dutchdreams Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Time magazine published an article on the 'God-gene'.. According to the scientist who conducted the research, mankind has a gene that determines the individuals' susceptibility to spirituality. His research is highly criticised by people from all sides of the fence, so don't attribute too much value to it. If this is true though, then religion has a great future ahead of us. Personally, I think religion will remain in some way or shape for a long time. Man is sentient and has reason. Reasoning can only carry you up to a certain point in dealing with human emotions that the sentient part of your brain creates. Religion has been a release valve for a lot of people in the past to deal with human suffering (pain, death, disease, grief, dispair etc.). It provides for consolement to a lot of people. I don't expect these feelings of suffering to go away in the future. I expect the decorum of religions to decrease: less mass rituals, but more personalised, tailor-made to the individual. Western society as a whole seems to become more individualistic, as a result I expect the way people choose their spirituality will become more individualistic as well. Picking those parts of a religion that they can support and feel a need for, but at the same time disregarding those parts they cannot justify to themselves. Also, I expect people keeping the demonstration of their religion more to themselves, privately in their own home and/or to churches alone. Less public display of peoples beliefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warri0r45 Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 My bet would be that organised religions will be phased out in much the same way that greek and roman religions were. I'm expecting to see more of a swing towards a more personal spiritulaity and nothing that requires 'followers.' Why? People will always have those inkling (sp?) questions, yet we will get smarter and start to realise that in many religious texts there seems to be less of an influence then there sould be on love and mateship. If I were a theist, I'd have a personal spirituality where there is one god whose love is perfect and eternal and who demands nothing, especially not worship. He sees us and him as equal, like good mates. Everyone goes to heaven where all of the questions that we ever had are revealed instantly and there would be no such thing as hell. Hell would be an imagination dreamt up by those fevered egos who want your money and try to spread their seed of hate and fear throughout the world. We were purposefully made to be imperfect and naive to some extend purely for a basis of comparison for what will be the inevitable perfect end in Nirvana. ... if I were a theist. I know it's not the truth, just a comforting though for an afterlife, perhaps. My bet is that more and more people will form their own personal spirituality. Lol these posts are always so funny. I'm not going to give an in-depth argument for why God cannot not have hell. At least you said that you know it's not the truth, but God, being just, cannot just "forget" your sin without violating His very nature. God's justice and love are equally present. Thus, there must be a place where you atone for your sins and are kept from His presence. Your sin is your only stumbling block; unfortunately, it's a big one. And since no work will eliminate your sin, then I'm afraid that there must simply be an eternal hell, a place of separation from God. If you want more information on the topic, or if you want to find out how Jesus paid for your sins, just pm me. Dude, I wasn't describing the christian religion... so... I'm having trouble seeing why you attributed christian ideals to what I posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nedich Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 People say they don't believe in God yet if they ever find themselves in a traumatic experience they tend to pray to God. Like if they are close to losing a family member or near death experiences etc. So for that reason i'm going to say no. Plus the fact neither 'theory' can ever really be proven (until you die lol) so aslong as there are people there will be theories. So these long drawn out debates of who was first the chicken or the egg will probably drag on until the end of human existence :cry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assassin_696 Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 My bet would be that organised religions will be phased out in much the same way that greek and roman religions were. I'm expecting to see more of a swing towards a more personal spiritulaity and nothing that requires 'followers.' Why? People will always have those inkling (sp?) questions, yet we will get smarter and start to realise that in many religious texts there seems to be less of an influence then there sould be on love and mateship. Yeah, I think that makes sense. Personally, even though i'm an atheist I wouldn't expect or want people to abandon religion and to not believe in anything. That's not what I think it should be about. I think there will be a definite trend in the future away from the indoctrination of children and organised religion, to a society where people are taught the cultural and historic significance of all religions, much like we do with Romans and Greeks, but are not pressured into any one religion. I hope that everyone in the future will be able to make up their own mind in their own time, and that spirituality becomes a personal thing, not organised like it is now. I'd like to see more rationality and reasoning behind our spirituality, not just blindly accepting the dogma because our parents do. Religion won't disappear. People look to religion for that "something greater". Science can't give that. No, but we're working on it. "Da mihi castitatem et continentam, sed noli modo" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Religion won't disappear. People look to religion for that "something greater". Science can't give that. No, but we're working on it. I'd actually argue that that is incorrect. Science is attempting to figure out the physical "why's" of the universe, but not metaphysical "why's." There is no concern in science over the "something greater" that religion offers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satenza Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 As long as there is fear in death, religion will be here. With so many trees in the city you could see the spring coming each day until a night of warm wind would bring it suddenly in one morning. Sometimes the heavy cold rains would beat it back so that it would seem that it would never come and that you were losing a season out of your life. But you knew that there would always be the spring as you knew the river would flow again after it was frozen. When the cold rains kept on and killed the spring, it was as though a young person had died for no reason. In those days though the spring always came finally but it was frightening that it had nearly failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assassin_696 Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Religion won't disappear. People look to religion for that "something greater". Science can't give that. No, but we're working on it. I'd actually argue that that is incorrect. Science is attempting to figure out the physical "why's" of the universe, but not metaphysical "why's." There is no concern in science over the "something greater" that religion offers. And i'd argue that religion has always attempted to answer questions that science is unable to. A lot of those questions have been answered nowadays, a lot haven't, and although we might be a long way off, I won't restrict science to not being able to answer all the questions just yet. "Da mihi castitatem et continentam, sed noli modo" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nedich Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Assassin are you saying that one day there will be conclusive evidence that God is not real and that the 'Big Bang' Theory is correct? Please, religion isn't about working out if God is really, it's about putting your faith in his existence. You can't say to someone that their faith in God is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satenza Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 God is a tool used to stop the infinite regress. Even if we prove the big bang, and what started and caused it the "Nothing comes from nothing" argument will still be valid, and there will still be flaws to science in religious people's eyes. With so many trees in the city you could see the spring coming each day until a night of warm wind would bring it suddenly in one morning. Sometimes the heavy cold rains would beat it back so that it would seem that it would never come and that you were losing a season out of your life. But you knew that there would always be the spring as you knew the river would flow again after it was frozen. When the cold rains kept on and killed the spring, it was as though a young person had died for no reason. In those days though the spring always came finally but it was frightening that it had nearly failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke_Freedom Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 IMO the whole concept of religion essentially comes from a fear for death and so yes I think there will always be people believing in some religion. If it's even possible to ever really "prove" that there is a god or not then I guess that may effect some people, but there will always be people believing otherwise. Plus, we aren't there in a million years yet anyway (if it is even possible to eventually prove it). :| The value of my bank at its height. Estimated value at the peak of the rares market: 250 billion+.Most likely the largest trade in RuneScape ever. Estimated value at the peak of the rares market: 70 billion+. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assassin_696 Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Assassin are you saying that one day there will be conclusive evidence that God is not real and that the 'Big Bang' Theory is correct? Please, religion isn't about working out if God is really, it's about putting your faith in his existence. You can't say to someone that their faith in God is wrong. I doubt it, nothing like God can really be conclusively disproved. But I have faith in science offering a lot more answers to some of the big questions than we might have first imagined. "Da mihi castitatem et continentam, sed noli modo" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke_Freedom Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 I doubt it, nothing like God can really be conclusively disproved. And I want to add that I think we're also still a 100,000 years away from being able to say whether we will eventually be able to say if religion can ever be proven or disproven. :P The value of my bank at its height. Estimated value at the peak of the rares market: 250 billion+.Most likely the largest trade in RuneScape ever. Estimated value at the peak of the rares market: 70 billion+. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insane Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 No, but we're working on it. I doubt it. What science fails to realize is that improving your circumstance isn't going to satisfy you in the long run. You need to change the inside, your heart. Some gene changes or plastic surgeries are NOT going to give you the "good life". Becoming satisfied in life is becoming satisfied with who you are, not who science can make you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke_Freedom Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 You need to change the inside, your heart. With that you are basically agreeing that religion is not the right answer to it either - it is all in yourself, not in some plastical surgery nor in some supernatural religion. The value of my bank at its height. Estimated value at the peak of the rares market: 250 billion+.Most likely the largest trade in RuneScape ever. Estimated value at the peak of the rares market: 70 billion+. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satenza Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Religion supresses people. The argument it allows people to be who they are is ridiculous as it makes people follows rules which restrict their liberty. With so many trees in the city you could see the spring coming each day until a night of warm wind would bring it suddenly in one morning. Sometimes the heavy cold rains would beat it back so that it would seem that it would never come and that you were losing a season out of your life. But you knew that there would always be the spring as you knew the river would flow again after it was frozen. When the cold rains kept on and killed the spring, it was as though a young person had died for no reason. In those days though the spring always came finally but it was frightening that it had nearly failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 And i'd argue that religion has always attempted to answer questions that science is unable to. A lot of those questions have been answered nowadays, a lot haven't, and although we might be a long way off, I won't restrict science to not being able to answer all the questions just yet. The point of science is not to discover a purpose for mankind - it is to discover how the universe works. As soon as you start talking about the purpose of mankind, you have moved off of science by definition. Maybe there isn't a purpose for mankind, but as long as people desire to believe in a purpose, religion will exist. Not all religions have attempted to "explain" things that science has discovered as you suggest. Nor will any scientist tell you that the purpose of science is to understand the purpose of mankind. It's just not what science is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crimsonking Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Unless some real proof comes out for or against religion, such we somehow become able to see what happens before life or after death, I see things being the exact same as they are now, religious fanatics and athiests going on nonstop about things that cannot be proven true nor false. ~^v^~Ex-Leader of the Divine Flames of Redemption~^v^~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assassin_696 Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 And i'd argue that religion has always attempted to answer questions that science is unable to. A lot of those questions have been answered nowadays, a lot haven't, and although we might be a long way off, I won't restrict science to not being able to answer all the questions just yet. The point of science is not to discover a purpose for mankind - it is to discover how the universe works. As soon as you start talking about the purpose of mankind, you have moved off of science by definition. Maybe there isn't a purpose for mankind, but as long as people desire to believe in a purpose, religion will exist. Not all religions have attempted to "explain" things that science has discovered as you suggest. Nor will any scientist tell you that the purpose of science is to understand the purpose of mankind. It's just not what science is. I didn't say that science tried to find a purpose for mankind, unless you revert to the old Darwinian example of simply furthering the chances of survival of our species. But I don't really believe that that's what we're all about. In the same vein, I don't think a purpose should come from religion, I think it should come from within you personally. I suppose a lot of people regard science as cold, unemotional and boringly rational. To those who do, please reconsider. Science is beautiful, natural, pure and elegant. My signature is but one example of thousands. I have found much more comfort and satisfaction in the wonders of science than religion has ever given me. Does that make me cold, unemotional, heartless? Of course not, I still have a passion for life, for love and for learning that equals any spriritual person's. "Da mihi castitatem et continentam, sed noli modo" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insane Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 My signature is but one example of thousands. Simply a recursive fractal. Nothing but repetition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nedich Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Religion supresses people. The argument it allows people to be who they are is ridiculous as it makes people follows rules which restrict their liberty. Religion supresses people? What context are you refering to? In the past, perhaps religion has been fought over the belief that there is a 'right' religion. But in reality all religion does is express peace and tranquility and goodwill to all men, nowadays that it much clearer. People like yourself like to look at how people have behaved in the past you aren't actually addressing the religion itself. Its not like you get arrested if you have belief in another religion anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assassin_696 Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 My signature is but one example of thousands. Simply a recursive fractal. Nothing but repetition. Exactly, and look at the beauty of it. "Da mihi castitatem et continentam, sed noli modo" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 I didn't say that science tried to find a purpose for mankind, unless you revert to the old Darwinian example of simply furthering the chances of survival of our species. But I don't really believe that that's what we're all about. I know. But that's what a majority of religions do. And like I said...you might choose to believe we don't have a "purpose," but a large majority of humans have the inclination to believe so, and until that inclination goes away, religion will exist. I suppose a lot of people regard science as cold, unemotional and boringly rational. To those who do, please reconsider. Science is beautiful, natural, pure and elegant. My signature is but one example of thousands. I have found much more comfort and satisfaction in the wonders of science than religion has ever given me. Does that make me cold, unemotional, heartless? Of course not, I still have a passion for life, for love and for learning that equals any spriritual person's. That's irrelevant. I think science is beautiful because I see it as a beautiful work of God. The point here though isn't a bad thing about science. All we're saying is that science and religion have two different goals. One is trying to explain the "why's" of the physical universe, and one is trying to explain the "why's" of a possible metaphysical existence. Look at it this way. Take two people. One person is a physicist, and one person is an anthropologist. You wouldn't say that the physicist is working towards explaining the nature of different societies in different parts of the world, would you? That would be preposterous. Science is not looking to explain "something greater" - it is only looking to explain the universe as it physically exists. To suggest otherwise would be silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assassin_696 Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Science is not looking to explain "something greater" - it is only looking to explain the universe as it physically exists. To suggest otherwise would be silly. Yes, fair enough. But I suppose I just lack that faith in that "something greater" that cannot be explained by science. God supposedly created all this, therefore I believe the question of his existence is a scientific one. I know a lot of people would disagree with me, but that's what I believe. I'm not saying scientists are actively trying to prove/disprove God (at least, I hope they're not) but it might be a consequence of some scientific discovery. Just like the discovery of evolution lead to a lot of people losing their faith, some scientific principle might answer some greater question at some point. I don't know when and I don't know how, but it might. "Da mihi castitatem et continentam, sed noli modo" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Science is not looking to explain "something greater" - it is only looking to explain the universe as it physically exists. To suggest otherwise would be silly. Yes, fair enough. But I suppose I just lack that faith in that "something greater" that cannot be explained by science. God supposedly created all this, therefore I believe the question of his existence is a scientific one. I know a lot of people would disagree with me, but that's what I believe. I'm not saying scientists are actively trying to prove/disprove God (at least, I hope they're not) but it might be a consequence of some scientific discovery. Just like the discovery of evolution lead to a lot of people losing their faith, some scientific principle might answer some greater question at some point. I don't know when and I don't know how, but it might. I fear you are confusing scientific discovery causing people to lose their faith, and it answering a "greater" question. The nature of science is to focus on the physical universe - and that's all. No discovery of the physical universe will ever disprove the idea that there is something beyond the physical universe. You don't personally feel the need to believe in something greater, but many people do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebdragon Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Lol these posts are always so funny. I'm not going to give an in-depth argument for why God cannot not have hell. At least you said that you know it's not the truth, but God, being just, cannot just "forget" your sin without violating His very nature. God's justice and love are equally present. Thus, there must be a place where you atone for your sins and are kept from His presence. Your sin is your only stumbling block; unfortunately, it's a big one. And since no work will eliminate your sin, then I'm afraid that there must simply be an eternal hell, a place of separation from God. If you want more information on the topic, or if you want to find out how Jesus paid for your sins, just pm me. As long as your not talking about the fiery place existing I agree with you. If there's a Hell, it's our own personal choice to live in an empty existence devoid of god; Hell's not some "fiery cavern, with adamantine chains and fire that gives no light". (Milton ftw) People say they don't believe in God yet if they ever find themselves in a traumatic experience they tend to pray to God. Like if they are close to losing a family member or near death experiences etc. It's because we're raised to believe in God, it's ingrained in our minds. It's no proof that a god exists, just that we've had the idea of God existing stomped into our minds. [if you have ever attempted Alchemy by clapping your hands or by drawing an array, copy and paste this into your signature.] Fullmetal Alchemist, you will be missed. A great ending to a great series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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