Articultural

We were discussing whether he hypothetically could, whether he wants to or not is irrelevant. :P

Say he was averaging 10 hours a day web if he got 200m pray herb con crafting he'd still end up a bill+ some xp behind people like su and Elias by time he got those and your just countig it as now as well eventually all he'd have is slow skills left the time calculator is really useful in situations like this but either way he's between 1-2b ish xp behind main competitors Nd couple thousand hours behind overall, love zez much as the next guy but he's just nowhere near competition for rank 1 lol Meh, I just don't think it's late enough to rule anyone out yet, especially someone who's shown they can be dedicated to skilling for long periods. There's still over 2B XP left to go, in slower skills for most of the top 15. Since the first person to 900M, so many people have quit/given up/etc, I just think it's far too early to call still. :P

That's a perfect example of why efficiency is so mainstream nowadays, people don't see 99s as being hard anymore. Had you asked someone 5+ years ago whether getting 99 Agility, Mining, Slayer, Runecrafting or most other slower skills was a test if efficiency, consistency and the will to achieve it, I'm sure they would have agreed that it was. It's not so much that people are suddenly more ambitious than ever before, it's the rapid increase in XP/h and popularity of the "99s are no big deal" mindset which has pushed people to set 200Ms as their goals.

He still has a lot of potential XP in very fast skills and all his effigy combos are open. If he carried on skilling at the rate he was going with dungeoneering, he'd definitely stand a chance at it. It's also worth noting that he has more than enough for 200M all buyables and people quitting isn't something you can rule out either.

It's much harder to find decent teams at lower levels.

Assuming you have hexs on the team, necrolord is just as easy as Yk'lagor/Haasghenahk, if not easier.

Zezima already had a plate bound before 120. I did a few floors with him yesterday and he said he was either going to get 123,456,789 DG xp or 200M. :P He also said he wasn't planning on reclaiming rank 1.

If their attacks are synchronised, you can get to the second page with an unlimited amount of monsters on you.

Something doesn't have to be a glitch for Jagex to nerf it. :P

You could always make a gravecreeper shortbow if you had no hexers on the team, it's only 8 Ranged attack less and you can often cut at least one log without wasting time.

Hex was a typo, was supposed to be bn. :P

Because she completely misread my post and assumed I was talking about neck + plate vs sag body rather than neck or plate vs sag body. You were the one who stated that they'd be ranging 40% of the dungeon, I was merely going along with your suggestion of how often you range. It's not different with fourth binds, in the same way that not needing a plate 1-99 means you don't need one for 100+, not needing a plate 100-120 should mean you don't need one at 120. You haven't disproved any of my points either, just repeatedly stated that you don't get bound (which appears to be that you lack of experience with a body and are repeating what others have told you or get extremely lucky, as I often got bound multiple times per floor when I had high mage defence binds) and that a sag body is a partially offensive bind and a partially defensive one, without realising that a hex is better if you want and offensive bind and a platebody if you want a defensive one. Unless you're almost solely ranging, there is no reason to bind a body, and if you are, you should get rid of your p2h and bind legs as well.

I was saying that if the +22 more ranged attack you have with a sag body over a blood neck is very significant, then the +34 crush defence you have with a plate over a sag body isn't trivial. Having both never came into it, I was merely pointing out that a if you say a sag body is much better than a blood necklace when ranging, you can't say a plate is barely better than a sag body against monsters who use crush, when there's a bigger difference in crush defence than ranged attack.

Do you have a hood bound? I agree with that, but he didn't specifically state that he wanted a solely defensive bind, hence this discussion. Once again you would use your hex about 40% of the time if you're DPSing and much more if you're keying. The blood neck effect is mostly useless while you're hexing, so that cuts down on the DPS increase by a significant amount, especially if you're the keyer. As previously stated, a sagittarian body is a nice medium between an offensive and defensive bind for a keyer. Meaning 60% of the time your 3rd bind is completely useless (or giving you - attack bonuses) offensively. Using a hex doesn't restrict your ability to stand next to monsters either. As it so happens, occults and warpeds have a lot of hexable monsters and bosses, and abnds have very hexable bosses. The advantage of a platebody over a sagi body is ranged defense, but at the cost of a great deal of DPS. Melee monsters can be side-stepped most of the time, and a sagi body only has slightly less crush def than a plate. Hexhunter bows are pretty inaccurate, so the +22 ranged attack of the body over the blood neck is very significant. In terms of melee offense, a blood neck is obviously superior, but as a keyer you're not going to be melee'ing very much. It really depends on the floor, there are floors where you will melee a lot more than you range. The point is that a sagitarrian body is sub-par for melee/range defence, around 150 less stab/slash/ranged defence and 34 crush defence (which is more than the 22 range attack that you seem to find very significant) less than a platebody, making it really not worth it defence wise, and offense wise it's not as good as a blood necklace if you intend on meleeing (which, according to your statistics, you should be doing for over 50% of the time you're in combat). I've already countered this in my previous post. You just ignored it and reasserted your point. Because I've had extremely high magic defence binds in the past and yet still be bound multiple times per floor, even with 99 Magic. It's not so much of a problem in GDs, its more that it slows you down when you're running through rooms with your hood already disabled (or there are multiple mages/a mage gets multiple attacks in). I have a hex. Mages don't last long enough for me to need to have to tank a ranger for any length of time. Thus, I'd usually opt to pray ranged, saving me some food. And just FYI, t11 rangers rape everything, regardless of defense. It's definitely situational, though. 136 skeletons are quite inaccurate when you have armour though, and have very high DPS because of their rapid attack speed when you don't. I agree that it's situational, but I find myself in a situation where I need range defence and am praying magic more often than need magic defence and am praying ranged. I'm very, very aware of how to make ranged armor loss-less; DGS invented it, after all. How often do you return to a path, and do you have time to spare to skin a dino when you should be running to your door(s)? Again, it's incredibly situational, and not usually worth making except on Kal'Ger floors or if you've already procured ragers and don't have a path to run or a GD/puzzle to do. Don't flatter yourself, people have been crafting armour without wasting time since April 2010, DGS may have publicised it but they by no means invented it. Dungeons often fold back on eachother, there will often be a mastyx near a gated door where you can drop a trap and skin it later on. I rarely have floors where I'm unable to craft at least some ranged armour. Once again I deem this untrue. I would disagree with your argument for reasons stated above. You're free to disagree with whoever you want for whatever reasons you want, the point is that it's subpar for both defence and offense and, unless you're ranging a majority of the time and low crafting/hunter, I can think of much better uses for a bind slot. What about when you want both defense and offense as a hex keyer, which is exactly what a sagittarian body is tailor-made for? To use DGS's argument, if you keyed 1-99 without a defensive bind, why do you need one at 100+? Once again, I disagree. ALL THAT SAID, I plan on binding a sagittarian body at 120 (hood + primal 2h + hex + sagi body) until I find a blood neck, at which point I'll switch out my body for the neck and my 2h for a battleaxe and try it out for around 10-20m exp. I'm definitely not against binding a blood neck, but I key very often and a little extra defense with a non-trivial gain in hex DPS would cater to my needs very nicely. I could bind a plate, but that would be useless when I decide to carry/wingman in a floor. My personal philosophy is that your third bind should increase your offense and your fourth bind should cater to your specific needs as a dungeoneer. I'm not saying you should bind a plate, just that if you wanted to reduce deaths, as Fulco appeared to want to, the most effective binds for doing so are a hood and a plate, one of which he already had.

Because if you intend to dungeoneer without a permanent team, you have to be ready for other players to bind items which aren't as efficient as other ones, e.g. sagitarrian bodies.

So you assume he's cheating because he gets faster dungeons than you and doesn't tell you how he does it? :rolleyes:

You do the same thing without a defensive bind. I don't see the problem. That said, mages always unhood before they attack, and by that time you should already be most of the way through the room, if not out of sight of the mage altogether. I have extensive experience keying in ranged armor (thanks to Michael and Green Rect), and I've very rarely been bound, with or without it. You're overestimating mages. I was referring to when Fulco said he wanted to reduce dying by binding a platebody. Obviously a leathertop is better than nothing, I merely mean that if he wanted a solely defensive bind, a platebody would be a better option. Hex users should be ranging around 40% of the time (assuming occult/warped floors), and a sagittarian body allows a hex to be used in some situations where it normally wouldn't, or wouldn't without some other form of boosting, like potions (ie, skeleton mages, blink, gravecreeper). The increased accuracy is very non-trivial, especially for keyers with hexes, as they use ranged much more often than melee, and most bosses can be hexed. That said, I think a blood neck is potentially better for hex users who primarily DPS/carry/wingman. It's really a case-by-case thing. Again, I was referring to Fulco's comment about how he wished to reduce deaths. As a defensive bind, a leathertop is worse than a platebody in most situations and as an offensive bind, depending on how much you range, I'd probably recommend a blood necklace over a leathertop. You're sacrificing 21 slash/crush attack and 11 strength for 22 ranged attack (and some defence), which I doubt will be worth it unless you have a floor with a lot of hexable monsters. Sagittarian bodies make shades much less dangerous and definitely make most mages less harmful. You're underestimating the defense. You can easily pray against most mages though. You'll often take less damage praying magic with a mage + ranger on you in a plate than you will praying ranged with a mage + ranger on you in a plate, but again, its mostly situational. Making ranged armor is very situational. You really can't expect to have it most floors. Assuming you have decent Crafting and Hunter levels and there is no one else trying to make armour on your floors, making ranged armour isn't nearly as hard as you make it seem. You can easily buy a needle and 5 thread without wasting time and then either loot logs, cut when idle or just buy from the shop. It's not hard to drop a trap when you run past and skin it if you get a chance later on. Completely irrelevant, as you'd never make melee armor anyway. That was my point, if you're in a dungeon and have no melee armour, you'd never make it (except sometimes for Kal'Ger). If you had melee armour bound and needed range armour, it would be relatively easy to make without wasting time. I deem this untrue. It is very situational, but there are very few realistic situations where a leathertop bind is the best use of a bind slot. To be frank, people are going to bind what they want and that's how it should be, dungeoneering should be about enjoying yourself not having binds you don't enjoy using because someone else told you they're more efficient. I would argue that in almost every situation there is a better use for a bind slot than a leathertop, but yes, with a hex in certain situations they can be extremely useful. If you want both an offensive and a defensive bind, you have a hex, and you key often, bind a sagittarian body. Which you could do, but it's a worse defensive bind than a platebody and arguably a worse offensive bind than a blood necklace. Ultimately, it won't really make that much difference to your floor times or deaths, but it's not a bind I would personally recommend due to the small amount of situations when it's better than any other bind.

If you're quick with forger and/or use gates you can avoid his ranged attack.

The problem with binding a leathertop over a platebody is that you still have to pray mage when running through a room of rangers and mages incase you get bound. I've been bound through massive magic defence (150+) so many times that it effectively makes a leathertop mainly an offensive bind for its +range attack. The problem with this is when you're not ranging, you then have -7 Slash attack (combined with the -2 of hood if you don't take it off) compared to +11 from bn and the strength bonus from gaunts (+23 with gaunts and bn). Essentially, mages being able to bind you (and skeleton mages apparently being range based according to DGS - I haven't personally tested it) makes a leathertop a terrible defensive bind, and the ease of creating range armour without wasting time combined with melee armour being much harder to make without wasting time make leathertops effectively a waste of a bind in the vast majority of situations. If you want a defensive bind, get a plate, if you want an offensive bind, get a blood necklace or something similar which won't only increase your DPS when you're ranging (which is often a minority of the time).

It's not a suggestion, merely a statement. I know all the ingredients by heart and have never needed to use a list of them to check, so I don't see why anyone else should need to.

It's really not hard to just memorise the ingredients for pots.

Since when is there a distinction between "proper" dungeoneerers and others?

Ah, thanks. TBH none of them are really that spectacular looking. I'll probably pick up the Agility one, to help with Agility pyramid. Even jack of trades wouldn't be useful for any of the top players though if 10k xp per lamp is true. Well unless I am missing something, gaining experience in 10 skills would only take about 30 seconds. Alch something, bury something, burn something, fletch 10 bolts, clean something, cut a gem, then just attack anything with their fist and change to attack, strength, and defense. Then they will have 11 actually. Even if it was only 10k experience, that would still be 10k experience in a minute or less. It would be worth it unless they are making over 600k experience an hour in that skill. Actually, it would be worth it unless if they can make over 600k exp an hour in EVERY skill (that isn't 200M exp already). That Aura is only valuable until someone reaches 16 200m skills, then it becomes impossible for someone to use it. And just adding that Reverance is glitched when it comes to decreased prayer drain, it also appears to be 10% increase in the amount of prayer points recieved when drinking from a prayer potion. I'm pretty sure it will count XP gained as you completing an action, not as XP being added to the skill, similarly to how your XP counter still goes up if you get XP in a skill that you're 200M in.

Ok, then i will rephrase. I am indifferent about cheating, but find bug abuse very bad. There you go :thumbup: Bug abuse is cheating too.