cut the crap and remove pricing limits

[being_true]

in the mortal words of carlos mencia... DE DE DE!

 

 

 

you obviously have no clue why they actually help if there was no limit then there would be even more price manipulation then there is now not to mention the fact "inferior theory" doesnt work alot of the time

 

 

 

take the dfs vs. rune defender

 

 

 

rune defender is almost free with a little work and dfs is 20 mil give or take i dont really vare for real price also goes for barrows vs bandos/armandyl

 

 

 

not to mention the trade limit might as well not be there if there are no caps since you could just use ge to sell or buy for any price you wanted as long as someone else is selling or buying for that price

[quelmotz]

Even better, get rid of the +/- 10% caps on Grand Exchange trades.

 

 

 

RWT. :roll:

 

 

 

Undoing all the hard work Jagex has put in to stop RWT with such an update?

 

 

 

[]

 

 

 

Because you could so easily put a Party hat in GE for 1gp and have nobody but your customer get it?

 

 

 

Oh no, wait, you couldn't.

 

 

 

Without the cap, you could put an item that nobody trades for 500mil and the other RWTer would buy it. Why people are always assming you can only RWT with phats and rares?

 

 

 

:thumbup: +1

 

 

 

That was just what I was going to reply.

[Ravenkana]

Even better, get rid of the +/- 10% caps on Grand Exchange trades.

 

 

 

RWT. :roll:

 

 

 

Undoing all the hard work Jagex has put in to stop RWT with such an update?

 

 

 

[]

 

 

 

Because you could so easily put a Party hat in GE for 1gp and have nobody but your customer get it?

 

 

 

Oh no, wait, you couldn't.

 

 

 

Without the cap, you could put an item that nobody trades for 500mil and the other RWTer would buy it. Why people are always assming you can only RWT with phats and rares?

 

 

 

:thumbup: +1

 

 

 

That was just what I was going to reply.

You see it on WoW's AH all the time. Solution? Either implement less strenuous caps based on high alch price, like, for example, if an item alchs for less than a hundred, the most you can put it up for is ten thousand, with the exception of rares. Or you could have a program that checks the G.E. for unusually high offers along the guidelines above, flag them, and send a mod to check it out. See? Two solutions to RWT right there that allow Jagex to actually tell the truth that players control the market as well as obliterating merchant clans.

[Karvinen]

Even better, get rid of the +/- 10% caps on Grand Exchange trades.

 

 

 

RWT. :roll:

 

 

 

Undoing all the hard work Jagex has put in to stop RWT with such an update?

 

 

 

[]

 

 

 

Because you could so easily put a Party hat in GE for 1gp and have nobody but your customer get it?

 

 

 

Oh no, wait, you couldn't.

 

 

 

Without the cap, you could put an item that nobody trades for 500mil and the other RWTer would buy it. Why people are always assming you can only RWT with phats and rares?

 

 

 

:thumbup: +1

 

 

 

That was just what I was going to reply.

 

 

 

-1111111111111111111111111111

 

 

 

The GE system already blocks items with too small amount of available offers, which is why you sometimes see GE as "broken". You're buying (item). You see someone saying "selling (item)". Yet, your offer doesn't complete. That's because you are the only ones trading that item.

 

 

 

If real world trading with items that nobody trades was possible, the current 5% limit would be more than enough for doing it.

 

 

 

Instead, the price limit system creates false prices, which makes RWT possible. If an item is worth 1m at GE and the true value is 50 millions...

[quelmotz]

Even better, get rid of the +/- 10% caps on Grand Exchange trades.

 

 

 

RWT. :roll:

 

 

 

Undoing all the hard work Jagex has put in to stop RWT with such an update?

 

 

 

[]

 

 

 

Because you could so easily put a Party hat in GE for 1gp and have nobody but your customer get it?

 

 

 

Oh no, wait, you couldn't.

 

 

 

Without the cap, you could put an item that nobody trades for 500mil and the other RWTer would buy it. Why people are always assming you can only RWT with phats and rares?

 

 

 

:thumbup: +1

 

 

 

That was just what I was going to reply.

 

 

 

-1111111111111111111111111111

 

 

 

The GE system already blocks items with too small amount of available offers, which is why you sometimes see GE as "broken". You're buying (item). You see someone saying "selling (item)". Yet, your offer doesn't complete. That's because you are the only ones trading that item.

 

 

 

If real world trading with items that nobody trades was possible, the current 5% limit would be more than enough for doing it.

 

 

 

Instead, the price limit system creates false prices, which makes RWT possible. If an item is worth 1m at GE and the true value is 50 millions...

 

 

 

How the [bleep] does an item get to value 1million in the GE in the first place when its value is 50 million? It'll take years.

[3hitm4g3u]

Even better, get rid of the +/- 10% caps on Grand Exchange trades.

 

 

 

RWT. :roll:

 

 

 

Undoing all the hard work Jagex has put in to stop RWT with such an update?

 

 

 

[]

 

 

 

Because you could so easily put a Party hat in GE for 1gp and have nobody but your customer get it?

 

 

 

Oh no, wait, you couldn't.

 

 

 

Without the cap, you could put an item that nobody trades for 500mil and the other RWTer would buy it. Why people are always assming you can only RWT with phats and rares?

 

 

 

:thumbup: +1

 

 

 

That was just what I was going to reply.

 

 

 

-1111111111111111111111111111

 

 

 

The GE system already blocks items with too small amount of available offers, which is why you sometimes see GE as "broken". You're buying (item). You see someone saying "selling (item)". Yet, your offer doesn't complete. That's because you are the only ones trading that item.

 

 

 

If real world trading with items that nobody trades was possible, the current 5% limit would be more than enough for doing it.

 

 

 

Instead, the price limit system creates false prices, which makes RWT possible. If an item is worth 1m at GE and the true value is 50 millions...

 

 

 

How the [bleep] does an item get to value 1million in the GE in the first place when its value is 50 million? It'll take years.

 

 

 

Have you heard of a little thing called junk trading?

 

 

 

That's what occurs when situations like that happen. Just look at the discontinued items for an example.

[quelmotz]

Those were before the GE...

[Sir_Kurity]

Junk trading fails.

 

 

 

I have loads of junk, but if i wasn't making that junk i probably would have got the same if not more in cold hard cash playing GOP than i would making crappy unstrung bows.

[nerdboyxxx]

Caps are annoying. In some ways they are advantageous, in most ways they just spit in the eye of legitimate trading. I say get rid of them. Or make them a LOT more flexible than they are now.

[quelmotz]

Caps are annoying. In some ways they are advantageous, in most ways they just spit in the eye of legitimate trading. I say get rid of them. Or make them a LOT more flexible than they are now.

 

 

 

I don't agree. Less strict caps, e.g. 10% (or maybe up to 20% for items with prices below 100gp, e.g. fire rune, etc) would do the job as well, AND prevent (or at least limit) price manipulation.

[sees_all1]

I think the discussion on this rant may have fallen away from what I originally ranted about.

 

I don't have a problem with +/- 5% system currently in place, where the price of items are flexible (rereading my OP I realize I may not have been clear enough on this).

 

 

 

I do, however have a problem with the rigid caps set by Jagex, where an object absolutely cannot go above.

 

My example with death runes still holds true, about 10 days out. Death runes currently cost 305 gp each. There is a rigid price cap of 306, the absolute maximum offer you can put up in the GE is 306 gp per death rune.

 

If price caps were removed, the maximum offer you could *currently* put up should be around 321.

 

 

 

Without price limits (caps, not +/- 5%), items could rise or fall to whatever the market demands.

 

This might make price manipulation easier, but it wouldn't make RWT easier than it is now (and in fact would stop junk trading, which could be a means to RWT).

[langer]

I don't understand what is the big deal though...

 

 

 

Runes are buyable at 1 gp over the G.E. cap in stores instantly. I mean unless you are buying 1 mil+ runes, this would not be a huge investment for an instant buy.

 

 

 

What they could do is add a feature that tells you the shop price so you know when it's time to go to the store instead.

 

 

 

As for the alchables, this is to prevent people from scamming noobs by buying alchables way under the alch price and make a profit through hi alch. This is also to prevent RWT, someone smithing things to sell them to a RWTer that would eventually hi alch it for a profit.

[sees_all1]

An item will never get more than 250 below its high alch value. If it does, people will notice, and alch it.

 

 

 

Using this to RWT isn't a reliable method - first there needs to be an item significantly lower than its high alch price (which would be a very rare occurance). Then, one account would have to trade the other account literally tens/hundreds of thousands of this item (oh, and to do that there has to be GP on the other side to make the trade possible). Finally the other side needs to alch ALL of the items...

 

 

 

 

 

Back to the runes example - I don't think the prices in the runes shop were fixed. If it is, it must have been a recent update (within the past year) that I missed. I thought it was based on how many runes you've bought from the store in the past, recently, and a few other variables.

[langer]

An tiem currently cannot be under 300 gp of its alching price, not 250. Trust me I bought countless dragon meds at 59700 GP.

 

 

 

It would not be a very reliable way to RWT, but with over 100 alchable items over 1k, it would be pretty easy to spot one for a quick trade. I know it would not be as fast as before the trade limits, but RWTers would probably do it.

[Karvinen]

 

As for the alchables, this is to prevent people from scamming noobs by buying alchables way under the alch price and make a profit through hi alch. This is also to prevent RWT, someone smithing things to sell them to a RWTer that would eventually hi alch it for a profit.

 

 

 

If the law of supply and demand makes the price go below alch price, it should be allowed to go below the alch price. Otherwise, the result is the item becoming completely unsellable.

[langer]

 

As for the alchables, this is to prevent people from scamming noobs by buying alchables way under the alch price and make a profit through hi alch. This is also to prevent RWT, someone smithing things to sell them to a RWTer that would eventually hi alch it for a profit.

 

 

 

If the law of supply and demand makes the price go below alch price, it should be allowed to go below the alch price. Otherwise, the result is the item becoming completely unsellable.

 

 

 

And how do your prevent RWT then if you can sell drag med for 40K to someone who will alch them for 60K?

[sees_all1]

An tiem currently cannot be under 300 gp of its alching price, not 250. Trust me I bought countless dragon meds at 59700 GP.

 

 

 

It would not be a very reliable way to RWT, but with over 100 alchable items over 1k, it would be pretty easy to spot one for a quick trade. I know it would not be as fast as before the trade limits, but RWTers would probably do it.

 

 

 

I think it would be as fast as every 15 minutes, giving someone 10k.

 

Only thing I could see happening is items crashing so hard that there aren't enough nature runes to alch them, and then nature runes skyrocketing in price, causing more instability. It may seem a little far-fetched, but nature runes could get to 500+ gp each.

[Guest]

I saw people who have already posted this but I'm saying it again.

 

 

 

They have a trade cap to prevent merchants and merch clans from being able to control the prices of everything. You complain about the cap because you want to sell death runes for more than 306, but you would be complaining if they removed it once death runes hit 1 k ea because of merch clans buying up all the supply and charging rediculous prices for it. Yes its annoying if you want to make more money, but its much better than the alternative.

 

 

 

Bottom line, the majority of players are not merch's and benefit from the trade cap. As business your goal is to please the majority, not the minority.

 

 

 

I never said in this thread that I wanted to merchant Death Runes, I posted because I was frustrated that my buy offer wasn't going through, until I realized they had hit the cap.

 

BTW - death runes are sold in rune shops for 310, so even if Jagex did remove the cap, there would be another "natural" block.

 

The majority of players do not benefit from trade caps when they want to purchase an item that has hit the ceiling, or sell an item that has hit the floor. How many times have you wanted to sell a adamant med helm, only to find that you can't?

 

Another thing players have noted - there is inflation in runescape. If this is true, and price limits are not removed, prices may naturally expand before Jagex can remove limits, making trade impossible.

 

 

 

If all price limits were removed in the game, then yes, certain items may become targets of price manipulators, but that is a separate problem in an of itself. If you removed all trade from the game, then price manipulation wouldn't go on anymore, but that isn't really doesn't solve anything, does it?

 

Keeping price limits in the game bottle necks trade, and is not a good solution to price manipulation.

 

 

 

I never said you wanted to merch death runes either, the trade cap is to prevent merchs from being able to control the prices on them. If you want to purchase an item that has hit the cap you either have to wait for your offer to fill up or go buy from the shop for 4 gp more per rune. And I've never wanted to sell an addy medium helm, the price has hit the floor because there is no demand for them, just high alch it and get money that way. As far as inflation, inflation only occurs in markets where the currency is based on gold (or another commodity used to back it up). For instance in the US every dollar is supposed to be backed up by 1 dollar worth of gold. This used to be the case, however now each dollar is not backed up by a dollars worth of gold and therefore is worth less.

 

 

 

In other words, if you have 1 dollars worth of gold and print off two dollar bills each dollar is only worth 50 cents. So inflation is not the right word to describe the RS economy where each gp is backed up by itself and holds value regardless of how many there are. There is an issue of money being created in vast quantities, but I am unaware of the word that describes that.

 

 

 

To your comment about removing trade fixing price manipulation, that is a silly point that doesn't contribute to the conversation at all. The only problem we're dealing with here is limiting the ability of merch's to manipulate prices anyway that they want to. The price cap fixes that. If the cap were removed and the price of deaths went to 1 k then everyone would go to the shop (as you said) and get them for 310 anyways. So either be patient and wait for your orders to fill up or go buy them for 310 each.

 

 

 

Excellent post. Really does answer the points.

[Rockneo1]

Jagex is working on letting up the cap a little bit but not full on gone because then the autoers will come back.

[Karvinen]

 

As for the alchables, this is to prevent people from scamming noobs by buying alchables way under the alch price and make a profit through hi alch. This is also to prevent RWT, someone smithing things to sell them to a RWTer that would eventually hi alch it for a profit.

 

 

 

If the law of supply and demand makes the price go below alch price, it should be allowed to go below the alch price. Otherwise, the result is the item becoming completely unsellable.

 

 

 

And how do your prevent RWT then if you can sell drag med for 40K to someone who will alch them for 60K?

It's earned profit then, and doesn't have anything to do with RWT. Usually supply and demand won't allow this to happen, as the demand would skyrocket until the price reaches the alch value.

[3hitm4g3u]

 

As for the alchables, this is to prevent people from scamming noobs by buying alchables way under the alch price and make a profit through hi alch. This is also to prevent RWT, someone smithing things to sell them to a RWTer that would eventually hi alch it for a profit.

 

 

 

If the law of supply and demand makes the price go below alch price, it should be allowed to go below the alch price. Otherwise, the result is the item becoming completely unsellable.

 

 

 

And how do your prevent RWT then if you can sell drag med for 40K to someone who will alch them for 60K?

 

 

 

First you'd have to keep it a complete secret, which would be next to impossible.

 

 

 

Then you'd have to buy alot of them to be worth RWT, which would drive the price up as multiple RWT companies and people just wanted to raise magic would be buying tons on max, making Dragon Meds practically unattainable until they NATURALLY go back to being more than their high alch price. Caps are a ridiculous implement.