Punitive_D

I read this thread for entertainment value, but I keep in mind that the posters driving this thread are players in the market. If someone seems to be pumping something (right now, it seems to be partyhats), I assume they're holding that item and riding the price up. I don't really have a problem with the drivers of this thread using this forum to try to profit by influencing the market -- it should be on the readers to maintain a healthy skepticism about what's posted here.

I'll still consult Tip.it before entering an unfamiliar area -- there's still lots of value-added to Tip.it's maps that Jagex never will provide (such as keys and the like).

Not sure what you mean by "camp" velds. They are extremely easy to slaughter. The strength xp is out of this world. As an additional benefit, you get a pile of green charms. Abyssal charms also are very easy to get. It's the way I play -- I never buy anything that I can make myself. I agree with you that buying the pouches would be "faster," but my game philosophy is different from that of high level grinders -- for me, the journey is the destination. I enjoy doing all of the many varied things in runescape. I don't enjoy grinding away at one thing and buying the supplies to let me do that. As it turns out, I get all of the greens that I need on task, BUT, I may craft a lot more runes in the future, and I would camp veld for charms as needed. No question. I already camp abby demons for the pure ess.

I always use abyssal familiars while runecrafting, and they tend to be pretty expensive on the ge.

Bloodveld are an excellent source of green charms.

You don't have to quit Runescape to regain motivation -- just stop no-lifing for a while. Take a couple of weeks and play only when you feel like it. When you do play, do only what you feel like doing. If you want to play castlewars all evening, do it. Eventually you'll get the itch to start training again. When you do, scratch it.

The few thousand with high slayer don't have "zip" -- they have the same thing everyone else has. Yes, I think it would be rational for Jagex to focus its resources on developing more high level ranged content than mage content if there are more high level range players than mage players. Btw, I know exactly what you mean -- you might notice that my slayer level is 86 -- once I could be assigned abby demons, I stopped focusing on slayer. But I also can see the sense in what Jagex is doing. Fwiw, even if you are right, I think Jagex should introduce a level 88 monster before a level 95. Due to the unattractiveness of the dark beast, the lack of incentive everyone is whining about kicks in at 86, not at 91. I suspect, though, that the high levels still would complain if Jagex did that because there would be too many competitors for the millions available from a new level 88 monster, which is what this is really all about.

Cause slayer is a [bleep] to train, and the highest req for a new monster is 90. ~7M exp of killing the same thing, over and over, gets old fast. This doesn't make sense. A new level 78 monster helps break up the monotony just as well as a level 95. The question is why there should be something that only a few thousand players can work on rather than many thousands. In the end, this decision probably is not driven by the desire to ideally develop the slayer skill. Jagex probably wants to add a new item and so needs a new slayer monster to make the unique drop. The quality of the item probably is driving the level of the monster. The last thing we would want is a crappy unique drop for a very high level monster -- that's what we got with the dark beat/dark bow. (Dark bow is not really "crappy," but not valuable enough, from what I'm told, considering the difficulty of dark beasts to kill.)

Don't know about the vams, but bear helmet has highest mage defense in the game -- higher than arma. Not according to Tip.It's item DB... I stand corrected -- Jagex changed this.

Better?

Sell and buy back later.

Don't know about the vams, but bear helmet has highest mage defense in the game -- higher than arma.

This little scenario may help some understand why what Jagex is doing is rational. This is not a true story -- it's just an illustration. Imagine that Jagex started the slayer skill with the idea of adding higher level monsters as players trained the skill up. Imagine that it was very hard to train, so that most players trained it slowly. Imagine further that there are 100 players. On day 1 everyone has one monster on which to train. Soon, Jagex adds another. Imagine that most players train at roughly the same speed. But there is one no-lifer who quickly gets to 99 slayer. So imagine with me that the overwhelming majority of players when the no-lifer reaches 99 have slayer levels around fifty or so. Imagine further that Jagex has by then added several slayer monsters from levels 3 through 60. Now they're thinking about another. Ninety-nine players want a monster a level 70. One player wants a monster at level 99. Would it be rational for Jagex to add the monster at 70? I think so, and most, I think, would agree. Now I know that the real situation is not exactly like my imagined scenario, but it's enough like it to make the point. If you can understand why it would be rational for Jagex to add the level 70 monster in my imagined scenario, then you should at least be able to understand why they have done what they have done with this new monster, even if you still don't like it. Honestly, the number of players with slayer levels above 90 is relatively tiny. It is a very exclusive club. Congratulations to those of you who belong. I am sure that it has paid off for you and will pay off again at some point down the road. But don't let your own narrow self-interest blind you to the greater good of the broader community. Jagex knows what it's doing because it has to make everyone happy. They're going to let that one guy hang out at 99 slayer with no new monster for a time while others slowly catch up. Slayer is a relatively new skill. The overwhelming majority of players don't burn through levels. Most play (like I do) a few hours here and there. Jagex is developing this skill for most players, not only for the hard core players. If we paid for runescape by the hour, I guarantee you things would be different -- Jagex would cater to you guys who play (and pay for) 50+ hours per week. But since we all pay the same, Jagex pays no more attention to you than it does to the rest of us paying customers, and there are a lot more of us. It's as simple as that.

You basically would have to play full time. Or just know how to play efficiently. I can get the xp to 80 in two weeks, and I don't even have to try that hard. Sure, I have my skills maxed, but it shouldn't take ages for those who have lower levels. That is, if you want to play efficiently. If you look at that guy's total stats, you do not get there in one year merely by "playing efficiently." You would have to play A LOT AND efficiently.

You basically would have to play full time.

High levels don't want anything to do with a level 78? Really? I'd be surprised if that were true. My preference for particular assignments is not tied to level. It takes into account xp rates, drops, and just how fun the things are to kill. Brine rats are a low level assignment, but I'd take them all the time if Duradel would give them to me. I know there's a lot more xp from 90 to 99 than there is from 75 to 80. Of course, the higher your level, the faster you burn through the xp. Having said that, I agree with you that it takes most people a lot longer to go from 90 to 99 than from 75 to 80. But I'm not sure which way that cuts. That just means that a level 95 monster will be even less relevant to the level 75 slayer.

Perhaps Jagex needs to boost the charm drop rate on these?

What would you think of a very nice rate of blue charm drops?

Believe it or not, in my opinion, we're actually making some progress here in mutual understanding. Let me point out one or two other things that you may or may not have thought of on this subject. First, as you yourself aptly noted before, Jagex has limited resources. They cannot do everything at one time. They have to choose what should come first, a level 78 creature or a level 95 creature. I suggested that they rationally chose 78 because (among other reasons) a lot more people play at this level. Your response seems to be that while a level 78 monster is good, mid-level players are not as desperate for something to do as extrememly high level players. I am inclined to agree with you there, but, again, that's only one variable in the calculus. Imagine Jagex's decisionmaking process this way: Which monster should we do first, level 78 or level 95? Well, we want to create the most player happiness for our expenditure of development resources. What will create more happiness? Well, those above 90 slayer are very bored because the only thing they have to look forward to is the cape. And the level 75-80 slayers also are a little bored because they're tired of gargoyles but have a way to go to nechs. If we assign an unhappiness measure to each group on a scale of 1-10, we would put the 90+'s at "9" and the 75-80's at "6." If that's all you looked at, you would conclude that the 95 monster should be done first. But the other element in their calculation is how many players are there at each level. And if there are ten in the 75-80 range for every one in the 90+ range, then the decision probably will come out against you even if the happiness gain per player clearly would be higher in the 90+ range. Second, and somebody already has alluded to something like this, adding a 90+ monster is a much higher risk proposition. Over time, the game "grows." By that I mean everyone gets higher levels. Everyone gets more money. Everyone gets better gear. Jagex has to gradually provide higher and higher gear to keep players like yourself looking forward to the next great thing. But they have to do that slowly. It would be very counter-productive for them to each month come out with something that makes what they did last month obsolete. No question, a 90+ slayer monster would have to drop "the next great thing." Jagex only wants to do that when they absolutely have to because the minute they do, they have diminished all of their other content. Right now, godswords and spirit shields are "the thing." I don't believe (and I'll get Jagex agrees with me) that the excitement of these has entirely worn off yet. We may be getting close on the godswords. Anyway, I think you can see my point -- Jagex has to go slow with high level additions to slayer. Finally, I think that you're understating how much high level content is added to the game. True, not much of it is specific to slayer, but there has been high level content added in the last couple of years. Off the top of my head, I would call WGS high level content. It was a bit of a long-term fail because the dragon plate was underpowered and too easy to get, but, still, jagex tried to add high level content there. I would call the CB high level content. I think that has been a dramatic success. (Btw, I think there's a lesson for Jagex here in the contrast between spirit shields and dragon plate -- when you add high level content, it must be really, really hard to get AND it must kick [wagon] when you get it. Spirit shields ftw, but dragon plate fail.)

First, I think you're wrong -- there are no unique slayer monsters between 75 and 80 slayer even though (you've apparently conceded) LOTS of players fall into this range (especially compared to those few who are 90+. Second, no incentive to train past 90? If you have 99 slayer, you are a GOD of Runescape. No incentive? Please. Third, you seem to forget that Runescape is a business. You pay for it, I pay for it, and every low leveled newb member pays for it. And we all pay (more or less) the same. Actually, old-timers like you actually pay a little less if you've maintained your membership. Jagex has an equal interest in keeping every player happy. There are a lot more middle level players then high level grinders. That means that there will be more mid-level updates (which everybody can play) than high level updates, which cater to only a few. If you're going to get your undies in a bundle over this fact of life, then you're going to be very uncomfortable, because it's not changing. I know that it can be frustrating for someone who plays the game a LOT to have done almost everything that there is to do in the game, but that's just the way it goes. To try to have a game that caters to everyone is very hard. Jagex does quite a good job. (Otherwise, you wouldn't still be playing after all these years.)

This is getting tiresome. With this creature, Jagex filled the gap between 75 and 80 slayer. You think that they should have filled the gap between 90 and 99 slayer. How many players are there between 75 and 80 slayer? How many between 90 and 99? If you can make your point using these numbers, then I'll have to concede it. If you can't make your point using these numbers, then you're just whining because Jagex met the needs of a greater number of others before it met yours.

Only if it uses multiple attack types like waterfiends. Otherwise, you can just wear mage protective gear as needed.

Makes sense. Mage is due since the highest mage slayer drop is the mystic top from gargoyles and kurasks. Maybe a mist battlestaff?

Well it certainly will have a special drop -- all monsters at this level do. Whether the level is too low or too high, it's hard to say. Slayer needs new monsters at every level. Ideally, I think that it should be like summoning -- you get a level, you get a new monster. Eventually, it probably will be like this. I agree that something new is needed for those precious few who have 90+, but I'll also bet that there are a lot more people between 75-80 than there are 90+. Also, we don't know how it's going to be released. If it's released as part of a quest, it wouldn't make sense to have a level 90+ slayer requirement on a quest. You can't have a quest that can be done by so few people -- it just isn't worth the resources. Frankly, the only way we'll get a 90+ slayer monster is when jagex wants to introduce a very rare new item into the game. Right now, godswords and spirit shields seem to have this need covered.

20