Bloodstain

That's a bad comparison. Humans are naturally whiny animals. Dogs eat off the floor and there's nothing wrong with it - they don't really care. A person eating off the floor is a lot different. Just because we don't like eating off the floor is no argument against dogs eating off the floor. The floor? What the hell are you talking about? You are telling me that dogs LIKE being in 30+ celsius weather with a fur coat on their back? Do explain. I'm not giving it as a comparison, I'm saying you THINK they enjoy it, then go do it for yourself and see how bad it is. edit: I can understand that dogs like outdoors. If my dog wants outside, he goes outside. However, if I am going to be somewhere or doing something that makes me unable to check on him every ~15 minutes, he comes inside. Making a dog live outside though is just stupid

My problem is this. You got a dog, take care of it. Anything you can provide them shelter wise will never be as good as a house. Dogs are pack animals, they need to be with their pack. If people can't handle having a dog in the house, or exercising it, or training it, or anything, then get rid of it and give it to someone who will. It might appear happy, but how would you like to spend every day of summer in boiling heat with a sweater on by yourself? Looking healthy and being deemed healthy as a vet are different things, although as you said I don't know their situation. A dog will always, always, always be healthier living as indoor dog rather than an outdoor. Why bother having to pay for vet bills caused by having an outdoor dog when you can just keep an indoor dog? That is assuming the people who own outdoor dogs can even notice the injury or sickness, and then if they even take the dog to the vet instead of "letting him stay for a while and see if it goes away" I'm not sure the pack argument works very well, as most dogs will be alone on average one third of the day either way. Most parents work and most children have school. In many cases, school and work come at the same time. So the dog will inevitably be alone either way. Yes, but when you are home the dog will likely be with you at all times, or near you. As opposed to an outdoor dog who likely only gets interaction with its family only a couple times a day for less than an hour two. Dogs are pack animals, it's a pretty well known fact. That doesn't mean you need to be together at ALL times, just that there needs to be an establish hierarchy that you often cannot have with an outdoor dog. The dogs also need to be around their "pack" for reliance and companionship, affection, etc. Really, I can't seem to find a reason NOT to keep a dog inside, aside from being too lazy to exercise, not wanting to train, and stupid excuses like shedding where they should not have got a dog.

I do not know the Katrina thing, but human lives > dogs, but if you can save both then do it. You seem to mistake me for someone who is a PETA freak, rather than someone who actually knows how to take care of dogs.

My problem is this. You got a dog, take care of it. Anything you can provide them shelter wise will never be as good as a house. Dogs are pack animals, they need to be with their pack. If people can't handle having a dog in the house, or exercising it, or training it, or anything, then get rid of it and give it to someone who will. It might appear happy, but how would you like to spend every day of summer in boiling heat with a sweater on by yourself? Looking healthy and being deemed healthy as a vet are different things, although as you said I don't know their situation. A dog will always, always, always be healthier living as indoor dog rather than an outdoor. Why bother having to pay for vet bills caused by having an outdoor dog when you can just keep an indoor dog? That is assuming the people who own outdoor dogs can even notice the injury or sickness, and then if they even take the dog to the vet instead of "letting him stay for a while and see if it goes away"

They don't have fur covering the pads of their feet. And if those get damaged in any way, it is an excruciating amount of pain for a dog. They will when you let the outside for a while. I have had dogs my entire life, more or less. They were primarily inside dogs, but they were allowed outside when we were. They have always been in great shape because we let them out daily. Walks, runs, fetch, whatever. Generally speaking, inside dogs in this area are far healthier and seem much happier as a result. On topic, I don't have any suggestions that haven't already been, er, suggested. I assume it is the difference of location. In addition to the fact that they are animals, dogs don't smell like roses which to me don't smell good to begin with. I don't want my house smelling like dog when you walk in. Because you can always smell when somebody has an inside dog. Obviously, if my dogs weren't well taken care of two things would have happened. A. The birds would be eating them because they dropped dead. B. My neighbors would have called the aninmal rescue joint on me. And no, they don't bark constantly through the night, or even the day. They are animals, but why does that mean you need to treat them like crap? You bought them, you took responsibility for them, now take care of them. Dogs don't have a smell if you take good care of them, groom them, feed them GOOD food (food can make a HUGE HUGE HUGE difference between a LOT of things for a dog. Bad food can cause anything from a greasy coat to farting.). Don't like how a dog "smells" inside? Don't get a dog you aren't prepared to take care of. YOU are an animal, so go spend 72 hours outside. 30 celsius heat, no AC, no fresh water on demand, lets see how long you last. Oh, and wear a sweater to simulate dog fur

I mentioned the dog parks because it is the best off leash (or on leash) exercise that I know of, but walking is good also. If you take your two dogs for more than an hour walk a day then good, because a labrador is going to need a hell of a lot of exercise every day to be happy. Unless those dog houses are heated for the winter months then they really should not be outside during the winter. Do you know anything about a dogs diet, a dogs fat reserves, or they amount of calories extra required for winter outside? Because I'm guessing you don't, and to top it all off you are probably not giving them a very good food for winter. They have fur, but they are bred not to be outside all the time. Dogs have not had to live outside during the winter for many, many years, your dogs are not fit to live outside during the winter. Any type of outdoor shelter you can provide for them will pale in comparison to indoors, so why the hell don't you let them indoors? If you do have a lab like you said, IT SHOULD NOT BE OUTSIDE FOR LONG PERIODS OF TIME DURING WINTER! Their coats are very thin, they come from a place that has VERY VERY mild winters. Dogs as a whole should not stay outside during winter, but people who leave common short hair dogs like labs outside during winter are just stupid. I mean, I would understand how someone can mistake that a husky would be ok outside during winter, but a freaking lab? How often do you change the pool water? Dirty water is a breeding ground for various bacteria and bugs. During the summer heat, warm water does not get absorbed as quickly as cold water, and unless you are changing the water for your dogs every hour on the hour during summer, all their water will be warm. People take dogs for more reasons than just to sell them. I've heard from someone who had their pitbull stolen from their backyard while they were out shopping, and considering it was a pitbull and in a not so great part of America, it was no doubt stolen for dog fighting. Pitbulls aren't the only dog that is fought. Hell, on the radio a couple months ago there was a lady sobbing because someone stole her dog out of her yard, they DID get the dog back eventually though (a person heard her on the radio, then was confronted by some guys who wanted to know if he would like to buy a dog, a dog that matched the exact description of the lady's. He bought it from them and gave it to her). Dogs aren't running machines, if you exercise them sufficiently then they will not need to be left outside. A backyard isn't even enough space to run in. I let my dog outside, only difference is I actually do activities with him when he is outside, although I do sometimes let him just lay out on the deck. Inside dog does not mean never outside, it means they live inside and get outside exercise. Best of both worlds, none of the problems of either. Cows are domesticated to be livestock, to be eaten. Dogs are bred to be companions, or working dogs (which your dog isn't). They can get hurt any variety of ways, eating stuff they shouldn't, eating dead things (my dog has found dead birds in my yard before), dogs or cats or other animals coming IN, people throwing [cabbage] over your fence because they don't like your dog (happens more than you'd think, anti freeze is a good one), cutting paw pads, anything. It is better to let them live inside where it is safe, and either let them outside while you are home and can atleast watch them some what and let them in when it gets dark (this if IF exercise is too much of a hassle for a dog owner, even though rehoming would be best). You know what? My dog likes the smell of chocolate. You know why I don't let him eat it? Because it is dangerous for him and he is a stupid dog, he does not know what is and isn't dangerous. My dog also likes to eat dead, decomposing things, so should I let him eat them? No, because that is stupid. Dogs are stupid, he might like the outdoors but he isn't going to be miserable if you make him live inside and let him outside (if you aren't too lazy to give him enough exercise a day). 30 celsius is [bleep]ing hot for a dog, congrats on taking horrible care of your dogs.

Dogs are animals. Yes, everyone understands this point. But what people fail to grasp apparently, is that they are bred for DOMESTICATION. That means relying on humans to take care of them, not ignoring them and leaving them outside exposed to the elements and god knows what else. Ticks, disease, sickness. Anything. Who said he is ignoring the dogs? Dogs are pack animals, they NEED to be with their pack (you and your family). Leaving them outside and visiting them once a day do not cut it. Most people who own outdoor dogs do not walk or exercise their dog (which some in this thread think that dogs outside do get exercise.) They do not let them in during hot days or cold days. That most certainly is ignoring them, borderline neglecting them.

Dogs are animals. Yes, everyone understands this point. But what people fail to grasp apparently, is that they are bred for DOMESTICATION. That means relying on humans to take care of them, not ignoring them and leaving them outside exposed to the elements and god knows what else. Ticks, disease, sickness. Anything. edit: to elaborate, in the winter, things like: frost bite, hypothermia, iced paws, cracked pads, more summer: exposure to sun can cause cancer, sunburn, dehydration, overheating, and more You people that own outside dogs, next time you go to the vet (which I'm sure is once in a blue moon), ask the vet about your dog being a 24/7 outside dog.

If common guests are allergic to dogs, THEN WHY THE [bleep] WOULD YOU GET A DOG THAT SHEDS? That is not a reason to keep it outside, that is a reason to NOT get it or REHOME it. They can be hurt but their chances are greatly lower than outdoors They can break or chew things. Yes, but if you TRAIN them they will not, lazy people do not train their dogs. Never let them out? My dog is an inside dog, I am 100% certain that my dog is more happy and healthy than any of the dogs left outside. My dog is an inside dog, but that doesn't mean he doesn't get exercise, it means when he is not getting exercise or play outside he is indoors, especially at night. Here is our schedule 7:30 AM: 30 minute walk 8:00 AM: Goes back to bed with me 8:00 - 4:00 PM: He sleeps, not because he is bored but because he is tired. 5:00 - 7:00 PM: 2 hours at the dog park. Intense running and socialization with other people and dogs. Every single dog that goes there (which is a ton, and they are all there EVERY day) are inside dogs. 8:00 PM: If he still has energy, I play with him until he is tired. Sometimes a family friend brings his dog over and they play really hard for an hour or two. Oh, and he is a 20 pound breed of dog considered not to be high energy. You are telling me that a dog being locked up in a backyard gets anywhere NEAR that much exercise? A backyard has no where near the adequate space for a dog to get exercise, and the owner should be the one responsible for exercising the dog, not leaving the dog outside expecting it to get exercise on its own. Outside does not = exercise. What most of your points come down to is either a stupid owner, or a lazy owner. Those are your reasons for keeping a dog outside. Oh and by the way Overexposure to the sun is considered to be the main cause of dog skin cancer.

AHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! Yeah, because standing around/walking around in a small backyard is the same as 2 hours of walking or playing at a dog park right? Right? Oh my, he has an awning or dog house that can protect them partially from the rain, but what exactly are the dogs going to do when it is really hot out, like it tends to get in the months known as summer? Or cold during winter? Go inside their dog house or under their awning and crank up their doggy AC/heat? Depending on where you live there are lots of things that can attack a dog OR PEOPLE THAT CAN JUST WALK UP AND TAKE YOUR DOG. Yeah he can get hurt inside, the difference being that you would be INSIDE WITH HIM to know if he got hurt or stop him from getting hurt. God damn some people are horrible pet owners Oh, and yeah because going outside for 20 minutes a day to play with your dog is the same as having them live with you in a steady family where they can be with all members of their family. Yeah, same thing right? edit: I don't even want to think about how rarely your (OP and that other guy) dogs go to the vet Last time I checked dogs liked being outside. They don't just stand around unless they're chained to something. In the Summer time dogs look for shade and water to cool off. In they Winter time they grow thick fur, which is also another reason why people don't like dogs in the house because they get hair on furniture and a common guest could be allergic to dogs. What if the dog gets hurt inside but no one is home? It's the same situation. You're starting to sound like the PETA... I can assure you that dogs are a lot happier and healthier indoors than outdoors, and yes they do like outdoors, but imagine being outdoors in a small backyard 24/7 that gives you no where near the area you need to get even close to adequate exercise. How exciting. Shade in the summer does not cut it. A lot of dogs that people own are from all over the world, and lots of them have different issues surrounding temperature. You cannot just leave a dog outside in the heat all the time, that is both cruel and irresponsible. Thick fur does not cut it either. Lots of dogs do not get even close to the amount of fur needed to survive outdoors in most American places during the winter. Dogs won't just grow coats of fur during the winter like some sort of magic. They get hair on the furniture? It's called a hair cut, or brushing their hair everyday to get loose parts out, or NOT GETTING A DOG THAT SHEDS IF YOU CANNOT HANDLE THE RESPONSIBILITY. If a dog gets hurt inside then you will see it the instant you get home, and if your dog is prone to hurting itself while you are gone (read: you do not keep dangerous things out of its reach) then either putting it in a crate or in a room of the house is the safest option. I do not sound like PETA, PETA believes that people should not own pets, I am saying you should know how to take care of your pet instead of tossing them outside They are animals yes, but they are also DOMESTICATED. They are bred to be companion dogs and expecting them to live outside on the basis that they are animals is just ludicrous. You are an animal, so why don't you spend 24/7 outside, even when it is freezing cold and blistering hot with no electricity to keep you cool or warm? They can SURVIVE, but I guarantee you they are not happy. Let your families dogs inside for a day or two, and then give them the option to go outside. I can guarantee you they will not stay outside if they have the option to go inside after seeing what it is like. You two tell me, what are the reasons NOT to keep a dog indoors, aside from being too lazy to train it and keep control of it? edit: One thing that just instantly sprung to my mind about winter, when there is snow on the ground, dogs get snow built up between the pads of their paws. This snow then gets compacted as they walk and freezes. This is VERY VERY VERY uncomfortable for dogs, as they have frozen feet and now must bite at it and pull it away from the sensitive fur between the paws. My dog gets this after about 15 minutes outside on the right winter day, imagine what walking on snow ALL day would do to their paws.

AHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! Yeah, because standing around/walking around in a small backyard is the same as 2 hours of walking or playing at a dog park right? Right? Oh my, he has an awning or dog house that can protect them partially from the rain, but what exactly are the dogs going to do when it is really hot out, like it tends to get in the months known as summer? Or cold during winter? Go inside their dog house or under their awning and crank up their doggy AC/heat? Depending on where you live there are lots of things that can attack a dog OR PEOPLE THAT CAN JUST WALK UP AND TAKE YOUR DOG. Yeah he can get hurt inside, the difference being that you would be INSIDE WITH HIM to know if he got hurt or stop him from getting hurt. God damn some people are horrible pet owners Oh, and yeah because going outside for 20 minutes a day to play with your dog is the same as having them live with you in a steady family where they can be with all members of their family. Yeah, same thing right? edit: I don't even want to think about how rarely your (OP and that other guy) dogs go to the vet

Why shouldn't they be? I'd never let a dog in my house, way too messy. Aside from all the possible bad things that could happen to your dog while outside (jesus man, it's a living thing that is pretty stupid, why the hell wouldn't you let it in?), it NEEDS to be with your family. Dogs are pack animals, they need to live with their humans, not outside. Keeping them outside all the time can damage their psychological health. Even if you decide to dismiss that, what the hell? Leaving a dog outside in the back yard for 24 hours with no AC or heat? Do you even have a shelter outside for them? No protection? Nowhere to run if something attacks them? Tons of ways to injure themselves? You really need to bring your dogs in unless they are working dogs on a farm that you spend 8 hours with a day herding animals. Most people buy dogs for companionship, not for being a god damned lawn ornament edit: What breed of dog do you two even have?

Are you saying your dogs are outside 24/7?

I knew someone would come up with this BS argument. It isn't the gateway drug, it's simply the most common type of drug, so people who do heavier drugs will of course tried marijuana at least once, not the other way around. edit: And I can see it's already been tackled

Meh, the age part was just explaining why alcohol is legal. However legalizing marijuana is only going to add to the indirect deaths alcohol causes. I'd prefer you try and back that up. Wouldn't you assume those who abuse marijuana to the point of it causing (or indirectly causing) death would already be abusing it, legal or not? You wouldn't necessarily have to be abusing it to cause an accident. Legalizing it will only bring more people to do it and with more people comes more idiots. This is all just hypothetical. Base your opinion on facts and studies that you have, not "what if's". I could make a "what if" for any situation, so really doing that is kind of pointless

I'm kind of curious to see what smoking it is like, but doing that pretty much automatically eliminates me from being accepted as a cop, so I can live with out it

Oh cool a totally impartial party, aka the government who wants to keep weed illegal :thumbsup: Correlation != causation. I can also link you to studies that show marijuana has no effect on mental health, and if I remember from researching it, that it also does not do a hell of a lot to interfere with driving while high. Actually I found it http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/19 ... 110700.htm http://hempus.org/?p=171 Your second website is kind of a mess, third has some funny stuff and some possibly plausible. Honestly though, we could go back and forth all day long countering each other with studies probably. For me what it comes down to is smoking weed is a victim less crime and really isn't that dangerous, so why not make it legal and tax the hell out of it? Oh, and by vaporizing marijuana you can eliminate pretty much all the risks that come with smoking, like cancer. For the record, I have never smoked weed once in my life, and only seen it once for a brief moment. One day I plan to be a cop so I'm pretty much never going to smoke weed

I wonder if he did a control group with his study

Understanding how your mind and brain work is a really nice thing, and I think it's pretty dang important. It really is interesting stuff too, it's not like biology or anything like that

Most animals (including cats and dogs) are not self aware. So no. edit: Some of the animals that we consider to be quite social animals are thought to be self aware (bottle nose dolfins, certain apes, and elephants) And some interesting stuff http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn1 ... ad_dn14552 If you are interested in this stuff try taking at least intro psychology once you reach college (everyone should do this imo)

When you hear the bathtub overflow, what do you do? Ok, what about when someone rings the doorbell? What if you hear something fall? Not that i'm defending him but how is a bathtub overflowing, doorbell ringing, or something falling insanely hard to believe? They're all responses to stimuli. As is the child's ringtone that supposedly increases breast size. Albeit, the last is actually changing a physical characteristic, but it's not that unbelievable. Doorbell = conidtioned Baby crying = (I believe) unconditioned Therefore, doorbell = learned, baby crying = innate

Hah, Pavlov's classical conditioning is way different than this

Do people actually buy those though?

Pretty badly. It would work, but you'd only be able to get a few kills per trip and very slow kills. For your case, I would suggest duoing as a ranger with a meleer. Although the finding a partner bit would be rather difficult (especially considering most people just solo). Or better, a team of 4+ people, which would be even harder to find. Thanks, that's what I was expecting. Guess I'll forget about TD's until I decide to raise melee then

How well (if at all) do you think I'd be able to solo with: 86 HP 90 Range 80 Att 74 Str 87 Def 56 Pray 91 mage ?