Ditch or no Ditch?

[Geordiequeen]

There have been several posts in the rants forum about the ditch so i thought i would love to hear what you guys think about the ditch.

 

 

 

With the introduction of the ditch luring has went down massively, people can not accidently go into wilderness for example if they trade someone who runs into the wilderness they will stop at the ditch. So now the forums are clear of people complaining about how they got Lured and they are free of people saying "I accidently went into the wilderness and lost my blue Phat". Good thing, is it not?

 

 

 

On the other hand, by introducing the ditch Jagex may have got rid of people who have got lured complaining but now they have people complaining about how it takes 3 extra seconds per run when they are runecrafting.

 

 

 

So Jagex introduced the ditch to stop the lurers and people going into the wilderness by mistake but dealing with that problem has made a new problem occur, Runecrafters now have a extra 3 seconds onto their runecrafting time.

 

 

 

So what is your thoughts on the matter and how do you think that Jagex could fix the problem without upsetting more people.

 

 

 

Rules

 

Please do not flame other people for their ideas and what they think and please do not spam this thread. In other words just be nice and follow all of Tip.it's rules.

[darkforaster]

3 seconds doesn't matter that much. sure it eventually builds up. but there is many solutions:

 

 

 

-Don't use abyss runecrafting

 

-Don't Runcraft in the first place, and buy your runes.

 

-Just ignore it and continue.

 

 

 

See how those solutions make it much easier?

 

 

 

so now the disadvantage is taken away, the advantages include:

 

 

 

-now less people get lured

 

-less people flood forums with luring rants

 

-gives you more warning when entering the wildy

 

 

 

so using this. the ditch is fine.

[Fairness]

The Runescape community seems to suffer from a never-ending complaining mania. If they get something, they want either more or in another way. Some people are always gonna find an excuse. The problem is, Jagex is quite indecisive as well. So now we would get a small hole for abyss RCers in that ditch, or a bridge. Just like with the anchor. (2 seconds is really just making fun of themselves, but...)

 

Maybe if Jagex wrote it out in big, bold letters, something like "SHUT THE HELL UP, RCERS! WE HAVE DONE SOMETHING, WE HAD ENOUGH COMPLAINTS ALREADY, A SMALL GROUP OF PLAYERS ISN'T GOING TO CHANGE OUR DECISION!!!!1!!1!" Something like that would prolly silence some of the people. The rest can happily get banned.

 

Well, but we can dream :boohoo:

[Bobbington]

Too be honest with you, I am glad of the introduction of the ditch!

 

 

 

It was actually developed from a suggestion on the offical forums by one of my friends, although it was originally going to be a wall. i have a certain attacthment to it too :).... although I'm sure they would ahve though of it eventually the idea of a small gap between the 'wall' and the wildreness was my imput on it... tehehe.

 

 

 

Seriousally though, it solves more problems than it makes, it stops numerous scams and lures, it gets rid of that annoying warning popup message that got me in edgvill wilderness or at the bridge over the river.

 

 

 

Interms of the 3 second delay for runescrafters, this was one of our conserns on the suggestions forums when we where proposing it, but from the way it has been done, I dotn actually notice the differnce.

 

 

 

I belive it will cost a diehard runecrafter very little xp per day, although for me, i actually get more as I find it less boring so can do more runs.

 

 

 

I understand that it is annoying in some circumstances, but on the whole it's good.

[Dogman112018]

Hey Gordie-look down the page. I had a topic on this awhile ago :D

 

 

 

Anyway, I see this as a good thing. Without the Ditch, there were spots of the Wild where the boundary wasn't known. In other words, you could wander into the Wild, without even knowing it. Also,the ditch lessens the chance of being lured as well.

 

 

 

But of course, the people who complain about it sometimes have no logic in it? How can it be bad if it helps people. I guess this statement is true then:

 

 

 

How many RuneScape players does it take to change a lightbulb?5,000. One to change the bulb, and 4,999 others to complain how it was better in the first place.

[Gin_and_Tonic]

The benifits of the whole population of Runescape from this ditch outweigh the costs of the Runecrafters having to jump it.

 

 

 

I mean, 3 seconds - :roll:

 

 

 

What i do hate is egotistical people who just think they can rant about every update JAGeX ever do - To be honest, the mature, high level Runecrafters probably dont give a dam, but its the 'just level 44 rcers' that seem to moan about it.

[unkn0wnwarrior]

I believe it is a very good idea. The only problem I see with it is that they didn't do it sooner. If they had introduced it before the major problems people have with it, they would never have started complaining in the first place, and luring would have been extremely rare.

[Freesia]

Though the ditch mainly involves stopping luring/wildy related scams, it also eats up some of lvl 1 wildy. I'll add another advantage of the ditch here: when you head towards the chaos temple to telegrab wines, you no longer bypass lvl 1 wildy, thus totally eliminating the possibilities of getting pked while only trying to get wine.

[Geordiequeen]

I agree with all of you. The number of people who used to complain about getting Lured is huge compared to the amount of people who complain about the 3 extra seconds of time.

 

 

 

Jagex have to make a decision. Do they keep Luring out of the game or do they keep the runecrafters happy.

 

 

 

Luring to me seems to be a worse problem than 3 extra seconds each run to runecrafters.

 

 

 

It has been mentioned before on the official forums and here at tip.it but it could solve both problems if the mage was a few squares down meaning that both parties get what they want but even then i think that the Pkers would complain. No-one can ever be truly happy with what they have.

[Freesia]

I agree with all of you. The number of people who used to complain about getting Lured is huge compared to the amount of people who complain about the 3 extra seconds of time.

 

 

 

Jagex have to make a decision. Do they keep Luring out of the game or do they keep the runecrafters happy.

 

 

 

Luring to me seems to be a worse problem than 3 extra seconds each run to runecrafters.

 

 

 

It has been mentioned before on the official forums and here at tip.it but it could solve both problems if the mage was a few squares down meaning that both parties get what they want but even then i think that the Pkers would complain. No-one can ever be truly happy with what they have.

 

This comment is more of the supporting-rcers side. The main reason why luring is such a big problem is due to the fact that majority of the population don't know how to think before they act. In times where a lurer promises them blue phat across the wildy line, their greed tells them to fall for the trap even though they may be aware of that is a lure. In this case they deserve to be lured and why do we rcers have to suffer for their stupidity? How is this fair you say? If the victims of luring don't fall down once, they won't learn.

[suomiownaa]

No ditch is better, they got that warning window which appeared when you were near wilderness border.

 

Wasn't that enough?

[Fairness]

Well, no. The ditch stops one important kind of luring. In this, the character follows the lurer who then goes up to the border and takes a turn. Then the lurer won`t be inside, but the luree gets in temporarily which is enough for the lurer`s strong PKer friend (s) to take him out via a freezing spell, for instance. The warning screen appeared way before you were in, and once you clicked through it, it would never appear again until you logged out and back in.

[darkmage099]

'twas a good update for the simple fact that no one complains about luring. Before, it was ridiculous and annoying. It is not so much that luring is wrong (I call it exploitation of the stupid), it is the constant complaining.

 

 

 

I buy phats, rares, etc. and posts about luring were common and annoying. Now, they're gone. BEsides, I don't even runecraft anyway. I am sure it is annoying but o well

[Gin_and_Tonic]

No ditch is better, they got that warning window which appeared when you were near wilderness border.

 

Wasn't that enough?

 

 

 

I disagree.

 

 

 

Say you've been in a world all day, or for aobut 5-6 hours and have recently, knowingly been into the wilderness to playerkiller or you've ignored the sign once already knowing you dont mind if you die - The sign in now no longer there the next time you walk in.

 

 

 

Also, by Varrock Pub, the sign was up way before the Edge of the wilderness, so saying you would trade in the Pub, meant they would have passed the sign already.

[vilageidiotx]

I, for one, runecraft quite often, and i don't see how the ditch slows me down any. I still get my runes done at about the same speed i did before it was there, its really an extra click and maybe a second or two more for me, nothing serious. If that insignifigant little extra step is all i have to pay to help thousands of other players enjoy the game without being scammed, im more then willing to pay it. I dont think a majority of runecrafters really care, just that group of people who feel they must complain about everything jagex does couldn't come up with anything else to support their whining.

[Ginger_Warrior]

On a more general scale, I'll weigh up a few thousands RuneCrafters speding 3 seconds more per run against a few thousand people being lured illegally... it's a no-brainer really. I'll protect those that get lured any day. You'd have to come up with a much more convincing argument to convince me otherwise.

[Ginger_Warrior]

This comment is more of the supporting-rcers side. The main reason why luring is such a big problem is due to the fact that majority of the population don't know how to think before they act. In times where a lurer promises them blue phat across the wildy line, their greed tells them to fall for the trap even though they may be aware of that is a lure. In this case they deserve to be lured and why do we rcers have to suffer for their stupidity? How is this fair you say? If the victims of luring don't fall down once, they won't learn.

 

 

 

It's this kind of attitude that annoys me about the whole issue of luring/acamming. The idea that because they were naÃÆÃâÃâïve enough to fall for it in the first place, they deserve to be scammed. I'll refer to the Grandma situation. The old Grandma was unaware of the scam, so she deserved to be mugged in her own home and have all her pension money taken... of course she didn't.

 

 

 

Also, the attitude that somehow the victim has benefited from the scam. OK, so they know not to fall for it next time. Does that make the crime acceptable, just because the victim is now a bit wiser? No, absolutely not!

 

 

 

Apologies for the double post, I meant to edit this into the other one, sorry! #-o

[Freesia]

This comment is more of the supporting-rcers side. The main reason why luring is such a big problem is due to the fact that majority of the population don't know how to think before they act. In times where a lurer promises them blue phat across the wildy line, their greed tells them to fall for the trap even though they may be aware of that is a lure. In this case they deserve to be lured and why do we rcers have to suffer for their stupidity? How is this fair you say? If the victims of luring don't fall down once, they won't learn.

 

 

 

It's this kind of attitude that annoys me about the whole issue of luring/acamming. The idea that because they were naÃÆÃâÃâïve enough to fall for it in the first place, they deserve to be scammed. I'll refer to the Grandma situation. The old Grandma was unaware of the scam, so she deserved to be mugged in her own home and have all her pension money taken... of course she didn't.

 

 

 

Also, the attitude that somehow the victim has benefited from the scam. OK, so they know not to fall for it next time. Does that make the crime acceptable, just because the victim is now a bit wiser? No, absolutely not!

 

 

 

Apologies for the double post, I meant to edit this into the other one, sorry! #-o

 

How is that related? If something turns out too good to be true, you know something is not right. If the population were aware of this basic principle, would the first wildy lure have taken place (it's not impossible to get out alive in lvl 1 wildy even though being tb and barraged blah blah blah unless it is a multi combat situation then it is different) and subsequently becoming a threat to runescape?

[Ginger_Warrior]

How is that related? If something turns out too good to be true, you know something is not right. If the population were aware of this basic principle, would the first wildy lure have taken place (it's not impossible to get out alive in lvl 1 wildy even though being tb and barraged blah blah blah unless it is a multi combat situation then it is different) and subsequently becoming a threat to runescape?

 

 

 

I'm not saying that moddy-cuddling does anybody any good, nor am I saying that they weren't incredibly dim to fall for it in the first place, but you have to put things into context here. In a a better world, scammers would only be working at lower-levels, and people would only be scammed out of worthless items, but Jagex restrict the game so much there's no opportunity for scammers to work here. Whilst this may sound like a good thing, it inadvertently created a whole pool of 'experienced' players that frankly can't tell a scam if it hits them in the face, and that's why luring is such a successful practise.

 

 

 

I've long supported the argument "It's their own fault for being so stupid in the first place", but the fact of the matter is scamming is against the rules, and shouldn't be tolerated at any level. It's not good enough to say "They deserved it, case closed", because that in itself condones the actions of the scammer, and encourages this sort of activity, leading to a negative community.

 

 

 

I personally feel that Jagex shouldn't have even made a rule concerning scammers... an RPG should be like real-life, and you don't get moddy-cuddled in real life - why should it be any different in RS? But the fact of the matter is Jagex have decided to protect players. However, you can't really have it in the middle, you either have to protect players, or leave them to learn from their own mistakes. Therefore, if Jagex are going to act on scamming, you can't really say that one form of scamming is down to a player's stupidity, and is therefore not as bad (luring); and then say that another form of scamming is deceitful and not the victim's fault (trade scamming, for example), so everything should be done to combat it. They both have a negative influence on the game, and should both be dealt with, and prevented under the same heavy hand. If that means building a silly little ditch that means RCers have to spend 2/3 secs more per run, then I'm all for it.

[ysne58]

A hedge would be more attractive than the ditch. It does look like the owners accomplished their goal with the ditch.

[lotrking1010]

i think the ditch is a sign o jagex weakness i mean poelple complain about being luerd(wich is their fault) so they add a dich. people coplain too much and they get wat they want its the same as alto of things getting nerfed. if ur stupid enough to walk into the wildy without being prepared than they should get pked and when they complain tell them to SHUT THE HELL UP!!! IT WAS UR FALUT NOT OURS SO STOP COMPLAINING!! but all jagex cares alot about now is winers and lower lvls

[Ginger_Warrior]

i think the ditch is a sign o jagex weakness i mean poelple complain about being luerd(wich is their fault) so they add a dich. people coplain too much and they get wat they want its the same as alto of things getting nerfed. if ur stupid enough to walk into the wildy without being prepared than they should get pked and when they complain tell them to SHUT THE HELL UP!!! IT WAS UR FALUT NOT OURS SO STOP COMPLAINING!! but all jagex cares alot about now is winers and lower lvls

 

 

 

Nothing's been nerfed. Or at least, I can't see how it has, can you tell me how anything has been nerfed? Yes, I'll agree it's half the victim's fault for being so gullable in the first place, but you're making out as though the lurer didn't do anything wrong, hasn't scammed, and should carry on because all he's doing is capitalising on other poeple's stupidity. Well I'm sorry, news flash, luring is against the rules; regardless of how stupid the victim is.

 

 

 

What really baffles me is that Jagex try to uphold the laws of the game, respond to a majority of players (which they did, it was hardly a few players "whining"), don't do anything too drastic; yet they get all these protests! It annoys me because it's posts like these that undermine the rules of the game and condone rule-breakers, and that's unnacceptable as far as I'm concerned.

[Geordiequeen]

I have always agreed partly with the fact that Luring is partly the victim's fault and they should not complain about it, but also Luring is wrong and people who Lure are players Jagex don't want in their game. The amount of people who used to get Lured compared to the amount of people who are now complaining about runecrafting is huge and personally on this matter i think the runecrafters who are complaining need to prioritise. What would they prefer people getting lured and losing items because of one mistake, or 3 extra seconds spent during a run. The answer should be simple.

[Freesia]

I have always agreed partly with the fact that Luring is partly the victim's fault and they should not complain about it, but also Luring is wrong and people who Lure are players Jagex don't want in their game. The amount of people who used to get Lured compared to the amount of people who are now complaining about runecrafting is huge and personally on this matter i think the runecrafters who are complaining need to prioritise. What would they prefer people getting lured and losing items because of one mistake, or 3 extra seconds spent during a run. The answer should be simple.

The majority of the rcers who complain, are apparently the smart ones that are smart enough not to get wildy lured, and hence feel that the ditch update is unnecessary and goes against their interest.

[lotrking1010]

i think the ditch is a sign o jagex weakness i mean poelple complain about being luerd(wich is their fault) so they add a dich. people coplain too much and they get wat they want its the same as alto of things getting nerfed. if ur stupid enough to walk into the wildy without being prepared than they should get pked and when they complain tell them to SHUT THE HELL UP!!! IT WAS UR FALUT NOT OURS SO STOP COMPLAINING!! but all jagex cares alot about now is winers and lower lvls

 

 

 

Nothing's been nerfed. Or at least, I can't see how it has, can you tell me how anything has been nerfed? Yes, I'll agree it's half the victim's fault for being so gullable in the first place, but you're making out as though the lurer didn't do anything wrong, hasn't scammed, and should carry on because all he's doing is capitalising on other poeple's stupidity. Well I'm sorry, news flash, luring is against the rules; regardless of how stupid the victim is.

 

 

 

What really baffles me is that Jagex try to uphold the laws of the game, respond to a majority of players (which they did, it was hardly a few players "whining"), don't do anything too drastic; yet they get all these protests! It annoys me because it's posts like these that undermine the rules of the game and condone rule-breakers, and that's unnacceptable as far as I'm concerned.

 

 

 

of course the lurer did something wrong and im glad they made it against the rules but did they need to add a dich to tell people when the wildy starts you get a message the first time you log in and get too close. we still have people item scamming like swiching items out at the last second are we gonna add a third screen? i agree that it is the lurers fault too for being lazy and takeing advantge of people but now they will probly move on to something else.