Ubuntu

[Zibl]

Friend of mine got started talking to other day about Ubuntu. I'd heard of it before, and knew it was an operating system, but that's about it. He was telling me all about it, but I don't know anything except Windows (yeah I know -- I R NEWB <_< ). He did mention that "one of the main differences is that you have to open everything through like a DOS command prompt. You don't just double click a desktop icon", or something along those lines... which sounds annoying to me to be honest :lol: ; but perhaps I misunderstood him.

 

The POINT of this topic is this: can anyone give me some brief (or long, your choice) descriptions of exactly what good/bad differences there are between Ubuntu and Windows? I've heard for years around these forums that Windows is a terrible operating system, but I've never really paid attention to it much because I didn't know anything about another op system.

 

Any help (especially if some kind Tip.iter left some helpful instructions) is greatly appreciated.

[ElkNight]

Here is a good place to start for comparisons.

[Zibl]

I actually did a Google search believe it or not :mellow: . I skimmed over this article : http://www.informationweek.com/news/software/operatingsystems/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=199201179&pgno=1&queryText=&isPrev= (which coincidentally was the #1 result in your Google search) but didn't really find out much. Don't get me wrong: it's a good comparison article and all, but it was done not only in 2007, but on stuff I don't really know much about.

 

I suppose I should just stick with Windows. I'm normally fiddling with Limewire, Firefox, and Vuze (bittorrents) and I'm not sure an entire operating system is really worth the time and effort of downloading/installing if it isn't gonna do any good. Considering I don't ever do anything crazy with my computer.

[RSBDavid]

Hello I am a Linux newbie myself. It took me maybe a week to get to know Linux and I believe it is better then Windows if you are a software developer at least.

 

Here is an example of why Linux is better then windows in one sense.

 

Installing certain softwares.

 

Lets say I wanted to install something like MSN Messenger.

 

Windows method:

Open up web browser > navigate through web pages to find the MSN Messenger installer > download the package > install the package.

 

Ubuntu Linux method:

Open up terminal > enter "Sudo apt-get install MSNMessenger" (don;t know if that is exact but you get the point)>Enter administrative password > wait for it to download and install.

 

You can also use the sofware center or package manager.

 

Linux also offers support for more drivers. Windows 7 did not support my audio card, Ubuntu 9.10 did.

 

Also, you can press "CTRL + ALT + F1-F7" to get different command line interfaces instead of the graphical one.

 

To keep this from turning into a "Which OS is best" war, I would say just read a few guides and play around in Linux.

[ElkNight]

You could dual boot and just switch back to vista or whatever if you dont like it.

[dsavi]

Personally if I was in your situation I would try Ubuntu as a new operating system and not as a potential replacement. Your friend isn't entirely right about how that you "Have to use" the command line but it is incredibly useful, far more useful than cmd on Windows and it can be used to do things a lot faster than with a graphical tool. Can't say more right now other than that Ubuntu is my main OS (Has been that way for like 9 months). I have to go, I'll get back to you on this.

[opeious]

Friend of mine got started talking to other day about Ubuntu. I'd heard of it before, and knew it was an operating system, but that's about it. He was telling me all about it, but I don't know anything except Windows (yeah I know -- I R NEWB <_< ). He did mention that "one of the main differences is that you have to open everything through like a DOS command prompt. You don't just double click a desktop icon", or something along those lines... which sounds annoying to me to be honest :lol: ; but perhaps I misunderstood him.

 

The POINT of this topic is this: can anyone give me some brief (or long, your choice) descriptions of exactly what good/bad differences there are between Ubuntu and Windows? I've heard for years around these forums that Windows is a terrible operating system, but I've never really paid attention to it much because I didn't know anything about another op system.

 

Any help (especially if some kind Tip.iter left some helpful instructions) is greatly appreciated.

I've been using for a lot of time now...Ubuntu is not much different from windows in a lot of aspects, the double click on a desktop icon works -.- btw....and the DOS kinda thingy is called terminal, its not compulsory to use it...I would suggest that you make a new partition and install ubuntu in that just to try it out

[Sbrideau]

As others have said, you should try it in dual boot. I think Ubuntu is the most Windows like linux-based OS, and maybe that's what's getting it so popular. I would not install it in a replacement of Windows either since you never know if some part may not work.

 

But saying this is a better OS than Windows? Completely untrue, it's just a matter of opinion, every OS is as good as the others.

 

Also, saying programming is better on Ubuntu? Untrue as well, I've programmed on Both Windows and Ubuntu and it's pretty much the same.

[dsavi]

Also, saying programming is better on Ubuntu? Untrue as well, I've programmed on Both Windows and Ubuntu and it's pretty much the same.

I'd personally much rather program for UNIX or UNIX-like OSes than Windows.

He did mention that "one of the main differences is that you have to open everything through like a DOS command prompt. You don't just double click a desktop icon", or something along those lines... which sounds annoying to me to be honest :lol: ; but perhaps I misunderstood him.

To continue what I said in my previous post, Ubuntu is made to be user-friendly, just as Windows or OS X are. While it is entirely possible to do just about everything that does not need graphics from the command line, it is by no means necessary and if you choose not to learn how to do it I doubt that you will have any problems. The command line is there to make it possible to administrate and control your system in a very efficient way.

 

That article you read gives the impression that compiling source code is necessary; Unless you have very unusual hardware I doubt that would be the case. (I had to compile a driver for my 12-year old laptop) So unless you have a 8+ year old computer laying around that you want Ubuntu on, (And yes! It runs.) the risk is pretty low. One thing about Ubuntu I think anyone would like is the startup time. My computer, a two and a half year old midrange Dell, starts up in ~25 seconds and shuts down in 5.

 

One issue you may have is finding alternatives to programs you use on Windows. All of the software that 90% of computer users use on a daily basis works on Ubuntu or is already installed; A web browser (Firefox), an office suite, instant messaging, a music player, an image editor, a CD burner, all of the normal accessories and all of the normal games. That kind of stuff. If you use some Adobe software though, you probably want to keep it installed on Windows and boot into Windows whenever you need it. Alternatively, you could install it through WINE, but you'll probably get less stability. There are good open-source competitors to Adobe's flagship products though, like GIMP for image editing or Ardour for audio editing.

 

Something I really like about Ubuntu is the way you install software. This is something you should take note of, otherwise you'll probably go searching on the internet looking for software to install on Linux. You'll find it, but there's an easier way. In the Ubuntu software Center (Applications -> Ubuntu software center) you can just search for a program and download and install it. When you uninstall it, it uninstalls cleanly. But what's really good about it is the HUGE selection of software. There are literally 20,000+ programs (Called packages, actually, which can contain things other than programs).

 

I would suggest that you check out other similar projects like Fedora, but if your friend uses Ubuntu it's probably best to use that to get started with (As he can help you if you get stuck). Then if you like it, maybe you can move on to other distributions of Linux later.

[The Runar]

If you haven't tried Linux before and want to try it without any risks, I recommend using Wubi to install Ubuntu. It creates a virtual disk (basically a file which Ubuntu sees as a real hard disk) and installs Ubuntu on that. Unlike making a second partition on your computer (and installing Ubuntu on that), there's no risk of losing files with this method.

 

It's so easy to use that you shouldn't need a tutorial. Set the disk size to about 8 GB, it should be more than enough for testing. After the installation, when you reboot your computer, there is a menu from which you can choose which OS to boot.

 

If you want to remove Ubuntu, just open the Add/Remove programs tool from Windows control panel and remove Ubuntu from there.

 

Note that using a virtual disk is slower than a "real" install, so if Ubuntu seems to be slow, I can guarantee you it's much faster if you install it normally on another partition.

 

Good luck. :)

[Zibl]

Thanks very much everyone for your speedy & very helpful replies! I suppose it couldn't hurt to at least give it a try. But I'm a bit confused about one thing that many of you keep mentioning: "partition". What exactly is that? I know the definition and meaning of the word, obviously, but I'm not sure what exactly you mean when using it in computer terms relating to Ubuntu. I assume you simply mean by not replacing Windows with Ubuntu and setting it up as a dual boot type of deal, but I'm not sure how to do that. Assuming again you just install Ubuntu normally and it automatically sets it up as you all are saying without me having to manually do so, then we're all gravy :thumbsup: .

 

One other question: I noticed that you download an ISO file of Ubuntu, do SOMETHING with that ISO file, and burn that to a normal CD (700 mb/80 minute). What exactly am I supposed to do with that ISO file? I've only dealt with ISO file(s) once and that was years ago relating to ROM hacks. But the program I used (forgot the name) was a very small ISO type converter that took the hacked ROM file and made it playable with emulators (if I remember all that correctly).

[The Runar]

Thanks very much everyone for your speedy & very helpful replies! I suppose it couldn't hurt to at least give it a try. But I'm a bit confused about one thing that many of you keep mentioning: "partition". What exactly is that? I know the definition and meaning of the word, obviously, but I'm not sure what exactly you mean when using it in computer terms relating to Ubuntu. I assume you simply mean by not replacing Windows with Ubuntu and setting it up as a dual boot type of deal, but I'm not sure how to do that. Assuming again you just install Ubuntu normally and it automatically sets it up as you all are saying without me having to manually do so, then we're all gravy :thumbsup: .

 

The installation program of Ubuntu does that automatically. You just choose how big partition you want to give to Ubuntu. If you're only testing it, I still recommend using Wubi to install Ubuntu, as it doesn't have to create a new partition.

 

Anyway, if you want to install Ubuntu on a separate partition, be sure to defragment the disk first! If you don't do this, you have a much higher risk of losing data. And backup all important files, there's always a slight chance that something goes wrong in the process - resulting in losing files.

 

One other question: I noticed that you download an ISO file of Ubuntu, do SOMETHING with that ISO file, and burn that to a normal CD (700 mb/80 minute). What exactly am I supposed to do with that ISO file? I've only dealt with ISO file(s) once and that was years ago relating to ROM hacks. But the program I used (forgot the name) was a very small ISO type converter that took the hacked ROM file and made it playable with emulators (if I remember all that correctly).

 

I haven't heard about that "SOMETHING" part, I've always just downloaded the ISO file and burned it to a disk (I've burned four Linux installation CD's so far, and every single one worked without any special configuration). You can also use an USB stick or something (I've even used my phone's memory card :P ) like that, but it's a bit harder.

[dsavi]

Anyway, if you want to install Ubuntu on a separate partition, be sure to defragment the disk first! If you don't do this, you have a much higher risk of losing data.

I was going to install Ubuntu on my sister's laptop. She had never defragmented. I went to partition it, but it was so fragmented that it wouldn't even let me make a partition 1 mb wide. :lol: My point though is that it gave me a warning, that was in Windows 7 but I'm pretty sure that it does the same thing in Vista and XP too.

 

So yeah defrag first.

[Zibl]

Alright. Just as a precaution, this is what I got to do:

 

#1 - Download Ubuntu (currently at 46% completion).

#2 - Burn the Ubuntu ISO file to a 700 mb/80 minute CD (CD-R is fine I assume?).

#3 - Defragment the computer.

#4 - Insert burned disk, restart, and it'll start up.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong :^_^: . I appreciate the Wubi suggestion Tiigon, but I think I'm just going to go ahead and install it normally anyways. I'm on Firefox 95% of the time I get on the computer (only occasionally do I use anything else). So even if I don't use Ubuntu EVERY time I get on the computer, I'll still have it regardless.

[dsavi]

You probably want to start the defrag now. And when you start up, you have to press F12 or F2 or maybe F11 (Depends on your computer, I would guess it's F12 on most though) and it will go into a "boot menu". There you should be able to select different devices to boot from, select the DVD/CD drive.

 

CD-R is fine.

[Zibl]

Keep in mind I'm using Windows Vista for all this.

 

I defragmented. Took an hour or 2, and when finished just said "your system is good". Neat. The download finished of Ubuntu. Now here's where I MAY have screwed up, but I don't think I did. I inserted the blank CD-R and clicked "Write/Move Files using Windows" on the pop up box. It opened the empty CD-R menu and it said "Drag files to the blank CD" or something along those lines. So that's what I did. I drug the ISO file to the CD, right clicked, and went to "Finish disk" I believe was what the choice was. A couple minutes later the CD popped out, apparently ready for use.

 

I restarted my computer and hit F10 (which is the Boot Menu for this particular laptop) and it came up with 3 choices; the first of which was labeled with the CD/DVD-RW drive. I hit enter. A black screen came up with a bunch of random stuff somewhere along the lines of this (keep in mind this isn't WORD FOR WORD and nor is it all the writing... I just jotted down a few bits of it in case I needed to repeat it here):

 

Yukon PXE v5.0.4.3

Pre-boot execution Environment (PXE) v2.1

[another couple of random copyrighted lines and years]

 

CLIENT MAC ADDR: bunch of numbers

GUID: 20240922 (and the numbers/letters go on for a bit)

 

Just said stuff like that. After the GUID line it said something else and had a few dots that kept getting longer and longer as time went on, and eventually got a message saying "No Boot File name Received" and then it retried with the dots and stuff. Soooo... yeah. I didn't know if it was working, wasn't working, if I screwed up with the burning of the CD, or what was going on. If you guys need more info I can try it again and write down everything word-for-word if it'll help.

[Sbrideau]

You should always use a specialized program in buring thos things, such as imgburn, which is the one I find the best to burn a .iso. Relatively simple and nothing too big.

[The Runar]

You should always use a specialized program in buring thos things, such as imgburn, which is the one I find the best to burn a .iso. Relatively simple and nothing too big.

 

That's right. If you burn an ISO file straight to a CD, it will be a data CD containing the ISO. Only with an actual image burning tool it will be bootable.

 

That ImgBurn seems to be a good tool for the job. There seems to be an option "Burn image" blah blah in its menu, so use that. I haven't used the program myself, but it should be pretty straightforward.

[Zibl]

I figured that was most likely the problem <_< . I'll keep you all posted!

[Zibl]

I just got slammed with confusion about the whole partition setup thing. I googled a "How-to" but it's still got me confused. The 2 I've found were basically the same, but not very descriptive for... erm... dummies like me.

[lordkafei]

...

One other question: I noticed that you download an ISO file of Ubuntu, do SOMETHING with that ISO file, and burn that to a normal CD (700 mb/80 minute). What exactly am I supposed to do with that ISO file? I've only dealt with ISO file(s) once and that was years ago relating to ROM hacks. But the program I used (forgot the name) was a very small ISO type converter that took the hacked ROM file and made it playable with emulators (if I remember all that correctly).

 

I just ask them to mail me a disc; it comes from the Netherlands and if you are in the USA you will get it in 7-10 days.

[The Runar]

I just got slammed with confusion about the whole partition setup thing. I googled a "How-to" but it's still got me confused. The 2 I've found were basically the same, but not very descriptive for... erm... dummies like me.

 

If it hasn't changed much, the partition screen should look like this:

 

[hide][/hide]

 

Make sure that "install them side by side" is selected. The lower bar has a slider, use it to change the partition sizes to what you want. In my picture Vista's C: disk is 69.8 GB, Vista's D: disk (/dev/sda3 is how Ubuntu sees it in this case) is 52.0 GB, and Xubuntu (basically Ubuntu with a different desktop, installation process is the same) has 15.0 GB.

 

That's everything you need to do. I recommend 10-15 GB for Ubuntu and the rest for Windows. If you need more space, it's possible to increase it later.

[Zibl]

Alright, there isn't a place to select "Install them side by side". I've looked twice and see nothing like that. Since I don't have a camera to take & upload a picture, here is a leet paint drawing of basically exactly what it says on my screen:

 

 

Not everything is listed because most everything in your picture looks exactly what mine looks like; minus the place to select "install side by side". I suppose I could just be overlooking it... but how!? I didn't see any selection option like that the first time through, and I just tried it a 2nd time after looking at your picture and STILL didn't see that choice.

 

This is version 9.10 by the way, if that even matters.

[The Runar]

Alright, there isn't a place to select "Install them side by side". I've looked twice and see nothing like that. Since I don't have a camera to take & upload a picture, here is a leet paint drawing of basically exactly what it says on my screen:

 

 

Not everything is listed because most everything in your picture looks exactly what mine looks like; minus the place to select "install side by side". I suppose I could just be overlooking it... but how!? I didn't see any selection option like that the first time through, and I just tried it a 2nd time after looking at your picture and STILL didn't see that choice.

 

This is version 9.10 by the way, if that even matters.

 

That's really weird, because it should have that button. I even checked a video of Ubuntu 9.10 installation and it is there.

 

No problem, though, you just have to do the partitioning manually. It's not hard, but make sure to do exactly as I say. (There probably is another way, but I can't think of anything...)

 

1. Make sure that you've defragmented the hard disk and backed up all important files. Then launch Ubuntu from the CD. There is an option "Try Ubuntu without changes to the computer" or something like that. It takes a few minutes to boot, however it is much, much faster when it's installed.

 

2. Look through the menus until you find a program called "GParted" (it may be listed as "Partition Editor" or something like that, but it's the same program). Open it. You should now see a screen like this:

 

[hide][/hide]

 

Chances are that you don't have 8 partitions like I do :razz: , but it does not matter.

 

I haven't used the program for a while so I don't remember what the buttons are called exactly, but you should be able to follow my tutorial.

 

3. In the upper right corner you should see "/dev/sda (XXX.XX GB)". That's the name and size of your hard disk. If you have multiple hard disks, make sure to select the right one (check the size). If you have only one, then it's the right one. Note that if you have a USB stick or something like that attached, GParted also shows them.

 

4. Now right click the last partition in the list. Choose "Resize/move". Enter the new size for that partition. If I remember right it shows it in megabytes. The new size should be about 8 GB (8000* MB) less than it is now (actually more is better, but it's possible to resize it again later). So if it is 50000 MB now, reduce it to 42000 MB etc. Press OK. There should be a list of pending changes now.

 

5. Now, if you're sure you did it right, and you have backups and everything, press "Apply changes" (or whatever it's called, I haven't used the program for a while). Now it resizes the partition. It usually takes a while.

 

6. Start the installation of Ubuntu by double clicking the icon on the desktop. While it asks you about partitions, choose to use largest continuous free space. The installation will take care of the rest.

 

If you still have problems, just ask.

 

* Idiots: Yes I know 8 GB is 8192 MB, but it doesn't matter here

[Sbrideau]

I believe using wubi would be better in your case, still dualboot and not as clean, but it's as fast as the real thing plus you don't have to play with your hard drive like that and taking the risk to lose your mbr.