Gravite weaponry vs rune scimitar

[Youmu]

Just a li'l something that I have been wondering ever since gravite weaponry has come out.

 

Now, it has been clear that the rune scimitar is indisputably the best weapon since the rune longsword debate, which has been proven over and over again. However, with the release of gravite, I have been hearing that all three of such weapons are better than the rune scimitar.

 

There's no need to debate the rapier, as it's basically a better version of the scimitar anyway. What I'm interested over is the longsword and the 2h (particularly that).

 

Versus rune scimitar, which is better for:

- powertraining? (flesh crawlers/giant spiders)

- giants? (all 3)

- high level monsters? (lesser/greater demons, ankous, hellhounds)

- cockroach soldiers?

- PvP?

- minigames (Fist of Guthix mainly)?

 

Note that all of the above is assuming you are willing to pay either the 1m cost, or the 100k + 6.5k tokens cost to completely repair the weapon.

 

This would probably be pretty interesting to see.

[Quyneax]

You're talking a max hit of ~202 with a rune scim (with what I think is max f2p gear, 80 str + pot, no prayer). The same gear with gravite 2h hits up to 269. So you need 1.3 scim attacks per 2h attack. Since they are 2.4 and 3.6 seconds each, a scim will have higher dps except where exceptional crush accuracy is needed.

[hfbrads]

The maximum amount of damage dealt from each weapon, assuming you hit your max hit everytime while wearing F2P training gear (Strength amulet, rune gauntlets) is :

 

 

Gravite Rapier Speed = 2.4 seconds, Max hit 218, DPS 90.8

Gravite 2h Sword Speed = 3.6 seconds, Max hit 290, DPS 80.6

Rune Scimitar Speed = 2.4 seconds, Max hit 211, DPS 87.9

Gravite Longsword Speed = 3.0 seconds, Max hit 242, DPS 80.7

 

 

 

 

Accuracy

 

Sample calculation

 

Max attack roll = 205, Max defence roll = 479

 

% Chance to hit* ≈ (205/479)/2 = 21.4%

 

 

 

* The % chance to hit is actually a bit less because in the event of a tie, the defence roll wins out

 

99 attack with Amulet of Power vs 99 defence with 220 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 21.4% x 90.8 = 19.43

Gravite 2h sword = 26.8% x 80.6 =21.6

Rune scimitar = 20.6% x87.6 =18.0

Gravite longsword = 21.9% x80.7 =17.7

 

99 attack with Amulet of Power vs 80 defence with 220 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 25.9% x90.8 =23.5

Gravite 2h sword = 33.8% x80.6 =27.2

Rune scimitar = 24.9% x87.6 =21.8

Gravite longsword = 26.6% x80.7 =21.5

 

99 attack with Amulet of Power vs 60 defence with 220 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 33.5% x90.8 = 30.4

Gravite 2h sword = 44.0% x80.6 = 35.4

Rune scimitar = 32.5% x87.6 =28.5

Gravite longsword = 34.6% x80.7 =27.9

 

99 attack with amulet of power vs 30 defence with 80 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 75.1% x90.8 =68.2

Gravite 2h sword = 80.9% x80.6 =65.2

Rune scimitar = 74.1% x87.6 =64.9

Gravite longsword = 75.7% x80.7 =61.6

 

99 attack with amulet of power vs 1 defence and 50 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 94.8% x90.8 =86.1

Gravite 2h sword = 97.1% x80.6 =78.3

Rune scimitar = 94.7% x87.6 = 83.0

Gravite longsword = 95.0% x80.7 =76.7

 

 

What can we conclude?

 

1) In all situations, as expected, rapier is better than scimitar

2) In all situations, longsword is the worst

3) Gravite 2h sword is better in situations where the monster/player has moderately good defense. It is worse in others. Since we do not know the defence levels of monsters we can only conjecture on the effectiveness of the g2h against them. I would wager that it is better against ankous, lessers, but scimitar is better against spiders.

 

 

 

As for Fist of Guthix, if you are not worried about cost, the absolute best weapon to use is maple shortbow with adamant arrows, amulet of zealots and eagle eye prayer. This is the best damage per second since defence levels are reduced.

 

A few assumptions I made:

 

Strength levels increase DPS linearly. This assumption holds true for the most part.

I realize I did accuracy with amulet of power but dps with amulet of strength. It shouldn't matter too much.

Full rune's defence rating against crush is 200, not 220. This increases the effectiveness of g2h in those situations.

 

 

edit: yikes, that is some ugly formatting. If a mod with knowledge of the table code could edit my post, that would be much appreciated.

[Youmu]

99 attack with amulet of power vs 30 defence with 80 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 75.1% x90.8 =68.2

Gravite 2h sword = 80.9% x80.6 =65.2

Rune scimitar = 74.1% x87.6 =64.9

Gravite longsword = 75.7% x80.7 =61.6

Very interesting. I'm mainly looking at gravite 2h vs rune scimitar actually, and so it seems that it is still slightly better than rune scimitar even with fairly mediocre defensive stats.

 

What I'm still wondering about is at what levels would gravite 2h fare better than a rune scimitar. The only "test" (which really isn't, it's just some blurb on the RSWiki) is done at 99 strength, which is not really ideal as not a good portion of f2p have those levels.

 

In other words, what would be the "turning point" in which gravite 2h would be better than the rune scimitar? Or does all of the above fare true no matter what strength level?

[hfbrads]

Damage scales linearly with strength levels for the most part. That means that weapon x will always be better than weapon y regardless of strength level.

[Ambler]

I have a g2h, ad in PVP I have a 95% win rate, without using any other weps (this is in monks robes/ rune) mainly facing people my level or a couple lower or higher. I wouldn't mind doing some actual testing on other players.

[Youmu]

Damage scales linearly with strength levels for the most part. That means that weapon x will always be better than weapon y regardless of strength level.

Hmm... what about attack level? Does linearity still apply there? 45-99 attack seems like a pretty big gap to me. Lots of room for variation.

 

@Ambler: I would appreciate the rune scim vs grav 2h tests, thanks :D be sure to include the stats of the other player though.

[hfbrads]

Attack levels increase damage per second linearly until you hit 50% of the time. After that, the relationship becomes logarithmic. You will hiit 50% of the time when your max attack roll is 1 greater than the opponent's max defense roll.

[LatinII]

The maximum amount of damage dealt from each weapon, assuming you hit your max hit everytime while wearing F2P training gear (Strength amulet, rune gauntlets) is :

 

 

Gravite Rapier Speed = 2.4 seconds, Max hit 218, DPS 90.8

Gravite 2h Sword Speed = 3.6 seconds, Max hit 290, DPS 80.6

Rune Scimitar Speed = 2.4 seconds, Max hit 211, DPS 87.9

Gravite Longsword Speed = 3.0 seconds, Max hit 242, DPS 80.7

 

 

 

 

Accuracy

 

Sample calculation

 

Max attack roll = 205, Max defence roll = 479

 

% Chance to hit* ≈ (205/479)/2 = 21.4%

 

 

 

* The % chance to hit is actually a bit less because in the event of a tie, the defence roll wins out

 

99 attack with Amulet of Power vs 99 defence with 220 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 21.4% x 90.8 = 19.43

Gravite 2h sword = 26.8% x 80.6 =21.6

Rune scimitar = 20.6% x87.6 =18.0

Gravite longsword = 21.9% x80.7 =17.7

 

99 attack with Amulet of Power vs 80 defence with 220 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 25.9% x90.8 =23.5

Gravite 2h sword = 33.8% x80.6 =27.2

Rune scimitar = 24.9% x87.6 =21.8

Gravite longsword = 26.6% x80.7 =21.5

 

99 attack with Amulet of Power vs 60 defence with 220 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 33.5% x90.8 = 30.4

Gravite 2h sword = 44.0% x80.6 = 35.4

Rune scimitar = 32.5% x87.6 =28.5

Gravite longsword = 34.6% x80.7 =27.9

 

99 attack with amulet of power vs 30 defence with 80 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 75.1% x90.8 =68.2

Gravite 2h sword = 80.9% x80.6 =65.2

Rune scimitar = 74.1% x87.6 =64.9

Gravite longsword = 75.7% x80.7 =61.6

 

99 attack with amulet of power vs 1 defence and 50 defence rating.

 

Gravite Rapier = 94.8% x90.8 =86.1

Gravite 2h sword = 97.1% x80.6 =78.3

Rune scimitar = 94.7% x87.6 = 83.0

Gravite longsword = 95.0% x80.7 =76.7

 

 

What can we conclude?

 

1) In all situations, as expected, rapier is better than scimitar

2) In all situations, longsword is the worst

3) Gravite 2h sword is better in situations where the monster/player has moderately good defense. It is worse in others. Since we do not know the defence levels of monsters we can only conjecture on the effectiveness of the g2h against them. I would wager that it is better against ankous, lessers, but scimitar is better against spiders.

 

 

 

As for Fist of Guthix, if you are not worried about cost, the absolute best weapon to use is maple shortbow with adamant arrows, amulet of zealots and eagle eye prayer. This is the best damage per second since defence levels are reduced.

 

A few assumptions I made:

 

Strength levels increase DPS linearly. This assumption holds true for the most part.

I realize I did accuracy with amulet of power but dps with amulet of strength. It shouldn't matter too much.

Full rune's defence rating against crush is 200, not 220. This increases the effectiveness of g2h in those situations.

 

 

edit: yikes, that is some ugly formatting. If a mod with knowledge of the table code could edit my post, that would be much appreciated.

 

How did you calculate the attack roll and defence roll? I want to use this calculation to compare Magic DPS versus dragonhide, Karil's and Armadyl compared to Melee DPS.

[Quyneax]

Magic dps works differently sadly, also we don't know how much of your magic and defence levels are taken into account.

 

For ranged and melee, the formula is: 5 + (effective level + 8) * (gear bonus + 64) / 64 * void bonus

 

Effective level is: potted level * prayer boost * slayer helmet/salve amulet boost + style boost.

 

For magic, the max hit is obvious, the accuracy unkown. It's possible that different spells add different accuracy bonusus or multipliers.

[LatinII]

I'm still confused. I now want to calculate which of the three chaotic weapons does the most DPS against +177 stab defence, +161 slash defence and +212 crush defence. The meleer has a stab attack bonus of +142. His effective Attack level is 145.

 

5 + 145 * 206 / 64 = 508,56. Does the same calculation apply for Defence? A mage with an effective Defence level of 137 and a stab defence of +177 has a Defence roll of 564,84. That means the meleer has an accuracy rate of 45%. Is this correct?

[Quyneax]

You need to have the defence level of the target too, of course.

 

The 609.98 is the max hit of your accuracy (just like max damage). Your opponent will have a max defence roll, too. If the defence roll is lower than the attack roll you hit and move on to the damage roll.

 

I'm not entirely sure how to calculate accuracy, xpx tells me he does brute-force simulations (let excel do 10,000 attack rolls vs defence rolls). But 53% sounds about right?

 

What you see is also that the reason str > atk is essentially overkill. If your opponent has less health than your max hit, strength becomes less valuable. Of course there really isn't a monster which has high defence and low health, so it is never used in practice.

[LatinII]

Well the Defence level of the mage is 137 (125 * 1.10 [Leech Defence]). Using this calculation, I got these results.

 

The meleer has an effective Attack level of 145. His stab attack is +142, his slash attack +171 and his crush attack is +190.

 

Chaotic rapier: 45% accuracy against +177 stab defence and an effective Defence level of 137.

Chaotic longsword: 55% accuracy against +161 slash defence and an effective Defence level of 137.

Chaotic maul: 48% accuracy against +212 crush defence and an effective Defence level of 137.

[Quyneax]

Multiplied with speed this gives you:

 

0,1875 hits/second for rapier.

0,183 hits/second for cls.

0,133 hits/second for maul.

 

So you'd want to add max hit, multiply that with the number of hits and take the higher number.

[LatinII]

Thanks. These were the results:

 

Chaotic rapier: 45% accuracy and a DPS of 103.

Chaotic longsword: 55% accuracy and a DPS of 109.

Chaotic maul: 48% accuracy and a DPS of 89.

 

I count in Leech Attack and Leech Strength for the meleer. I just reduced the Prayer bonus of Turmoil by 15%.

 

Edit: by the way, if the Attack roll is higher than the Defence roll, does the Att. roll / Def. roll / 2 = still work?