AThousandLies Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/151726 ... lines=true A federal judge ruled this week that school districts cannot "out" gay students even if their sexual orientation is known on campus. The ruling paved the way for a discrimination lawsuit by a 17-year-old student to go forward against the Garden Grove Unified School District in California, after Charlene Nguon alleged that officials unfairly disciplined her this year for hugging and kissing her girlfriend on campus. Her punishment? Administrators revealed Nguon's sexual orientation to her mother and temporarily forced the teen to change schools. According to a report in the Los Angeles Times, the district wanted Nguon's suit to be dismissed, arguing that the student had no expectation of privacy about her sexual orientation because she was openly gay at school. U.S. District Judge James V. Selna rejected that argument and allowed a claim that the district violated Nguon's privacy rights. The American Civil Liberties Union attorney who is representing Nguon, Christine Sun, praised the ruling. "Even though the information might have been known to some people, it wasn't known to the family," she said of Nguon's sexual orientation, according to the Times. "She had a right to tell her family on her own terms, especially when it's such a sensitive matter in a lot of families." Nguon's suit seeks unspecified damages and requests that the district establish, among other measures, a policy prohibiting administrators from revealing a student's sexual orientation. "It's a really good thing for the case and for other students," Nguon told the paper. "I hope it would, like, tell [school officials] that they can't ... go around invading people's privacy rights." A school district spokesman declined to comment to the Times for the story and could not be reached for comment at press time. And rightly so, as far as I'm concerned. EDIT: the stars are the censored version of the three letter slang term for homosexuality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trip Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 Step in the right direction :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
logic-is-overrated Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 This is the way I see it: If there IS a rule against displaying affection towards other students and she broke that rule then I agree. She broke a rule and the school has the right to tell her parents what rule she broke and how she broke it. If there IS NOT a rule then of course it was unfair. I understand that the point of the article is that the school is treating homosexual couples differently than heterosexual couples, but the only evidence for that in this article is some girl whining about her rights and accusing people. I think it really depends on whether or not she broke a school rule. This is the way the world ends. Look at this [bleep]ing shit we're in man. Not with a bang, but with a whimper. And with a whimper, I'm splitting, Jack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insane Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 This is the way I see it: If there IS a rule against displaying affection towards other students and she broke that rule then I agree. She broke a rule and the school has the right to tell her parents what rule she broke and how she broke it. If there IS NOT a rule then of course it was unfair. I understand that the point of the article is that the school is treating homosexual couples differently than heterosexual couples, but the only evidence for that in this article is some girl whining about her rights and accusing people. I think it really depends on whether or not she broke a school rule. Yea, I pretty much agree here. I know the high school I went to had rules against certain "PDA" (public dislays of affection). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CARTMAN842 Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 This is the way I see it: If there IS a rule against displaying affection towards other students and she broke that rule then I agree. She broke a rule and the school has the right to tell her parents what rule she broke and how she broke it. If there IS NOT a rule then of course it was unfair. I understand that the point of the article is that the school is treating homosexual couples differently than heterosexual couples, but the only evidence for that in this article is some girl whining about her rights and accusing people. I think it really depends on whether or not she broke a school rule. .Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryles Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 This is the way I see it: If there IS a rule against displaying affection towards other students and she broke that rule then I agree. She broke a rule and the school has the right to tell her parents what rule she broke and how she broke it. If there IS NOT a rule then of course it was unfair. I understand that the point of the article is that the school is treating homosexual couples differently than heterosexual couples, but the only evidence for that in this article is some girl whining about her rights and accusing people. I think it really depends on whether or not she broke a school rule. spot the homophobic.... the girl is 17 and therefore has legal rights to express her sexual idienty, the school had no right to go to her mother as it is the girls affair and it should not of been brough to the mums attention. all she was doing was hugging and kissing, if she was doing more full-on stuff (i dont feel that its neccessary to say wot they could be lol) then there might be a cause for concern at the school. schools need to realise now that ppl do not save themselves till marriage anymore (probably only a very very very small minority do) and that this type of behaviour is not regarded as exceptable. i have a strong feeling that if she was kissing a boy then this would not have been brought to her mothers attenion, i feel this is merly another discrimination act 200TH TO 99 COOKING, JULY '05 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevester77 Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 the girl is 17 and therefore has legal rights to express her sexual idienty, the school had no right to go to her mother as it is the girls affair and it should not of been brough to the mums attention. all she was doing was hugging and kissing, if she was doing more full-on stuff (i dont feel that its neccessary to say wot they could be lol) then there might be a cause for concern at the school. schools need to realise now that ppl do not save themselves till marriage anymore (probably only a very very very small minority do) and that this type of behaviour is not regarded as exceptable. i have a strong feeling that if she was kissing a boy then this would not have been brought to her mothers attenion, i feel this is merly another discrimination act Im a senior and everyone of my friends (myself included) are all still virgins.. the most we've ever done is kiss the opposite sex. I know that I personally am saving myself for marriage :roll: . I also know that at my school, kissing and even long affectionate hugs are not allowed.. regardless of oriantation. So even at my school provided she was kissing a guy, she would still be disaplined and her actions would have been explained to her parents. Idk, I think the writer of the article is a bit biased when he said that the school told her parents about her sexual orientation as a "punishment". Surely, whenever you kid does something wrong at school and gets punished for it, the school has to explain why. It wasn't a matter of them telling her parents about it out of punishment, but rather, what she is being punished for. I personally don't side with the girl. Sure, the girl should have been the one to disclose her orientation to her parents rather than her school. But the girl brought it upon herself by breaking school rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
logic-is-overrated Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 [the girl is 17 and therefore has legal rights to express her sexual idientyRegardless of age or sexual preference if you're in school and you're school has a rule against displaying affection then you're not allowed to display affection. She wasn't warned repeatedly to stop being homosexual, she was warned repeatedly to stop breaking school rules. [the school had no right to go to her mother as it is the girls affair and it should not of been brough to the mums attention.She was warned repeatedly to stop and was suspended numerous times for not stopping. When school officials take disciplinary action you can't expect them to lie to her mother. all she was doing was hugging and kissing, if she was doing more full-on stuff (i dont feel that its neccessary to say wot they could be lol) then there might be a cause for concern at the school. schools need to realise now that ppl do not save themselves till marriage anymore (probably only a very very very small minority do) and that this type of behaviour is not regarded as exceptable.It doesn't matter what "people do nowadays" and it doesn't matter how extreme her displays of affection were. There's might be many ways to break a rule but in the end it's the same thing. She broke the rules. After doing a little reasearch I'm thinking she wasn't discriminated against. It seems to me she's just immature and stubborn. I'm guessing a lot of couples were told to stop displaying affection in public but her and her girlfriend thought they had to make a point so they kept doing it. You can't lobby for privacy of the same thing you made public. And you can't argue discrimination for being punished when you break the rules. This is the way the world ends. Look at this [bleep]ing shit we're in man. Not with a bang, but with a whimper. And with a whimper, I'm splitting, Jack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayjest Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 i have a strong feeling that if she was kissing a boy then this would not have been brought to her mothers attenion, i feel this is merly another discrimination act If she had been kissing a boy, then yes they would have, because schools have to tell the parents why the student is being punished, no matter what rule they've broken. If the girls was straight but didn't want her parents to know she had a boyfriend, she probably wouldn't have kissed him on campus. The same rule applies with this. The fact that it was a girl kissing a girl makes no difference. Goals to get my skills back up to a barely respectable level on the high scores: Currently going for Bone to Peaches spell. It's amazing how boring doing the same repetitive task is! Stupid MTA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOV Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 This is the way I see it: If there IS a rule against displaying affection towards other students and she broke that rule then I agree. She broke a rule and the school has the right to tell her parents what rule she broke and how she broke it. If there IS NOT a rule then of course it was unfair. I understand that the point of the article is that the school is treating homosexual couples differently than heterosexual couples, but the only evidence for that in this article is some girl whining about her rights and accusing people. I think it really depends on whether or not she broke a school rule. spot the homophobic.... the girl is 17 and therefore has legal rights to express her sexual idienty, the school had no right to go to her mother as it is the girls affair and it should not of been brough to the mums attention. all she was doing was hugging and kissing, if she was doing more full-on stuff (i dont feel that its neccessary to say wot they could be lol) then there might be a cause for concern at the school. schools need to realise now that ppl do not save themselves till marriage anymore (probably only a very very very small minority do) and that this type of behaviour is not regarded as exceptable. i have a strong feeling that if she was kissing a boy then this would not have been brought to her mothers attenion, i feel this is merly another discrimination act If such rules are in place [they were at my high school] then the school has every right to tell the parents what is going on. Some parents may not allow their children to date, it is their right to know what is going on, especially if the kids are breaking school rules. They are not going to treat her any differently because of her sexual preference. They would do the same thing if it happened to be a boy and a girl kissing in such a manner. If she wants to "express her sexual identity" she can do on her own time in the bedroom, not on school property. I know the price. I pay it gladly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weezcake Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 Does the school have a rule against showing public affection? :? ==================================Retired tip.it moderator.Teaching and inspiring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
logic-is-overrated Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 Does the school have a rule against showing public affection? :?I reasearched that school district and from what I could find, yes they do have a rule against it. Which is why i'm having a hard time agreeing with the girl. This is the way the world ends. Look at this [bleep]ing shit we're in man. Not with a bang, but with a whimper. And with a whimper, I'm splitting, Jack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOV Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 Does the school have a rule against showing public affection? :? That's the question of the day :P My highschool had one. I know the price. I pay it gladly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AThousandLies Posted December 4, 2005 Author Share Posted December 4, 2005 [the girl is 17 and therefore has legal rights to express her sexual idientyRegardless of age or sexual preference if you're in school and you're school has a rule against displaying affection then you're not allowed to display affection. She wasn't warned repeatedly to stop being homosexual, she was warned repeatedly to stop breaking school rules. [the school had no right to go to her mother as it is the girls affair and it should not of been brough to the mums attention.She was warned repeatedly to stop and was suspended numerous times for not stopping. When school officials take disciplinary action you can't expect them to lie to her mother. all she was doing was hugging and kissing, if she was doing more full-on stuff (i dont feel that its neccessary to say wot they could be lol) then there might be a cause for concern at the school. schools need to realise now that ppl do not save themselves till marriage anymore (probably only a very very very small minority do) and that this type of behaviour is not regarded as exceptable.It doesn't matter what "people do nowadays" and it doesn't matter how extreme her displays of affection were. There's might be many ways to break a rule but in the end it's the same thing. She broke the rules. After doing a little reasearch I'm thinking she wasn't discriminated against. It seems to me she's just immature and stubborn. I'm guessing a lot of couples were told to stop displaying affection in public but her and her girlfriend thought they had to make a point so they kept doing it. You can't lobby for privacy of the same thing you made public. And you can't argue discrimination for being punished when you break the rules. Proof for these statements, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostRanger Posted December 4, 2005 Share Posted December 4, 2005 the girl is 17 and therefore has legal rights to express her sexual idienty, the school had no right to go to her mother as it is the girls affair and it should not of been brough to the mums attention. all she was doing was hugging and kissing, if she was doing more full-on stuff (i dont feel that its neccessary to say wot they could be lol) then there might be a cause for concern at the school. schools need to realise now that ppl do not save themselves till marriage anymore (probably only a very very very small minority do) and that this type of behaviour is not regarded as exceptable. i have a strong feeling that if she was kissing a boy then this would not have been brought to her mothers attenion, i feel this is merly another discrimination act Umm...she is 17 and therefore she is still in custody of her parents. Becuase of this, and because of the fact that she is attending school (which is agreeing to follow school rules and respect the consequences) the school has every right to notify her parents of everything that happens while she is at school. If she did not want her parents to know, she should not be doing it at school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOV Posted December 4, 2005 Share Posted December 4, 2005 I must add, cases like this annoy me to no end. People like this girl are the first to flaunt their rights to equality and fair treatment. Yet it seems that even when they are treated in the same manner everyone else is treated they will scream, "racism, sexism, biased treatment," when things don't go their way. I know the price. I pay it gladly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AThousandLies Posted December 4, 2005 Author Share Posted December 4, 2005 Since when are schools obliged to tell parents of every single little punishment? It's the first I've heard of it. And, additionally, there are other ways the schools could've informed her parents - they could've said that she partook in overt displays of affection. If that was breaking the rules, then that's all they had to say. The fact that they specified that it was with a girl suggests that there were some ulterior motives there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostRanger Posted December 4, 2005 Share Posted December 4, 2005 Since when are schools obliged to tell parents of every single little punishment? It's the first I've heard of it. And, additionally, there are other ways the schools could've informed her parents - they could've said that she partook in overt displays of affection. If that was breaking the rules, then that's all they had to say. The fact that they specified that it was with a girl suggests that there were some ulterior motives there. Its perfectly reasonable for a school to say "Your daughter was seen partaking in some extreme displays of affection with another girl" just as I have often heard of it being said "Your daughter was seen partaking in some extreme displays of affection with a boy." Both are perfectly reasonable and whether or not the school is obliged to tell every single punishment - the schools I've gone to inform parents of most punishments. AND even if they aren't obliged, it is their right to do so - and therefore they should not be sued over it practicing their rights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamerr Posted December 4, 2005 Share Posted December 4, 2005 If there IS a rule against displaying affection towards other students and she broke that rule then I agree. She broke a rule and the school has the right to tell her parents what rule she broke and how she broke it. If there IS NOT a rule then of course it was unfair. I understand that the point of the article is that the school is treating homosexual couples differently than heterosexual couples, but the only evidence for that in this article is some girl whining about her rights and accusing people. I think it really depends on whether or not she broke a school rule. Yep, agreed. ~Gamerr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
logic-is-overrated Posted December 4, 2005 Share Posted December 4, 2005 Proof for these statements, please.http://www.aclu.org/lgbt/youth/19925prs20050907.html Previously he had singled Nguon out for discipline a number of times for displaying affection with her girlfriend. She is enrolled in a number of advanced placement and honors classes and was a candidate for the National Honor Society until the offer was rescinded because of discipline, including one weeklong suspension, for hugging her girlfriend on campus. http://www.queerday.com/2005/sep/13/lesbian_teen_charlene_nguon_sues_garden_grove_school_district.html Charlene Nguon, 17, has filed suit against Garden Grove Unified School District, claiming she was suspended several times and forced to temporarily transfer because she refused to stop hugging and kissing her girlfriend on campus. The Santa Ana resident and her girlfriend, Trang Nguyen, 16, allege that Santiago High School Principal Ben Wolf told them not to show affection toward each other after they began dating as juniors last year. Throughout the year, the two defied the order and continued to hug and kiss on campus despite suspensions ranging from one to five days, the suit says. http://www.gay.com/news/article.html?2005/12/01/4 Nguon was repeatedly disciplined during the 2004-05 school year by Santiago High School Principal Ben Wolf for displaying affection for her girlfriend. http://articles.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20051202141509990008 The suit also claims discrimination, contending that Nguon was suspended several times because she ignored orders by Wolf to stop hugging and kissing her girlfriend. This is the way the world ends. Look at this [bleep]ing shit we're in man. Not with a bang, but with a whimper. And with a whimper, I'm splitting, Jack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faux Posted December 4, 2005 Share Posted December 4, 2005 Cliffs to anyone who doesn't wanna read the whole two pages: 1. Girl is an attention [bleep]. 2. School administration informs her family. 3. Girl gets embarassed. 4. Sues. 5. ???. 6. Profit. This is the way I see it: If there IS a rule against displaying affection towards other students and she broke that rule then I agree. She broke a rule and the school has the right to tell her parents what rule she broke and how she broke it. If there IS NOT a rule then of course it was unfair. I understand that the point of the article is that the school is treating homosexual couples differently than heterosexual couples, but the only evidence for that in this article is some girl whining about her rights and accusing people. I think it really depends on whether or not she broke a school rule.a spot the homophobic.... the girl is 17 and therefore has legal rights to express her sexual idienty, the school had no right to go to her mother as it is the girls affair and it should not of been brough to the mums attention. all she was doing was hugging and kissing, if she was doing more full-on stuff (i dont feel that its neccessary to say wot they could be lol) then there might be a cause for concern at the school. schools need to realise now that ppl do not save themselves till marriage anymore (probably only a very very very small minority do) and that this type of behaviour is not regarded as exceptable. i have a strong feeling that if she was kissing a boy then this would not have been brought to her mothers attenion, i feel this is merly another discrimination act Stereotype for the lose? People think majority of people in high school have sex because it's shown in media, a lot of times. What they don't show are the people who DO save theirselves for marriage. If the school has something against gay people, props to them. I know a lot of people act gay just for the attention. <- Another reason why I don't like them. :: Guess the Movie Contest Champion: pfilc23 :: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insane Posted December 4, 2005 Share Posted December 4, 2005 schools need to realise now that ppl do not save themselves till marriage anymore (probably only a very very very small minority do) and that this type of behaviour is not regarded as exceptable. Dude, lay off the TV and movies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostRanger Posted December 4, 2005 Share Posted December 4, 2005 schools need to realise now that ppl do not save themselves till marriage anymore (probably only a very very very small minority do) and that this type of behaviour is not regarded as exceptable. Dude, lay off the TV and movies... Maybe laying off the movies will allow him to learn to spell words like "acceptable." Seriously...we're suppose to take your profound thoughts seriously and you spell "acceptable" like "exceptable." Yeah right... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AThousandLies Posted December 4, 2005 Author Share Posted December 4, 2005 Since when are schools obliged to tell parents of every single little punishment? It's the first I've heard of it. And, additionally, there are other ways the schools could've informed her parents - they could've said that she partook in overt displays of affection. If that was breaking the rules, then that's all they had to say. The fact that they specified that it was with a girl suggests that there were some ulterior motives there. Its perfectly reasonable for a school to say "Your daughter was seen partaking in some extreme displays of affection with another girl" just as I have often heard of it being said "Your daughter was seen partaking in some extreme displays of affection with a boy." In this case, it is obviously a very touchy situation. If she was, after all, breaking the rules, then the school should exercise their rights and punish her, and, if need be, inform her parents. However, when a controversial factor such as homosexuality is present, care must be taken, and the school should do their best to avoid invading her privacy. They could have just as easily said it was with another person and not a girl; thus avoiding informing her parents of something they may not know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GhostRanger Posted December 5, 2005 Share Posted December 5, 2005 Since when are schools obliged to tell parents of every single little punishment? It's the first I've heard of it. And, additionally, there are other ways the schools could've informed her parents - they could've said that she partook in overt displays of affection. If that was breaking the rules, then that's all they had to say. The fact that they specified that it was with a girl suggests that there were some ulterior motives there. Its perfectly reasonable for a school to say "Your daughter was seen partaking in some extreme displays of affection with another girl" just as I have often heard of it being said "Your daughter was seen partaking in some extreme displays of affection with a boy." In this case, it is obviously a very touchy situation. If she was, after all, breaking the rules, then the school should exercise their rights and punish her, and, if need be, inform her parents. However, when a controversial factor such as homosexuality is present, care must be taken, and the school should do their best to avoid invading her privacy. They could have just as easily said it was with another person and not a girl; thus avoiding informing her parents of something they may not know. The girl has no "privacy rights" from her parents if she is 17. Because she did it openly at school, she gave the school the right to tell her parents everything about the situation. No one attending school under legal guardianship of their parents has any right to secrecy concerning what they do at school (and who they do it with). Therefore, there is no ground for a lawsuit. The school has every right to do what they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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