessarily both :P) can move to the debates forum, and the rants forum can continue to be a hothouse for flames. one side note, posts in the rants forum do not count towards your total post count. kinda like the rate this forum.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

examples:

 

 

 

rants forum:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

0h emm g33!!!1shift1 the n00bz0rs 4r3 invading pc! it shuld b 4 high lvls onli!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

yeah... random bunch of pointless spam that doesnt count towards the post count...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

debates forum:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

dont you think that pest control should be split according to combat level? perhaps one boat for under level 75, with a slightly easier game, and another for 75+, with the minigame as it currently is. the rewards should stay the same. what do you think?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[insert balanced, intelligent and thoughtful reply here]

[neogeo0823]

 

i just saw the thread for the T.i.T. article where we interviewed zezima...

Holy cow, neogeo0823 said a dirty word! :o

:roll: :P obviously it would be pronouced "tee aye tee", not what your insinuating. :shame: it was extremely late and i was too lazy to write out the whole thing that many times. anyway, onto the part i wans looking at...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

how about splitting the current forum into a "rants" forum and a "debates" forum. all the older and mature people (not necessarily both ) can move to the debates forum, and the rants forum can continue to be a hothouse for flames. one side note, posts in the rants forum do not count towards your total post count. kinda like the rate this forum.

i had actually suggested something almost exactly like this back a page or two ago, but this is a much simpler, easier to understand version. i think this idea would work well, and i had also said that in that same post.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

EDIT: the post im talking about is on the first page, in my last post, beggining at the paragraph that starts with "the third option..."

[Stallion4589]

how about splitting the current forum into a "rants" forum and a "debates" forum. all the older and mature people (not necessarily both ) can move to the debates forum, and the rants forum can continue to be a hothouse for flames. one side note, posts in the rants forum do not count towards your total post count. kinda like the rate this forum.

i had actually suggested something almost exactly like this back a page or two ago, but this is a much simpler, easier to understand version. i think this idea would work well, and i had also said that in that same post.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

EDIT: the post im talking about is on the first page, in my last post, beggining at the paragraph that starts with "the third option..."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

wow. my bad. well i wont claim that one as my own. still i think thats a good idea that would work better than most others. this is following my "idiots will be idoits" theory that someone disproved. but yeah. sounds good.

[Stihl]

this is following my "idiots will be idoits" theory that someone disproved.

This has most definitely not been disproved. It has been disregarded as trivial information. I'd shower you with analogies, but suffice it to say that there is quite a distinction.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The only reason I'm not going to support a clean split into "rants" and "debates" forum, is that I don't feel garbage posts belong here at all, let alone deserve their own board. Also, having a trash board could potentially get some users into a bad habit - they get used to flames being okay on one board, and start to distribute them on other boards. Like Nadril said, we have other outlets for that. Violent video games, journals, aggressive sports... we shouldn't need to spend TIF bandwidth on it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

More what I had in mind was an "archive" board that hosts the better rants which are technically mentionned on that nasty list in the Rant Guide. Perhaps then we could move said list to a second sticky in much the way that Trojan_Zebra has been suggesting. This, at least I believe, would give newer users the opportunity to see debates on those dead topics (perhaps even debate themselves), without reducing the rants board to a ..."diseased hulk", as Swampjedi might put it.

[Stallion4589]

 

this is following my "idiots will be idoits" theory that someone disproved.

This has most definitely not been disproved. It has been disregarded as trivial information. I'd shower you with analogies, but suffice it to say that there is quite a distinction.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

lol point taken.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

More what I had in mind was an "archive" board that hosts the better rants which are technically mentionned on that nasty list in the Rant Guide. Perhaps then we could move said list to a second sticky in much the way that Trojan_Zebra has been suggesting. This, at least I believe, would give newer users the opportunity to see debates on those dead topics (perhaps even debate themselves), without reducing the rants board to a ..."diseased hulk", as Swampjedi might put it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i agree that the rants forum cant be reduced to a "diseased hulk." that would suck, to put it bluntly. however, the counter to this was that there are perfectly legitimate posters that will have new and fresh ideas that they wont be able to add to a locked sticky. so far, stickied threads have looked like the most sensible and beneficial idea that we can come up with.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

we have one stickied thread... do you think that it works?

[Stihl]

however, the counter to this was that there are perfectly legitimate posters that will have new and fresh ideas that they wont be able to add to a locked sticky.

I'm not advocating a series of locked stickes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm advocating a single "Index" sticky. One which, for each item on that list of "dead topics" (those that are worthy of debate, anyway), would point to related threads hosted by an "archive" type board, where those dead topics could remain open for debate by the newer generation. Whether we accomplish this through Trojan_Zebra's 'perpetually cleaned threads', or neogeo0823's 'weekly tip.it rant', or something different altogether, is an entirely different question... and heck, that's assuming that this is a plausible option in the first place. :oops:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

we have one stickied thread... do you think that it works?

Two, if you count the "new updates" sticky. There are still a few rants on hunting, mind you. I suppose the question is, how many more would there be without Jaklumen's sticky? :-k

[Stallion4589]

so with the index sticky, these would link to the original threads? kinda like leesters old archive of wisdom thread before the player made guide/aow forums were in existence? if so, we are on the same page.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

and there are far too many hunter rants considering the sticky. maybe a hunter sticky in neccesary in this special case. its not like theres going to be a skill update every week, is there?

[neogeo0823]

i suppose a temporary hunter sticky could be in order, because its only a matter of time before the hunter threads die out almost completely. its just the hype of the new skill and should soon be over.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

that said, i also agree with the indexing idea thats been discussed over the last couple of posts. my primary concern on that one is making sure that the threads that are linked into that index remain intact. if that can be assured, then im all for it. thought, to make it as useful as possible, it should include not only rants about improper topics, but rants about long debated topics, rants on current popular subjects, any really good rant that would normally be stickied, and the old tip.it rant of the week that would be done, if they were to be reinstated. basically, it would turn into a database of really good rants for people to refference, post opinions on, debate, and discuss.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

that said, i would still like to see a revival of the weekly tip.it rant, fairly simply cause i never got to see it happen the first time. of course, it wouldnt need to be every week. maybe bi-weekly, or monthly. it could be an interesting sidetrack to the normal rants forum. i mean, a good rant is all in fun, but i know when i see a new thread about the newest tip.it times, i immediately stop what im doing to go and read the new article. if the authors present their rants in an interesting manner, maybe with a joke or two, a bit of witty sarcasm, and a good helping of tiradical(is that a word?) anger, then it really could be an interesting read.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

either way, though, im going to go back and edit my first post to encourage more people to come and post opinions on this matter. this threads quickly becoming a three man show between me, stallion, and stihl.

[Stihl]

so with the index sticky, these would link to the original threads? kinda like leesters old archive of wisdom thread before the player made guide/aow forums were in existence?

I'm not quite sure I could call it "original". Like neogeo0823's "T.U.F.W. on f2p vs. p2p", threads I would like to think of as "original" have long since evaporated. That's more or less the idea, though. In fact, the AoW is what brought about the idea.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

My primary concern on that one is making sure that the threads that are linked into that index remain intact. if that can be assured, then im all for it. thought, to make it as useful as possible, it should include not only rants about improper topics, but rants about long debated topics, rants on current popular subjects, any really good rant that would normally be stickied, and the old tip.it rant of the week that would be done, if they were to be reinstated. basically, it would turn into a database of really good rants for people to refference, post opinions on, debate, and discuss.

That's where the AoW got me thinking. Threads there don't die too bloody fast, so couldn't an "archive" board lengthen the lifespan of these threads? I'll concede popular and long debated topics, as those definitely have a place in the little space I've dreamt up, but a word of caution regarding "any really good rant": the more we remove good writing from the rants board, the more we risk reducing it to the "diseased hulk" board. If such a line is to be drawn, it must not be drawn lightly.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Which relates to the whole concept. Like Gidion hinted at so long ago, before we get too entrenched in this 'separate board' thinking, some consideration to the strain this would/could put on the Tip.it Team wouldn't be out of place. Having these 'debate' threads (whether stickied or not) could get to be something of an eyesore, but is the creation of another board really what's necessary to reduce the clutter? Is it worth it?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This thread's quickly becoming a three man show between me, stallion, and stihl.

Huh-huh. Hey, Beavith. I'm h****. We need a chick. [/guilty pleasure]

[neogeo0823]

That's where the AoW got me thinking. Threads there don't die too bloody fast, so couldn't an "archive" board lengthen the lifespan of these threads? I'll concede popular and long debated topics, as those definitely have a place in the little space I've dreamt up, but a word of caution regarding "any really good rant": the more we remove good writing from the rants board, the more we risk reducing it to the "diseased hulk" board. If such a line is to be drawn, it must not be drawn lightly.

true, i suppose. i guess it boils down to matters of "acceptable losses", really. we have a select set of threads that go in this section and after that, theres two choices present. we can either keep what we have and only add really relavant, cutting edge style rants, or we can write out the set of rants that covers the list that we need to cover and not have anymore threads let into that board.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

the problem i see with the latter is that the board may go stale after a while, as theres nothing new to discuss, while with the former, we run the risk of moving all the quality stuff that we would normally want to see in the rants board over to this new board, thereby making the rants board into this "diseased hulk" you guys keep talking about. its all a matter of give and take.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Which relates to the whole concept. Like Gidion hinted at so long ago, before we get too entrenched in this 'separate board' thinking, some consideration to the strain this would/could put on the Tip.it Team wouldn't be out of place. Having these 'debate' threads (whether stickied or not) could get to be something of an eyesore, but is the creation of another board really what's necessary to reduce the clutter? Is it worth it?

well, consider what other option have been presented. since the start of this thread, ive been trying to find the solution that would require the least amount of work, the least amount of moderation time, and cause the least amount of disruption. once again, its a question of compromise. we could make stickies in the rants board, but that would be messy looking and might need heavy moderation to maintain. we could create a seperate board and mark one for the purpose of spam, but that would instantly become the "diseased hulk" thing that you guys were talking about. we could create an archive of good rants, but it runs the risk of either becoming stale, or taking away from the overal "quality"(and i use that term loosely around most of the time) of the rants board.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

to me, the logical choice would be the seperate board. it seems to require the least amount of work, and would almost definately help to reduce flaming and spam around here. althought, thats just my point of view. if anyone else would care to argue for a different solution, ill be more than happy to hear what they have to say. heck, if anyone can come up with an easier solution, ill listen to that as well. im pretty much all ears over here as it is.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This thread's quickly becoming a three man show between me, stallion, and stihl.

Huh-huh. Hey, Beavith. I'm h****. We need a chick. [/guilty pleasure]

:shock: umm... yeah... :? uh... :| *walks away* :ohnoes:

[Stihl]

"acceptable losses"... a matter of give and take.

Precisely. I'll grin and bear whatever the administrators deem the best option, but the consequences are real. Frivolous decisions are not recommended.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To me, the logical choice would be the seperate board. it seems to require the least amount of work, and would almost definately help to reduce flaming and spam around here. althought, thats just my point of view.

A little healthy skepticism would do us well. Logic or no, like Zubeedoo was shooting for earlier, it's practicality and efficiency that matter. Humans haven't been known for their logic in the past.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Have you ever opened a piece of junk mail, realized that you're looking at the back of the item, and had that little nagging sensation of disinterest? Ever bought a bag of potato chips without reading the net weight, only to realize later that it's half full of air? Isn't it funny how such minor efforts influence our actions?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

A new user, in order to reap the benefits of an archive board, would have to notice the index sticky, read the intro blurb to the sticky, scan the sticky for topics similar to their would-be rant, click the appropriate link, and then spend a good bit of time reading what others have to say on the subject. Translation: we're going to be filtering some individuals out, some of which may not belong to that group we call, "idiots". So, two questions there.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1) Is that an acceptable loss?

 

 

 

2) How much of the eyesore we are currently dealing with can be attributed to the individuals that would still be filtered out by this change? In other words, how much is this really going to help?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Questions I alone cannot answer. We're coming full circle, some fresh blood around here would be really helpful.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Pfeh. Classic Beavis and Butthead, and I get nothing, but a quick "Bow-Chick-A-Bow-Wow" would've had you rolling. No class, I tell ya, no class at all.

[neogeo0823]

Pfeh. Classic Beavis and Butthead, and I get nothing, but a quick "Bow-Chick-A-Bow-Wow" would've had you rolling. No class, I tell ya, no class at all.

hey, red vs blue > beavis and butthead anytime :

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

and to disqualify this post from the spam category, ill let you know that im editing the title so that hopefully more people will read this thread.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

EDIT: no more space to add a bit extra to the title...

[Stallion4589]

sorry for my absence. i shall turn this back into a 3 man team. ive been at schoolies (those aussies will know what im on about). but im back now. never fear. and i know how neo likes free bumps from me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

like stihl said, the decision will be made by the admins based on the man(or woman)power that they have to moderate another rants archive board. perhaps this is the best idea there has been so far. i seriously doubt that an archive board will be a graveyard for the big picture threads. im sure there are enough of us to keep it alive. the question is, will the rants forum have a fairly permanent and active moderator (like pokemama in the aow) to sticky great threads? that is really the only way it would work. vote 1 neo for rants forum mod. or stihl. or zub. rai. gid. screw that, a hoard of mods of the rants board!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

stickys such as the hunter one should only be temporary. like another week or 2 at the most. someone has already gotten 99, and i think the new skill phase is over. i havent really checked how productive the "bad person" sticky. so i guess some indication can be taken from that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i dont have much else to add. 5 hours sleep in 2 days does that to you.

[Stallion4589]

this was almost at the bottom of the page. where has everyone gone? has this thread really died?

[Ard_Choille]

this was almost at the bottom of the page. where has everyone gone? has this thread really died?

 

 

 

Putting together some ideas based on what you've all discussed. I haven't forgotten you.

[neogeo0823]

you know what i just noticed? this thread has almost as many views as the rant guide. i dont know whether to laugh or cry at that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

on a side note, Ard, ive figured out how you got that sig pic that changes everytime you reload the page. ive filled mine with interesting tidbits thats ive gathered from conversations with npcs in runescape. whqat do you think of my little collection? 8-)