Thai_tong

To whoever said that talk on runecrafting is not important. It IS important that we talk about better way to runecraft because if rc is more than 72k/hr then lamps can be used on agility which means you don't max rc from slaying/assist. And if its better to use lamps on slayer well then...

Maybe this was the update to make slayer faster that drumgun was waiting for. Is it just miths that aren't cannonable atm? And well done xen your list seems to have a pretty good balance between summoning and slayer.

How fast is paying blood runners?

They are giving a good reward for earning respect from your dwarf homies yo. Maybe this smithing update wasn't useless

If you care about summoning as much as you do slayer then yes. I think xen's formula is better than mine until it comes to things that can't be converted into time, e.g. "fun". At least I can say that I contributed to his formula in giving him the idea of H/av H ^length Also xen did you make that summoning change I suggested? I am absolutely sure you should be using green charm xp rate not blue.

Lol that would ruin our slayer findings. Formulae would still work though :P Here's what I have found to be the best task list including frequencies [hide] Do tasks: black demons aberrant spectres bloodvelds waterfiend dark beasts steel dragon dagganoth black dragons iron dragon hellhound nechryael Skip: dust devils Mithril dragons suqath skeletal wyvern blue dragons terror dog gargoyles greater demon fire giants warped tortoise Living rocks Jungle strykewyrm kalphites Block ice strykewyrm abyssal demons aquanites Jad spiritual mage desert strykewyrms note the ice's are blocked not because they are a huge amount worse than dust devils but because they are assigned more frequently. This way you can block 7 ice's tasks and skip 2 dust devils instead of blocking 2 dust devil tasks and skipping ice tasks to keep more points for other skipping.[/hide] It would effect fire giants, waterfiends, gargoyles, dust devils, black demon (maybe), daggs (maybe, probably less crowded). I don't know if there are any dragons higher than bronze in there.

I repeated the calculations with my formula leaving frequency out until after. Task rankings [hide] black demons aberrant spectres bloodvelds waterfiend dark beasts steel dragon dagganoth black dragons iron dragon hellhound nechryael ice strykewyrm dust devils Mithril dragons suqath skeletal wyvern blue dragons abyssal demons aquanites terror dog gargoyles greater demon desert strykewyrms fire giants warped tortoise Living rocks Jungle strykewyrm kalphites Jad spiritual mage[/hide] Which looks better than last time. Last time the list was for best to be blocked, this is for best to be skipped.

Note: this does not mean that you should block the worst 5, I will have to take in to account frequency to find the best ones to block. Anomalies: The three tasks I find are in weird spots are; hellhounds seem too high, and waterfiends and wyverns seem too low. Question: are Jad and Mages the only tasks that don't drop effigies? WHAT?! Your fomula makes no sense and is invalid. What is H av? 1000? pi? How do you get H? summing together several random time figures gives you a meaningless figure. Why do you use indexes instead of just dividing or multiplying this part of the equation? Suqaths also seem too high up on your list but they were also higher up on my list than I had expected... Mages and Jad are the only tasks that dont drop effigies but the data for kalphites and terror dogs in zarfot's guide has 0 drops in about 2000 kills each

Flesh crawlers? I really don't know which water was talking about

What do f2p kill for melee and range?

Does anyone remember the old login where it said members was 25000 hours gameplay and non members was 5000. I should be members have 22000 hours and free play have 62023 hours. Moral of the story, free to play is better :P

Oh I forgot about rc lol. what's the xp rate of rc using body runners? or even air runners or making some tiaras idk much about tiara training. Prayer- bury bones while firemaking reduces time a bit and doesn't cost ftp anything more ;) Smithing- superheating iron when mining reduces it a bit and I think addy plates are more than that even without a yak. Magic- low alch during anything lol magic time is always 0 ok still a lot more than p2p lol

Does anyone think that someone in f2p will get all f2p 200m's? It would probably take less time than an extra 9 skills at a faster rate. El popo1 has 1bil xp with 200m range and cooking. I heard range is a difficult skill to train in f2p. Maybe there's a player with more xp who doesn't have 120 dung. link to hiscores http://services.runescape.com/m=hiscore/c=dHcssk2MKeM/hiscorepersonal.ws?user1=El%A0Popo1

Are you going to slow up at the end to let him catch up to get ranks next to each other? Maybe he will play vinesweeper :o

You guide still says pvp worlds and bh worlds and hotzones.

[hide=Copy-paste from my post on the update thread] You must use a normal hammer. Assuming ore prices remain on average similar to the past, adamant ceremonial swords are roughly 10gp/xp based on experience figures in the knowledge base. Hopefully either the experience figures I'm using are incorrect (i.e. this new thing about one-time bonuses can be gotten semi-frequently?), or the experience per hour is much higher than existing methods. If neither of these things are true, then it may still be more efficient to smith adamant platebodies with sacred clay hammers. Even if it isn't what we were hoping for, Jagex has clearly gone to a lot of effort with this, so it'd be a shame for it to turn into the next charm sprites. I have bad news. Even as a new training method, this area appears very deficient. I first taught myself how to quickly make ceremonial swords decently well using a bunch of iron ingots. I'm sure with more practice it's possible to get better, but not substantially so. I then used 20 adamant ingots to make adamant ceremonial swords. This took me half an hour, earned me 97,655 experience, and cost approximately 1.37M at average historical market prices (not current extra-high prices). This places the experience at around 200k xp/hr, and the cost at about 14 gp/xp. It turns out earlier figurse of 10 gp/xp were too optimistic, based upon achieving perfect swords every time, with no breakages. Straight-up smithing adamant platebodies, with no bonuses, gives about 250k xp/hr at about 12 gp/xp. Using sacred clay hammers and a scroll of efficiency, adamant platebodies would give the same experience as ceremonial swords, but at only 5.6 gp/xp. (Figures courtesy of Grimy's spreadsheets). So in other words, not only did this update fail to provide the smithing revamp everyone has been asking for, but it provides training which is inferior in every way to already-existing content. Unfortunately, you're looking at the new charm sprites :(. [/hide] I'm sure that the experts on this thread can manage more XP, and faster, than I did. However, I'd still be very surprised if it turns out better than previously-existing methods. Maybe there's some value to be salvaged from unexpectedly-good runite ceremonial swords? But I doubt it. [/hide]I haven't tried the update yet, only read the news article. I imagine you didn't count making adamant ingots (I think they are like bars and can't be bought from a dwarf) which means they are even lower than 200k :( Making adamant ingots is actually fairly instant. The machine just fills your inventory, it's not like smelting. Of course you also get no experience for making ingots. Do you get respect for making swords and can you spend respect on xp? I doubt this will increase xp much even if you can =/ I think they are the new charm sprites but even charms sprites were useful for skillers.

[hide=Copy-paste from my post on the update thread] You must use a normal hammer. Assuming ore prices remain on average similar to the past, adamant ceremonial swords are roughly 10gp/xp based on experience figures in the knowledge base. Hopefully either the experience figures I'm using are incorrect (i.e. this new thing about one-time bonuses can be gotten semi-frequently?), or the experience per hour is much higher than existing methods. If neither of these things are true, then it may still be more efficient to smith adamant platebodies with sacred clay hammers. Even if it isn't what we were hoping for, Jagex has clearly gone to a lot of effort with this, so it'd be a shame for it to turn into the next charm sprites. I have bad news. Even as a new training method, this area appears very deficient. I first taught myself how to quickly make ceremonial swords decently well using a bunch of iron ingots. I'm sure with more practice it's possible to get better, but not substantially so. I then used 20 adamant ingots to make adamant ceremonial swords. This took me half an hour, earned me 97,655 experience, and cost approximately 1.37M at average historical market prices (not current extra-high prices). This places the experience at around 200k xp/hr, and the cost at about 14 gp/xp. It turns out earlier figurse of 10 gp/xp were too optimistic, based upon achieving perfect swords every time, with no breakages. Straight-up smithing adamant platebodies, with no bonuses, gives about 250k xp/hr at about 12 gp/xp. Using sacred clay hammers and a scroll of efficiency, adamant platebodies would give the same experience as ceremonial swords, but at only 5.6 gp/xp. (Figures courtesy of Grimy's spreadsheets). So in other words, not only did this update fail to provide the smithing revamp everyone has been asking for, but it provides training which is inferior in every way to already-existing content. Unfortunately, you're looking at the new charm sprites :(. [/hide] I'm sure that the experts on this thread can manage more XP, and faster, than I did. However, I'd still be very surprised if it turns out better than previously-existing methods. Maybe there's some value to be salvaged from unexpectedly-good runite ceremonial swords? But I doubt it. I haven't tried the update yet, only read the news article. I imagine you didn't count making adamant ingots (I think they are like bars and can't be bought from a dwarf) which means they are even lower than 200k/hr :(

Wow you read 269 pages? New smithing rates pls. I hear its very expensive.

I took zarfot's xp/hr and divided by xp/kill so if you have a problem talk to him.

For charms I suggest getting the time saved by using the charms instead of green charms. So 1 crimson is equivilent to 435.2/154.4= 2.819 green charms. Using 1 crimson instead of 2.819 greens means you have to create 1.819 fewer pouches and the time saved would be 1.819/3500 hours. You could use the time saved instead of gold charms if you think the best task list wont get enough blue/crim/green charms to get 200m summoning. When you get the results for that list will you do something like B/ average B ^ freq* length? Kills/hr list [hide] aberrant spectres 700 abyssal demons 290.3 aquanites 289.5 black demons 279.1 black dragons 176.2 bloodvelds 427.8 blue dragons 334.6 dagganoth 842.1 dark beasts 222.2 desert strykewyrms 283.3 dust devils 428.6 fire giants 369.4 gargoyles 323.8 greater demon 344.8 hellhound 525.9 ice strykewyrm 160 iron dragon 190.5 Jungle strykewyrm 290.9 kalphites 411.1 Living rocks 184.8 Mithril dragons 87.9 nechryael 361.9 skeletal wyvern 152.4 spiritual mage 305.9 steel dragon 136.1 suqath 556.6 terror dog 426.0 Jad doesn't work with this task warped tortoise 443.2 waterfiend 289.1[/hide]

I'm glad you put some thought about frequency and length into your list even if you didn't use a formula.

The best skip/block list for counting slayer only (+lamps on slayer) would be Block spiritual mage desert strykewyrms warped tortoise Mithril dragons nechryael Aquanites (not unlocked) Skip dust devils iron dragon steel dragon terror dog blue dragons aquanites fire giants abyssal demons Jungle strykewyrm gargoyles waterfiend greater demon skeletal wyvern kalphites If you unlocked aquanites then skip aquanites and spend any extra points on skipping most dust devils At 28.8 points per task this setup would give you a gain of 283.2 points every 102 tasks which is just short of being enough to skip all jad tasks, you can skip 4/5 of the tasks (note that skipping the task reduces points gained by 28.8 and increases points spent by 30 meaning you need 58.8 spare points to skip a task) I have not had time to see if this gives 75k/hr.

^Lol There you go, said by the most mathematically minded man here :P Good luck i hope your method works out for you. O I thought the original equation was equal to (B/maxB) not just B since the rates were individually averaged in the original equation. Also @ Thai thanks for spending to time to make the equations for it, so for an optimal slayer xp list using effigies on slayer (for fastest possible slayer xp in the game) would the coefficients for slayer summ and effigies be 1, 0, 1 respectively or what For purely slayer you would have to adjust the slayer xp rate to include lamps. I don't think 1, 0, 1 would work because you are valuing the skills xp from opening effigies. I guess you are still interested in Elias' task list for the 75k/hr? I'm not going to start saying whats wrong with Quyneax's formula because I'm getting tired of this...

I hope spending the last 150 minutes explaining it was of some use. My formula works on comparing the perks of tasks, you formula works on turning everything into time. Hey at least I levelled woodcutting at ivy since I couldn't do anything less afk while answering your tedious questions

I disagree