Lateralus

Why? With interventionist foreign policy, things like Iraq can easily happen. I was for the invasion of Iraq. That's not to say I agree with the way the invasion was conducted, but I agreed with the principle of it. I'm going to bed, and if you don't mind I'd rather do this over PM. Is that alright with you?

I agree with America's interventionist foreign policy. It's a major point of argument between me and most of my liberal friends.

[hide=]Now when I was a young man I carried me pack And I lived the free life of the rover. From the Murray's green basin to the dusty outback, Well, I waltzed my Matilda all over. Then in 1915, my country said, "Son, It's time you stop ramblin', there's work to be done." So they gave me a tin hat, and they gave me a gun, And they marched me away to the war. And the band played "Waltzing Matilda," As the ship pulled away from the quay, And amidst all the cheers, the flag waving, and tears, We sailed off for Gallipoli. And how well I remember that terrible day, How our blood stained the sand and the water; And of how in that hell that they call Suvla Bay We were butchered like lambs at the slaughter. Johnny Turk, he was waitin', he primed himself well; He showered us with bullets, and he rained us with shell -- And in five minutes flat, he'd blown us all to hell, Nearly blew us right back to Australia. But the band played "Waltzing Matilda," When we stopped to bury our slain, Well, we buried ours, and the Turks buried theirs, Then we started all over again. And those that were left, well, we tried to survive In that mad world of blood, death and fire. And for ten weary weeks I kept myself alive Though around me the corpses piled higher. Then a big Turkish shell knocked me arse over head, And when I woke up in me hospital bed And saw what it had done, well, I wished I was dead -- Never knew there was worse things than dying. For I'll go no more "Waltzing Matilda," All around the green bush far and free -- To hump tents and pegs, a man needs both legs, No more "Waltzing Matilda" for me. So they gathered the crippled, the wounded, the maimed, And they shipped us back home to Australia. The armless, the legless, the blind, the insane, Those proud wounded heroes of Suvla. And as our ship sailed into Circular Quay, I looked at the place where me legs used to be, And thanked Christ there was nobody waiting for me, To grieve, to mourn and to pity. But the band played "Waltzing Matilda," As they carried us down the gangway, But nobody cheered, they just stood and stared, Then they turned all their faces away. And so now every April, I sit on my porch And I watch the parade pass before me. And I see my old comrades, how proudly they march, Reviving old dreams of past glory, And the old men march slowly, all bones stiff and sore, They're tired old heroes from a forgotten war And the young people ask "What are they marching for?" And I ask meself the same question. But the band plays "Waltzing Matilda," And the old men still answer the call, But as year follows year, more old men disappear Someday, no one will march there at all. Waltzing Matilda, waltzing Matilda. Who'll come a-waltzing Matilda with me? And their ghosts may be heard as they march by the billabong, Who'll come a-Waltzing Matilda with me?[/hide] Lyrics by Eric Bogle. The Pogues version is the best I've ever heard though.

How old are you? I think I'm older than the majority of this forum and I would be embarassed to have any solid political ideology. It's brilliant that youngsters be interested in politics (not necessarily directed at OP), but there's too much reading and living to do before you can have any idea about yourself.

I'll make a better post later, I just had to take issue with this. Whoever decided to get milk from cows will have observed the calves suckling. No mystery or oddity there.

Cigarette smoke works just fine for smoke rings. It's not as lovely and billowy as it is with a cigar, but the smoke is thick enough to make it work. Doesn't taste great, though.

...at the minor expense of killing millions every year. I'm killing myself actually, it's not the cigarette's (or cigarette companies') fault. One sweet puff at a time.

The triviality of this is what makes it important if you ask me. If they're legislating things as petty as furniture in your garden, then there is a problem.

(Not trying to start an argument here, legitimately curious) But don't fetuses have brain behavior around seven months? Doesn't that imply thought and probably knowledge? I mean, it'll be in a different sense than what we consider knowledge as adults or fourteen-year-olds, but maybe those unborn little fetuses know the secrets to the universe. I was really only guessing at the brain behavior. I don't know much but I know I love yooooouuuu about fetuses. It might 'know' how to be comfortable or something like that. It will 'know' how to move its body, but it doesn't have any idea about the outside world and as such can't reason or ponder anything about it. Brain behavior or not, it will still have no idea about god.

It's not an opinion. No knowledge always comes before knowledge. You didn't believe in the existence of a deity when you were born. How do you know? Because you don't know anything when you're born. Not knowing is the default position. One day someone put the idea in your head that the Christian God was the master of the universe. You weren't born with that idea.

By "suggest" do you mean "to believe" or "to assert"? I have no problem with anyone saying they believe something because it's on a personal level, but when they go as far as asserting it, it makes it sound as if it is a universal fact which I believe should be complemented with evidence. He couldn't say 100% that the barn wasn't yellow, but at the very least he could ask for proof. If Bob can't prove it, then there's no reason to listen to what he has to say. So in reality what's actually being rejected is Bob's idea that the barn is yellow, not the 'yellowness' of the barn. I'm rejecting the idea of the existence of a god because there's never been a satisfactory proof for it. Obviously you can't say for certain that there is no god but Occam's Razor means I don't need him.

It's not an opinion. No knowledge always comes before knowledge. You didn't believe in the existence of a deity when you were born.

Well, I do have to say you put it into better terms than I've ever seen someone else say it before. But, I still don't agree with the way they word it - as an assertion. Say Bob and Rob are working on a farm one day, on the opposite side of where the barn is. Bob goes up to Rob and makes the positive assertion, "They painted the barn yellow." Rob argues back and says, "No they did not paint the barn yellow. There is no evidence so therefore they did not." Of course Bob has no evidence that they did paint it yellow, but I don't see how his assertion and lack of evidence is any different than Rob's. For all he knows, they could have painted it yellow. Rob doesn't know whether they did or not, so if you ask me the default position should be indifference - not biased towards either side. In this example you can turn to the proof though, and the onus of proof is on Bob, not the skeptical Rob. If the barn was invisible or inaccessible, or previous claims that the barn was yellow had been sensibly dismissed, then Rob could quite easily suggest that the barn was not yellow (EDIT) or more importantly that Bob could not know anything about the barn.

The logic for asserting anything should go: Premise, proof, conclusion. If there's no proof for the premise then you can dismiss it. You don't have to prove that god doesn't exist because that is the default position. The idea of god came after the default position of no god.

I realise that's what he said, but when people say that it's pretty obvious they mean (or should mean) "there's no evidence that God exists", which he did go on to say.

That same exact rationale can be used to show that he can't be "proven" false either. That which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed the same way.

Please don't take away my cigarettes.

Please explain so this doesn't seem so disgusting. Are you joking? Why am I joking? While I'm sure all of us here would love to save millions of people with a cure, it has effects other than so. Most of the virus is in third world countries, who have enough trouble feeding, housing, and supporting its own people. "Saving" 20 million people will only worsen this, causing even more suffering, loss of jobs, housing space, and competition for resources and food. And even then, they would continue to have unprotected sex, as there is a less of a consequence, increasing population. Why would you want them to suffer even more? It's called a carrying capacity, and many countries are con their way to reaching it. Deaths from AIDs in Africa has very little effect on population control. There was around 2 million deaths from AIDs in Africa in 2005, which is piss in the ocean, frankly. "Many people believe that the AIDS pandemic will end the population explosion, especially in Africa, where population growth is very high and poverty reigns. Africans make up 10 million of all 15 million HIV- infected persons worldwide. Yet, the proposition that AIDS will sole population explosion does not stand up to reason. About 200 million people in Africa will be HIV infected by 2010, but the loss of 200 million people would not slow population growth. The 14th century's Black Death killed more than 50% of the European population, but by 1750 Europe had reached the population size it would have reached without the Black Death. The 200 million people who died violent deaths between the start and end of the two World Wars did not stop world population growth from peaking in 1970 at about 2%." Trying to control AIDs in Africa diverts resources that could be far better used. Call me an idealist, but I won't accept slow and painful death as a means to limit population.

[hide=Poetry]The festival was over, the boys were all plannin' for a fall, The cabaret was quiet except for the drillin' in the wall. The curfew had been lifted and the gamblin' wheel shut down, Anyone with any sense had already left town. He was standin' in the doorway lookin' like the Jack of Hearts. He moved across the mirrored room, "Set it up for everyone," he said, Then everyone commenced to do what they were doin' before he turned their heads. Then he walked up to a stranger and he asked him with a grin, "Could you kindly tell me, friend, what time the show begins?" Then he moved into the corner, face down like the Jack of Hearts. Backstage the girls were playin' five-card stud by the stairs, Lily had two queens, she was hopin' for a third to match her pair. Outside the streets were fillin' up, the window was open wide, A gentle breeze was blowin', you could feel it from inside. Lily called another bet and drew up the Jack of Hearts. Big Jim was no one's fool, he owned the town's only diamond mine, He made his usual entrance lookin' so dandy and so fine. With his bodyguards and silver cane and every hair in place, He took whatever he wanted to and he laid it all to waste. But his bodyguards and silver cane were no match for the Jack of Hearts. Rosemary combed her hair and took a carriage into town, She slipped in through the side door lookin' like a queen without a crown. She fluttered her false eyelashes and whispered in his ear, "Sorry, darlin', that I'm late," but he didn't seem to hear. He was starin' into space over at the Jack of Hearts. "I know I've seen that face before," Big Jim was thinkin' to himself, "Maybe down in Mexico or a picture up on somebody's shelf." But then the crowd began to stamp their feet and the house lights did dim And in the darkness of the room there was only Jim and him, Starin' at the butterfly who just drew the Jack of Hearts. Lily was a princess, she was fair-skinned and precious as a child, She did whatever she had to do, she had that certain flash every time she smiled. She'd come away from a broken home, had lots of strange affairs With men in every walk of life which took her everywhere. But she'd never met anyone quite like the Jack of Hearts. The hangin' judge came in unnoticed and was being wined and dined, The drillin' in the wall kept up but no one seemed to pay it any mind. It was known all around that Lily had Jim's ring And nothing would ever come between Lily and the king. No, nothin' ever would except maybe the Jack of Hearts. Rosemary started drinkin' hard and seein' her reflection in the knife, She was tired of the attention, tired of playin' the role of Big Jim's wife. She had done a lot of bad things, even once tried suicide, Was lookin' to do just one good deed before she died. She was gazin' to the future, riding on the Jack of Hearts. Lily washed her face, took her dress off and buried it away. "Has your luck run out?" she laughed at him, "Well, I guess you must have known it would someday. Be careful not to touch the wall, there's a brand-new coat of paint, I'm glad to see you're still alive, you're lookin' like a saint." Down the hallway footsteps were comin' for the Jack of Hearts. The backstage manager was pacing all around by his chair. "There's something funny going on," he said, "I can just feel it in the air." He went to get the hangin' judge, but the hangin' judge was drunk, As the leading actor hurried by in the costume of a monk. There was no actor anywhere better than the Jack of Hearts. Lily's arms were locked around the man that she dearly loved to touch, She forgot all about the man she couldn't stand who hounded her so much. "I've missed you so," she said to him, and he felt she was sincere, But just beyond the door he felt jealousy and fear. Just another night in the life of the Jack of Hearts. No one knew the circumstance but they say that it happened pretty quick, The door to the dressing room burst open and a cold revolver clicked. And Big Jim was standin' there, ya couldn't say surprised, Rosemary right beside him, steady in her eyes. She was with Big Jim but she was leanin' to the Jack of Hearts. Two doors down the boys finally made it through the wall And cleaned out the bank safe, it's said that they got off with quite a haul. In the darkness by the riverbed they waited on the ground For one more member who had business back in town. But they couldn't go no further without the Jack of Hearts. The next day was hangin' day, the sky was overcast and black, Big Jim lay covered up, killed by a penknife in the back. And Rosemary on the gallows, she didn't even blink, The hangin' judge was sober, he hadn't had a drink. The only person on the scene missin' was the Jack of Hearts. The cabaret was empty now, a sign said, "Closed for repair," Lily had already taken all of the dye out of her hair. She was thinkin' 'bout her father, who she very rarely saw, Thinkin' 'bout Rosemary and thinkin' about the law. But, most of all she was thinkin' 'bout the Jack of Hearts.[/hide] Could well be Dylan at his best.

I like Satch, but I find that a lot of his music is filler. I went to see him live and he just played the cream of each album, which was good.

Please explain so this doesn't seem so disgusting. Are you joking?

Some sort of brain scan could be used to show proof of whether or not someone was enjoying cookies. Certain areas of the brain probably fire up when someone experiences displeasure.

I'm not the jealous type. It's not that I'm ridiculously confident, I'm just apathetic. I don't like women that much, and would much rather spend my time with men.

Generally my posts are in debate topics. If I was debating someone in person I wouldn't continue if they were slurring or incoherent. It might sound arrogant, but I demand more respect. The odd wrong word doesn't bother me, but I won't speak to someone who won't take the time to type out a proper sentence.

Kids/people need to be taught to love learning. If the school can do that, then the rest is up to the person. If you want to be a physicist, then you'll do it. If you want to be a joiner, then you'll do it. Cramming facts down throats is not useful.