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A little bit, I guess. To be called arrogant is like being slapped in the face and told that trying to understand things is pointless, just accept what is. When you are someone like me, who probably spends 40%-50% of their time humbly serving others, being told that you have unwarranted pride is unfathomably offensive. When you are someone like me, who probably spends 20%-30% of their time reflecting on their experiences and the way other people act and the way the world works, being told that you are presumptuous, to an extreme, is mind-boggling. I freely admit I am condescending. I know that I am domineering...but arrogance...arrogance is a weapon of a word, wielded at those who strive to help others when the help is resented or denied. For me, someone who waits to be asked their opinion or advice as oppose to proclaim the answer for all to hear, it just is a slap in the face....I really don't know how else to put it. Oh, and your point... We have already agreed that my views are different from yours. For me one small stone in the river of lava is one small stone too many. I guess I thought you would understand. I apologise for my arrogance.

Its hardly petty when you make a defacto statement...Merely expediant as it has already been shown that it is not true...

Cutting out the bit where you explain why it is still okay is extranous. 'One right is slightly damaged' 'No rights are damaged' They contradict each other, no matter what arguement you give to justify the damage. Yeah we have come down to personal lines. We both strongly believe in the cause we are fight for and, while I maintain an objective distance, you are emotionally involved. So I am more insensitve about things than you are... Its not a bad thing but you take the points to heart where as I take them in my stride.

Can I just point out I am ignorant and actually wanted to know what was going on...I am not critising, I am trying to get involved.... What does a coder averagely do? And when they have done whatever it is they do(Coding by the looks of it :rolleyes: ) What do they do with what they have done? Or is it an end in itself? Do people look at other people's code and go 'Well it started good but I think your mentioning of DOS was completely wrong, and really once you started using brackets the whole code just fell apart'? Which is what 'Story like' conjures up. Or do you code a program which you then run and go 'Yeah, I now can work out how long to dip my teabag for the perfect cuppa!' Maybe I came off a bit strong, I just happen to be of the generation...and community...where programming means copyright infringement and hacking so sorry about about, I am just trying to look like I have a vague idea, as by my other two examples you can see it just sounds silly when I talk about it.

Umbra- Cado? Means fallen in Latin Or Cador A Cornish Duke feared by the Romans Or Cadorius The name the Romans gave to said Duke Its also fairly easy to remember. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FKF49XtawU8

Well I just don't really get programming so I was wondering what exactly you would be doing in the forum. To me, and it is a complete prejudice, it seems to indicate some sort of hacking. Though I know that probably isn't what is meant I am wondering what else there is which would be discussed or posted. I guess I am just asking 'What are you going to do with the forum?'

You did say it was nonsence...which kind of implies you don't get it. Up until then I thought you simply differed in your view point...Which would kind of point to you not understanding (Its great isn't it) @ Meol: I am not arguing against gay marriage... This thread is about New Jersey banning gay marriage. Romy thinks(or seems to think) that the moral minority should bypass the voting process and just force gay rights. So my argument is that if the majority says 'no' then fair enough, it is not the right time. Then we went off on alot of tangents trying to explain why I thought one thing and she thought another. As for the CofE(Church of England) progress is going much more smoothly than you seem to imply. While it is true that currently we don't allow gay people to marry it could quite simply be that gay people with a British background are not that bothered about getting married. I am not, probably 90% of my gay friends are not...And probably about 90% of my straight friends are not that bothered about getting married either... "Find someone, move intogether, have a couple of kids and then some grandkids" seems to be the general gist of people's wants from life, in Britian(or at least the 12-21 and 30-60 brackets I seem to interact with). Its just not, seemingly, a driving force in British Culture. Course, a slightly sexist point, women seem more bothered about marriage than men. In my experiance British Males just see a marriage as a lot of effort with no reward, British Females see marriage as a life goal. (Though I disagree with the notion that it is possible to be sexist, we embrace differences in sex, we don't ignore them...)

I had been wondering. Girls seem to have a much higher tendancy to call me arrogant. Guys are more likely to say they don't get it.

Oh, reminder that Ross is GMing tonight, just in case anyone was worried. Oh... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSdqLvMA9IE&feature=PlayList&p=DE530A1E6239F416&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=2 Yesterdays's session is offically finished

Possibly. Or we just happened to agree on things he said but not on the things that I said. :roll:

It seems probable 03 January 2010 - 17:51 PM 19 January 2010 - 18:02 PM 16 days and 11 minutes. 1927 posts. Or 23051 minutes. Or 1 post every 11.9 minutes. Posts per Minute .07686439643598190000 Hegemony .34393301809032100000 Dungeon .01305939314717570000 Banned .00810109980025510000 Listening .01497367505003920000 First to 500 .00654783502660861000 How famous .01250000000000000000 Today

Might sound a bit silly...but what would you actually be doing there? VCR Programming is one thread and unless you plan to use open source stuff(Or self written) there is all kind of legal stuff to worry about. (A life time...well 10-11 years....of using Windows has pretty much stunted my programming know-how so...)

We are almost a 3rd of the way there. http://forum.tip.it/topic/29062-the-youre-banned-game-over-22000-banned/ Almost half way to the top three http://forum.tip.it/topic/38120-what-are-you-listening-to-right-now/ http://forum.tip.it/topic/185149-count-to-500-before-a-mod-posts-fifth-round/ Next week http://forum.tip.it/topic/38927-how-famous-are-you-on-tipit-over-10k-posts/ And we are only a few days(at current growth) behind http://forum.tip.it/topic/195466-today/

Well it is more a structural point than anything else...You start strong but you just can't keep the tension up...as a rule when you start reading 'Magic is defined into' you are losing interest left right and center, especially if there has just been a massive combat scene. I would recommend changing the beginning from this massive war, essentially the climax of story, to something a bit less dramatic...simply because you can then increase the tension, as opposed to hitting the peak and then bottoming out with description while you build up to the next scene. I am in my exam weeks so I have not read the whole thing(to be honest I have been using it to put off my revision :thumbdown: )

Sol is not about to go nova.

Hehe, you are a special case Retech :grin:

People to stop calling me arrogant when they don't understand...or even try to understand...where I am coming from.

Sigh. I agree. You don't seem to be getting my points and, while I accept some of your points, most of them have flaws that I can see and you seemingly can't...or seem to think they are added bonuses, not flaws. Shame about the arrogance part, it has actually made me want to write something, but I am not sure what... On the one hand I don't see myself as arrogant, I see myself as confident. On the other I can understand that you don't understand why I am confident and thus come to the conclusion that I am arrogant because I have 'unwarrented' confidence in my abilities. Whereas I understand why you are confident, because I understand your points and so don't see you as arrogant. Which I guess you will take as proof you are not arrogant, but consider that I have agreed with you more times than you have agreed with me, so which one of us is more prideful in our abilities... Anyway, I enjoyed some of it and I have gained much(and it has definately changed my mind, though probably not the changes you wanted =P) so thank you for debating with me.

I agree. I see the objective truth and you see a subjective truth. Even so someone may decide something is morally right at the time, as many Nazis did, but reneg later on. It sort of depends on if you can trust the person to tell the truth when they are under the emotional duress of being unable to change the past. We have no idea what the repercussions of doing something as drastic as enforcing a new law on 300 million people. It may go well or it may not go well. Further removing Stalin and then someone else and so on and so forth, until we get a good timeline, could take hundreds of years....We couldn't just go back remove Hitler and then come back, realise Stalin did something and go back and then get rid of him...We would have to get a text book or something and find out what went wrong and each change we made would take time further and further away from our perspective....It could be that by removing Hitler the British Empire never crumbled and the USA remained in economic decline until the 1960s when finally it went bust and 140 million people died of starvation. In that timeline there is no 'one person' to remove. In our 'executive power' machine we would do something and then have to wait maybe 5 years before we saw all the repercussions, and then we make another change and another 5 years pass...and this keeps happening, with matters getting more an more distorted until eventually we have lost sight of our goal. I mean look at this debate, we have gone off on loads of tangents and it has only been a few days...We would be correcting the injustices of the injustices of the injustices and would probably be recreating the same injustices we originally set out to avoid. Chaos theory...a small change at the start can lead to massive changes further down the line. Actually I just see people resenting homosexuality...its not that big a deal in the grand scheme of things...But if you had the chance to stop one death in world war two then you would take it. Why? You have not seen the results I have seen. Within the space of only a couple of years I have have changed maybe 200 people's minds. Within the space of 50 years homosexuality has gone from evil to tolerated... The path is slow and ardous, but it is not like we are not moving. Hehe, I have this image of you hitting it with a hammer and having it spring back to smack you in the face. Anyway. Injustice is not standing straight. Injustice is at some degree and is constantly moving between the degrees depending on societies needs. It is a social injustice that people starve while other people waste food, but it would also be an injustice to take the food from those who have enough merely because they have enough...If people have worked for their food then they should have it. Injustice will Always fight back and you just have to hope that the people around you will be on your side and that together you can overwhelm the injustices. Sigh. We could eliminate injustice by exterminating all the gay people too. That has a fairly low cost...Say 15% of the population, thats 1,050,000,000... Which seems like alot, but really thats only the privately owned firepower of the USA...200 million guns, assuming they are all handguns with 9 bullet clips that is 1,800,000,000 bullets. So really the cost is very low indeed, there is actually no government outlay at all. Further think of the food and housing and healthcare and all of the other things you could save...and, as we all know, gay people are hairdressers and fashion designers, so we are not making any loss in revenues. Hell you might even make a net gain. Another reasoned(full of holes) and logical(With false premises) argument... Just to prove how very easy it is to make one when your views are subjective. Even by your own tongue you do not accept that no rights are damaged. You are just doing what the people you proclaim to be stopping are doing...Ignoring the inconvinent facts in the hopes that people will blindly follow your utopian view of the world, down the road to injustice.

"Hello, this is your Moderator speaking. There is absolutely no cause for alarm." "The Urk-Orz are not planning to invade" "Please make no efforts to increase alertness. There is no reason to." "Thank you."

This is such a pointless debate. Kelp has already been supered up and barely covered the Empire's needs after you lost 2 planets and Japan. This is why Hegemony goes wrong, it just wears you down...people constantly insisting that 'No' last time when they said uber they meant normal....This time is the uber version....Until next time.

See sense... He did something. He consciencly did something. He did something which he deemed to be right. If he did not deem it to be right then he could not have done it. This is a FACT. Maybe he was influenced by his body but he made the choice to rape this person. No one else made the choice. He made the choice and he deemed it to be right for him to do it. ...I deem it wrong to rape someone and lo I don't rape someone. I deem it right to have sex with a guy, if we both want to, and lo I do it. Its a very simple concept...Right and Wrong. I just take responsiblity for my actions as opposed to make excuses. ...If we accept your view then clearly it is wrong for us to punish him because he had no choice over the incident. He was an innocent bystander. Or you go back in time, kill Hitler and Stalin invades Europe and over 50 million people die in the ensuing combat, followed by billions more in the eventual nuclear holocaust as nuclear weapons are discovered. You don't cancel the injustice, you dwarf it. Your reasoning is flawed because you have't thought out the implications. All you have done is make a defacto statement 'I think Hitler is bad. Therefore killing Hitler is good.' and it's statements like that that really screw the world up because they forgo substative logical and pschyological process and instead rely on animal like instinct. I agree...There is a chance that things will turn out for the best. But its a gamble...and, like a vegas slot machine, the odds are stacked against you achieving the grand prize. I believe it is better to take five generations of hard work and get the bounty at the end of that, than to make one heap of all our winnings and bet it on one turn of pitch and toss. Its used to describe, not to explain....

Retech we already worked out that, even going full tilt, your planets are not all self-sustaining.

Mather you died...repeatedly...remember And Mather...Its not a scam to die and have the battlefield looted while you are dead. Anyway, I am off. The stats stand. Ross, its up to you if you really want to change things then do, but it is accurate.

Hey, I don't plan to be on- gonna catch up on my sleep :thumbsup: (Seriously 10 hours in 84 is not fun.) Anyway I have updated the front page. If Igos is on he can control my character, if he isn't then he will just stay in Ikana doing some farming, going out with Mueller and training solarmancy. I will probably stay in Ikana anyway but just so I get XP either way.