Death_By_Pod Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 And regarding Miller's experiment - he used an atmosphere *fixed* to produce favourable results. When compared to what the early atmosphere would have been like when the first cell "evolved", even Miller himself conceded that it was completely unlike the early atmosphere. Miller himself conceded that his experiment was reduced to merely scientific trivia due to this new information. However, it remains to be just a tiny footnote in todays textbooks... I wonder why ;). Furthermore, EVEN if his experiment was legitimate (which he himself conceded it wasN'T), all it does is produce amino acids... the mere building blocks for life, it doesn't produce a cell or show how a cell could be produced through this, just the building blocks for life. But it doesn't evne show that, since it's illegitimate. Until next time... and Zealot, nice to see you posting again :). I just wish I had the time to post more than 10mins a week myself... then I could actually read the posts in this thread. Just by looking at resources from the internet (Like I said I'm not a biology/chemistry expert) it seems that you can replace the "atmosphere" with any other type of reducible atmosphere you will still get amino acids. Even if the entire experiment was wrong: Many of the compounds made in the Miller/Urey experiment are known to exist in outer space. On September 28, 1969, a meteorite fell over Murchison, Australia. While only 100 kilograms were recovered, analysis of the meteorite has shown that it is rich with amino acids. Over 90 amino acids have been identified by researchers to date. Nineteen of these amino acids are found on Earth. (Table showing comparison of Murchison meteorite to Miller/Urey experiment) The early Earth is believed to be similar to many of the asteroids and comets still roaming the galaxy. If amino acids are able to survive in outer space under extreme conditions, then this might suggest that amino acids were present when the Earth was formed. More importantly, the Murchison meteorite has demonstrated that the Earth may have acquired some of its amino acids and other organic compounds by planetary infall. But whatÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s really to say that the first proto-cellÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s were made with DNA/RNA replication. There are other forms of replication (like PNA for example) that would thrive under conditions that are not what we experience today. One such theory is an 'RNA world'. But if you the amino acids keep moving around eventually it will hit an order which makes replication, self replicating. All you need it time (I think 3.5-3.8 billion years is enough) for everything to fall into place. There is a FAQ that deals with transitional fossil records here ---> http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitional.html so there is another piece of the puzzle to put away. I'm not going to be posting too much more in the coming weeks due to a whole heap of exam's but if you want to leave stuff then Ill look up the posts whenever I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maximus Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 yes and no..... i think theres a higer power... but not god... no prrayer of mine was answerd no sign no nothing so yeah... and dont you think hell and the great land above would be crouded after like a 100 billion years of dying? Long since retired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dittos Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 yes and no..... i think theres a higer power... but not god... no prrayer of mine was answerd no sign no nothing so yeah... and dont you think hell and the great land above would be crouded after like a 100 billion years of dying? depends what u call ' praying ', if u only pray when u need a good test and when u don't studied etc u don't have to expect miricals, but if u really would believe it'll work ( ex. when somebody is in life danger after an accident ) MAYBE it'll work. BTW, u say ' after 100 billion years of dying ' but it aren't the BODY'S that go to the ' heaven ' or ' hell ' but it's the soal ... ~Dittos~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zealot Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 Make it a poll so people don't flame. The last one of these had a poll, didn't change the fact it was like 100 pages long... I remember that... It's quite amazing how much people like to talk about this and politics... and even more amazing is that there is so little flaming going on; I have to say that the majority of people who use these boards are more mature then most adults "He is no fool who gives up that which he can not keep to gain that which he can not lose."--Jim Elliot "You must picture me alone in that room in Magdalen, night after night, feeling, whenever my mind lifted even for a second from my work, the steady, unrelenting approach of Him whom I so earnestly desired not to meet. That which I greatly feared had at last come upon me. In the Trinity Term of 1929 I gave in, and admitted that God was God, and knelt and prayed: perhaps, that night, the most dejected and reluctant convert in all England. I did not then see what is now the most shining and obvious thing; the Divine humility which will accept a convert even on such terms. The Prodical Son at least walked home on his own two feet. But who can duly adore that love which will open the high gates to a prodigal who is brought in kicking, struggling, resentful, and darting his eyes in every direction for a chance of escape? The words compelle intrare, compel them to come in, have been so abused by wicked men that we shudder at them; but, properly understood, they plumb the depth of the Divine mercy. The hardness of God is kinder than the softness of men, and His compulsion is our liberation."--C.S.Lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilsonisme Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zealot Posted October 17, 2004 Share Posted October 17, 2004 Good luck with your exams, Death_By_Pod... I know how much work studying for exams can be. I don't agree with your assessment of Miller's experiment... But since you're rather busy, I won't go into that at the moment. BTW, u say ' after 100 billion years of dying ' but it aren't the BODY'S that go to the ' heaven ' or ' hell ' but it's the soal ... ~Dittos~ Dittos, I half agree with you... But because Jesus was physically raised from the dead, Ihave to believe that so will everybody else... But not to worry, because if there were no deserts, seas, and no need to feed people, earth is plenty big. In fact, you know, heaven would be kinda empty if there weren't at least a couple billion people in it... And by no means would even ten billion really be that crouded. (about 50 people per square mile, which really isn't that many when you don't have to worry about feeding them or such) If you consider height, then I'm sure that you could accomodate 100 billion people comfortably... (Revelation says that the New Jerusalem will be 12,000 stradia to a side, and 12,000 stradia tall. In miles, that's 1,400... In kilometers, 2,200... Hmmm, I think that there'll be plenty of room :wink: As for the rest of all human kind who have ever lived... Quite frankly, If creating the New Jerusalem is within God's power, and indeed creating this universe, then quite frankly, there's no problem space-wise for them either. "He is no fool who gives up that which he can not keep to gain that which he can not lose."--Jim Elliot "You must picture me alone in that room in Magdalen, night after night, feeling, whenever my mind lifted even for a second from my work, the steady, unrelenting approach of Him whom I so earnestly desired not to meet. That which I greatly feared had at last come upon me. In the Trinity Term of 1929 I gave in, and admitted that God was God, and knelt and prayed: perhaps, that night, the most dejected and reluctant convert in all England. I did not then see what is now the most shining and obvious thing; the Divine humility which will accept a convert even on such terms. The Prodical Son at least walked home on his own two feet. But who can duly adore that love which will open the high gates to a prodigal who is brought in kicking, struggling, resentful, and darting his eyes in every direction for a chance of escape? The words compelle intrare, compel them to come in, have been so abused by wicked men that we shudder at them; but, properly understood, they plumb the depth of the Divine mercy. The hardness of God is kinder than the softness of men, and His compulsion is our liberation."--C.S.Lewis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haihong Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 I do not believe in God but tat doent mean it doesnt exists.. True to some ppl God exists....but hrought now is yr faith tell u that God exists..but in reality... i stress reality... did u see God? some may say God hints u n cannot be show or dunno wad crap la...But ... May i ask who write the bible..fro the bible jesus go alot of places to help ppl... but is there really someone who see all his works everwhere!!! u say his diciples who wrote it... but alter they are all dispersed.. who is the one who can combine al these thing and make it intio bible?If it is the God words, den y ppl are making new bible and upgrading the meanings,,, apparently some words which are changed may change the meaning of the whole sentence... u no?if it is God words den is is a kind of disrespect liao... cuz it should be God who wrote the book and not a human lol... is there true in it?... if it is a human who wrote tat den we are listening to human advice... lol...haha that was like 2000 years ago where jesus come to earth rmb last time they got pen to write book ar? they using wad so call brush nia.. no paper somemore...write on bamboo la... N how u no it is true tat jesus rise from the dead... Did u see it? it was written 2000 years ago...i stress is 2000 years ago... 2000 years ago still persists ar?Logicall speaking the thing more or less got change leh..u check teh first of the first bible n the new bible i bet there is different... Even i bet u dunno yr 1 st ancestors lor... den how u no there is god when u cant even no yr first ancestor name.. Somemore if There IS A GOD DEN Y THERE IS SO MUCH SUFFERING IN THE WOLRD!WAD BIRD FLU SARS TSUNAMI>>>SOME MAY SAY IS THE PUNISHMENT OF OUR SINS!>>>But for GODNESS SAKE.... is it true:?U say u ll go heaven if u died if u belioeve in christ.. but u died before... if u didnt die before how u no u go to heaven...UNless u can ask the DEAD TO WAKE UP N TELL U LA>>>WHICH IS LAME...ALl these are doubts but that doesnt show that god doesnt exist... which is true.... FOR WAD I BELIEVE WAD CARE SO MUCH THING>>> LIFE I SO SHORT.... if u cant do this or do tat u better go die fast... as u believe in yr God when u deid u can go heaven... so wad u dun kill yr own baby so to let him have a happy day living wif God... den the whole world population get killed la... LAme.. THere is no fact stating thus is yr belief but i dunno y ppl care so much... Maybe is the fact tat u guys ppl beleive in enternity life which u guys care so much... den if i say i can giv eu eternity life better pray me....lol... ALAS>>> anyway it juz my opinion... as i bleieve in living my life better without having any religious affecting my life... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete_the_Viscous Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 Haihong raises a good point: this thread has been done to death lots of times. deviantart account Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anesthesia Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 You managed to decipher his post? Some people are changed by being a moderator. I wouldn't be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete_the_Viscous Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 Nah, I just thought it needed saying -- I doubt he said anything about that. deviantart account Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alduron Posted February 24, 2006 Share Posted February 24, 2006 Locking this since this topic has become rather lengthy and a new one has been created see this post. Thanks ~Alduron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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