I recently watched the film "Downfall", not sure if anybody has seen it, its an exceptional film. It tells the story of Hitler's final days in power, running up to the end of the third reich. Anyway it got me thinking, who was worse Hitler or Stalin? They're both pretty much agreed as the two most evil men of the twentieth century even though one usually overshadows the other.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But which was worse?

Hmm, Hitler was definitely smarter, but he was also much crueler. Stalin was pretty much not to Hitler's level.

That's interesting that you believe Hitler was smart, he was charismatic but he was only a house painter afterall..

That's interesting that you believe Hitler was smart, he was charismatic but he was only a house painter afterall..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually, he was the President of Germany.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you think he can get elected in Germany, convince thousands of German's to slaughter millions and millions of people, build up a military only 15 years after the entire world told him he wasn't allowed to, and take over Europe like he did - do all of those things with with only charisma, not intelligence, then you're a very silly person.

If Hitler wouldn't have done all that, Germany wouldn't be the awesome country that it is today...

 

 

 

If Stalin wouldn't have done all that, the "Space Race" and Cold War wouldn't have happened. We probably wouldn't be building the ISS, have a probe in Saturn's orbit. We might've nuked our planet, or we might not have any nukes...

Well starlin was a hilter wanna be

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hitler is bad as they come

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The holocaust is an extremely terrible thing

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Saying that I think Hilter was metally insane so mabye not so much aware of his actions as much as starlin was.

If Stalin wouldn't have done all that, the "Space Race" and Cold War wouldn't have happened. We probably wouldn't be building the ISS, have a probe in Saturn's orbit. We might've nuked our planet, or we might not have any nukes...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Really? Are we talking about the same Stalin who died in 1953, and the same "Space Race" that started around 1957?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And how do you suppose we wouldn't have nukes, which were dropped on Japan in 1945? Surely that isn't the result of the "Space Race."

Well, Stalin kinda, to put it bluntly, got rid of all the people who were keeping Russia back (in the communist party's eyes). If he hadn't done those mass killings, then Russia would likely not have stood a chance in WWII, particularly at Stalingrad, where Stalin introduced the policy of shooting anyone who wasn't prepared to die for the city, and then likely they wouldn't have become a world power anyway.

Well, Stalin kinda, to put it bluntly, got rid of all the people who were keeping Russia back (in the communist party's eyes). If he hadn't done those mass killings, then Russia would likely not have stood a chance in WWII, particularly at Stalingrad, where Stalin introduced the policy of shooting anyone who wasn't prepared to die for the city, and then likely they wouldn't have become a world power anyway.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the history lesson. Does that make Stalin worse or better than Hitler do you suppose?

Well, that was actually in response to the guy who who was talking about the space race.

 

 

 

But i'll take the bait, see what happens. Define better or worse. Better or worse for who? Their respective nations? The world? Their ancestors? And do you mean just crimes against humanity, because perfect logic dictates that some must die for the greater good.

Hmm, Hitler was definitely smarter, but he was also much crueler. Stalin was pretty much not to Hitler's level.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'd disagree Stalin was a shrewd political operator. From the very moment he was made General Secretary of the Communist Party (which was though of as a worthless position) in the 20's he slowly but surely filled the party with those loyal to him & gradually began to turn them against his rivals (Trotsky particularly). As soon as he had that post he used and abused it to consolidate his own power - the guy really knew how to manipulate others to gain the best possible advantage for himself. Then again after the war he did it again at Potsdam when he used FDR's weakening health to his advantage & virually secured East Europe for the USSR.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In terms of who was the most brutal I'd say Stalin because basically the man had no heart. He was famously the man who coined the phrase "One death is a tragedy, a million is a statistic" and who upon hearing his own son had been captured by the Nazi's stated that he had no son. I'd say Stalin was worse because of how he consolidated his power (via the Purges) and was then able to kill at will. I read somewhere that Beria(who was Stalins most infamous NKVD chief) was even given daily targets for execution numbers that had to be adhered to.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Don't get me wron Hitler was truly evil but I consider Stalin worse since he created the power structure to keep him in power for as long as he lived where as Hitler was erratic & couldn't even control his closest allies towards the end.

Well, that was actually in response to the guy who who was talking about the space race.

 

 

 

But i'll take the bait, see what happens. Define better or worse. Better or worse for who? Their respective nations? The world? Their ancestors? And do you mean just crimes against humanity, because perfect logic dictates that some must die for the greater good.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Quit being pedantic. Why would the topic poster ask if they were worse for their ancestors? That doesn't even make sense.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

They're both pretty much agreed as the two most evil men of the twentieth century even though one usually overshadows the other.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But which was worse?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you can't figure out the question from the first post, there's no use explaining it to you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Worse for the ancestors...honestly?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Who do you think is worse...and stop thinking your so smug and bigheaded

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think they were equally as bad. And...no thanks.

If you think he can get elected in Germany

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Elected in Germany...you believe he was elected democratically? Then I suggest you read a little more up on Hitler. He was put into power by Von Papen, who believed he could control Hitler. Granted he was popular but that was the result of the state Germany was in at the time. What with the depression, state of government, contempt for the Treaty of Versailles. All Hitler had to do was take advantage of the mood. I'm not saying he was stupid but he certainly wasn't the man people believed him to be, a demigod of some sort.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

do all of those things with with only charisma, not intelligence, then you're a very silly person.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe I commited myself with a sweeping statement, but Hitler didn't do all of those things, he spent most of his days relaxing in his Bavarian retreat. This topic was made to compare Hitler with Stalin, I wasn't implying he was stupid just an observation really.

Well starlin was a hilter wanna be

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Even though Stalin came BEFORE Hitler, and killed more people in his reign than Hitler did...

If he hadn't done those mass killings, then Russia would likely not have stood a chance in WWII, particularly at Stalingrad, where Stalin introduced the policy of shooting anyone who wasn't prepared to die for the city, and then likely they wouldn't have become a world power anyway.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually Stalins pre-war purges greatly weakened Russia's military power as he killed so many of his own Generals that he had to replace them with far inferior skilled/inexperienced replacements.

I didnt mean it like ......and just becuase he killed more people dosent mean he was worse

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1 million killed lifes or 1 killed life is just as bad. Its mjy personally opinon that i think Hilter was worse

Elected in Germany...you believe he was elected democratically? Then I suggest you read a little more up on Hitler. He was put into power by Von Papen, who believed he could control Hitler. Granted he was popular but that was the result of the state Germany was in at the time. What with the depression, state of government, contempt for the Treaty of Versailles. All Hitler had to do was take advantage of the mood. I'm not saying he was stupid but he certainly wasn't the man people believed him to be, a demigod of some sort.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

He was appointed by Papen as Chancellor - and regardless of whether or not he was fairly elected as President doesn't detract from the point which was that he had to be smart to get there.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe I commited myself with a sweeping statement, but Hitler didn't do all of those things, he spent most of his days relaxing in his Bavarian retreat. This topic was made to compare Hitler with Stalin, I wasn't implying he was stupid just an observation really.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You were responding to the assertion that he was smart. I was defending that statement because it took brains to do what Hitler did.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Intra seriously why do you have analyse everyone elses threads and find something that is wrong with them

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

People should quit posting information that is wrong.

 

Well, that was actually in response to the guy who who was talking about the space race.

 

 

 

But i'll take the bait, see what happens. Define better or worse. Better or worse for who? Their respective nations? The world? Their ancestors? And do you mean just crimes against humanity, because perfect logic dictates that some must die for the greater good.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Quit being pedantic. Why would the topic poster ask if they were worse for their ancestors? That doesn't even make sense.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Worst for their ancestors. Well I know that Hitler's family changed their name after the war, because of the sheer embarrassment. Whereas recently I watched a documentary on Stalin, and his ancestors still bear the name proudly, claiming he proud Russia into the modern age and whatnot.

 

 

 

Actually Stalins pre-war purges greatly weakened Russia's military power as he killed so many of his own Generals that he had to replace them with far inferior skilled/inexperienced replacements.

 

 

 

Ah yes, its coming back to me now :P.

 

 

 

The purges thing simply helped kick start the country into developing economically. People were too scared to ask for raises or days off, and so by sheer terror, Stalin managed to get his country mobilised for war relatively quickly

 

 

 

(even if all the quality of the Red Army had been lost :x )

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

edit - Achilleus - things like your last post won't beat Intra...it will simply make YOU seem the idiot.

People should quit posting information that is wrong.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are not always right thank you very much. Do not live in a black white world, you CAN be WRONG. And don't justify it when you are wrong with technicalities that are merely opinions.

Worst for their ancestors. Well I know that Hitler's family changed their name after the war, because of the sheer embarrassment.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And why would you think, based on the first post, that is what the topic starter was wondering about?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Whereas recently I watched a documentary on Stalin, and his ancestors still bear the name proudly, claiming he proud Russia into the modern age and whatnot.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wait. His ancestors were born after him? That's a bloody miracle!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are not always right thank you very much. Do not live in a black white world, you CAN be WRONG. And don't justify it when you are wrong with technicalities that are merely opinions.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And I expect to be called out on it when I post wrong information, which is why I was not offended when someone tried to explain to me that Hitler wasn't elected democratically, despite it being completely irrelevant to my point.

 

Worst for their ancestors. Well I know that Hitler's family changed their name after the war, because of the sheer embarrassment.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And why would you think, based on the first post, that is what the topic starter was wondering about?

If you're allowed to be pedantic to the letter, why can't I?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Whereas recently I watched a documentary on Stalin, and his ancestors still bear the name proudly, claiming he proud Russia into the modern age and whatnot.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wait. His ancestors were born after him? That's a bloody miracle!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ancestors/family, same thing. Stop trying to win arguments on bloody tiny nitpicks.

If you're allowed to be pedantic to the letter, why can't I?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So you admit to acting that way?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ancestors/family, same thing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No.

Don't get me wron Hitler was truly evil but I consider Stalin worse since he created the power structure to keep him in power for as long as he lived where as Hitler was erratic & couldn't even control his closest allies towards the end.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Do you think if Hitler was smarter in the way he handled himself, he would have ended up just as evil in Stalin?

And I expect to be called out on it when I post wrong information, which is why I was not offended when someone tried to explain to me that Hitler wasn't elected democratically, despite it being completely irrelevant to my point.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

He was appointed by Papen as Chancellor - and regardless of whether or not he was fairly elected as President doesn't detract from the point which was that he had to be smart to get there.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That sounds to me like a justification of opinion.

 

If you're allowed to be pedantic to the letter, why can't I?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So you admit to acting that way?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Why the hell not? You blantently are, so I will to. Fight fire with fire and all that.

 

 

 

 

Ancestors/family, same thing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No.

 

 

 

*sigh* You know full well what I mean, if you're going to have a debate, then for god's sake, stop dancing around the issue going 'La la la i'm awkward!' with your fingers in you ears.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

edit - Anchillus - now is the time for you to disappear from the thread before any more contempt can be shovelled onto you. No one wants your spam or lies.